Gaybutton

I don't understand why you are using a real estate agent at all. Why? It's easy to find rental property via classified ads, billboards at grocery stores, etc. To me, using a real estate agent is wasting a lot of money for nothing. My suggestion is to try on your own first and use a real estate agent only as a last resort, if all else fails.

Some banks still permit you to open an account with a tourist visa, but it will be much easier if you have a Type "O" visa. Since you are planning out your retirement, I suggest not trying to cut corners during this stage, but spending a few extra dollars to do things the right way and avoid problems later.

To the best of my knowledge, any bank passbook will do, but it must be from the bank at which the "Letter for Immigration" is generated.

All of my neighbors are Thai.

I would not dispute what the British Consul says, but apparently, based on what you are saying, it applies only in Pattaya. However, if it was me, then despite what the Consul is saying about Pattaya, I still would not want to be the one experimenting to find out if he's right. As far as I know, no matter what the policy is in Pattaya, the rule does state that the money is to be in the account for at least three months. If that is correct, then Pattaya is looking the other way at that rule. If Pattaya is looking the other way, do you really want to risk that they'll be looking the other way the day you apply for your visa renewal? In any case, I would think if a person is wealthy enough to have 800,000 baht in a Thai bank account at all, then he probably has a lot more than that in his account for a lot longer than three months anyway. Of course, there is always the proof-of-income statement. Getting the proof-of-income statement is certainly simple enough for Americans. Apparently it is also simple enough to get one no matter which country you come from. I have neither read nor even heard any stories of anybody having any difficulty obtaining a proof-of-income statement from his embassy.

I'm one of the people who lives in a non-gated community. I don't think I'm any less safe than those who do live in gated communities. My home was broken into once. Meanwhile I have a friend who lives in a gated community, with security guards, and his home was also broken into. If a burglar wants to get into your home he'll find a way, no matter how well you have secured your home. You do the best you can. That's all you can do. Isn't that true no matter where in the world you live? Since the break-in at my home, I secured my home as best as I can. I feel perfectly safe. I also am fortunate that my neighbors all know me and we all look out for each other. If any of my neighbors spot anything going on, I know they'll call the police. I think it's a combination of how well the home is secured, the neighbors, and sheer luck. I certainly don't dispute the idea that a gated community with security guards is a deterrent, but just how much of a deterrent is anybody's guess. I think there's a big difference between how safe you feel and how safe you actually are.

Ok, I think I understand now. If you are using the 800,000 baht method: 1. The first time you apply for the retirement visa, then the 800,000 baht must be in a Thai bank account a minimum of three months prior to the fist time the visa is applied for. 2. For retirement visa renewals, then 800,000 baht must be in a Thai bank account, but not necessarily for three months. The minimum time it must be in the account is questionable and there is no set, in-writing, policy about that, making it pretty much up to the immigration officer handling your application. 3. The "not necessarily three months" part applies only in Pattaya. Whether it applies in any other offices is as yet unknown to us. Is that correct?

For those of you who wish to keep up with Kevin Quill's plight, I was informed that he was moved to the Klong Prem Prison, in Bangkok, a day or two ago. I understand he is a bit happier there and will have access to competent medical facilities, which was of great concern. That is all I know at this point.

That is true, but you had to go to Singapore to get the mortgage. From this article, I'm getting the impression that now you can get the mortgage within Thailand. The article doesn't make that clear, at least not to me. Does anyone out there know for sure?

