Those Damned Airline Surcharges!

[Guest fountainhall]

We’ve all experienced it!

The other day I was looking for cheap air fares to bring my Japanese friend to enjoy my 6-day break in Khao-Lak at the start of April – thanks to the travelzoo 75% off offer in another thread. No fares are cheap – not even Air Asia, perhaps because I’ve left it too late. But then I did find what I thought was a decent fare from Tokyo to Phuket on Malaysian via KL – ¥45,000. When I then tried to book it, I discovered a page or two later that the ‘extra’ charges were a whopping ¥44,230 – i.e. ¥89,170 total.

This was not for an ultra-cheap 6-months in advance ticket where the extras are understandably higher than the basic fare. This was a basic economy fare one month ahead of time.

I know  these surcharges vary from airline to airline. So I ran a check to see what other airlines are adding. Cathay Pacific/Dragonair also requires one stop en route. Their available tickets on the dates I need are more expensive, but the tax/surcharge element is ¥23,120 – almost half that of Malaysian.

I then checked ANA which has a plane change in BKK. It offered 4 possibile itineraries and total prices. So I clicked each in turn hoping I’d get a price breakdown. Each time I got the following message –
 

 

Upon reconfirming the itinerary, we are sorry to inform you that this is an itinerary which cannot be selected

Seems there’s a lot more wrong with ANA than just its Dreamliners!

But what pisses me off about all the surcharges is they just make life more complicated for the passenger, especially the less experienced ones. Book a hotel room and you may have a choice of 4 or 5 different rates depending on the type of room, its size, its access to an executive club etc. Do they have a surcharge for electricity? No! For Water consumption for the shower? No! For heat or air conditioning? No! For use of the TV? No! For having a phone in the room (even though the charges to use it are usually astronomical)? No! For having a lift? No! These are all vital to a hotel stay and are part of the package. So it’s relatively easy to compare prices.

Similarly, tickets, security, fuel, luggage, airport taxes, the need to get something to eat and drink on a 12-hour flight – we cannot get off the ground without these and other payments. So why the f-ck will airlines not bundle at least the basic ones together so we can make effective comparisons as easy as with hotels?

[Guest fountainhall]

A quick clarification of the seeming error in the addition in the Malaysian Airlines ticket. Was it ¥89,170 or should it have been ¥89,230? Well, believe it or not, both were 'correct'. The first is given in the first page where, after choosing your flights, you are given a breakdown.

Tokyo Narita Apt, Japan  -  Departs: Mon, 01 Apr 2013, 22:05
Tokyo Narita Apt, Japan  -  Arrives: Sat, 06 Apr 2013, 07:40
1 Adult: JPY 45,000
Surcharges: JPY 39,360 + Taxes: JPY 4,810
Total + Taxes + Surcharges: JPY 89,170
 
Proceed on with the booking, and the total becomes ¥89,230!
Tokyo Narita Apt, Japan
Phuket, Thailand
Tokyo Narita Apt, Japan
Total + Taxes + Surcharges: JPY 89,230

 

How to explain the extra ¥60 in the same booking, I have no idea!

[Guest scottishguy]

I agree, the pricing mechanisms are ludicrous and utterly meaningless - it used to be the preserve of the likes of Ryanair - but they all do it now.

 

A recent KLM return flight to Gran Canaria had a breakdown "flight" price of around £12 and "extras" of over £190.

 

The "extras" included a charge for fuel ----------hardly optional I'd have thought!

 

[Guest abang1961]

I have not been travelling on full-fare flights for the past few years.

I am basing on my experience when I take budget airlines.

 

There are several major budget airlines flying out from Singapore Changi Airport.

We have AirAsia, Tiger, Jetstar, Scoot and some other minor ones.

 

If I can have a personal favourite then it would have to be Air Asia.

What you see is what you pay because the airport and other surcharges are included.

 

For example should I be flying to Bangkok from Singapore on Wed 10 Apr

...Air Asia total is SGD 165, Tiger is SGD 233 and Jetstar is SGD 224.

Not only is Air Asia cheapest, its departure and arrival time are more humane.. not in the wee hours of the morning!

 

Yes, Singapore being Singapore... it has rules to insist the budget airlines comply and commit to reveal the full price..add SGD 20 for administrative charges and flight insurance...

[Guest thaiworthy]

A recent KLM return flight to Gran Canaria had a breakdown "flight" price of around £12 and "extras" of over £190.

 

What's in Gran Canaria? I've heard of it, any gay activity? I heard it's pretty Hedonistic.

[Guest]

There are 2 separate problems with airline surcharges:

 

1 The fuel surcharges, which may be levied AFTER you purchase a ticket.

I don't see why airlines are allowed to do that.

Futures markets are supposed to be there so the risk of price fluctuations can be passed to to investors willing to take the risk/opportunity. Airlines should use them to hedge their fuel costs & fuel surcharges should be banned.

