Rogie

The title of this topic, Looks like its days are numbered - They will rely on Thai lady boys has aroused my curiosity Nowhere in the OP's opening post, other than the title, is there anything written about ladyboys. The clear 'reading between the lines' is that the individual(s) alluded to were ladyboys. I could be wrong but it is my understanding the OP is riding a hobby horse here. Ladyboys get a bad enough press - the "Last night a Russian man was pickpocketed by two ladyboys on a baht bus . . . " kind of headlines in local Pattaya rags - without casting aspersions. There are bad apples in any barrel. Whether the barrel be labelled Cox's Orange Pippin (straight boys), Golden Delicious (gay boys) or Granny Smith (ladyboys).

Chin up, old boy. That's the spirit.

Wish I could afford one - they look kinda fun

Thank you for the link to that thought-provoking article Fountainhall. Although my earlier comments (repeated above in quote box) still hold true in that a person on the latest drug regime will not progress to full-blown AIDS, my use of wording 'considerable degree of comfort' is clearly unrealistic. Anybody currently on drug therapy is going to be, I hazard to guess, most anxious, (sometimes referred to as the 'worried well'), or at best extremely wary. I have And the Band Played On on my bookshelf but have never read it. Shame on me. But to be fair I also have Ulysses and Remembrance of Things Past and other voluminous tomes - all unread - more than I'll ever get round to reading! A Matter of Life and Sex by Oscar Moore came out in 1991. I didn't read it until 1998, by which time the author had been dead 2 years at he age of 36. It is written as a seemingly fictional biography of one Hugo Harvey, but it is clearly very much an autobiography. He lived with HIV for the last 13 years of his life, and from 1993 to 1996 wrote a regular column for The Guardian entitled "PWA (Person With AIDS)."

I came across this interesting-looking tie-in between Google and dengue fever: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-13599859

Thank you Fountainhall and Hayase for your most informative posts. I didn't see this topic when originally posted last month. On the website kindly referred to by Hayase, although the various pages you can access are listed in the left hand margin of the home page in English, unfortunately the text is in Thai. I was fascinated by the clip posted by Fountainhall. Would I be right in thinking that as the performance progresses you become less aware of the 'men in black' and able to focus on the puppets? I would like to think that is so because in a short clip they seem to 'get in the way' somewhat.

I haven't come across that habit. Maybe I could understand if your primary acquaintance introduced you to somebody and just as a matter of emphasis, instead of saying "Kjun12, meet my friend Non", he says, putting his arm around the new arrival, "Kjun12 meet my brother Non!". Dunno I'm just speculating! (I see I'm now a Connoisseur - shurely shome mishtake!)

The link kindly supplied by Fountainhall explains the tests. Whereas your HIV status is straightforward - you are either negative or positive - AIDS is another matter. It is the case nowadays, that for a HIV+ve person who is on the best regime of drugs, AIDS can be prevented, thus allowing such a person a considerable degree of comfort that they won't progress to what is sometimes referred to as full-blown AIDS. People who are not on therapy have no such comfort. I have no idea what their chances of longterm survival would be, but it is pitifully low. Some people do seem to have an unexplained immunity. I believe the gay writer Edmund White, who wrote A Boy's Own Story, is HIV+ve, and has survived, in contrast to many of his contemporaries. (I assume he is on the latest drugs now, but he must have lived a considerable time without any anti-AIDS drugs whatsoever). As far as I am aware there is still no explanation for why White has survived whilst others did not. So what is AIDS? It is one of several diseases that stem from the body's inability to fight infection, their immune system having been taken over by the HIV for its own devious ends. You'd have to consult a textbook or website if you want a full list of all the diseases that can be said to come under the AIDS umbrella. I wouldn't even know how to start. Is AIDS the same for the whole world? Theoretically yes, but in practice I would say no - it depends where the untreated HIV+ve person is living. A person living in the USA is going to present with a different range of illnesses to one living in South Africa, say. I recall in many African countries those unfortunates suffering from an AIDS-related illness often just wasted away. Locals called it 'Slim'. I suspect that is what kills the majority of untreated HIV+ve people in areas with 1) a low standard of living (malnutrition), and 2) poor or non-existent medical facilities. Back to the 'West'. All countries now have a good system of HIV testing in place, and that's fine, but the system as a whole is only as good as the number of people who come forward for testing. A small number of those in any high-risk category will always decline to be tested, but even so hopefully few people in western countries now present with full-blown AIDS without any prior medical intervention. That was not the case prior to HIV being eminently treatable by drugs. There was nothing that could be done to prevent it. Many of the patients presenting at hospital were suffering from unusual cancers, or conditions not normally seen in such relatively young patients. One such was Karposi's Sarcoma, previously a rare condition. It is my understanding, therefore, that the difference in prognosis between 'Africa' and any given western country (in the era before effective drug therapies) would have been down to the standard of living. An African person living in a country with a low standard of living would die much more quickly, probably before the onset of a life threatening cancer could take hold. I apologise for any mistakes! Above written from memory and I admit to making a few assumptions, albeit rational ones I hope.

