Happy Landings!

[Guest fountainhall]

We’ve had a thread of hairy airport landings before, but I just noticed this item with photos of 13 such airports.

It mentions Kathmandu but there is no photo. It’s scary only because the aircraft has to manoeuvre around quite high hills before lining up. Jiuzhai-Huanglong airport set at 3,450 meters up in China's Sichuan Province is a lot more nail-biting.

Of those in the photos, I’d love to land at Quito (No, 1) and Saint Martin (No. 8 ), although why anyone would wish to be on the beach at St. Martin with a 747 only meters above their head beats me!


Photo: The Guardian

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/gallery/2013/feb/07/white-knuckle-airports-in-pictures#/?picture=403674176&index=0

[Bob]

Many youtube videos of landings (and takeoffs) at Saint Martin.  Here's one of them:

[Guest anonone]

I have been on that beach at St Martin, but didn't time the visit correctly to experience the 747. 

 

A lot of smaller planes flyig in though.  It was an interesting experience being under the approach path. 

 

The takeoff of a wide body would be the dagerous time...and I would not be standing at the airport fence for that one !

[Guest fountainhall]

Nothing really beat arriving at Hong Kong's old Kai Tak airport from the west. The steep near 90 degree bank just before landing made it seem as though the wing tip would hit the apartment blocks. They used to say that Cathay Pacific pilots could tell not only those apartments which had the televisions on, but the channels to which they were tuned! And then the pilots had to very quickly straighten up before touching down.

 

I once drove past the airport and saw a brand New China Airlines 747-400 in the water at the end. The pilot had misjudged and touched down too far along the strip. The plane was a write-off but thankfully no fatalities. This vdo gives an idea of how hairy it could be (sadly with no sound).

 

[baobao]

Back in my more colorful college days we used to go park our cars under the approach traffic at San Francisco International, lie on our backs on the hoods of our cars and get high, enjoying the thunderous roar of the jets as they flew very low overhead, just before they touched down a hundred yards or so past our feet.  I seriously doubt you can still drive and park that close any more, but at the time it was quite an experience. 

[Guest fountainhall]

CNN has an article on Hong Kong's old Kai Tak airport which today becomes a cruise line terminal. It includes a number of photos of that airport which required an amazing 45° turn below 500 ft when landing from the west. This of a Cathay Pacific 747-300 is perhaps one of the most iconic.


Photo: Daryl Chapman on CNN website
http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/11/travel/hong-kong-kai-tak-airport/index.html?hpt=hp_c4

[a447a]

Yeah, there was the old checkerboard with the light stuck up on the hill, and as soon as you saw that, you had to bank sharply.

Not really dangerous, just a little scary, especially for the passengers. The aircraft then had to descend quickly, otherwise you would land too far down the runway; maybe that's why the aircraft ended up in the ocean.

All in all, a very interesting airport.  But what a strange place to build one!

[Guest fountainhall]

Strange, but like so many older airports, it was originally just a small airstrip that was a long away from inhabited areas. After World War II, it continued to grow slowly, but it wasn't really till the early 1980s that it started handling a lot of traffic when the government liberalised traffic rights and tourism began to mushroom. So instead of just 1 BA flight to/from London each day, for example, Cathay Pacific and British Caledonian were also allowed to fly the route.

 

Rather like Patong is named after the family which owns the land, Kai Tak was named after a Mr. Kai and a Mr. Tak! They reclaimed land for a business venture which failed, and so the colonial government of the day took it over for an airstrip. Chek Lap Kok, the present airport's name, on the other hand, is taken from the island which had to be flattened to form the base of part of the new complex.

[TotallyOz]

I love air travel but for me, there is no place on earth like landing at LaGuardia in NYC.

[Guest fountainhall]

There speaks a man who never landed at Kai Tak in a typhoon.    Cathay Pacific pilots regularly landed in typhoons when almost every other airline would divert their flights to Guangzhou, Taipei and Manila.

 

I agree landing at La Guardia can be 'fun' at times, especially in heavy rain and with dozens of planes lined up to take-off. It would just need one aircraft to skid off the runway, though, and goodness knows how many would be killed in the fireball. But I hate the long waits for take-off at that airport. I've often been on planes crawling along taxiways for more than an hour before finally taking off.

[firecat69]

There can be some pretty interesting approaches at Washington National.  Have to keep those politicians safe!!!

[a447a]

 

Cathay Pacific pilots regularly landed in typhoons

The crosswind limitation for a 747-400 is approx 30 knots in wet conditions, so I find it hard to believe the landing took place in an actual typhoon.  Maybe there was one in the vicinity but such winds at ground level at the airport would have precluded a landing. If there were a tailwind, the aircraft would need a longer runway.  If there were a headwind, the aircraft could be flying too slow.  And as I recall,  the airline policy was 2 aborted landings and then a diversion. (My father was a commercial airline pilot with Cathay and I'd love to ask him, but he is no longer with us.) 

[Guest fountainhall]

The photo - and I think also the vdo - was not taken during a typhoon. But I can vouch for Cathay landing at Kai Tak in some typhoon conditions when pilots of other airlines diverted. 

 

I should have added that typhoons are rarely monster storms and even more rarely will one of these (Category 10) hit Hong Kong. A typhoon can be relatively minor or it can first be termed a severe tropical storm and then upgraded. The outer bands of a typhoon can also affect Hong Kong with heavy rain and strong wind gusts. All conditions affected Kai Tak because of its proximity to the hills to the north and its north-west/south-east axis, whereas the prevailing winds are basically south-west/north-east in summer and the reverse in winter. Even in good weather, less experienced pilots would take extra care!

 

I was doing a job in SIngapore around mid 1995. I had booked a late afternoon CX return flight as I had to be back for an important meeting the next morning. The previous day it had become clear a typhoon might be heading to or near Hong Kong. Early on the morning I was due to fly, I checked with the CX Marco Polo Club. If there was any hint - at that time - that the aircraft might be diverted, I said I'd like to rebook on an earlier flight. I was assured the typhoon was not expected to hit and the flight was operating as scheduled.

 

By noon, it was being announced that some aircraft from other airlines were being diverted from Kai Tak. I called again and was again reassured that my CX flight was expected to take-off and land on time. SIA flights were still landing and had a flight departing about 90 minutes before mine. So around the deadline to go out and get that SIA flight, I again called CX. Again the flight was on schedule. As if to reassure me, I was even told "Our pilots are trained to handle many typhoon conditions."

 

The typhoon was not over Hong Kong but somewhere close by. When we arrived at Kai Tak (a remarkably smooth landing), most other carriers - including that SIA flight I nearly took - had diverted.

 

I do not know what the exact conditions were and whether the winds had died down by the time we landed. I can only assume the runway level  crosswinds were below the level indicated by a447a. It was certainly very bumpy during the descent, but we had no go-around - just a straight in, hard right bank and down. The husband of one of my work colleagues is also a CX pilot and now flies 744s. I always understood that if an airport was open and no company orders had been made to divert, the decision to land or not was made by the captain.

 

Kai Tak - and now CLK - often stayed open during severe tropical storms and the milder typhoons, usually without any incident. However, as I posted on another thread some time ago, I was at CLK due to fly to BKK in August 1999 when a China Airlines MD-11 crashed on landing and ended up on its back in a ball of flames during a mild typhoon.