To be fair I think the likes of Ryan Air do hedge their fuel costs. It's the flag carriers who need to change their attitude.

 

2 Pricing Structure With Add Ons

This is typical of low cost airlines, especially in Europe. They quote a price, then you have to pay extra for checked in bags, tax, web check in & paying by debit or credit card. Of these costs, only the bags are optional. The debit card charge bears no resemblance to the actual cost of processing a debit card booking.

So they confuse the charging structure to make it difficult for customers to compare prices.

The law should compel the airlines to quote the actual minimum cost for a passenger to take the flight. They can put whatever they like underneath in a breakdown.

In this area, Ryan Air are one of the worst offenders. The few Asian low cost airlines I've used are better.

[Guest fountainhall]

The fuel surcharges, which may be levied AFTER you purchase a ticket

 

Odd, I've never heard of this and have never had to pay any supplement after paying for a ticket. If I have a ticket on hold at a travel agency, yes, surcharges can vary prior to actual purchase. But that's the only time.

 

As for hedging, I think most major full-service airlines hedge fuel prices. Cathay Pacific has been doing it for at least 2 decades.

 

As for low cost airlines, I have nothing against them - in principle. The problems always seem to occur when people have not read the fine print - as I have stated in several threads. I wonder if abang has actually read the fine print on Air Asia's Conditions of Carriage contract before ticking the "I agree" box? That airline, in common with many budget carriers, can effectively cancel your flight for any reason whatever - any reason! Not only do you have no comeback, you get no compensation apart from a trip on an alternative flight (which may be a day or two later depending on schedules and availability) or a voucher to use on another flight within three months! Great if you're a once-a-year tourist! Thai Air Asia totally screwed up a Hanoi trip - and they admitted they had not even bothered to tell me my flights had been cancelled. They tried, but the sms did not go through!!! So I found out about it way too late. That debacle cost me well over Bt. 10,000! That, and delays of between 1 and 12 hours have done Air Asia for me. I'll never fly it again.

 

I realise millions fly it and are happy with it. Great for them! I just hope they've read the fine print!

[Guest abang1961]

I have been told horror stories about AirAsia but had experience none personally.

An ex-colleague bought a ticket to fly to Penang on a long weekend.

 

The original flight was scheduled at 0900 but was later changed to 2100.

Although she was informed of the change a week in advance, she was devastated.

Imagine losing an entire day at the beach and worst, arriving at night for a 2-day break.

So her trip was completed in less than 24 hours - at 1/3 at the airport!

 

Some of the bad timings/schedule actually work for me...

1. Singapore to Taiwan on Jetstar is a midnight flight.

I checked-in at 2330 hours and the plane left at 0115 hours.

I arrived at Taoyuan Airport, Taipei at 0545 hours.

I took the airport bus at 0625 hours.

I arrived downtown Taipei in an hour's time - just nice for breakfast.

 

2. Shenzhen to Siingapore

Similar to the above.. just nice for breakfast in Singapore.

 

Some of the bad timings/schedule that I really dislike

1. All the horrible morning departure flights that start at 0600 - 0830 hours

2. All the horrible midnight arrival flights that arrive at 2330 - 0400 hours.

 

I dislike taking such flights because it is never here nor there.

Should I stay in the airport or take the expensive taxi downtown?

Should I book a room in the airport hotel for just a couple of hours?

What if I choose to public transport - the last bus had left and/or the first bus has not arrived.

And worst, having to wake up in the middle of the night!

Spending an extra hour in the airport is fine (for daybreak/dawn) but not more .......

[Guest fountainhall]

It's not only the budget carriers that have departures at lousy times. Try flying non-stop to Tokyo, Osaka, Seoul, Beijing - even Shanghai. A majority of the full-service carriers have flights departing BKK around 23:00 - 01:00 for relatively short 5-hour flights. 

 

Re your friend who took Air Asia to Penang. At last I hear of someone with the same delay I had on that route. In Penang I got up at 05:30 for an 08:30 departure to Bangkok. It finally departed at 20:30pm! When they cancelled my Hanoi tickets without notice, they expected me to shorten my holiday from 3 full days to 36 hours! I tore up the tickets and took another carrier.

 

Incidentally, have you ever read the carrier's Terms and Conditions before ticking the box?

[Guest abang1961]

FH, so sorry that you had a long wait in that lousy Penang airport.

I'm crossing my fingers now...about my next flight...hope, there is no delay...

 

 

Don't label me as a cheapstake... I am just cost-conscious.

I would step out of my office and head straight to the airport on Fridays...just to catch the flight out of Singapore.

This is especially so for flights leaving around 7.30 pm...

I would arrive at the airport at about 6.30 pm (after doing my check-in online) to clear the immigrations.

 

 

 

 

Normally for such short trips of say, 2 to 3 nights, I travel with a small bag of old clothes.