That's interesting to know you can freeze them KhorTose. They have a short shelf life and I have been known to throw some away because I couldn't eat 'em in time! You are lucky you live (or lived) in Washington, a state I have never visited, if blueberries are so big there. One of my favourite breakfasts is blueberry pancakes! Last eaten by me when cooked by my cousin in Toronto on a recent visit there. Fountainhall you are right. The link below confirms that. I'm actually impressed that blueberries are so hard to grow and maybe I feel a bit more charitable now I know the complexities involved. http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090618153720AA43cJ2

Yes. I guess you're referring to hotels or guest houses that have a safe in your room. I prefer these for obvious reasons. Many places don't have a room safe. You can chooses not to stay in such an establishment, or use one of the boxes usually sited behind the reception desk. The Malaysia Hotel in Bangkok is a good example of this. You pay 500 baht deposit for the key. Clearly it isn't as convenient as having one in your room, but better than nothing!

As a shoe lover I envy anybody buying shoes that cost 7,000 baht. If money did indeed grow on trees this is where I'd head to buy mine. An endangered species, the hand-made shoe. http://www.johnlobbltd.co.uk/main/main.htm You often hear a gentleman's shoes tell you a lot about him. I usually take a quick peek to see how a fellow I'm introduced to is shod. Yummyacious indeed! I have every reason to believe those prices you quote Fountainhall are excessive. The price we typically pay in the UK is

I've much enjoyed reading Fountainhall and Patpat's debating the merits or otherwise of Islam. Good stuff. Back to Arabs and the way they are perceived by the gay community in Pattaya: Arabs are a minority in Pattaya just as gays are. There are many different sorts of 'Arab', as well as those often lumped into the Arab camp such as Persians (Iranians). As Thrillbill says, the 'Arab World' is extensive and it is misleading to draw conclusions regarding likely behaviours based on limited experience in a place such as Pattaya. First-time Arab visitors are variably (depending on their home country) disorientated and confused in a place such as Pattaya. Non-Arab gays in Pattaya are also very variable: Thais and falungs. The Thais comprise young men who look like boys, those who look like men (and indeed are) and those who look like ladies (but are not). That some Arabs and Persians have been reported to rub shoulders quite amicably with ladyboys and femboys is encouraging. Suspicion seems quite understandable. The Arabs stick with their kind and seem to enjoy loud music; gays may feel that an unwelcome intrusion in what they regard as their territory. A falung and a local Thai man, when seen together, are often made to feel unwelcome in non-gay areas frequented by straight falungs, but meet little or no hostility in an Arab-quarter. It would be presumptuous to say, but could it be that Arabs are basically more gay-friendly than their western counterparts? That their initial shyness comes across as aloofness, but once they work out what Pattaya is all about they are open and friendly. Of course, by the law of averages, some Arabs are gay. That must be very awkward for them.

