Serious Illness of a Former Poster

[Guest fountainhall]

Anyone who reads other gay Thailand forums will be well aware that the poster who used to post here under the LMTU/HeyGay handles seems to be very seriously ill. It also appears that he is unable to pay for medical treatment here in Thailand and is too ill to fly to his native UK (even there, though, it is not certain he would qualify for treatment under the Health Service).

 

LMTU/HeyGay was a polarizing personality. A great many – myself included – greatly disliked most of his posts, and thought quite a few not merely insulting, but bordering on libelous. Some, especially those relatively recent ones about an expat who jumped to his death in Pattaya, illustrated what I found to be an appalling lack of any kind of sensitivity for another’s misfortunes.

 

Perhaps as a result of that, on one other Board in recent days some posters have made what I consider the inappropriate suggestion that you reap what you sow. Such, though, is the depth of feelings this poster engendered.

 

When anyone is facing what appears to be certain death (if what I read is correct), it really does put into perspective what is valuable in life. Irrespective of what feelings may have been expressed in the past, I feel saddened by the news of his condition and I wish him only the best as he faces the very difficult times ahead.

[TotallyOz]

I am glad that you have compassion FH. I know you have never liked his postings but your post shows that you are a true gentleman. I just read today on SGT the thread there and I am embarrassed at any person that says that a member of their community deserves pain and sickness and death. It is sick and from sick minds.

 

I can honestly say that I wish no one that I have ever met in Thailand ill will. No matter what my differences with them, I always wish them well. I just don't understand the hatred anyone can have against someone else no matter what they have done.

[Guest scottishguy]

An internet persona and the real person are often very different.

 

Many people will dislike the LMTU persona - but only a handful will have actually met the person (I haven't).

 

Until I have met the real person I avoid strong language like love and hate.

 

If he is indeed ill with late-stage cancer and suffering tremendous pain, my best wishes go out to LMTU - and I would suggest that anyone who feels otherwise needs to examine their humanity.

 

On a practical note, he needs to get himself back to the UK for treatment and although I read that he is in difficult financial circumstances, a one-way ticket ought not to be beyond his reach or at least that of his friends (assuming he is free to leave Thailand). The NHS will treat him once he is there permanently (but let's not revisit that one) and it certainly doesn't sound like he'd be going anywhere.

 

[Guest ultimo]

Having read the two posts above I have to also have compassion for LMTU.

I have never been a fan of the person concerned and felt very vengeful of things that he has done to me over many years.

 

Now however,  whilst I used to consider 'what goes around' etc with his earlier problem ,  just felt that he was a very silly person to himself facing a spiralling downward road.   

Unfortunately all his problems were as a result of things he bought on himself and because he became alienated from his fair weather friends he embarked on a path of  self destruction.

 

Having said that I am totally disgusted with the  wholesale vindictiveness that has transpired on another website.   It reeks of self satisfaction of completely destroying the person concerned.  The webmaster being able to swing the axe and banning people who made any remarks towards him on his dying days of owning the site.

   

The latest is a 'Thank You' balloon chasing party on the beach, where I am sure that the giver of this party will be wallowing in having put the final pin in the voodoo doll.

 

I now just hope that the 'Queens' will now let it rest and he be given nice thoughts in whatever time he has left. This should also be extended to his carers fo maybe a difficult time ahead.

 

The name I have is my name ownly and DO NOT go under any other persons handle on any of these forums.

[Guest fountainhall]

On a practical note, he needs to get himself back to the UK for treatment

 

I am sure you are correct in saying the NHS would treat someone is his condition. According to TravellerJim who is the expert on medical and insurance issues, however, the patient is not in a physical state that will enable him to fly - other than by air ambulance. And the cost of that would be way out of most people's reach.

[Guest scottishguy]

Ah, I didn't realise things had reached that stage.

 

He posted a pic of himself at a Birthday Party @ Baan Souy fairly recently -  it was plain to see the change in the man -  he looked a shadow of other pics I have seen - but as I say I didn't realise there had been a rapid deterioration even since then.

 

Unfortunately, in the case of many cancers, the decline once it comes can be very swift.

 

I'm genuinely sorry to hear of the current state of affairs.

[williewillie]

The recent death of David Brendel from cancer was reported on gaybuttonthai.  David was one of the nicest men who

enjoyed the fun and excitement of gay Pattaya.  He wasn't controversial, notorious, loud or brash, just a good soul,

whom one felt enriched for having known.

It seems misguided to me to concentrate ones thoughts, emotions or even donations on someone whose claim to fame

was so irritating to so many.  So many gay farangs come to Pattaya in their elder years to enjoy what is left of their lives

and many end their lives in Thailand.

I will save my tears and feelings for all the good men I have known who have passed on in Thailand and the many who are

fighting their cancers and other serious medical conditions.

