PeterRS Posted March 26 Posted March 26 In all my years of flying, I have encountered a number of emergencies. But never have I been on an aircraft that has had to turn back. The 270 souls on board Flight UA198 had to endure that last Saturday afternoon. Flying from Los Angeles to Shanghai on a 787, the flight surprisingly turned around after 90 minutes and landed at San Francisco. Engine trouble? No! Air conditioning problem? No! Other mechanical problem? No! The pilot had forgotten to take his passport! Gulp! A new crew flew the aircraft to Shanghai. vinapu, TMax and Ruthrieston 1 2 Quote
BjornAgain Posted March 26 Posted March 26 Begs the question how did he get through Passport Control at LAX? vinapu, PeterRS and TMax 3 Quote
Keithambrose Posted March 27 Posted March 27 18 hours ago, BjornAgain said: Begs the question how did he get through Passport Control at LAX? Indeed! BjornAgain 1 Quote
10tazione Posted March 27 Posted March 27 Maybe he forgot the passport somewhere AFTER passport control? Quote
PeterRS Posted March 27 Author Posted March 27 4 hours ago, 10tazione said: Maybe he forgot the passport somewhere AFTER passport control? If his memory is that bad, why is he flying a passenger aircraft? Quote
Keithambrose Posted March 27 Posted March 27 4 hours ago, PeterRS said: If his memory is that bad, why is he flying a passenger aircraft? The computer flies the plane! vinapu 1 Quote
PeterRS Posted March 27 Author Posted March 27 13 minutes ago, Keithambrose said: The computer flies the plane! And you are happy that the computer flies the plane without a pilot? Rather you than me. In fact I wouldn't go near a plane without a pilot AND a computer! Quote
bkkmfj2648 Posted March 27 Posted March 27 29 minutes ago, Keithambrose said: The computer flies the plane! Wait until they will implement an FSD (Full Self-Driving) system, perhaps it would be called, FSF (Full Self-Flying) system, like what is commonly found in Tesla cars. Quote
reader Posted March 27 Posted March 27 I was discussing the OP with PaulSF, who is as an experienced long-haul traveler and airline buff as you'll find here. He reminded me that during Covid when China required cargo pilots to quarantine for 14 days just like anyone else entering the PRC, crews ate and slept on board and never passed through immigration. Quote
PeterRS Posted March 27 Author Posted March 27 3 hours ago, bkkmfj2648 said: Wait until they will implement an FSD (Full Self-Driving) system, perhaps it would be called, FSF (Full Self-Flying) system, like what is commonly found in Tesla cars. Do you know how many Tesla cars have had to be recalled? More than 700,000! The Model S tops the list with 38 separate recall orders. This is followed by the Model X with 37 recalls. Even the Cybertruck introduced as recently as November 2023 has been the subject to 8 recalls. My view is that airlines will never take a risk with pilotless passenger carrying passengers. Never! The passengers will never stand/fly for it! LOL https://www.brclegal.com/tesla-recall-statistics/ Ruthrieston 1 Quote
Keithambrose Posted March 27 Posted March 27 9 hours ago, PeterRS said: And you are happy that the computer flies the plane without a pilot? Rather you than me. In fact I wouldn't go near a plane without a pilot AND a computer! I agree, but I would like to know how many takeoff and landings are automatic. I vaguely remember, years ago, occasionally the pilot would announce, as we were taxiing to the stand, that it had been an instrument landing. Not heard this for many years. I also recall an apocryphal story, I hope, that the early Airbus used a computer based on that in a French tank! Quote
fedssocr Posted March 28 Posted March 28 On 3/26/2025 at 1:33 AM, BjornAgain said: Begs the question how did he get through Passport Control at LAX? But there is no "passport control" on exit from the USA. As crew he would go through the crew security lane with just his airline ID. PeterRS, vinapu and 10tazione 1 2 Quote
BjornAgain Posted March 28 Posted March 28 32 minutes ago, fedssocr said: But there is no "passport control" on exit from the USA. As crew he would go through the crew security lane with just his airline ID. Cheers for that. Seams like a bit of a security flaw. 10tazione 1 Quote
PeterRS Posted March 28 Author Posted March 28 6 hours ago, Keithambrose said: I agree, but I would like to know how many takeoff and landings are automatic. I vaguely remember, years ago, occasionally the pilot would announce, as we were taxiing to the stand, that it had been an instrument landing. Not heard this for many years. Quite a number of aircraft are certified for automatic computer landings. If there is a problem it is that the ground systems must work flawlessly to provide 100% accurate info to the on board computer. Few airports I believe are certified for automatic landings. Quote
thaiophilus Posted Friday at 10:25 AM Posted Friday at 10:25 AM Yes, for full autoland the airport needs a Category III instrument landing system, but many airports are Cat II or less. Most approach procedures bring the aircraft down to a decision height, where if they can see the runway they land visually, otherwise they have to go around or divert. At some smaller airports because of terrain obstructions the ILS track isn't even in line with the runway, so the final phase of landing has to be visual/manual. Also, true autoland in zero visibility slows down all other airport traffic because it's not just a matter of having the right instruments on the aircraft and the right navaids on the ground (and trained pilots!). Ground vehicles and taxiing aircraft near the runway have to stop, so they don't introduce unexpected reflections of the radio signal. vinapu and bkkmfj2648 1 1 Quote
Keithambrose Posted Friday at 12:37 PM Posted Friday at 12:37 PM 2 hours ago, thaiophilus said: Yes, for full autoland the airport needs a Category III instrument landing system, but many airports are Cat II or less. Most approach procedures bring the aircraft down to a decision height, where if they can see the runway they land visually, otherwise they have to go around or divert. At some smaller airports because of terrain obstructions the ILS track isn't even in line with the runway, so the final phase of landing has to be visual/manual. Also, true autoland in zero visibility slows down all other airport traffic because it's not just a matter of having the right instruments on the aircraft and the right navaids on the ground (and trained pilots!). Ground vehicles and taxiing aircraft near the runway have to stop, so they don't introduce unexpected reflections of the radio signal. I thought most, if not all, major airports are Cat III. You can see the sign as you taxi to the runway. LHR for example. It was at LHR, I believe, many years ago that I heard the comment about the instrument landing. There was perfect visibility, so I assume that they were just testing. Quote
Keithambrose Posted Friday at 12:41 PM Posted Friday at 12:41 PM 11 hours ago, fedssocr said: But there is no "passport control" on exit from the USA. As crew he would go through the crew security lane with just his airline ID. At security in the US, they check your passport, or other photo id, and your boarding pass. You can use your driving licence, which goes in a slot on the machine, which takes a photo of you to check. Quote
thaiophilus Posted Saturday at 01:03 PM Posted Saturday at 01:03 PM On 3/28/2025 at 12:37 PM, Keithambrose said: I thought most, if not all, major airports are Cat III. You can see the sign as you taxi to the runway. LHR for example. It was at LHR, I believe, many years ago that I heard the comment about the instrument landing. There was perfect visibility, so I assume that they were just testing. Depends how you define "major". In USA and Europe, yes. Elsewhere, not so many. I found this list of 228 worldwide (can't guarantee its accuracy but stackexchange is usually pretty good): https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/71602/is-there-a-list-of-airports-with-category-3-ils-systems LHR (or rather EGLL) is certainly in there, but there are no Thai airports listed. And, for example, neither Suvarnabhumi (VTBS) nor Don Mueang (VTBD) has Cat III approaches according to the official eAIP https://aip.caat.or.th/2025-03-20-AIRAC/html/index-en-GB.html Quote
