Guest voldemar Posted April 30, 2011 Posted April 30, 2011 State Department's new, excessive passport application rules by Chris Hinyub Sat, Apr 30th 2011 If you thought it was an ordeal for Obama to prove his citizenship, wait until you see the new passport application. Form DS-5513 is a Quote
Moses Posted April 30, 2011 Posted April 30, 2011 have no idea why you are using "marxism" in topic's name... is it just for to connect name of Obama with it? Quote
Guest voldemar Posted April 30, 2011 Posted April 30, 2011 have no idea why you are using "marxism" in topic's name... is it just for to connect name of Obama with it? Because Marxists states were known for the denial of their citizens the right to travel. Have you ever heard of "iron curtain"? Quote
Guest anonone Posted May 1, 2011 Posted May 1, 2011 I am not sure what the big deal is with this. It is not used as the primary application document for a passport. It sounds like a fairly standard full-background questionnaire. If someone is not able to show citizenship, this offers a method to investigate and confirm that they are deserving of the document. Birth and residency records would be very important to establish citizenship. Quote
Bob Posted May 1, 2011 Posted May 1, 2011 Much ado about nothing in my opinion. And tossing around the word "marxism", although true to form, only continues to reflect the author's opinion about the current president (to which I continue to respond "who cares"). And I'm sure Obama has been working on this every single day (I doubt if he knows much if anything about it). I read the new "proposed" form and I don't see anything there that bothers me. I'd admittedly would have to guess on a few items and I wouldn't remember exact years or, perhaps, some addresses, but I could fill it out in less than 5 minutes without any problem. One section only needs to be filled out a bit more if you weren't born in the US or a medical facility (which, in this day and age, involves almost nobody born in the US). For anybody interested in reading the form (again, it's only a "proposed" form at the moment), here it is (in PDF form): Proposed Passport Form Quote
Guest voldemar Posted May 1, 2011 Posted May 1, 2011 I am not sure what the big deal is with this. It is not used as the primary application document for a passport. It sounds like a fairly standard full-background questionnaire. If someone is not able to show citizenship, this offers a method to investigate and confirm that they are deserving of the document. Birth and residency records would be very important to establish citizenship. Well, I definitely do not remember all addresses inside and outside US where I lived since my birth. I lived in at least ten countries and there is absolutely no way to recover this information. People who are willing to defend this form are most probably willing to go much further towards totalitarian path as long as it does not concern them personally. Quote
Guest anonone Posted May 1, 2011 Posted May 1, 2011 Well, I definitely do not remember all addresses inside and outside US where I lived since my birth. I lived in at least ten countries and there is absolutely no way to recover this information. People who are willing to defend this form are most probably willing to go much further towards totalitarian path as long as it does not concern them personally. A background questionnaire is not a pass / fail test. If you do not remember all little pieces of data, it does not disqualify you. The form is a tool used to compile as much data as possible to aid in the investigation. The more info you supply, the greater chance of having the items verified. And I am a rather staunch defender of civil liberties. There are certainly government actions which I believe cross the line, whether I am personally impacted or not. The"nude-o-scopes" being used for domestic travel comes immediately to mind.... This issue, in my opinion, is not a big deal. Quote
Guest voldemar Posted May 1, 2011 Posted May 1, 2011 A background questionnaire is not a pass / fail test. This issue, in my opinion, is not a big deal. How do you know that? This type of documents can easily be used a tool to deny application. The circumstances are changing, the bureaucrats are changing. Imagine the situation when the country is in the state of deep political, financial and economic crisis, a lot of people want to leave and take their assets with them. This type of documents can be used to prevent them leaving the country. How can you be sure that "other forms" are not quietly prepared by government bureaucrats for the state emergency. And, by the way, the crisis is may very well be right around the corner and you are not going to have warning on Bloomberg and CNBC. Yes, it may sound very unamerican but coming crisis of this type will unprecedented in American history. The other day I made a call to IRS regarding new FBAR form and wanted to clarify certain issues. This change of the form is already second under current Administration {the form has not been changed for years before). After 15 minute conversation with the agent [black women) I told her that I will not be able to comply with new requirements and will send an empty form ( that is a legal option under certain circumstances). Her response was that this is my choice to have offshore accounts and correspondingly I need to consider the consequences... The other day I had a visitor from Switzerland who told me that America, in his opinion, is rapidly changing and getting more and more unhospitable towards foreigners.. I have a liberal friend who likes to tell that Obama is the most transformational president in US history to which I like to respond : transformational to what? To destroyed economy, to worthless currency? To weakness in foreign policy? Did Obama invented new social formation? Obviously not. Than possible transformational choices are quite limited... Quote
Bob Posted May 1, 2011 Posted May 1, 2011 After 15 minute conversation with the agent [black women) Out of curiosity, why is it that you somehow know that the person you talked with over the phone was "black?" And why did you happen to mention that (does it somehow add to or clarify your information in any regard)? Quote
Moses Posted May 1, 2011 Posted May 1, 2011 Because Marxists states were known for the denial of their citizens the right to travel. Have you ever heard of "iron curtain"? Yes, I have. Moreover: I had living in USSR for few years and late - in modern Russia too. So I know some local laws. By the way : in USSR (before) and in Russia (now) citizens have to fill form application about job for travel passport only for past 10 years. For domestic passport (is used like an ID card) they haven't to fill any form about job, but have to fill form about place of residence, estate ownership and about relatives. Quote
Guest voldemar Posted May 1, 2011 Posted May 1, 2011 Yes, I have. Moreover: I had living in USSR for few years and late - in modern Russia too. So I know some local laws. By the way : in USSR (before) and in Russia (now) citizens have to fill form application about job for travel passport only for past 10 years. For domestic passport (is used like an ID card) they haven't to fill any form about job, but have to fill form about place of residence, estate ownership and about relatives. I have no idea what are requirements in modern Russia. In the former Soviet Union where I lived for 35 years everybody got domestic passport at the age of 16 and though I do not remember exactly what were the requirements, it was pretty easy with birth certificate. You are right it was like id card and did not allow for international travel. For vast majority of citizens it was IMPOSSIBLE to get international passport. It was not really about formal requirements... When I finally was allowed to live the country for good my domestic passport was revoked and I left the country as stateless person with around 100 US dollars without travel documents. It was the standard emigration procedure at the time... Soviet citizens could not have foreign currencies. For those who were allowed to leave the country by the same channel I did, they allowed to exchange around 100 Soviet roubles to 100 US Dollars in so called VneshTorgBank. I forgot a lot but I still remember the exchange procedure.. You can imagine what difference it made to end up eventually in US. But by the same token seeing the country slipping towards Marxism is equally shocking... Quote
Guest Posted May 1, 2011 Posted May 1, 2011 There is still too much socialism on this planet. Much of Europe persists in paying people who have no intention of ever working to be idle all day, whilst simultaneously over taxing enterprise & success. That's one reason why the wealth is heading east. Quote