If you want to do a quote, the easiest way is to simply hit the reply button and then delete everything except the part you want to quote, as I did above. Make sure the end quote is there. It goes in brackets, but I'll put the example in parentheses: (/quote). That has to be there with the slash, but in brackets [ ], or the quote won't show. Now, all I'm trying to say is to use common sense precautions. After all, you don't know the boy. Sometimes the cutest cherubs can turn into the worst nightmares. Make sure the boy is who he says he is and has an ID card to prove it. Make sure he is at least 18 years old. Make sure, if you are staying in a hotel or condo, that he leaves his ID card with the front desk or security guard and will not get it back until they get an "all clear" from you. Don't have valuables or other temptations sitting out where he can get at them. The boy will expect you to take those sorts of precautions. In other words, Lead him Not into Temptation, especially if you are going to have him sleep over. I've lost count of how many times I've heard stories and read stories in the English language media about farang who had a boy sleep over, and then woke up to find the boy gone, along with money, telephones, cameras, gold, and other valuables gone. That sort of thing can also happen during a "short time" encounter, usually when the farang is in the shower and the boy has a few minutes alone. There have even been stories about farang who had lived with a boyfriend for months or even years, and then came home one day to find his safe or other hiding place had been opened, and hundreds of thousands of baht and valuables lost to a boy who they had come to fully trust. The boy, of course, disappeared off the face of the earth and the farang was left heartbroken and devastated. I am not trying to say this sort of thing is likely to happen to you, but it makes sense to me to do what you can to make damned sure it doesn't happen to you. It does happen often enough that taking simple, common sense precautions is the thing to do if you want the best assurance that problems will not occur. If you are using online hook-up web sites, most of the boys are probably very nice and they're not out to rob you. They're most likely hoping for money and the possibility of a relationship with someone who will "take care" them (a sugar daddy). But if you don't take simple precautions, then sooner or later you're likely to bring a boy back who turns out to be really bad news, and you'll find that out the hard way.

Do I understand that correctly? Those using the 800,000 baht method only have to do that once and never again? What do they have to show when doing renewals other than the letter from the bank? If that is the case, then I have learned something new. I thought you would have to have the 800,000 baht in the account for three months every year or change over to the proof-of-income statement method. If that what the British Consul is saying, then I assume he is correct. Am I understanding you correctly?

I suppose, to reassure people, within the tenth post on this thread the person who wrote it said that you have to renew your retirement visa at least thirty days in advance of its expiration date. That is not correct. I just renewed my own, a grand total of two days prior to the expiration date, with no problems or questions whatsoever. In other words, there is no such requirement. Either the Immigration officer who told him that is clueless about their own rules or that particular office is making up their own rules. You can renew your retirement visa on the very day it expires. I actually did that a couple years ago, only 40 minutes before the Pattaya Immigration office was to close for the day. Again, I had no problems at all and was asked no questions.

The following appears in the PATTAYA DAILY NEWS: (for photos, see: http://www.pattayadailynews.com/shownews.p...NEWS=0000006270 ) _____ ELDERLY BRITISH MAN FALLS TO HIS DEATH FROM PATTAYA HOTEL Pol.Lt.Col. Thawatchai Sudsakorn, Pattaya Investigator, received a report on June 11, 2008, at 7am, that a foreign man had fallen to his death from the 3rd floor of Diana Estate Hotel, in Soi Bua Khao, Central Pattaya. Pol.Col.Nopadol Wongnom, Pattaya Superintendent and Sawang Boriboon rescue accordingly went to investigate. At the scene, police found Mr. Roy Norton (75), a British citizen, lying dead in the rear car park of the hotel. He was wearing a red patterned shirt and brown shorts. There were broken glasses and a hotel room key by the side of his body. On the 3rd floor, there was a pair of shoes, apparently belonged to the deceased, which police kept as evidence. A police investigator examined the body and found the man had sustained head injuries, broken arms and legs and there was blood coming out of his mouth. Initial estimates assessed the time of death as not more than 20 minutes previously and there was no sign of his being attacked. Mrs. Jamnong Ratanajaruen-norakul (40), a hotel maid, told police that Mr. Norton had been a hotel guest for about 7 years and this time he had been staying at a room on the 3rd floor that she regularly cleaned. Normally, he liked to drink and used to tell her about his English ex-wife whom he had divorced long ago. Apparently, he had had two children with his ex-wife who are now grown up. Miss Jamnong said that while she was working in the office on the ground floor with other staff members, she heard the sound of a heavy object hitting the ground and she and her colleagues rushed out to have a look, only to find Mr. Norton lying dead; she then reported the incident to the police. Hotel staff led the police to examine Mr. Norton's room and found no trace of fighting, and all of his property in an orderly condition. Inspecting the air circulation window on the staircase near Mr. Norton's room, police found evidence of footprints and signs of climbing consistent with the apparent trajectory of the deceased's body as it hit the ground. Presumably, Mr. Norton had climbed up to the air circulation window and leapt off to commit suicide, but the motive is still unknown. Police assumed that the man was distressed because of personal problems. However, the British Embassy will be informed and the body will be handed over for an autopsy to ascertain the real cause of death.

