New "yellow bank" ripoff?? Beware!

[Marc K]

For the past umpteen years I have used the "yellow bank" ATMs. I always got a near-current exchange rate (a 1% currency conversion fee) and it allows a daily withdrawal of 30k baht. The service fee (200B) has always been refunded by my bank back home, so I was always happy.

Last night, for the first time, a new screen appeared just at the very end of the ATM withdrawal process which asks if you want THEM to do the conversion to US dollars? I foolishly pushed "ACCEPT" which was a BIG mistake -- the receipt slip informs me that they took an additional 5% currency conversion fee for the privilege of doing the conversion!! This means I lost more than $40 on that transaction! I am really pissed!

I knew the moment I pushed ACCEPT that I had made a mistake, but there is NO WAY to cancel or reverse your choice once you push that button (which is far bigger than the other buttons). I was in a hurry and it cost me dearly.

So please, any Americans out there, please be careful with this raunchy (at best!) business practice. I was going to go back to the Yellow Bank to complain this morning but I realized it would do me no good. SO please be careful! (I don't know if this scam, and yes it is a scam, is also being done for pounds and euros, I hope not.)

[Mavica]

US$40?  How much did you withdraw?

It's not a scam or rip-off - we have the option to accept, or not.  Most banks worldwide outside of our home countries ask if you want to accept its / their conversion rate.  Nothing new.  Just don't accept it.  You learned a lesson, which will save you money down the road.  I'm surprised this is the first time you've encountered it.  Currency conversion fees are typical charges, nothing new from what I've experienced.  Some bank / investment account cards reimburse us for the fees ... most do not.  Take a deep breath.  Tomorrow will be better.  Thanks for posting the report.

[scott456]

What is Yellow Bank? Is it a real bank ATM or just an ATM network(e.g. Euronet in Europe)?  I always use an ATM at a real physical bank when I travel in a foreign country, and never accepted currency conversion. 

[Gaybutton]

1 hour ago, scott456 said:

What is Yellow Bank?

 

"Yellow Bank" is Krungsri Bank, aka Bank of Ayudhya.

The Thai banks are all easily identifiable by their various color schemes.  For example, Kasikorn Bank, aka K-Bank, will be green.  Bangkok Bank is dark blue.  Siam Commercial Bank is purple with yellow lettering, etc.

However, "Yellow Bank" is the only bank often referred to by its logo color.  Nobody refers to the other banks by their logo color or color scheme.  They are simply referred to by their names. 

I have no idea how Krungsri came to be commonly referred to as "Yellow Bank", but there it is . . .

[Boy69]

I was in Colombia last year many ATMs wouldn't let me withdraw if I didn't confirm to accept their conversation so I had been  forced to confirm , luckily theirs rate were almost the same to my local bank.

[kokopelli3]

Yellow Bank

[vinapu]

Like mavica said, nothing new but thank you for OP for reminding us about that dreadful 'dynamic conversion rate" as it is called.

Banks are getting more sophisticated to catch us off guard. It happened to me once even if I was aware of what's going on. I took it as a lesson.

Few times when paying  for purchases with card I was not even asked if I want charge in local currency or get it converted right away, the same big No, No

[billyhouston]

Since I have debit and credit cards with several Thai banks this situation does not arise but, in the dim distant past, when 'dynamic conversion' was applied to a foreign card, without my consent, I made the shop reverse the transaction. They had to nullify the original and put through a new transaction without the 'dynamic conversion'. Caveat Emptor.

[floridarob]

Something similar happened to me when I used the ATM outside of the The Bangkok Christian Hospital....the sun reflection was so bad on the screen I couldn't read the screen, and I thought the conversion OK, was Continue. When I saw the receipt I almost shit. I took a picture of the screen showing it was nearly black.

I knew I wouldn't win the DCC (Dynamic currency conversion) dispute, so I disputed that the machine didn't dispense any currency. I won the dispute because the Thai bank never responded to the dispute request and their time to do so ran out....I suspected that would be the outcome. My justification was that's what they get for being so greedy with their DCC % 😉

[vinapu]

4 hours ago, floridarob said:

I knew I wouldn't win the DCC (Dynamic currency conversion) dispute, so I disputed that the machine didn't dispense any currency. 