I wish no ill to anyone but my heart goes out to the dozens of other gay farangs who made a difference in my life and others.

I celebrate men like David Brendel but can only pity heygay.

Others can do as they wish.

[Guest scottishguy]

I'm sure there is a lot more to LMTU than meets the eye - and he will undoubtedly have done good in his life as well as things which annoyed, offended, or hurt others, as have we all.

 

At the end of the day we all go the same way and since he did nothing to me personally apart from occasionally annoy me on a message-board (which is hardly the crime of the century), I am happy to hope that he either recovers or suffers as little as possible.

 

Of course, had he been a friend or a bitter enemy I would have more intense feelings either way but the core of it is the same - a human life is a human life.

[Guest travelerjim]

An internet persona and the real person are often very different.

 

Many people will dislike the LMTU persona - but only a handful will have actually met the person (I haven't).

 

Until I have met the real person I avoid strong language like love and hate.

 

If he is indeed ill with late-stage cancer and suffering tremendous pain, my best wishes go out to LMTU - and I would suggest that anyone who feels otherwise needs to examine their humanity.

 

On a practical note, he needs to get himself back to the UK for treatment and although I read that he is in difficult financial circumstances, a one-way ticket ought not to be beyond his reach or at least that of his friends (assuming he is free to leave Thailand). The NHS will treat him once he is there permanently (but let's not revisit that one) and it certainly doesn't sound like he'd be going anywhere.

 

From my source, LMTU is not able to fly back to the UK...unless it was booked on a regular flight with doctor/nurse medical attendants... a very costly flight. Sadly, It is not feasible in his current medical or financial condition.

tj

[Guest luvthai]

LMTU brought scandal and controversay to many forums.  Sometime it was like only his postings that kept forums going.  I never met him but have sat behind him at various beer bars once in awhile.  The number of guys comming up to spend some time with him attested to his generosity with the boys.   He always came across as being a jerk but there was another side to him which we didn't see but his thai friends did.

i would never wish on anyone what he is going thru.  i am sure he feels abandoned and disliked and being so ill probably isn't able to rationalize right.  My prayers will not comfort him but he is in my thoughts.

[TotallyOz]

I will save my tears and feelings

 

but can only pity heygay.

Never save your tears and feelings. Just let them all out.

 

I don't pity heygay, I do feel sorry for him and his condition. I do pity those that have no heart for the sick. I guess I grew up different than most people but my mother always told me to never kick someone when they are down. I have tried to live by that for over 40 years. It has served me well so far.

 

 

 

 

It is sad that the cost is that expensive to have one flown back home. I know that most insurance companies do not cover that. Jim, if you are still in this conversation, can you tell us if most American providers like Blue Cross will medivac someone back to USA?

[Guest fountainhall]

Do you feel a sudden medical condition coming on, Michael?   (I forgot, you are already back in the US)!

[Guest travelerjim]

Michael.

 

Your question is a good one and the answer will depend on the schedule of policy benefits in one's plan.

 

I suggest you pose that question to Blue Cross.

I will do a little more research in coming days and report back.

 

As for the very sick expat, clearly he waited too long for a flight back to UK.

Maybe he did not realize the seriousness of his disease.

 

A one way ticket BKK-LHR UK would have been the answer several months ago...

but now...his recovery I believe is in God's hands now.

 

tj

[Bob]

Michael, I have a BC/BS plan (Michigan) and I asked them that question (any medical evacuation coverage?) a couple of years ago and was told "no."  Regardless, my BC/BS coverage will reimburse me for covered medical expenses while I'm here in Thailand so long as I use one of their approved hospitals. Luckily, have never had to worry about asking for reimbursement.

 

I also got a couple of online quotes for medical evacuation insurance and both quotes (for a 9-month time period) involved a premium of over $1,800.00.  The hell with that, I'm not worrying about it. I'd note that the premium appears to be based on age and, given you (Michael) are still a puppy, perhaps they'll simply airmail you back for a few hundred baht? 

[Guest fountainhall]

If there's one issue this sad affair should teach us all, it is to know -

 

a) for what situations do we need insurance cover?

B) do we have insurance cover in place for when it is needed? 

c) is the amount of cover sufficient for each type of emergency?

 

I have read on more than one Board about farang in Thailand not bothering with medical insurance. Given that premiums rise quite steeply after around 60, there is probably the temptation to put the premium into a pot each year and just assume that there will be enough there if and when you get sick. Given that medical costs here are relatively low, perhaps that might be sufficient to cover one major illness. But what if you are struck down with two or more at roughly the same time? 

 

Ooops - having got rid of the 80 icon, now we have one for a small b followed by a close bracket! I'll make a note on the appropriate thread.