The following appears in the PATTAYA DAILY NEWS Bangkok Bank - First Thai Bank to Offer Mortgages to Foreigners In a welcome breakthrough in Thai mortgage policy, foreigners will now be able to apply for mortgage loans thanks to a precedent set by Bangkok Bank (BBL); a move expected to be followed shortly by other Thai banks, keen to tap the foreign property investor market. Previously, Thai banks were extremely reluctant to grant mortgages to foreigners due to their poor credit risk and the current laws governing Thai property ownership. This move by Bangkok Bank will put Thailand, more on a par with its neighbours in Vietnam and Malaysia, who do offer mortgages to foreigners. Chintan Mahida from the overseas property blog stated: "Thailand is now set to move up the ranks in overseas property, thanks to the Thai mortgage change. This is a positive move by the Bangkok Bank, having access to Thai mortgage finance will undoubtedly generate a surge in demand from buyers." Local developers and real estate agents have also welcomed Bangkok Bank's move, seeing it as a means to restore confidence and kick start the Thai property market once more after its recent downturn, due to current political unrest and renewed fears of another coup. The mortgages are available currently up to a limit of Bt25 million, available in US dollars, Singapore dollars or euros (but not Baht!) via Singapore for a wide range of purchasers and Hong Kong for their citizens only. Previously, private off-shore personal loans or lines of credit, especially in the Isle of Man, were available, but at unattractive rates. The Head of the Thai Desk at the Singapore branch of Bangkok Bank, Yaovaluk Suksathit, said that currently the bank has made 20 loans. The Singapore branch has been more assertive in its approach than Hong Kong, which only extends mortgages on freehold condominiums, as their 49% freehold terms and 30 year leases (in some cases, 90 years in perpetuity) carry less risk than houses, whereas in Singapore, loans will be considered for other types of property, including homes on leased land Prospective purchasers can now borrow up to 70% of the property appraisal value or the purchase price, whichever is lower, dependent on the applicant's earning capacity, over a maximum loan period of 10 years. A buyer interested in purchasing a condominium costing Bt20 million, for instance, should ideally be earning around Bt300,000 per month. However, all that glitters is not gold, as they say. Chintan Mahida, for example strongly advises prospective loanees to do their due diligence. If one was a Hong Kong citizen, for instance, one must pay a processing fee of about Bt125,000 baht on acceptance of the bank's letter of offer. Approximately Bt50,000 baht of this is refunded when the loan is drawn down. In addition, initially, 1.5% of the loan amount must be handed over to the bank as a "prepayment fee." In addition market fluctuations, interest rate increases, rising costs of living and other variable factors must be taken into consideration. In borrowing, a safe rule of thumb is to assume, for example on Bt 1 million, double the sum borrowed, which now amounts to Bt2m, and then halve it again ie 50% of the loan. All told one will have to repay Bt 2.5m over the loan period. Ideally, those in the know advise prospective borrowers not to listen to sales hype from real estate agents as they are only interested in their commission, not in one's your ability to repay one's loan. The best criterion is only to buy if you really need to and have sufficient reserves to cover emergencies and other contingencies and also take into consideration the bogey of negative equity. This, as speculators in the US housing market found to their cost, is an ever present threat, where the market value slumps lower than the resale value of the property, leaving you heavily in debt. Take heed; follow your head, not your heart!

