A Sad End

[zombie]

"A British man became yet another statistic of the insensitively named “Pattaya Flying Club” after he fell to his death at a condominium in the popular seaside resort. His Thai caretaker said the deceased had been depressed after losing his Thai boyfriend."

 

British man with depression falls to death from condo in Pattaya | Thaiger (thethaiger.com)

 

 

[Ruthrieston]

Sadly an old friend of mine killed himself in his condo on Friday morning, he was 89 years old and frail, tired and depressed. I only wish I could have helped him more. I hope he finds peace now.

[reader]

Truly sorry to hear about your friend. Unfortunately he was not the first who found himself in such dire straits. 

As a community, we have done little to address the fate on the aged members of our tribe. I read periodic comments about the  number of lonely men, particularly in Pattaya but they also exist in Bangkok and beyond. 

We understandably glorify the attraction of youth; that’s what drew most of us here in the first place. But time and age inextricably take their toll and all too often social isolation sets in.

Last week I was discussing the closure of the Coffee Grinder with the two men who opened the shop on Bangkok’s Soi.  Tarntawan. It was, they said, their intent to open a place that could serve as a gathering place for the city’s gay community during the daytime hours. There are many options in the evening in the Silom area, they reasoned, but no opportunity otherwise. They wanted a welcoming environment where folks could spend time and interact with others.

Sadly, due to conditions beyond their control, the shop had to close last month. I miss it already. I used it to meet with other members and it was a joy to be in those surroundings. We, as a community, need nurturing places.

[vinapu]

1 hour ago, reader said:

Last week I was discussing the closure of the Coffee Grinder with the two men who opened the shop on Bangkok’s Soi.  Tarntawan. It was, they said, their intent to open a place that could serve as a gathering place for the city’s gay community during the daytime hours. There are many options in the evening in the Silom area, they reasoned, but no opportunity otherwise. They wanted a welcoming environment where folks could spend time and interact with others.

 

and it worked intended way very well. Whenever option for meeting other member emerged it was almost always ' lets meet at Coffee Grindr" 

[Marc K]

Ok, call me sour if you like, but I think the term "Gay Community" is an oxymoron. Perhaps it is a remnant from earlier generations when our tribe had to hide and fear and fret, I don't know. We don't take very good care of "our kind" whether they be the elderly, the disabled, the dispossessed or despairing. Ask yourself the number of gay FRIENDS you actually have. For me I can count them on one hand, with a few fingers to spare. Buddies, many. Sexmates, who counts? Friends, well that's a different matter isn't it.

 

[PeterRS]

4 hours ago, Ruthrieston said:

Sadly an old friend of mine killed himself in his condo on Friday morning, he was 89 years old and frail, tired and depressed. 

 I only wish I could have helped him more

How dreadful! I wonder how long they had been together - quite a long time I expect. Losing a boy friend at that age must leave one with a horrible feeling of emptiness and no doubt fear for the future. I know from many of your earlier posts that you are one of the most caring of people. I doubt you could have done more.

While I agree with @reader that gay expats in Thailand tend not to be - as a general rule - very caring about fellow gay expats, I also agree with @Marc K and suspect quite a few do not consider their fellow gay men as a community any more. Time has moved on.

Perhaps I was lucky in that when i did move here, I already knew a couple of expats and several Thais. Now with a long-time Thai partner, I have a small group of gay friends, western and Thai. and he has a larger group of Thai friends. Fortunately he likes my friends and I really enjoy being with his friends. None of them know much about the gay scene except one who is still desperate to find a German boyfriend!

We do not go out to gay bars as we prefer an ambience that is not completely gay. In fact, my partner had never been to a gay bar until the friend desperate to meet a German took him to Soi 4 where they had a few drinks at Balcony. My partner said he would never go back. The reason? A few farang (probably tourists) came up to the two of them to ask them to go back for the night with them at the same time asking what fee to pay. When both politely would say 'no', the farang all basically told them to fuck off! 

I have met some other posters here and have arranged to meet another when he is next here. But we are all different and mixing with my existing friends gives me much enjoyment. For others I know it is different, and especially for those whose lives seem to revolve around a Thai or Asian boyfriend.

[jason1975]

I consider myself very privileged to have met some of the friendly members on this forum. During my recent weekend trip to Bangkok, I spent so much time chatting with a fellow forum member that I did not visit any gogo bar during the 3 nights! Even though there were 4 gogo bars and lots of fine looking guys around us! We chatted about our lives - the past, present and the inevitable future. The waiters were sensible enough to leave us alone when the topic of conversation became serious and solemn.

[reader]

3 hours ago, Marc K said:

Ok, call me sour if you like, but I think the term "Gay Community" is an oxymoron. Perhaps it is a remnant from earlier generations when our tribe had to hide and fear and fret, I don't know. We don't take very good care of "our kind" whether they be the elderly, the disabled, the dispossessed or despairing. Ask yourself the number of gay FRIENDS you actually have. For me I can count them on one hand, with a few fingers to spare. Buddies, many. Sexmates, who counts? Friends, well that's a different matter isn't it.

Don’t agree that gay community is an outmoded concept, although I certainly agree that “We don't take very good care of "our kind" whether they be the elderly, the disabled, the dispossessed or despairing.”