[Guest scottishguy]

I'm not resident in Thailand and it seem to me that those of us who might be tempted to become resident in Thailand can learn a few things from the experiences of others:

 

 

1. Rent. don't buy.

2. Always have Medical Insurance - unless you are fabulously wealthy. If too old - see below.

3. Always have a Contingency Fund large enough to see you though a crisis or get out in a hurry.

 

 

And the Golden Rule -   Never rent an apartment higher than the 1st floor.

 

[Bob]

And the Golden Rule?

 

Hmmm....my golden rule is to always wear a hardhat when walking by one of the Pattaya highrises...

 

As for the subject of the original post, I have very mixed feelings.  On the one hand, I feel bad for people who are undergoing significant medical problems and that even includes former posters who irritated the living hell out of just about everybody.  On the other hand, I also have some fairly strong feelings about expats who come over here without adequate financial resources, health insurance, contingency planning, etc.  What the heck, aren't we all supposed to get just a little wiser as we get older? 

[Guest scottishguy]

I guess some people arrive on a fixed income and inadequate reserves - which they think is more than enough to see them through - but it all gradually vanishes in the pursuit of pleasure, reducing exchange rates, and price inflation.

 

It's easy to lose your balance when riding a rollercoaster.

[Guest fountainhall]

I bought in 1999, two years before I moved here. Since then, all I have had to pay are monthly management fees and occasionally a small amount for maintenance. I've saved a vast amount in rent and I have an asset which is worth quite a bit more than I paid for it - the more so given the Baht's upward rise in recent years. I think renting makes a great deal of sense until you know this is where you want to live. Thereafter, I'd recommend buying if you're sure you'll be here for another few years at least.

[Guest]

 

4. Currencies will fluctuate. Plan for it.

 

If your country runs a big balance of trade deficit and has frequent QE programmes, there is a good chance the long term trend would be for that currency to weaken against a basket of other currencies.

[williewillie]

Never save your tears and feelings. Just let them all out.

 

I don't pity heygay, I do feel sorry for him and his condition. I do pity those that have no heart for the sick. I guess I grew up different than most people but my mother always told me to never kick someone when they are down. I have tried to live by that for over 40 years. It has served me well so far.

 

 

 

 

It is sad that the cost is that expensive to have one flown back home. I know that most insurance companies do not cover that. Jim, if you are still in this conversation, can you tell us if most American providers like Blue Cross will medivac someone back to USA?

really creepy to have someone quote what you write and edit out parts.  Sort of like twisting ones words to make your own point.

No doubt Michael is good friends with heygay and loves him like a brother but if you quote someone it is only fair not to

edit and leave out parts.  Like I said , just creepy and disingenuous.

 

You would think from the edited quote that I wasn't letting out my tears and feelings.  That is sick and

not what I wrote.  I made it clear that my tears and feelings were for those farangs whom I cared about and were close to.  I resent the editing of what I wrote.

If Michael wants to quibble over feeling pity or feeling sorry that is up to him but if you quote someone

don't distort their quote for your own purposes.

[TotallyOz]

really creepy to have someone quote what you write and edit out parts. Sort of like twisting ones words to make your own point.

My most sincere apologies. I did not mean to be creepy. But, we all consider different things creepy don't we? I know of one guy who likes to gossip so much that when he doesn't know anything new that he just makes it up. Creepy right? Hard to believe some people just love sitting around a table all night to discuss what other farangs do. Sick right?

 

But, I will try not to misquote you on this post.

No doubt Michael is good friends with heygay and loves him like a brother but if you quote someone it is only fair not to

edit and leave out parts. Like I said , just creepy and disingenuous.

As you know, I am friends with him. I also like him. And, I think it is very creepy for anyone to wish him or anyone else ill will or harm. Can we say that to do so would be disingenuous as a human being?

You would think from the edited quote that I wasn't letting out my tears and feelings. That is sick and

not what I wrote. I made it clear that my tears and feelings were for those farangs whom I cared about and were close to. I resent the editing of what I wrote.

If Michael wants to quibble over feeling pity or feeling sorry that is up to him but if you quote someone

don't distort their quote for your own purposes.

The editing was for 2 different parts of your long tirade. I separated them by long white space but I guess that was not understood. As I said, I apologize for this and I'll try to do your post justice. But, please pull in the claws and at least give me the benefit of the doubt that I was not trying to distort your creepy commentary. Sorry, I meant to say just commentary but since I really like the use of your word creepy, I'm going to use it.

 

So, here goes:

The recent death of David Brendel from cancer was reported on gaybuttonthai. David was one of the nicest men who

enjoyed the fun and excitement of gay Pattaya. He wasn't controversial, notorious, loud or brash, just a good soul,

whom one felt enriched for having known.

Fantastic.I don't know him but is there a reason you bring up all the things he wasn't? Were you trying to point out something here? I am so sorry I am not as smart as you but you could be a bit more specific and just cut to the point. What were you trying to say here?