Yes, the TM card is the departure card that was stapled into your passport upon your arrival in Thailand. I got my bank letter this week, and for the first time it actually occurred to me to ask what it says. The bank officer with whom I spoke speaks excellent English. He said the letter simply certifies that you do indeed have an account with that particular bank and it says how much money was in that account at the time you asked for the letter. He also said, and I agree, that it really doesn't make any difference how much or how little is in the account as long as you have an account at all (when using the proof-of-income method). You have no need to worry that the bank won't understand what you want. All you have to do is say to a bank officer, "I need letter for Immigration." Believe me, the dinkiest little bank in the most remote corner of Thailand will know exactly what you need. I guarantee you won't be the first farang who has asked for it. It's a standard form. They don't sit there and write out a letter by hand, at least not at my bank. They crank up the computer, write the information on a bank-authorized template, and print it out. The letter is not free. The banks charge for it, usually anywhere between 100 to 300 baht, depending on which bank you deal with. Since they charge for it, you can rest assured they know exactly what you want. Besides, there is only one kind of letter the banks are ever asked to write for Immigration, and that's the letter. If you still feel that your bank may not understand what you want, then all you have to do is walk into your bank tomorrow and ask them for the letter for Immigration and see if they understand. They'll ask for your passbook and your passport, so make sure you have them both with you. You can either pay for the letter or you can tell them you don't need it now, but were just trying to make sure they understood what you want. __________________ Added later: As an afterthought, let's assume the worst case scenario, that being the bank doesn't have a clue as to what you need. If that happens (and it won't) then all you would have to do then would be to go to your local Immigration office, tell them the bank didn't understand, and have someone there write a note explaining the requirement to the bank. I suppose you could also have the bank representative call Immigration and ask, although I'm sure the bank probably has on file the Immigration requirements. In short, the whole point of my long-winded response is to assure you there won't be any problem at all.

Now, you wouldn't be trying to twist my words around, would you? Ok. Many others have done the same thing. You have been lucky because of just that, sheer luck, without really knowing what to look for. That's good. I hope for your sake it continues and stays that way. I did say I've met them. I didn't say I took them all home with me. I have been lucky because I do know what to look for and I know what to accept and what to avoid. In a few years, so will you. I also speak the language fairly well. Do you? Yes, I do persist in advising caution and trusting nobody until they have proved themselves. That's why I have been lucky. I am happy to know, though, that after three months here you've got all the answers. Now, that wouldn't be me twisting your words around, would it?

What worries me is if the day will come when even those prices look good. I may have to do some belt tightening, if I can find a belt big enough to fit around myself.

I believe, but am not certain, they want you to sign those photocopies in their presence, not in advance. Ok, 2lz2p, we're 'go' for another year . . .

