omega

Which model? There are many that have come forward and given their stories to the BBC. One of the men said did indeed say that, and said it about the party after he was recruited by another man who had been supporting him financially. Others reportedly did not know that sex was the purpose of the party. And you're ignoring the entirely the account of Mr Bradbury who alleges that the middleman demand sex for the contact with A&F. Many of the men said that they attended more than one party becuase they were still under the impression that it would further their modelling career. The article isn't clear on whether they were given modelling work with A&F after.

You say that I missed your point on the gardener, I did not. You didn't quote my response, so let me put it again: "Your gardner is paid for a specific service - Gardening. Presumbly, he advertised that service, and you engaged him for that service. No that's not "manipulative and shady", and if you read my post carefully, I never said it was. What would have been "manipulative and shady" is if you'd demanded your gardner give you a blow job in order for you to engage his services as a gardener. It would have been even more shady, if after getting the blow job, you subsequently did not engage their services. Even more manipulative and shady, would have been if you had threatened to ensure that they would never find work as a gardener if they didn't accede to your demand." Putting this into the context of A&F story. The men were models. They were seeking work as models. In seeking work with A+F, they encountered a middle-man, a "gatekeeper" of acccess to A+F CEO who demanded sex for that access, and who would then pay the models "for their time" after they gave him the sex. This then set the models up for a similar situation when they were invited to the A+F CEO's parties. Sex in exchange for access, with money paid after to turn it into a sex for money transaction. The shady parts here is that the alleged "gatekeeper" did exactly that. Models who refused his demands for sex were not invited to these parties, clearly because they would refuse sex for "opportunities". The subsequent payments after that effectively turned the men from models to sex workers, changing the terms of engagement from "I'll give you modelling work for sex" to "here's some cash for that sex". This is all substantially different from engaging a gardener or a sex worker who is clear and consenting about what they are, what they're offering, and negotiates their fee in advance.

Not sure how useful it would be in a noisy bar.

If I may, I'll clarify using your own example, even if it would be a little to absurd to actually happen in real life: Your gardner is paid for a specific service - Gardening. Presumbly, he advertised that service, and you engaged him for that service. No that's not "manipulative and shady", and if you read my post carefully, I never said it was. What would have been "manipulative and shady" is if you'd demanded your gardner give you a blow job in order for you to engage his services as a gardener. It would have been even more shady, if after getting the blow job, you subsequently did not engage their services. Even more manipulative and shady, would have been if you had threatened to ensure that they would never find work as a gardener if they didn't accede to your demand. There is of course, a huge amount of grey area when it comes to human relationships. Sex work itself is frought with grey area. But on analysis of situations we can determine how deep into the dark a given situation is. This A&F situation seems pretty dark. The allegations suggest a deliberate abuse of power. Your promiscuous and fecund father perhaps promised love and marriage to his paramours. Or perhaps he just had that way with words that got his ladies into bed without actually promising them anything. On the face of the stated facts, I'd suggest that his actions are more towards the lighter end of the greyscale.

Oh absolutely agree with that, but I won't worry it too much. If the baht recovers just in time for my visit to LoS, then so be it... if it falls further, then so be it

I'm not such a big spender nor penny pincher that I would neccessarily see the difference too much. It might pay for a massage... one without a HE.

It's even more shocking when you consider they have security guards and metal detectors at every entrance. Clearly pointless security theatre.

I tend to ignore mainstream media when it comes to their reporting of science. The journalists are not scientists themselves. They don't understand the science. They don't understand what the studies they're reporting on actually mean. They just regurgitate it into some form that'll get people clicking on their article. Either read the study for yourself, or don't and go about your life as normal.

I think the problematic issue is the offer of "opportunities". Whether that offer got realised for most of the models or not, it's pretty shitty way to get someone do something they wouldn't normally want to do. It's the difference between performing sex acts to get a job and performing sex acts as your job. In my mind one is manipulative and shady, and the other is perfectly fine way to make money.

Another wonderful report. Hopefully tonights fare went well. On tipping, I think the meaning of the word in relation to sex services is different matter to the use of the word else where. Hopefully, the service provider is indepdendent, and with a minimum its right that good service is rewarded. When it comes to the more mundane service industry, such as waiters, bar staff and such, I tend to think it is delegating the responsibility of performance management onto the customer. It's an awful way to do business for the customer, and the staff. Makes the employer money tho.

I don't know of any other sites that are apparently not owned by Booking.com. I don't know how much responsibility we as consumers have in this matter. It's not like we have too much of a choice. If the option to pay at the hotel is as cheap as the pay via booking.com method, then I'll use it. Otherwise, I see no reason why I should pay more for the hotels convenience of getting paid - it should be the other way around. The hotel should make whats most convenient for them the cheapest option for me.

Choices were made, we live and learn

every bulge is nice, no? And he is hiding his...

This could make good sense to help promote development of ASEAN if the focus is on building infrastructure projects that will provide benefits to the host nations after. Unfortunately, most countries have been more interested in the prestige of hosting, and would prefer to build vanity projects that look good for a few weeks, and then slowly rot and crumble.

You just don't want the competition for the twinks

I agree. If you've just got a small bag, sure it makes sense. But if you've got a big heavy suitcase, It's worth that ~400-500 baht to arrive at the door.

Yup, was a great pun

This is my plan, at the very least it will be a few days on the beach getting a tan

Sometimes boys are just not photogenic, or the lighting in the pictures doesn't suit them

Cub is a young bear. An otter is hairy, and yet slim and lithe

In case anyone isn't aware, most countries will refuse entry to foreigners with less than 6 months validity on their passport.

Oversized & hairy... No thanks I don't mind an otter now and again

Like fishing in a fishing pond filled with fish

Would be a really good resource for the forum if we had a thread that kept everyone updated with the various bar/massage shop Line IDs I'd be happy to contribute when I actually find some

Looks like a tasty treat... And the food looks good too