I will save my tears and feelings for all the good men I have known who have passed on in Thailand and the many who are

fighting their cancers and other serious medical conditions.

Never save your tears and feelings. Just let them all out.

I celebrate men like David Brendel but can only pity heygay.

Others can do as they wish.

I don't pity heygay, I do feel sorry for him and his condition. I do pity those that have no heart for the sick. I guess I grew up different than most people but my mother always told me to never kick someone when they are down. I have tried to live by that for over 40 years. It has served me well so far.

 

 

Another comment not related to this catty thread:

 

It is sad that the cost is that expensive to have one flown back home. I know that most insurance companies do not cover that. Jim, if you are still in this conversation, can you tell us if most American providers like Blue Cross will medivac someone back to USA?

 

OK. Well, there you go. I didn't misquote you on this one. I used only your unedited words to show the area I was referring to. Again, I most humbly apologize if you read my initial comments and thought I was trying to misquote you. It was not my intent. My intent was only to take away a bit of the venom of your entire post. I am so sorry that I was unable to achieve this.

[Guest fountainhall]

really creepy to have someone quote what you write and edit out parts.  Sort of like twisting ones words to make your own point.

 

WIlliewillie, I think you are being oversensitive (as many of us are from time to time). I guess 99% of replies to posts highlight only the parts of the posts to which the reply refers. If you want every reply to include the whole post, then you are asking for threads which will be vastly and impossibly overlong.

 

Usually I try to put . . . before, after or in the middle of a quote I have shortened to show that there are parts deliberately missed out (but I frequently forget). Is shortening a quote twisting the original poster's words? Generally not. Occasionally, perhaps. But that assumes a deliberate ploy to divert a discussion in a different direction. But even then, surely every poster can scroll back and read the full quoted post? I don't see that is what was intended in this case.

 

You suggest that the comment "Never save your tears and feelings . . ." refers specifically to you. I certainly did not read it that way. I read "your" as being the easier and very common way of saying "We should never save our feelings . . . " In other words, it refers to everyone - not an individual.

 

Re David Brendel, I am sad that he has died - but I never knew him and don't believe I ever came across him on any Board. I have no idea even if he contributed to Boards and I do not know what contributions he made to to the gay scene. Would you perhaps give us a little more information about someone who is clearly missed?

[williewillie]

David Brendel's health condition and his death were reported on gaybutton.com by Pattayamale on April 5th, 2013.

I do not know if David posted on the gay forums.  If you read the thread, you will see David was a nice guy without

an enemy in the world and a dear friend of Pattayamale as well as farang owners of Oud's Bar in Sunee Plaza.

I was not a close friend but knew him for years and was greatly saddened by his death and admired his attitude

and coping skills.  I will let others who knew him better to expand on him if they read this and choose to do so.

 

I found Michael's apology a bit forced.  I had no intention of creating a tempest in a teapot.  He has run forums and knows

better than to edit postings to change their intentions and then comment on the edited postings.  There are far worst things

in the world and i will accept Michaels apology and move on.  One can only hope Michael will move on as well and not

hold a grudge against wee willie for earlier postings which praised the new management here as a big improvement

and also criticizing the former management decision about not banning heygay. 

I hope Michael is not so thin skinned that he cannot move and to cease ripping apart wee willies postings in order to make

williewillie look bad. 

 

I see no reason to continue this petty feud, apology accepted and I have moved on.

[TotallyOz]

I found Michael's apology a bit forced.

Not at all my dear. No one forced me to do anything. I hate S & M.

 

 

He has run forums and knows better than to edit postings to change their intentions and then comment on the edited postings.

Thank you for bowing to my vast knowledge. I appreciate that sir. But, I didn't think my "edit" changed the intentions at all or I would not have done it.

 

 

One can only hope Michael will move on as well and not hold a grudge against wee willie for earlier postings which praised the new management here as a big improvement and also criticizing the former management decision about not banning heygay.

Is this a joke? You must know by now that I am the one that does not hold any grudges at all. And, to be honest, I had forgotten you had posted earlier criticizing me. It must have been one of those quick "zingers" that I missed. Sorry, I'll pay more attention in the future.

 

 

I hope Michael is not so thin skinned that he cannot move and to cease ripping apart wee willies postings in order to make

williewillie look bad.

You give me too much credit. I could never make Wee willie look worst than he does. I am just not that clever.

 

 

I see no reason to continue this petty feud, apology accepted and I have moved on.

I can see by your last post that you have truly moved on. I am glad that you have once again done this. Like you, I have moved on as well.

 

 

New topic:

 

Getting back to the theme of this thread, I have been looking into my insurance and they do not cover the cost of a med evacuation from foreign countries. Damn.