Rob , you robbed the bank

[Patanawet]

Why is it 'a new ripoff"?
I haven't had to draw Baht from a foreign account for a few years but from what I remember, I used to have to choose between 2 exchange rates.
At the time, there was a lot of advice hovering around. So NEW, no.

And if you're given a choice, why is it a ripoff?

[vinapu]

8 hours ago, Patanawet said:

And if you're given a choice, why is it a ripoff?

choice may be hidden and when at ATM , specially on the street we want to conduct business fast.

[paulfort]

When I initially started visiting Thailand often many years ago I used to always use the ATMs then as their fees increased, coupled with my own UK bank fees, I looked after a holiday and realised just what this small benefit was actually costing me - and it was a fortune!

I now simply take sufficient UK notes, pack them in to a couple of envelopes, place in buttoned trouser pockets for my flight then straight in to the room safe on arrival, I then exchange with the best rates (defiantly I think in Bangkok Super Rich Silom road and larger notes give the best rates,  but always a long wait!) however other than a rip of sudden emergency ATM saves me a fortune! 

Additionally more Thai establishments accept credit or debit cards, some such as Chase don't charge a currency conversation fee and the rates their rates seem to normally reflect the acceptable rates from change places, so I increasingly use plastic! 

 

[Marc K]

On 10/7/2023 at 12:43 PM, Mavica said:

US$40?  How much did you withdraw?

It's not a scam or rip-off - we have the option to accept, or not.  Most banks worldwide outside of our home countries ask if you want to accept its / their conversion rate.  Nothing new.  Just don't accept it.  You learned a lesson, which will save you money down the road.  I'm surprised this is the first time you've encountered it.  Currency conversion fees are typical charges, nothing new from what I've experienced.  Some bank / investment account cards reimburse us for the fees ... most do not.  Take a deep breath.  Tomorrow will be better.  Thanks for posting the report.

I withdrew 30,000. And yes 5% of that is >$40. And no, this is the first time this screen appeared at the "yellow bank" ATM which I have been using for years. So get your facts straight, ok?

[Marc K]

On 10/7/2023 at 1:00 PM, scott456 said:

What is Yellow Bank? Is it a real bank ATM or just an ATM network(e.g. Euronet in Europe)?  I always use an ATM at a real physical bank when I travel in a foreign country, and never accepted currency conversion. 

"Yellow Bank" is Krung Sri bank. Each bank in Thailand seems to have a marketing "color". Yes, it most definitely is a real physical bank, one of the largest in the Kingdom.

[Marc K]

On 10/7/2023 at 8:08 PM, vinapu said:

Like mavica said, nothing new but thank you for OP for reminding us about that dreadful 'dynamic conversion rate" as it is called.

Banks are getting more sophisticated to catch us off guard. It happened to me once even if I was aware of what's going on. I took it as a lesson.

Few times when paying  for purchases with card I was not even asked if I want charge in local currency or get it converted right away, the same big No, No

You are right, vinapu, the bank's conversion rate is always lower, but in this case I lost FIVE PERCENT. That's a huge "commission" to take. And it does it by a very sneakily designed last-moment screen in the withdrawal process. Of course I will never make that mistake again, it cost me 40+ bucks. Hard lesson.

[Marc K]

On 10/8/2023 at 7:33 AM, vinapu said:

Rob , you robbed the bank

Good for Rob. That type of sneaky "theft" really needs to be called out! As for me, I was withdrawing quite a lot of money (30k) and I didn't want to dawdle near the ATM for obvious security concerns, and I was not expecting that stealth screen, so I rushed, which cost me dearly alas.

[Marc K]

On 10/9/2023 at 4:05 PM, Patanawet said:

Why is it 'a new ripoff"?
I haven't had to draw Baht from a foreign account for a few years but from what I remember, I used to have to choose between 2 exchange rates.
At the time, there was a lot of advice hovering around. So NEW, no.

And if you're given a choice, why is it a ripoff?

It is a ripoff because the conversion rate concession is way too big (FIVE PERCENT) and it was done in a very sneaky way with a final screen which was inserted into the process (at least at "yellow bank" that was the case). AND the buttons on the screen make it way more likely you are going to hit ACCEPT. In fact I don't even remember if there was a DECLINE button but I assume there was. Still sneaky shit in my book. Just a warning to others to be careful!

[Marc K]

7 hours ago, paulfort said:

When I initially started visiting Thailand often many years ago I used to always use the ATMs then as their fees increased, coupled with my own UK bank fees, I looked after a holiday and realised just what this small benefit was actually costing me - and it was a fortune!