Clothes that I may wish to dispose of.

So if I ever buy anything (which is always very possible), I dont need a new bag.

 

 

 

Yes I rarely read the fine prints as I always have travel insurance .. for delays beyond 8 hours.

And Singapore being Singapore, ensures that they have ground staff to handle such unexpected delays.

[Guest fountainhall]

I always have travel insurance .. for delays beyond 8 hours

 

You're certainly no cheapskate. See and enjoy the world as much as you can - that's my motto. We're only on this earth for a relatively short time. If we wait till we're retired, who knows which bus we might have ended under? Sorry, I know some are desperately saving for retirement here - or elsewhere. But there has to be a balance, if only because there is no guarantee we'll make it to retirement age.

 

And I'm glad you have travel insurance. Many just don't bother. But I'm never sure when insurers will pay out and when they won't. In Europe in May 2010, I was worried about possible cancellation of my flights when airspace was closed for days during the Iceland volcano outburst. I was told that was an Act of God and I'd not get reimbursed. (I liked the comment one wag made in an open letter to his insurers - "I don't believe in any God, so may I please have my money back!")

 

One day last November, bad weather forced hundreds of cancellations and delays in London. As a result, my cheap flight to Munich was delayed 3 hours and I missed my onward cheap flight to Dresden - which just happened to be the last of the day! I had to spend a night at an airport hotel (€83) and then pay full fare for the short 300km flight (about €402) the next morning. I was livid. Even though I had insurance, I did not expect to be covered beyond the cost of my cheap tickets. Then, surprise! All my extra costs were refunded - in full! Hallelujah!

[Guest abang1961]

There is always certain amount of risk in anything we do, especially when it is beyond our control.

Taking inexpensive flight is one such risk.

 

The trick of it is that we should NEVER EVER (this sounds like Taylor Swift) book two flights within 24 hours interval.

It is unbecoming of budget airlines to delay our flight and our tour itinerary but this is beyond our control.

So, I would rather spend at least 24 hours in one location before embarking to the next.

Any interval less than 4 hours is suicidal.

 

[Guest fountainhall]

The trick of it is that we should NEVER EVER . . . book two flights within 24 hours interval.

 

Sorry abang, I can't see how that helps many travellers who don't have the luxury of time if they want to get from A to B and there is no cheap enough non-stop flight. It may work for those only taking short hops and are happy to stop-over. But it won't work for many long haul flyers who often have to take three flights to get from, say, the US or Australia to BKK, and not all are on the same airline. Plus in some parts of the world, there is the hub and spoke system. I'm not to going to spend 24 hours in Dallas only because I might miss a connection from Louisville to Las Vegas!

 

On my nightmare Sunday, I was actually on three separate scheduled flights - two on BA and one on LH. Because I was on cheap tickets, I had indeed allowed very close to 4 hours for the connection at Munich airport - knowing that if for any reason my inward BA flight was cancelled or I missed it, that part of the ticket ensured I'd be put on the next one. That would still have given me over 90 minutes to transfer at one of the easiest transfer airports in Europe.

 

But there were knock-on delays which meant departures just got later and later. I've been lucky. I've had very few similar delays over the years. And I have saved a huge amount by not buying expensive tickets. I'll never allow 24 hours between flights unless I am on a multi-sector trip. And I'll keep buying the insurance!!

[Guest abang1961]

So the morale of the story, "Pay more if you have time constraint.  Enjoy budget airlines if you have time to spare."

 

The closest I have got to experience this was once I had to fly out of Kuala Lumpur, enroute to Tianjin, China.

The flight leaves KLIA at 0900 hours and there was no way I can catch a 0630 flight as it was already too expensive.

My alternative was to take the local bus from Southern Malaysia.

 

All went well until at about 0430 hrs, the bus stopped in KL and I was told to alight and wait for the next bus.

There were 2 other travellers in that bus and I was the only one who can speak the native language.

The half-hour wait was extended to an hour. 

Imagine braving the cold night air at a bus stop, somewhere in downtown KL....

 

Fortunately I managed to check-in and board the plane as scheduled.

I would not want to take the risk again.

[Guest fountainhall]

Like much of the rest of our lives, travel is essentially a compromise when we have to weigh up time constraints, schedules, convenience, risks, costs, etc.

[Guest]

I detest 7:00 am departure times or worse. That's no making it much of a HOLIDAY, but it can be even worse if you're getting up at about 4:00 am and are then expected to stay awake for business meetings  lasting several hours.

 

Those busy overnight flights might work well for a motivated entrepreneur who can sleep on the flight & not lose any time flying.

For a tourist in Asia, it's potentially wasting a night that could be spent with some handsome young Asian.

[Guest scottishguy]

...Imagine braving the cold night air at a bus stop, somewhere in downtown KL.....

 

Luxury!

 

Below is what happens when you wait for a taxi on a Saturday night in Scotland: