TotallyOz Posted June 3, 2014 Posted June 3, 2014 I was chatting with a friend in Pattaya and was asked if I had heard about Neal. I don't know the details but the reports of his death seem to be true.
Guest travelerjim Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 RIP Neal...You struggled with health issues for many years...Your board presence, PM's and e-mails were perplexing to say the least...But you lived your life as you could...I cannot even imagine the countless number of times each week, month after month...& for years...where you had to visit Bangkok Pattaya Hospital for much needed care...sitting for hours after hours...just to stay alive.You were as Thais say "jai dee" a good heart...May you now be "at peace".tj
Guest ronthai Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 I am saddened to hear this news. I knew he wanted/needed to go back home to get the health care so needed and be with his family. Unfortunately that did not happen. I have known Neal as a very nice man, a good man, someone very entertaining to have a conversation with, in the last year I got to know him. He always was very good to the Thai people around him and would help anybody if needed. People should understand that a forum and real life are 2 different things in knowing somebody. Neal hated un-truthfulness and was not afraid too tell things his way/view, even if it was not the general common way. On occasion he did only read what he wanted and not the whole post/package, including his stroke(s) and forgetfulness, that crashed with many people, who just where not understanding. I for one called him a friend and he will be missed, by many people farang and Thai. RIP, my friend Ron
NIrishGuy Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 "Neal hated un-truthfulness" HA, you'll excuse me as I choke on my breakfast here on reading that particular line. But hey if you believed Neal to be your friend then I'm sorry for YOUR loss.
Guest scottishguy Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 Ronthai has of course been Neal's gimp on several boards - allegedly even setting a new one up with him at the very time the duplicitious sod was selling SGT to Surcrest. He (Ronthai) has posted mountains of abuse on various bitch boards, lashing out at all and sundry in the most vile manner. Not quite two peas in a pod, but not far off it. So his comments must be judged in that light.
Guest frequentflier Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 I met him a few times but did not find him friendly ,the few times that I spoke to him he was complaining about other business owners.In saying that its sad when someone passes away,his friends and family will miss him.R.I.P.
Guest ronthai Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 I should have expected NG and SG responce, did not know they posted here, they are SGT members. But they have the Freedom and Right to whatever they do in the free world, ... including their opinion. Unfortunately, I could ONLY HERE on Gay Thailand Forum. EXPRESS my view, ... Since this is the ONLY Gay Thailand Forum that has not silenced me. YES, SGT/SN, I am no longer a member asked to be again, well PRIVATE between Surfcrest and emails, him and me. I tried to login as my "ronpattaya" on gaybuttonthai.com, but that name is invalid, WHY GB. SURFCREST IS A MEMBER and many more Micheal or other boss/mod sorry, but here is all I can do. NOBODY is 100% bad, ... IT TAKES 2 TO TANGO, ... which means when there is a conflict, it is never just 1 persons fault I will not respond to any and all posts here, not GT Forum, I apologize. Just can not sit back and have a good man drag through the mud, just because he lost a little mind and the FORUM GAY SCENE CURRENT SGT, which is 90% against and many many LEFT the SGT FORUM, because of lies and deception after Neal, so they will never be heared. Which means all the dozens of farang friends and 100+ Thais he was friends with and helped, little or very much, will NOT post on any forum, so at least let it be heared here, that NEAL was a good man and one of the best, generous heart I have ever known, in just one year of having the pleasure. (post this or delete it)
Guest scottishguy Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 Trouble is Ron, it wasn't just 2 who were tango-ing, was it? Sure, if it was just one person that he had argued with/stabbed in the back/threatened with violence/threatened with lawsuits/called a "rapist", a "drug addict", a "drunk", or whose name/address/photograph/occupation and phone number he published in his various "playgrounds" in an attempt to embarrass/ruin/shut them up then maybe you could dismiss it as "a conflict" or "bad blood" However, as you now see unfolding bit by bit - there are a BUNCH of people he treated in that manner - and another bunch of people who have no idea yet how he was manipulating and bad-mouthing them behind their backs. Have you any idea the way he hounded LMTU - scrabbling about in the dirt trying to find something to embarass him, revealing his name and the extent of his financial difficulties, and posting that there was nothing wrong with LMTU as he lay dying of cancer????? For you to try to make excuses for him, does nothing for your own reputation (such as it is). Nothing excuses that type of behaviour. Doubtless there will be a few ppl who liked him, and good luck to them - but kindly spare us the attempted beatification of a turd. That's all I have to say here on the matter - thanks to the owner for his indulgence
Guest ronthai Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 Sorry, Micheal/Mod had to reply, ... NEVER heard anybody say or complain about the above. Let they come forward, since any lawsuites will be invalid anyway, now Neal has passed. You just still angry he said bye bye to you as a BAD moderator to which many SGT members complained? Or is it still just that your constant attacks to nice members with good posts over all the years, WHY I LEFT, ask BIG SGT man. Give it a break and get a live in next year maybe country Scotland or Great Britain. Maybe come to Thailand again sometimes and have a reality check
Guest ronthai Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 ... and CLOSED for me to make anymore replies. My friend Neal deserves better than this.
NIrishGuy Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 I should have expected NG and SG responce, did not know they posted here, they are SGT members.......... Let they ( sic) come forward. Do keep up Ron as speaking personally I have been a member here for quite some time - as you may have noticed at some time if you'd been concentrating when reading any one of my 260 odd posts - well that is if you had been reading and posting here with any "genuine" interest and not just scouring the boards for something / anything to dig and poke people with like some kind of frothing at the mouth demented kid in a school playground over there on YOUR / Neal's PERSONAL bitching board - which of course was all along just a mechanism for Neal to spew his bile and play his twisted game on but that you helped keep afloat for him until you both had YOUR fall out. And as for "let they (sic) come forward" - it seems you don't read the other boards then eh (even though they are 100% public and available for anyone on the net to read without their having to be a member) as if you did you will see that in fact no, not everyone shares your view with regards to your friend. So, I'll leave it at that, I've said my bit elsewhere and I've no wish to drag this discussion onto this board as well as you may have noticed that I specifically have avoided mentioning Neal, you or the other boards issues anywhere in any posts made to this board up until now and have only did so in reply to your post. To conclude Ron my view of you was always more as one who was more misguided than genuinely mean and I always likened you to the dim boy standing behind the bully in the playground shouting "yeah thats right, yeah go on Neal" but not quite truly understanding why you were saying it as I believe that you honestly and genuinely believed the shit that you were feed and you merely acted on that accordingly - along with your own little bit of chip on your shoulder of course when ALL the other board owners blocked you for being hateful on their boards, which was unfortunate but not I guess entirely not understandable. However your bitterness and the childish way in which chose to manifest your dislike of others was the saddest thing I felt and it did you no favours, so, as your "friend" is now gone to meet the great moderator in the sky I hope that YOU now can find some peace and lose this silly bitterness that you have wasted SO long over and return to being a solid genuine poster wherever you chose to post as opposed to the intense insane nut job that you had appeared to become - because just as I told Neal many times "life's really is to short" to waste on nonsense like that and bitterness will only eat YOU up in the end. Best of luck with that ( and I mean that sincerely) colmx 1
Bob Posted June 4, 2014 Posted June 4, 2014 As noted, some of you have said your "bit elsewhere" and, given Neal was not a poster here (or at least not a regular poster), what's the point of rehashing all that on this board? Please....just a request.....keep the praising/trashing of him or each other elsewhere. KhorTose, TotallyOz, kokopelli and 1 other 4