I now simply take sufficient UK notes, pack them in to a couple of envelopes, place in buttoned trouser pockets for my flight then straight in to the room safe on arrival, I then exchange with the best rates (defiantly I think in Bangkok Super Rich Silom road and larger notes give the best rates,  but always a long wait!) however other than a rip of sudden emergency ATM saves me a fortune! 

Additionally more Thai establishments accept credit or debit cards, some such as Chase don't charge a currency conversation fee and the rates their rates seem to normally reflect the acceptable rates from change places, so I increasingly use plastic! 

 

I can see the logic of your argument, Paul, but with long-stays in Thailand I wouldn't really want to bring that kind of cash into the Kingom. I've relied on "honest" ATMs )who have given quite reasonable exchange rates, perhaps similar to Super Rich?) and have always gotten my 220B ATM fees refunded by my card holder, so it worked quite well for me until now. Now I learned I have to be much more careful.

[vinapu]

3 hours ago, Marc K said:

I can see the logic of your argument, Paul, but with long-stays in Thailand I wouldn't really want to bring that kind of cash into the Kingdom. 

threat it as you paid dearly for security and peace of mind. I still prefer to carry a cash and use ATM only when I'm running out at end of trip. In such cases I always try to withdrew as much as limit is so impact of those fees on both ends is minimized. If some baht will be left unspent , there's always next trip to ease that burden.

[Mavica]

All this angst for the approx. 1,500 Baht fee on the withdrawal of 30,000 Baht.  What would the fee / rate of exchange have been had Marc K not accepted the costlier one?  The difference between the two. 

Yes, it's a reminder for us all ... to read what we're being asked to agree to.  In this instance, a lesson learned.

[vinapu]

10 hours ago, Mavica said:

All this angst for the approx. 1,500 Baht fee on the withdrawal of 30,000 Baht. 

sometimes is not about money but very fact we are tricked by shady practices. 

completely unrelated to the story above but good example  - few month ago I ordered some skin treatment. Shipment come, it did not work as advertised , no surprise here , but that's not a point. Month later another shipment came and charge was made to card again. I called them , they told me I ordered subscription of the treatment which was not a case. Very sneaky. I called card company and asked for new card just in case.

[Mavica]

3 hours ago, vinapu said:

sometimes is not about money but very fact we are tricked by shady practices. 

Ok, what was shady?  The ATM message / instruction was clear, not deceptive from what I'm reading ... and the machine user didn't carefully read or understand the questions - didn't pay attention.  Embarrassing?  Yes.  As I interpret the transaction/ complaint I see it as a mistake on the part of the card user.  Let's accept our own actions without pointing the finger elsewhere.  All of us fuck-up from time to time.  It was an inexpensive lesson learned, IMO.  Is US$40 a make / break expense?  If so, maybe the trip should not have been taken in the first place.  A harsh commentary?  Yes.  But let's keep it real.  🫢

[PeterRS]

On 10/10/2023 at 12:46 AM, vinapu said:

when at ATM , specially on the street we want to conduct business fast.

And that then becomes the bank's fault?

[reader]

This is what Wise (formerly Transfer Wise) cautions about dynamic exchange conversion. 
 

Here's the simple rule you need to know when using a foreign ATM

When it asks which currency to charge you in, there's only one right answer... In the Eurozone, that answer is euros. In Sweden, Swedish krona. In Britain, pounds. In Australia, AUD. In the US, dollars.

Always, always, always choose to be charged in the local currency of the country you're in. If a Spanish ATM asks if you want to be charged in GBP, say no. Don't let the machine do your currency conversion.

Here's why you shouldn't let an ATM do conversion for you:

Foreign ATMs and card machines often say nice things like: This ATM offers conversion to your home currency.

On the surface, that seems pretty generous. It looks like you'll know exactly what you're paying, and in amounts you're way more familiar with. 

Nice, right?

But, in reality, paying in your home currency is hidden-fee-hell. 

It's a scam that goes by the name of Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC). DCC means you effectively ask a foreign ATM provider or bank to gleefully make up an exchange rate for you. And the only thing more likely to screw you over than your bank, is a foreign bank. 

This isn't a kind-hearted service. It's something banks use to take more of your money without you knowing.

https://wise.com/us/blog/choose-local-currency-at-foreign-atm