A Timely Reminder - and Warning!

[Guest fountainhall]

With subjects such as cottaging yet again appearing on the Board along with fairly frequent references to social networking sites, there is an interesting and timely interview on the fridae website with HIV expert and author Elizabeth Pisani. One of the pioneers of UNAIDS, when asked what she does for a living, she will tell you, “sex and drugs”! Specifically, she’s an epidemiologist who has worked on four continents “researching, documenting and trying to control the deadly HIV epidemic.” In Asia, she has spent many years in Indonesia to work with the Ministry of Health in strengthening their HIV surveillance system.

 

One of the many points she makes is the recent homogenisation of the gay scene in Asia. Whilst some may find this is somewhat contentious, she claims –

 

. . . Now, you could blindfold me and put me in a gay club in almost any major metropolitan area in Asia, and it would take me at least six minutes to figure out where I was – whereas before, you would know where you were in a nanosecond. There’s a homogenisation of behaviours: drugs are becoming more available and common throughout the scene, the music is more universally “doof-doof” – but that was ever thus. And the Internet is being used in much more similar ways as a site for hookups. And I think there’s a much greater similarity with basically the international gay scene that’s American and Australian.

 

One key factor she draws from this is –

 

HIV comes with gay liberation. HIV comes with the scene. Why did HIV emerge in New York City and San Francisco in the early 1980s? Because gay clubs emerged in New York City and San Francisco in the 1970s.

 

HIV is not a very infectious virus: it is only very infectious for short periods of time when viral loads are high, and that is principally for six weeks after you first become infected, and then during periods when you have high viral loads associated with other sexually transmitted infections.

 

What does that mean? That . . . as soon as you have a critical mass of people in physical space or in virtual space to have the ability to meet partners and turning over partners, and you have a culture that allows that, you create conditions for the spread of HIV.

 

That’s the downside of a gay scene – it’s about alcohol, it’s about clubbing culture, it’s about a go out and what the fuck culture; a go out and fuck culture. It’s not the fact that you’re homosexual that increases your risk; it’s not the fact that you have anal sex. It’s the fact that you have sex with a number of partners in a short space of time.

 

That also is contentious and will not endear her to gay communities. But she adds there is an upside.

 

The upside of the emergence of a gay identity and the tolerance that allows for gay clubs to exist – the upside is that it does come with a sense of community that also allows for a shared sense of responsibility and a shared sense of caring together about sexual health and all kinds of other things. And it was certainly that sense of community that created the first and to date the most effective response among HIV, which is among gay men in rich countries: the US, Australia, UK, a lot of Europe. Those responses did not come from the government; they did not come from health agencies. They came about from the communities . . .

 

Sadly though, she also sees the limits of that upside in Asia.

 

My observation – and you may disagree – in the gay communities in Asia with which I’m familiar, is that that sense of community is not well developed. Basically it’s still at the stage of “Hurrah, finally there’s somewhere I can go to party, get drunk, get laid.”

 

I do think the gay community has got a bit precious. Anything you say against them has become homophobic. And I don’t give a fuck who you screw, but if you do dumb things I’m going to say so. We sometimes have rates of HIV that are 10%, 20% or 30%, even where there is 100% availability of knowledge, 100% availability of condoms. And yet we are not allowed to say that maybe there is something that is wrong in the gay community. That gets censored.

 

Homophobia cannot transmit a virus. You can do all the whingeing you want, but there comes a point where the community has to look at itself and display some responsibility for its actions. We’ve managed to take personal responsibility out of the equation entirely, because it is strongly negative to say, “Actually, you know what? If you get infected these days, quite often it’s because you did something really dumb.”

 

She then repeats her warning about the false confidence too many display about HIV.

 

Very often now, even in communities where one in three people is infected, people hook up and don’t even discuss HIV and condom use – the logic being that if he’s infected, he’s probably on meds, so he’s not that infectious anyway. But here’s the thing: over 50% of transmission happens within six weeks of someone being infected, when they don’t know they’re infected and they’re certainly not on meds. It’s actually safer to fuck someone who knows they’re HIV-positive and is on meds than to fuck someone who says they’re HIV-negative.

 

And she ends with another stern warning about the responsibility we all must exercise in this age of HIV-AIDS

 

You are responsible for your own behaviour. You are responsible. HIV is a choice nowadays. And you can choose not to get it. And don’t come whining to me with stigma, etc, etc. If you’re having sex with another guy then you’re not in a situation where stigma is an issue. You may experience stigma in other areas in your life, but if you’re about to take it up the ass, you’re not facing stigma. You can use a condom.