KhorTose Posted June 5, 2014 Posted June 5, 2014 Not quite two peas in a pod, but not far off it.No, that is a perfect description of the whole Neal/Surf fight, and I am not the only non-bitch poster to say this. Note, that I said this on SGT's board to both of them and I still believe it. However, I have to agree with Bob the whole he said/she said crap belongs on SGT where it started. As for me, I wish Neal the peace in death he never seem to achieve in later life, and I hope when you pass away others do the same for you. kokopelli 1
Alexx Posted June 5, 2014 Posted June 5, 2014 Not knowing the deceased personally, I think I'm getting a good picture, thanks to ALL (!) the replies here, and therefor I think it's good that both his friends and his foes are given the opportunity to comment on his passing. Hopefully, that will then be it, may he rest in peace and the others move on. He was apparently a controversial figure and made both friends and enemies with passion. That's not unusual with passionate people, I might add. TotallyOz, kokopelli and vinapu 3
williewillie Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 It's always nice when someone tries to defend a reviled and generally despised farang. If I ever need a defense, I hope it's someone other than ronthai . Saying Neal loved truthfulness is paramount to referring to white power groups as black people lovers. It's absurd. Unfortunately , being a compulsive liar and savagely attacking and threatening other gay farangs, is what most people will remember about Neal. He will not be missed , except for a toady or two. colmx 1
vinapu Posted June 8, 2014 Posted June 8, 2014 I did not know him at all and am not even familiar with all controversies late Neil created. I found encouraging that he still had friends who are trying to defend him and also those who hate him for reason are not silenced by majesty of his death and speaking their minds . As Conan Doyle said in "the Hound of the Baskervilles", truly bad person is one after not even one woman cries. On another hand lesson from this debacle is that our wrongs are following us after death and there's no doubt in my mind that late Neil, God let him rest in peace, worked hard to create many enemies on all active gay Thailand boards and it's not their fault that thy seem to be relieved at news of his departure. I also sympathize with ronthai and Neil' s other friends, while ago I happened to lose close friend who was not universally liked to put it mildly and it was sad feeling to see that nobody really cared about her death and to realize it was really her working to create such a feelings. williewillie, TotallyOz and KhorTose 3
TotallyOz Posted June 9, 2014 Author Posted June 9, 2014 Unfortunately , being a compulsive liar and savagely attacking and threatening other gay farangs, is what most people will remember about Neal. He will not be missed , except for a toady or two. Thank goodness Pattaya is finally rid of those compulsive liars and those that savagely attack others. I was always in fear when I went there as I was worried about those vicious wolves. Now, I am put my red cape back on and skip into the woods as all those bad guys are now gone! A Pattaya without liars and gossipers and the like? Maybe I just need to invest into a home and move there permanently. Has anyone got the contact info for that great new tower soon to open called Ocean 1? I jest of course. I met Neal personally only a few times at his bar. He was always nice and cordial and friendly to me. I never had an issue with him that I know of. If he is really gone, which no one really knows for sure, then I do hope he is able to rest in peace. I do know for a fact that many Thai boys loved him and regardless of what shit he pulled on the boards, he does have those that love and care for him. Their pain is much more important to me than the need for some to piss on his grave. I am in no way saying that this pissing is undeserved. I am only saying I find it distasteful. What I do find interesting is that when others in the community have died, most boards refused to allow negative discussions about them. I can think of one many years back that died who was very well respected in the community and when his death notice was published, even the slightest, "I didn't care for him" was deleted and removed. But, with LMTU and now Neal, the tide has turned. To me, that is sad. While I do think every board should be free and open to discuss any topic ad nauseam, I do find negative discussion of people who have died distasteful. KhorTose and kokopelli 2