If I found that l had less than a handful of gay friends, however, I’d be poorer for it.

[kokopelli3]

The only friends I have here in Pattaya are gay friends;  I would be lost without them! And we are concerned about one another.

[scott456]

9 hours ago, Ruthrieston said:

Sadly an old friend of mine killed himself in his condo on Friday morning, he was 89 years old and frail, tired and depressed. I only wish I could have helped him more. I hope he finds peace now.

Sometime there is just nothing can be done to help in certain situation, especially if a senior has poor health, and no family members are willing to take up responsibility. 

[Lucky]

Whatever its faults, this website does allow some human/gay connection. I would miss it if it ceased operating.

[vinapu]

12 hours ago, Marc K said:

 We don't take very good care of "our kind" whether they be the elderly, the disabled, the dispossessed or despairing. Ask yourself the number of gay FRIENDS you actually have. For me I can count them on one hand, with a few fingers to spare. Buddies, many. Sexmates, who counts? Friends, well that's a different matter isn't it.

 

Your right  but after all we are men, like all men -  selfish, prone to brutality and rarely taking a shower other than on Friday

[vinapu]

10 hours ago, PeterRS said:

..... took him to Soi 4 where they had a few drinks at Balcony. My partner said he would never go back. The reason? A few farang (probably tourists) came up to the two of them to ask them to go back for the night with them at the same time asking what fee to pay. When both politely would say 'no', the farang all basically told them to fuck off! 

 

console him that as time goes by his chances of being left alone there are increasing exponentially, take my word for that although  from time to time even I'm s asked by some familiar Banana or Jupiter boys going to work " when I go with you?"

[vinapu]

9 hours ago, jason1975 said:

 I did not visit any gogo bar during the 3 nights! Even though there were 4 gogo bars and lots of fine looking guys around us! 

You may be turning lesbian, been there , done that and still regret

[vinapu]

6 hours ago, kokopelli3 said:

The only friends I have here in Pattaya are gay friends;  I would be lost without them! And we are concerned about one another.

Good job! Having friends is often life long exercise and require going through a lot of thick and thin. only then we reap our reward.

Mu uncle who died in good faculties at 94 remarked that no matter what , at some point of life you find yourself lonely because most of people you knew all your life are gone or they already don't know who you are. He called it 'penalty for living too long"

[PeterRS]

8 hours ago, vinapu said:

console him that as time goes by his chances of being left alone there are increasing exponentially, take my word for that

Sorry I don't wish to take your word. My partner has not the slighest desire to go with anyone from a gay bar and the mention of money makes him feel unclean. He has a wonderful knack of making friends and keeping friends. I am sure he will settle down with another after I die or we split up for some reason. And his future is definitely in Europe, not Thailand.

[vinapu]

2 hours ago, PeterRS said:

. My partner has not the slightest desire to go with anyone from a gay bar and the mention of money makes him feel unclean. He has a wonderful knack of making friends and keeping friends.

You are in good hands then

[Marc K]

20 hours ago, kokopelli3 said:

The only friends I have here in Pattaya are gay friends;  I would be lost without them! And we are concerned about one another.

Congrats, that's great! And your last sentence is the key. Not just drinking friends, or traveling friends, or companions, or sex-friends, or gabbing friends, but friends you can count on. And ask yourself how you can be counted on by others, too.

[TotallyOz]

The idea of gay community is important to me. There have been a few very close gay friends in my life in Thailand but sadly, they are no longer with us. As they were much older than me, I was so happy to have them as part of my life and listen to their stories and history. I learned a great deal from conversations and correspondence. The one friend I had in Pattaya passed away a while back and I have had zero desire to visit there since. He was the reason I went to spend long weekends and without that, I find I had rather go to other places. I do think very important to have a wide variety of friends. Most of my friends in most cities are not gay. But, where I spent most of my adult life (New York City), the opposite is true. I still have those gays that are as close as family and I see them often and hang out with them often. Gone are the days of discos and nightclubs and sex clubs, now to the days of brunches without handovers, dinner and the theater, and just getting together to play games (I taught them Rook so they would have a bit of my childhood).

 

[moistmango]

On 10/22/2023 at 1:14 PM, Marc K said:

Ok, call me sour if you like, but I think the term "Gay Community" is an oxymoron. Perhaps it is a remnant from earlier generations when our tribe had to hide and fear and fret, I don't know. We don't take very good care of "our kind" whether they be the elderly, the disabled, the dispossessed or despairing. Ask yourself the number of gay FRIENDS you actually have. For me I can count them on one hand, with a few fingers to spare. Buddies, many. Sexmates, who counts? Friends, well that's a different matter isn't it.

 

Where I come from - Asia - there used to be very little by way of a "community", if only because, as @Marc K observes, most of us were too busy maintaining facades and ensuring that our less licit activities remained under the radar. Growing up, the gay men around me were by and large judgmental, hierarchical, resentful. It wasn't great, to put it mildly. Things are a little better these days, thanks to the interwebs and the adoption of American notions of queer pride and community by a younger generation, but I still only have a small handful of gay friends. When I think of a "gay community", it isn't the pride parades that come to mind, but the sniping, morose, conflicted bunch in "The Boys in the Band" - which was brilliantly true to life. RIP Crowley and Friedkin.