Londoner

As Vessey says, it is not a question of physique. My friend began his journey as a "funny khatoey", that is participating in Thai-orientated khatoey shows. I saw one in Pattaya; it presented not only the attractive but competitions for the ugly, for the over-thirties, for the overweight- "Ms Jumbo"- and for the comic. He won the "comic" prize. Another strange manifestation of this phenomenon is in the rural area where P lives, where two very young boys- I mean pre-pubescent- are accepted by the community as prototypes for ladyhood. I was astonished also to hear that the school he attended as teenager held a khatoey show. This was thirty plus years ago; I suspect that attitudes may have changed.

The Internationale , sung in Thai.

Two straight men I know- yes, I do mix outside my community- are obsessive about Thai ladyboys....at a distance I must emphasise. I'm no expert but I have watched the two-way transition of P's cousin, whom I first met as a twenty-three year old in 2006. He was a good-looking, rather femme gay guy. Over the next eight years I watched him slowly but inexorably become "a lady". Hair, jewellery, dresses, speech, behaviour... step by step he was transformed. About thirteen years ago he became a mamasan in one of the "men for ladies" clubs in Third Road, even appearing on Thai TV. Then, when he reached forty, he started moving in the opposite direction and now dresses as a man, if a little eccentrically; and the cosmetics and the dresses are gone. P tells me he still uses Khatoey Argot, of which I understand not a word, but this remains the last vestige of his rather odd gender-journey.

One poster commenting on another topic mentioned an unfortunate experience in a straight hotel; this set me wondering whether such behaviour is commonplace in Thailand. I think not; it is true that when I'm with P in a hotel we don't look like a typical bar-boy and his client; he's now forty-three and I'm.... a little older. However, even considering our earliest trips to hotels outside Bangkok and Pattaya we never faced problems even when he was in his youthful-twenties. Planes, airports, restaurants, hotels....nothing. The only time when we have felt uncomfortable - and I stress felt- was when we were on a Phi Phi Island boat trip from Krabi which included a shared lunch for groups of eight or so tourists. Even then, it was hard to put our collective finger on why we both felt that way and both wanted to leave the table. It certainly wasn't the young Chinese (and noisy) girls who constituted the majority of the passengers. The people whom we felt were embarrassed by us were middle-aged, white and English-speaking. Only outside did we discover that we both felt the same way. An elderly Italian guy on the boat later went out of his way to be friendly to us. Perhaps he had noticed a frisson. A question; would a falang visitor in his fifties with a twenty year old Thai girl arouse cold looks or comments? Was it our sexuality or the assumption that our relationship was commercial that aroused the discomfort?

Your wish is my command....I'll be there in a few weeks. With P. And the squirrels.

I note Travellerdave's comments about the gay clientele at Zing. He recommended Agate to us about six years ago and we've been happy there ever since. I'm sure he's right; Agate's guests are more likely to be families than single gay men or couples like us, particularly in High Season. There was a higher proportion of gay customers when we started staying there. However, we're not bothered; we are left alone, indeed, we seldom come into contact with others even at breakfast where we eat earlier than most. We've never had any issues in any of the Thai hotels we've stayed in, from Krabi to Chiang Rai. Speaking of breakfast, Travellerdave is correct; Agate's breakfasts are predominantly Thai-based, which is why P likes them so much. He thinks the quality is high and he has exacting standards. As for me, I never want a cooked breakfast anywhere and so I'm not concerned.....and the coffee is good. We like sitting on our own near the waterfall just outside the restaurant. Our only companions tend to be the squirrels who nest above the waterfall. I wish I were there now!

See above.

I was referring to the Sunee dancers in the Jomtien Complex. I haven't been to the old Sunee Plaza for years!

I note the number of videos of the dancers on YouTube... they seem to be getting some world-wide attention! Good, they deserve it. I often see them arriving at in the afternoon for rehearsals; they work hard.

Recalling Groucho's remarks about clubs, " I wouldn't want to go to any orgy that invited me."

Visitors of my generation may recall that, back in the day, photographs in Boyztown- the soi itself- were forbidden. Ambiance used to have, for many years, a very nice guy as doorman/ security guard. I respected him because he was so kind to the guys I offed, treating them as customers, the same as me. One of his tasks was to stop-or at least discourage- anyone using their cameras to take photographs of the soi. Oh for the blessed days before the advent of mobile phones! I'm only joking about that...I think.

That happened to you too?

It's long way for a motorcycle taxi. I wouldn't, but it has to be admitted that nowadays I find it hard even to get on the d**n thing. I remember too well my ride to Jomtien many years ago on a motor cy operated by someone who looked no more than fourteen. He had yet to learn the meaning of fear. Go by car!

A Pattaya guy once said "too much" when I gave him his cash. Did I give him more than the going-rate? No. Or perhaps my performance was so earth-shatteringly good that he thought I deserved a free ride. No....that doesn't sound like me either. Most likely he was showing Buddhist compassion for an old guy who was obviously past his best. .

Apologies for the reminiscence...! Many years ago, I was dining at Balcony when one of the waiters, a very cute guy, seemed to take more of an interest in me than I expected. I'd never considered for one moment that the waiters there were "offable" and so I was merely polite. The next day I was in Babylon and whom should I encounter....? And yes, we did. Why he was interested in me I shall never know.

I am intrigued by the empty buildings in the JC, some of which seem to have been slowly deteriorating for many years, although the ground floors have flourishing business premises. Since Covid, new businesses- bars and restaurants- have sprung-up near Dick's and have made the area more vibrant while a couple of these huge buildings remain ugly and unused. With all the new buildings in the area, why so? Then there's the newly decorated and renovated (post-Covid) three story block- seemingly apartments- directly opposite The Agate- which remains, as I can discern, empty. Any explanations as to why this is?

It's place to visit with a partner, not in the expectation of finding one there.

Only in Thailand?

Returning to daydreamer's evocative photos, I am reminded that, in their heyday- circa 2005 - they were all well-patronised and all well-staffed. Of all those named and/or shown, only Charlie Boys wasn't a twink bar, its dancers being much the same "type" as found in BBB, suggesting that the tastes of today's punters have changed. I believe that the same could be said of Bangkok's scene. Is this reflective of national tastes? The influx of Chinese a few years back? Perhaps replacing Japanese? Just a guess.

We wandered past Poseidon last night and , as always when we pass, we see a busy, thriving restaurant. It interests me that there are always tables occupied by mixed Thai/falang groups, and it sets me wondering how much (or perhaps little) the Thais enjoy this standard of western food. Of course, there are Thai dishes if the answer is "not at all." The only other "quality" western restaurant in Pattaya I know with a similar customer base is Le Bordeaux. I recall P's first visit there, long ago, and how fascinated I was to see how he responded to la cuisine francaise. Very well, as it happened. And I recall his being delighted, and perhaps relieved, when he saw the clientele: predominantly gay, or so it seemed that particular evening.

Yes, City became Gacuya. It was rumoured to belong to a policeman. The mamasan was a flamboyant character whom I recall wearing outrageous, feathered hats. She could go outside and then suddenly open the door theatrically to re-enter, expecting the clientele to look round in admiration. We tended not to do so. It was a twink bar. And one of my favourites..

Book quickly. We arrived yesterday and the Complex was as busy as I've seen it since last High Season. I know that it was Jomtien's Loy Khatong but according to hotel staff, the season has started-off very well. Excellent news; it was very subdued when we were here last in July.