williewillie Posted June 9, 2014 Posted June 9, 2014 It surprised me that this thread wasn't cut short or closed. I think all the gaythailand forum owners saw the topic as appropriate despite the unpleasantness. Neal knew his death was imminent and that his memory would be besmirched by his behavior and he chose not to make amends. One reaps what they sow
Guest surfcrest Posted June 9, 2014 Posted June 9, 2014 What I do find interesting is that when others in the community have died, most boards refused to allow negative discussions about them. I can think of one many years back that died who was very well respected in the community and when his death notice was published, even the slightest, "I didn't care for him" was deleted and removed. But, with LMTU and now Neal, the tide has turned. To me, that is sad. While I do think every board should be free and open to discuss any topic ad nauseam, I do find negative discussion of people who have died distasteful. John Booth, LMTU became quite ill in early April 2013 and passed away later that same month, so it was posted. I recall some nice tributes from those of us who knew him and don't recall anything nasty...but Neal owned Sawatdee back then. I took over Sawatdee on May 1st 2013 and since then Monty, jinks and now Neal have passed away from our community. I believe the send offs for all but Neal were kept positive, as they will be for all future passings on Sawatdee for sure. This wasn't a witch burning, some posters did have nice things to say about how he treated the boys, for example. I can't speak for Gaybutton, but I told Neal that we would allow open postings (good / bad) in the event of his passing while he was still alive. To discuss how and why that came about would only be blowing old embers to flame. Many members felt afraid when Neal was alive that he would do something if they ever told their story publically about what he did to them behind the scenes. Now some of them are speaking their mind, telling what they went through without fear of him doing any of the things he threatened to do. Its a unique case, one we probably will never see again with someone making such a direct impact on people and members of all Boards personally. He wrote enough about you Michael, whether you read what he wrote or not, or whether you care what others choose to believe based on what they read... I've always hoped that we'd all (members) be free to participate on any Board discussion we pleased, including those of us connected to other Boards. I realized that wasn't possible here on Gay Thailand with Neal still alive and participating here as darkdays. I've tried to bury the hatchet with ronthai leading up to Neal's passing. To see the bright side to all of this, it's as though a great dark cloud has been lifted. Whatever fears that existed in the community over all of that have passed and we can all finally move on. Surfcrest
KhorTose Posted June 9, 2014 Posted June 9, 2014 To see the bright side to all of this, it's as though a great dark cloud has been lifted. Whatever fears that existed in the community over all of that have passed and we can all finally move on. Surfcrest I had to chuckle at this. I tangled with Neal often and when i realized there was no good way to deal with him I moved on long before you and some other posters. The answer to an unreasonable or difficult personality is indifference not hate. Hate is an emotion as strong as love and shows how Neal, even in death, has a hold of you and at least five other posters. Why you would give a personality like Neal's that kind of power over you amazes me. Yes, Michael is correct and I applaud him for his compassion. Bashing someone that is dead, for any reason, does no good, is not considered acceptable or showing any kind of class in most societies, and for the religious who believe in God's judgement it is a sin. Your mother and father should have taught you this. TotallyOz 1
TotallyOz Posted June 9, 2014 Author Posted June 9, 2014 One reaps what they sow God, I hope so! He wrote enough about you Michael, whether you read what he wrote or not, or whether you care what others choose to believe based on what they read... Surfcrest I did not know he had written anything about me at all. Even if he called me the worst most horrible things on earth, I would still feel the same way about talking bad about him after his death. It is just the way a good Southern boy is raised. I did read the old Pattaya Bitch Board I think 4 or 5 times when links were posted on this site. I found it very distasteful and it gave me ulcers. And, I felt bad for GayButton as he was really spoken horribly about on that board and I consider him a friend. Thus, I never returned to that site. The answer to an unreasonable or difficult personality is indifference not hate. Very wise words KhorTose and I totally agree.