Depends how 'gay bar' is defined I guess. This is one of the more discreet places. My idea of the opposite of that would be those bars that post those pesky 'encouragers' who (if you are to their liking) can (at least try to) bodily frog-march you into the bar. All good fun, but sometimes it can be a bit tiresome if you've had to dodge one after the other. Right opposite the DD Inn is the back entrance to the Bamboo Bar which is what I would call a genuine gay bar. It would seem that way. Just to be awkward I shall dissent from the general impression. I'd say the chap on the left was the cutest, but so what? Having to decide on the basis of a single posed photo is unrealistic. In real life we could interact with each of the three young men in turn in order to make a 'considered' preference. My betting would be the guy on the right would steal my heart (well, not really, my wallet maybe). He's a bit older but he looks to me to have a nice personality (how can I tell? fair point - just my impression, which goes to show in the final analysis this is just a bit of harmless fun!)

I'm sure most of us are aware the black box from Air France flight AF447 has been located. In view of the very interesting discussion in the Beer Bar nearly 2 years ago I thought it worth linking it up. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/8541703/3.5-minutes-of-terror-Air-France-crash-dropped-at-10000-feet-a-minute.html

Take a peek (or another look if you've already seen her) at the ladyboy Bob posted on the Ladyboy, ladyboy come out and play thread. Her name is Areeya. Maybe we can get a few clues from that nice photo. As we all know, for every ladyboy we see with silicon-enhanced breasts, there are many many more who cannot afford the money for this op, a ballpark figure for which is 50,000 baht. (The photo says $4000 but you can get it for less than that). With that hefty investment behind her, assuming the ladyboy wishes to work in a bar, she's got a massive incentive to prove to herself it was all worthwhile. She's going to fight for every customer, using every trick in the book. Any ladyboy thinking she can get away with doing Gaybutton's least favourite, the 'one knee shuffle', will soon have to perk up her act. In addition, ladyboys are proud of their 'new' bodies and, quite naturally, want to flaunt it, and flaunting yourself? . . . well, if that isn't fun, what is? Over in the gay go-go bars, on the other hand (and assuming it's a bar which doesn't employ any ladyboys), boys are boys. But there is another important distinction. Some are gay and some are not. I certainly would not dispute that gay boys are also proud of their bodies, but there is a much greater likelihood they take it for granted. When you add to the mix in the average gay go-go bar those boys who're straight, sometimes referred to as 'gay-for-pay', it seems to me the chances are the fun-quotient will be lower in bars like these compared to the average ladyboy bar. If any of us ever venture into girly go-go bars perhaps they can chip in here. If girly bars are fun places too, like the ladyboy establishments appear to be, that suggests the gay places are definitely not doing certain things right. If the girly bars are also a bit hum-drum then that'd mean (unless the ladyboy bar-owners have some kind of magic potion) that it's the ladyboys themselves who make the difference. I have no evidence for this but my explanation does at least seem rational to me. As to the question "why don't the gay-bar owners do something about it", I have no explanation.

Nowt! In fact that's just how I would describe myself. But we have to accept the fact some men always rate sex their #1 reason for being in a particular country or place, whilst others are more pragmatic. Take Thailand: If I am in Pattaya my behaviour and expectations are a whole lot different than if I am on a road trip up north or north-east. Another comparison would be if I had a travelling companion versus travelling solo.

Is a sex traveller the same as a sex tourist? Probably . . . However, forget about the sex part for a minute. Many people who visit foreign countries seem to prefer the term traveller. To me 'traveller' implies an individual or a small group of people who book all aspects of their flights and travel itinerary themselves and usually prefer to make their own decisions about where to visit and where to eat, drink, sleep etc. They may ask for help and advice but never take what is written in a guide book as gospel; their opinions are their own. Some 'travellers' deliberately seek out places well off the beaten track and hate it when they come across a fellow kinsman doing likewise. The expression 'roads less travelled' comes to mind. I think I would be correct in saying a person who books a holiday with a company that specialises in travel, such as a travel agent or on-line business, in which their itinerary (but not accommodation) is pre-planned is generally regarded as being a tourist, as is somebody booking a package holiday. If we accept these rough and ready distinctions, and clearly there will be many shades of grey, how would a person visiting a foreign country solely or primarily for the purposes of indulging in sex with local people best be described? Sex tourist or sex traveller, or am I wasting my time even hinting that there may be a difference?

