Israel And The Palestinians: A Nightmare In Desperate Search Of A Solution

[EmmetK]

Hamas intentionally targets civilians. The IDF targets Hamas murderers.

Hamas tortures (cuts open pregnant woman's stomachs, throws babies into ovens, gouges out victim's eyes, murders children in front of parents, murders parents in front of children, murders teenage concert-goers, etc.), rapes, and kidnaps the elderly, children, and babies. The IDF does not.

End of story.

It's really that simple.

[Latbear4blk]

1 hour ago, EmmetK said:

End of story.

It's really that simple.

[Marc in Calif]

3 hours ago, EmmetK said:

End of story.

It's really that simple.

Let me correct that for you. The only appropriate word to describe your "story" is simplistic. 

[vinapu]

7 hours ago, Latbear4blk said:

 the killing of innocent people.

war  is such horrible thing chiefly because ever since modern weaponry was developed  is about killing innocent and unarmed  people.

It's why it should be avoided by any cost. Too bad neither Hamas nor Putin aren't reading this board. 

Unfortunately current one was not started by Israelis.  Yes , Palestinians   have tons of legitimate grievances but that doesn't not change fact that current carnage  was triggered by Hamas onslaught. Like in every other war , aggressor need to take into consideration that side attacked will respond with all force it can muster.

They broken all rules including main one- don't start war without idea how you want finish it and means to meet your goal.

[reader]

17 minutes ago, vinapu said:

They broken all rules including main one- don't start war without idea how you want finish it and means to meet your goal.

I’ve gradually come around to the belief that this is precisely how Hamas figured it would play out. 

Given Israel’s consistent history of rapid and overwhelming response, how could they possibly believe otherwise.

Hamas’ goal was to sacrifice its own citizens to bring about unrest throughout the Mideast and beyond. And although they invited the disaster that’s unfolding daily, they way well be on their way to their ultimate objective.

[vinapu]

2 minutes ago, reader said:

I’ve gradually come around to the belief that this is precisely how Hamas figured it would play out. 

Given Israel’s consistent history of rapid and overwhelming response, how could they possibly believe otherwise.

Hamas’ goal was to sacrifice its own citizens to bring about unrest throughout the Mideast and beyond. And although they invited the disaster that’s unfolding daily, they way well be on their way to their ultimate objective.

Looks that it's their crooked and blood soaked logic but one who sows the wind  harvests storm. 

[reader]

From Thai PBS World

Remains of seven more Thais killed in Israel due back on Thursday

Seven more sets of remains of Thais killed in Israel are scheduled to arrive at Suvarnabhumi international airport on Thursday afternoon, according to the Thai Foreign Ministry.

A total of 34 Thai nationals died during or since the Hamas attack on Israel on October 7^th and 24 are being held captive by militant groups in Gaza. Four others are in hospital.

Foreign Minister Parnpree Bahiddha-Nukara said yesterday that the 24 hostages are being held by 2 or 3 militant groups, including Hamas, in various locations.

If the Thai hostages are released, he said that they must be set free through a safe corridor at the Egyptian border. The Thai government has already informed the Egyptian government and Thai officials should be allowed to accompany the hostages from Gaza.

From his talks with his counterparts in Qatar, Iran and Egypt last week, Parnpree said it is very possible that Thai hostages will be the first group to be released.

He also said that there are other groups of Thai people who have been trying to secure the release of the Thai hostages, using their own connections.

One of these groups is associated with House Speaker Wan Muhamad Noor Matha, a Thai Muslim. They approached Iran, which is believed to have influence over Hamas.

[Latbear4blk]

13 hours ago, reader said:

I’ve gradually come around to the belief that this is precisely how Hamas figured it would play out. 

Given Israel’s consistent history of rapid and overwhelming response, how could they possibly believe otherwise.

Hamas’ goal was to sacrifice its own citizens to bring about unrest throughout the Mideast and beyond. And although they invited the disaster that’s unfolding daily, they way well be on their way to their ultimate objective.

Indeed. Hamas knew that the IDF and the Israel government have no problems massacring innocent civilians. They bet for the mass murderers to react mass murdering. Easy bet.

[PeterRS]

On 11/8/2023 at 8:35 AM, Marc in Calif said:

Let me correct that for you. The only appropriate word to describe your "story" is simplistic. 

I would add "massively simplistic". I have repeatedly said you cannot regard the present/recent ghastly war without looking back at history, a position I know some other posters do not agree with. The treatment Israel, especially under its ultra right wing governments, has meted out to the mass of the Palestinians has been largely disgraceful. It continues to annex Arab lands to build their largely orthodox settlements despite this being against several UN resolutions. And who made the decision to prop up Hamas over more than a decade? Israel!

Since its inception in 2006, the UNHCR has adopted virtually as many resolutions against Israel's actions on issues regarding the Palestinians as in the rest of the world combined. Israel has been no saint!

The civilised world sees a two-state solution. Israel's politicians have stated this time and time again; yet their actions have proved the opposite. Yasser Arafat could have been a party to peace which seemed very close at the Camp David Accords, but pulled out because those present all agree that his aim was in fact a one-state solution.

Now with other actors taking part in the conflict, notably the US and Iran, with Netanyahu's position finally extremely vulnerable and much of the world against what israel is doing in Gaza, Israel is in arguably the most difficult situation it has faced for decades. That is not to condone in any way the terror and outright murder of Israeli men, women and children by Palestinian terrorists. It is merely facing facts.

It's really hard to see how Israel gets out of this mess without the war extending beyond the borders of Israel and Gaza.

[vinapu]

10 minutes ago, PeterRS said:

 

It's really hard to see how Israel gets out of this mess without the war extending beyond the borders of Israel and Gaza.

if other countries will be involved, this will probably create even bigger mess