a447a Posted June 9, 2014 Posted June 9, 2014 I, for one, unfortunately was unable to "chuckle." It's easy to suggest that the "at least five other posters" should move on, but Neal was obsessed with getting revenge and refused to move on himself; he just couldn't let go. I cut all ties with him but the threats of personal harm and of finding out my true identity so as to somehow have me arrested at Immigration continued unabated. I have no interest in "pissing" or " dancing" on Neal's grave. Nor am I "bashing someone that is dead." I'm only interested in giving an account if my experience with him in order to counter the few positive accounts of how he was such a nice guy who "hated un-truthfulness" (give me a break! When Neal owned the BB he allowed one of his lackeys to post that I was a pedophile - a convicted one in Australia no less! The poster then wondered how a convicted pedophile could possibly be allowed to enter Thailand. (That in itself is proof that he was lying.) Of course, no evidence was ever supplied to back up that assertion, but Neal chose to remain silent. So much for a guy who 'hated un-truthfulness!") His death is a legitimate topic to write about, given that, at one time, he was a well-known and influential member of the gay Pattaya community. It is ridiculous to suggest that nothing negative should be written about him because he has died - it happens all the time in the media. And I don't think my comments give Neal any "power" over me; on the contrary, if I had remained silent, then yes, it would have perhaps indicated that Neal had some kind of power over me and, thus, prevented me from telling my side of the story. "Neal knew his death was imminent and that his memory would be besmirched by his behavior and he chose not to make amends." And that is why he receives no compassion from me. And I know he would not want it, anyway. vinapu and williewillie 2
williewillie Posted June 9, 2014 Posted June 9, 2014 How scary to think some still believe in sin. We are all homosexuals. I'm sure that still qualifies as a sin. Holding to old superstitions is scary.
Alexx Posted June 9, 2014 Posted June 9, 2014 I can't speak for Gaybutton, but I told Neal that we would allow open postings (good / bad) in the event of his passing while he was still alive. Telling someone that you'll piss on his grave once he's dead is incredibly poor form, shame on you. I'm sure that you don't understand that concept, for I've been following your mudslinging matches since a long time, but let's hope people will be kinder to you once your time has come. KhorTose 1
KhorTose Posted June 9, 2014 Posted June 9, 2014 I, for one, unfortunately was unable to "chuckle." It's easy to suggest that the "at least five other posters" should move on, but Neal was obsessed with getting revenge and refused to move on himself; he just couldn't let go. I cut all ties with him but the threats of personal harm and of finding out my true identity so as to somehow have me arrested at Immigration continued unabated. I have no interest in "pissing" or " dancing" on Neal's grave. Nor am I "bashing someone that is dead." I'm only interested in giving an account if my experience with him in order to counter the few positive accounts of how he was such a nice guy who "hated un-truthfulness" (give me a break! When Neal owned the BB he allowed one of his lackeys to post that I was a pedophile - a convicted one in Australia no less! The poster then wondered how a convicted pedophile could possibly be allowed to enter Thailand. (That in itself is proof that he was lying.) Of course, no evidence was ever supplied to back up that assertion, but Neal chose to remain silent. So much for a guy who 'hated un-truthfulness!") His death is a legitimate topic to write about, given that, at one time, he was a well-known and influential member of the gay Pattaya community. It is ridiculous to suggest that nothing negative should be written about him because he has died - it happens all the time in the media. And I don't think my comments give Neal any "power" over me; on the contrary, if I had remained silent, then yes, it would have perhaps indicated that Neal had some kind of power over me and, thus, prevented me from telling my side of the story. "Neal knew his death was imminent and that his memory would be besmirched by his behavior and he chose not to make amends." And that is why he receives no compassion from me. And I know he would not want it, anyway. To sum up, you recognize that Neal was both good and bad, but you only saw the bad so you feel justified in taking revenge on him by coming on this board where you seldom have posted lately and besmirching his name now that he is dead. You clearly see nothing wrong in doing this. Sad, very sad I put report on your post to get Scooby's attention as I now think the topic should no longer be Neal has died but we should start a new topic from Michael's post. I have some suggestions for this new topic. 1. The ethics of speaking ill of the dead 2. What is class and what isn't 3. What constitutes a lack of compassion These are just ideas and Scooby you can pick your own