ORCHID GUESTHOUSE - A REVIEW The Orchid is a Boutique-style guesthouse situated in Jomtien just a 2 minute walk to Papa David's. It is very convenient for the beach and the Jomtien entertainment complex (The Venue etc). I stayed there in March 2011 for 12 days. I had come to Pattaya from Isarn unexpectedly so had not booked anywhere. I spent one night in a gay guest house near the beach but it was only so-so. I checked out the next morning and called into the Orchid 'on spec'. I was lucky, they had a room available. The manager, Nui, is extremely friendly and efficient. He's only too happy to help with suggestions if you are stuck for things to do. If you have a companion staying the night he will check their ID. As well as a key to your room, you are given a key to operate the main door so you can come and go as you please. There are 4 rooms, one on the ground floor that I imagine would be suitable for a disabled person, and 3 on the first floor. There is no lift (elevator) which is only to be expected in such a small establishment. All the rooms have decent sized beds, en suite bathroom, plenty of storage space, cable TV and DVD player, fridge, Tea/coffee, air con + ceiling fan, and (very importantly) a safe. The upstairs rooms open out onto a small balcony with table and chairs. This adds to the feeling of spaciousness. The area is very quiet and safe. Unless you are a very light sleeper a good night's sleep is assured. (I mention this because from time to time we hear of places that can be a bit noisy into the wee small hours). There is free wi-fi for those with their own laptops; those like me without are welcome to use the PC in the lobby (no charge). There is a Family Mart and 7-11 just by the Hanuman statue. In the next soi there are a couple of places you can get your laundry done. Room rates start from 650 baht a night. I paid just over 700 baht per night as March still counted as high season. Contact details http://www.orchid-guesthouse-pattaya.com email: info@orchid-guesthouse-pattaya.com phone: 038 251 568 Mobile: 085 160 5668

I would prefer that too. The main Gay Thailand forum gets most views and that's fair enough because those readers who initially come to the home page, perhaps after using a search engine, accessed via: http://www.gaythailand.com/ and who want more information or who wish to post an enquiry such as the recent one from Manforlads, are presumably primarily interested in gay issues and so make a beeline for the forum headed Gay Thailand. There is also the Articles on Thailand forum. If they have time to hang around and to check out the Beer Bar, fine, but most likely they will not bother. The way I see it the Beer Bar forum is mainly catering for regular posters or readers. These people can decide for themselves, when starting a new topic, which forum to place it in. We should not have to ask or rely on a mod to do that for us. If a 'newbie' slips up and posts in the wrong forum then by all means step in mods, but by and large leave it up to us to decide where it should go. One other point, which was mentioned in passing by Fountainhall in another thread: casual readers of this Message Board are wondering why all-and-sundry topics are being lumped together in the Gay Thailand forum. I think if we put ourselves in their shoes it is easy to see it doesn't make a very good impression.

http://www.krispykreme.com Inserted a hyperlink for ya, even so I ain't clickin' on it. I'm mighty fearful I may become one of them who just can't say no!

I read today on another site that Obama's approval rating has shot up. Bin Laden's death is certainly in his interests. Surely Obama's worst nightmare must be that the guy killed in the shoot-out was a double!

Above taken from a 'Skytrax' quote in an earlier post from Fountainhall. I've been to HK but as I am not an owl cannot confirm the anonymous contributor to Skytrax's experience. Surely HK is a 'city-that-never-sleeps' kind of place buzzing with activity 24 hours a day? As for booking cheap anything, whether they be flights, hotel rooms, hire cars, you name it, I tend to adopt a cynical attitude as to the likelihood of my obtaining whatever I am trying to purchase at anything like the bargain price advertised. If I come anywhere close I am pleasantly surprised, but if not c'est la vie.

You expected to be deleted Fountainhall? Well, I do too. This thread has taken a turn for the better! I love doughnuts but seldom buy any. A good one should have the consistency of something like a bagel, dense and chewy, and not too sweet. Before my sweet tooth was excised, I used to like the ones with jam in the middle. Is my lack of enthusiasm for so many nowadays down to the 'air filling' as KT implies? They also, to my mind, seem expensive for what they are. I am surprised to see how much they cost in Thailand. So, regarding all those KK addicts, may I offer this word of warning: A sucker is born every minute!