 

http://fridae.asia/n...th-pisani?n=sec

Use of boldface as in the original article

[Guest fountainhall]

I’ll add one further post relating to the above. In the comments posted about the interview with Elizabeth Pisani, one member of fridae incurred the wrath of others by referring to the work of The Perth Group. The poster wrote –

 

before we get excited. let's ask ourselves. does the HIV virus really exist?

 

let us do our individual research and base our actions on the facts and simple truth of this elusive virus.

 

check this link: http://www.theperthgroup.com/

 

There is nothing to stop simply because there isn't a virus.

 

I, for one, had never heard of this group and assumed it is a bunch of wackos. Yet, wackos have a habit of being taken seriously. Around the world, despite scientific ‘proof’, there are still some people who still believe in creationism as against evolution. Some states in the USA either do not permit the teaching of evolution or specifically teach the criticisms of the theory of evolution.

 

So I looked up The Perth Group’s website. Inevitably, how they arrive at their views is complex. But some of the bases of their argument are summed on their first page –

 

The view of The Perth Group is that the HIV/AIDS experts have not proven: (I list the first 3 of 6)

 

1. The existence of a unique, exogenously acquired retrovirus, HIV.

2. The "HIV" antibody tests are specific for "HIV" infection.

3. The HIV theory of AIDS, that is, that HIV causes acquired immune deficiency (destruction of T4 lymphocytes=AID) or that AID leads to the development of the clinical syndrome AIDS.

 

The Perth Group has argued: (I list 2 of 5)

 

1. The impossibility of haemophiliacs acquiring HIV following factor VIII infusions . . .

3. That AIDS will not spread outside the original risk groups.

http://www.theperthg...whatargued.html

 

After reading some pages of the site, I am convinced these people are indeed wacko! Simply to suggest that Factor VIII was not the reason for huge numbers of blood-transfusion patients becoming infected with HIV in the 1980s flies in the face of decades of established of medical science. This group’s ‘findings’ are ridiculous, in my view.

[Rogie]

With subjects such as cottaging yet again appearing on the Board along with fairly frequent references to social networking sites . . .

 

From sex-workers' perspective (copied from the Fridae interview):

 

"The problem is that virtual scene, the Internet scene, creates significant difficulties. Because if people are meeting partners in a physical space then I can meet them too. But if people are meeting partners in a virtual space.... I can get a condom into a sauna, into a cruising space, into a bar. But I can’t get a condom onto the Internet."

 

___________________________________________________________________

 

 

Pisani's a latter-day Kinsey; they'd make a great couple. Curiosity, persistence, and indefatigable attention to detail . . . one an epidemiologist, the other an entomologist who diversified into human beings and became a sexologist.

[pong]

really like this writing/person- frank and non-PC views.

Currently though it seems that in Europe the regions were HIv/Aids still spreads fairly rapidly are in druggie-scenes in east-Europe, notably Ukrayna.

Also it seems to me, that the more open a society is-not just for gays, but for any possible threat of values and morale, the best this seems for rapid action against further spread of virus. Do not know if the reverse then would also hold: the quicker this virus spreads in a country-the more homofobe it may be considered? or maybe I confuse with complete ignorance-like rural mainland China probably (still) is.

[Rogie]

Also it seems to me, that the more open a society is-not just for gays, but for any possible threat of values and morale, the best this seems for rapid action against further spread of virus.

 

Yes, provided the society, as mentioned in the Fridae article, has good information, education and communication.

 

Do not know if the reverse then would also hold: the quicker this virus spreads in a country-the more homofobe it may be considered?

 

Not sure about that. I am making a big assumptiom here, but I would guess most countries deemed to be 'homophobic' (and where HIV is a big problem) also have other ways in which HIV may be spread. I am thinking of some poor African countries when i say that. For example it is well known men in some countries, especially itinerant workers, use female prostitutes where unsafe sex may be practiced, then go home and possibly infect their wives or girlfriends.

 

or maybe I confuse with complete ignorance-like rural mainland China probably (still) is.

 

Yes, ignorance is different to making a taboo over something. I don't know whether ignorance is bliss or not. Maybe a parallel can be drawn with pregnancy rates in young girls. Going back several decades - pre-contraceptive pill - abstinence was the norm and so the majority of girls even if they didn't know where babies came from got away with it because they didn't 'go all the way'. After the pill and the advent of the so-called permissive society, any young girl who wasn't on the pill and who was ignorant of the facts of life was in real danger of getting pregnant.