There are two stories here. The first is that Thai Airways ticket prices are to rise due to "no choice" fuel surcharges. For the same reason, the dramatically rapid rise in fuel prices, Bangkok taxis are raising their fares by 11%. Throughout Thailand, massive protests and demonstrations are expected to shortly occur because of the rapid rise in the cost of living and people simply cannot cope with it. The first story appears in the THE NATION: _____ THAI Announces Substantial Increases in Fuel Surcharges Boonsong Kositchotethana Thai Airways International (THAI) has bowed to the inevitable again and is passing on higher costs to travelers in a new round of fuel-surcharge increases. The increases, effective on June 25, are much more hefty than the previous adjustment on April 28 _ as much as 140% on certain international routes _ as jet fuel prices have since skyrocketed. Like other airlines across the region, the national carrier is struggling to cope with high jet fuel prices, which have doubled in the past 12 months, through surcharges, hedging and other cost cuts. Jet fuel prices on Tuesday were quoted at US$166.26 a barrel on Singapore's spot market, down by $5.91 from the previous day. THAI executives said the new round of fuel-surcharge increases, however, did not cover the actual incremental fuel costs as the airline was mindful of the impacts on passengers. The calculations of the fuel surcharges were based largely on jet fuel prices of $153 a barrel. Fuel is the largest expense of THAI, accounting for 34% of its total operating cost, compared to 15-18% for wages. The increases in fuel surcharges on THAI's international routes are much more dramatic than those on the domestic routes, mostly in the range of 60-70% with a peak of 140%. Fuel surcharges on all but one domestic route are to rise by 100 baht to 850 baht per leg. But the rate on Chiang Mai-Mae Hong Son doubles to 600 baht per sector. The fuel surcharges on international routes vary from one geographical area to another. __________ The second story appears in the BANGKOK POST: _____ Taxi Fares Set to Increase By Watcharapong Thongrung The Nation Published on June 12, 2008 Bangkok passengers will have to pay 11 per cent more on average for their taxi rides if Deputy Transport Minister Songsak Thongsri approves the proposed fare increase today. Chairat Sa-nguansue, acting director-general of the Land Transport Department, yesterday said Songsak would weigh two options. One would be to keep the charge for the first two kilometres at the current Bt35 but raise the subsequent rates by 50 satang to Bt1 per kilometre, depending on the distance travelled. The other option would be to increase flag fall to Bt40 but raise the subsequent rates by a flat 50 satang per kilometre. Songsak said he would discuss the fare hikes with Transport Minister Santi Prompat before issuing ministerial regulations enforcing them. "The average per-trip fare would go up between Bt12 and Bt14," Songsak said. With their fares frozen since 1996, taxi drivers are asking for an increase now because fuel prices keep rising. Vitoon Naewpanich, chairman of a taxi cooperative, was pleased with the two options even though the operators had asked for a 20-per-cent increase by having flag fall raised to Bt40 and the subsequent rate to Bt1 per kilometre. "We need the hike, because fuel becomes more costly while the cost of the car is up to Bt700,000, from Bt400,000 a few years ago." All sectors of the transport industry are raising their over oil prices. The Supreme Court yesterday lifted the Central Administrative Court's injunction against imposing a surcharge of 3 satang per kilometre on interprovincial coach fares. Bus operators will start levying the surcharge today, worth 40-180 per cent of bus fares. Lorry operators threatened to storm the capital if the government failed to respond to their requests for relief from fuel costs by next Tuesday. About 50 lorries were parked at Bang Na-Trat Road, Km 3. More from the North, Northeast, South and Eastern Seaboard also seized the main arteries in their regions: the Asia, Friendship and Phetkasem highways and Rama II and Laem Chabang roads. "Without any action by June 17, we will invade Bangkok," said Land Transport Federation secretary-general Thongyu Kongkhan. The federation came up with a three-point proposal. Chiefly, lorries must enjoy part of the government's cheap-diesel programme and be entitled to low-interest loans for converting their engines to natural gas for vehicles. "The problem is oil prices are moving constantly," Songsak said. "If we tackle this part, will the overall problem end? A supply of cheap diesel is only a temporary solution."

Just for the record, this morning I applied for my annual retirement visa renewal. I use the proof-of-income statement method. I was in and out of Immigration in ten minutes, with no problems at all.

Oh well, sorry about that. To respond to what you are saying, you have been lucky. Not everyone experiences the same luck. After living here for a number of years already, I'm seeing things a little differently than many who are in Thailand only for a limited time on a holiday. I have, thank God, the opportunity to meet a great more boys than the average holiday maker. My experience tells me that if you are going to err, then err on the side of caution. I used to say I trust people until they give me a reason not to trust them. After being here this long, at least as it applies to the Thai boys, I now say I trust nobody until I have known them long enough to be absolutely certain they can be trusted. As Asmerom says, I too have never had any kind of a serious problem with any of these boys, but I have experienced boyfriend horror stories and I know too many people and have heard too many reliable stories to feel differently. I believe the vast majority of these boys would never try to steal from you or cause you any other problems, but enough of them do, unfortunately, to cause problems for the rest of the honest boys, similar to the way a very few pedophiles give a negative reputation to the vast majority of farang who want nothing to do with under age boys. All anyone can do on these message boards is to warn about the realities here. Whether you choose to heed those warnings is, as the Thais say, "Up to you." In many cases, once something finally happens, now you start listening.

Although he came on strong, I agree with Buaseng that it's not a good idea to give out details about yourself in an online chat. Asmeron, if that's what you want to do, go ahead, but I don't recommend it either. If a boy agrees to meet you, I suggest the first meeting take place on neutral territory, where either one of you could decide to forget it if you so desire, without any kind of problem. (That's one of the things that makes the Malaysia Hotel's outdoor restaurant ideal, when in Bangkok). Have a cup of coffee, or something, with him somewhere first. Check his ID card while you're having that coffee and make sure about his age. Don't just take his word for it. You don't have a legal problem if the boy tells you online that he's 18. You only have a problem if you actually hook up with him for sexual purposes and it turns out he is under 18 despite what he told you. Make sure first. If you have any doubts, have your hotel check his ID. And make sure they actually check his ID card. Some hotels simply hold the card until the boy leaves without bothering to even look at it. You do have to be careful about these gay hookup sites. Until you meet with the boy, you have no way of knowing if he's even using a real photo of himself, or if any of the information he tells you or is on his profile is true. You do, however, have a pretty good idea as to what his real intentions are. Some of them may be sincere, but most of them are looking for a farang, any farang, who is going to give him money, or better still, become a sugar-daddy. The plus side of some of these gay hookup sites is that many of the boys are bar boys. There's probably quite a few on these sites lately considering Pattaya's current 'farang shortage.' Using these sites with the proper precautions can save you from going to the bars and going through the usual routine of buying drinks you don't want in the first place, the pushy mama-san, the boy sitting next to you rubbing your leg from crotch to knee, with the "Where you come from? What you name?" questions, etc, not to mention there are no off fees from gay hookup sites. The down side is you really have no idea who these boys are. If any of them are, to put it politely, "bad news," then you have very little you can do about it. At least, with a bar boy, you can go back to the bar if there has been any trouble, because the bar is required to keep copies of each boy's ID card. But if a gay hookup site boy causes you some kind of a problem, steals from you, or whatever, good luck trying to do anything about it. My guess is the boy didn't intentionally cut off the chat. Something else probably happened. Check again in a few hours. Chances are a message from him will be waiting. He didn't log on to Gay Romeo for his health. He's farang fishing. With you, he reeled one in, so he would very unlikely to cut it short without rhyme or reason. It is possible, I suppose, that he's not a bar boy or money boy, and really did get insulted at the mention of money, but I just now went to Gay Romeo and had a look at his profile to see for myself. I could be wrong, of course, but from what I saw, he might as well be wearing a sign that says "Money Boy." Not that being a money boy is a bad thing. If I were in their shoes I'd be doing the same. But what I saw on his profile certainly looks, to me, typical of the "let's soak the farang for as much as we can get" game player.

Yes, I know. Sometimes the baht buses obey those rules.

Monday, June 9: Opening rates: US Dollar: 33.11 Euro: 52.165 British Pound: 65.115 Australian Dollar: 31.7325 Canadian Dollar: 32.3875 _____ Closing rates: US Dollar: 33.04 Euro: 52.145 British Pound: 65.08 Australian Dollar: 31.675 Canadian Dollar: 32.3875

I had never heard of Camfrog until your post. Out of curiosity I downloaded it. I had to use a proxy server to get to the Camfrog web site. Apparently my Thai ISP has decided the Camfrog web site is a no-no. Once I got a proxy server I had no trouble getting into the web site. The program downloaded and installed with no problems. It works with no problem once downloaded and installed. I didn't need a proxy server to use the program. I only thing I needed a proxy server for was simply downloading the program. I tried the 18+ rooms. I got in with no problem and I didn't purchase anything. I got in just fine without purchasing the pro version. How are you using it? I can see the Thai boys just fine, but they're all typing in Thai. I didn't see any of them typing in English. How are you communicating with them? Also, there are quite a few gay rooms in the 18+ section. Do you have a favorite room to recommend?