Another one caught...making his own videos with a 12 year old

[Gaybutton]

It's just incredible to me that given the number of arrests, people still think they're going to get away with it. Why do they even come to Thailand at all? Several other countries have ages of consent far younger than Thailand. Why do they come here? Just another item on my "I Don't Get It" list.

 

The following appears in PATTAYA ONE:

 

for photos see: http://www.pattayaone.net/news/2009/march/...9_03_52_3.shtml

_____

 

British National Arrested for Engaging in Underage Sex

 

Tourist Police held a press conference on Thursday morning to announce the arrest of Mr Paul Dixon, a 45-year-old British passport holder, on charges of engaging in sexual activities with a Thai male under the age of 15.

 

Police told journalists they had set up an observation post in a known early morning area frequented by foreign men in search of sex with underage Thai males. Mr Dixon had allegedly come into this area at around 4:30am and offered the teenager 500 baht to perform sexual acts with him. Police pounced, arrested Mr Dixon and went to the man's room where they found what they claim are incriminating objects such as KY jelly, pornographic movies, and allegedly incriminating photos.

 

Mr Dixon may now face court proceedings in coming days.

____________________

 

And this, in the PATTAYA DAILY NEWS:

_____

 

for photos see: http://www.pattayadailynews.com/shownews.p...NEWS=0000008692

 

ANOTHER BRITON ARRESTED IN PATTAYA ON PAEDOPHILE CHARGES

 

On the morning of 19th March 2009 Pattaya police announced that a suspected British paedophile had been arrested in Pattaya, accused of having sex with an underage Thai male.

 

At a press conference a police team led by Pol.Col. Krit Warit, Pol. Lt. Col. Chanchai Chowkasem, Pol. Lt. Col. Boon Rod Aung Gab, accompanied by Pol. Lt. Col. Suwan Aun Anan, revealed to the media that they had arrested Mr. Paul Dixon [45], a British national, for having sex with a Thai male under 15 years of age.

 

On display were items collected from the suspect’s room at King Fisher House 504/498 Moo .10 Soi Yensabai, Pratumnuk Road, including KY jelly, pornographic movies, a video camera, sex toys, a bondage belt and a collection of photos which are believed to incriminate the suspect.

 

Pol.Col. Krit Warit said they had been monitoring an area of the city frequented by foreign men looking for young Thai males for sexual purposes, and in particular a building no. 504/470 in Soi Tonson where many of these underage males were taken.

 

Mr. Dixon, an engineer with the London Underground, was arrested by a police team when he ventured into the area in the early hours of the morning and propositioned a young teenager for sex.

 

Police said the Mr. Dixon had been in Pattaya 5 times, normally on a 2 week stay. The suspect can now expect due processing according to the law.

 

Pol.Col. Krit Warit added that his police team was under direct orders from The Tourist Police Commissioner, Pol.Maj.Gen. Adis Ngahm-Jit Sooksri, to seize foreign tourists who travel to Thailand to have underage sex, a problem which is still prevalent in Pattaya.

[Guest Astrrro]

The Kingfisher is adjacent to 2 Guys. Exact same rooms, mostly a Norwegian clientele.

 

Soi Tonson, anyone know it?

[Guest taylorsquare]

If the allegations are true then I fully support the Police action.

Going by the online link to the news the boy clearly looks young by his structure.

 

However I do have some empathy for the alleged offender,it was his bad choice in speaking with the alleged "victim" at 4:30am of all times.

 

He will probably now lose his job,and other things.

I'm not sure where this "frequent area" is, soi tonson?

 

May justice do its course and the alleged offender receive psychological counseling/treatment for this.

My opinion is that these offenders are not gay,but they pretend to be,and thus gays traveling to Thailand are tarred with the same brush from authorities.

I think the alleged offender was a poster on another board.

There is no cure for this

I don't think punishment as such will help him. He needs intense pyschological counseling,and sorry to sound like a broken record,but please do not accept these people as gay,they are not,they have their own "title/group name" and i believe even their own forums.

I am gay,i am not the same as these..................people.

[PattayaMale]

What I write here in no way is meant to excuse people.

 

According to the CIP (a group that follows sexual child abuse), over 75% of sexual abuse is perpetrated on females. There web site also says 85% of the abuse is done by heterosexuals, and 21% abuse both boys and girls.

 

Since statistically this should be the same percentage world wide, how is 99% of the reported abuse in Pattaya just about underage male abuse?

 

Could it be that authorities only look in an area just populated by male boys? Could it be that there are areas in Pattaya that underage girls are being picked up?

 

I don't know. But statistically it seems there should be.

 

W

[Gaybutton]

how is 99% of the reported abuse in Pattaya just about underage male abuse?

I would think the reason is due to the fact that so many pedophiles come to Pattaya for the express purpose of seeking out sex with under-age boys. That's bound to add to the statistics. Unfortunately, Pattaya is unique in that sex with under-age boys is so readily available.

[Guest laurence]

Could it be that authorities only look in an area just populated by male boys? Could it be that there are areas in Pattaya that underage girls are being picked up?

 

I don't know. But statistically it seems there should be.

 

Most likely much of the underage sex with girls is by Thai males and not reported in foreign language papers.

[Guest Soi10Tom]

I think that Pattaya Male's post comes closest to hitting the nail on the head. There are many reasons that most of the arrest that take place involve boys and not girls. If you take a walk around the quieter girl bar area's (not Walking Street) you will see LOTS of underage girls engaging in the "trade." There is 10 times as much girl underage sex going on in Pattaya as there is boy underage sex.

 

I would suggest that there is a synergy between the cultural bias against gays, western governments, western NGOs, and a police system that lives,breathes. and eats corruption and bribes that bring about these totally out of balance arrest numbers.

 

Cultural Issues: All cultures, including Thai culture, carry a bias again gay men for whatever reason.

 

Western Governments, especially America, love to engage in the cultural policing of the world. America provides foreign aid based in part on a country's co operation in policing cultural issues....and the hottest of hot issues is gay child abuse. Also, keep in mind that most of the leaders of Thailand were educated in the West as young people and have cultural, personal, and professional associations that effect their thinking and INCOME.

 

Western NGOs make there MONEY by sell this underage gay sex issue as their fund raising issue It is the only issue that they have that gets a big CASH response. How much MONEY do you think World Vision could raise if they railed against child labor?? Westerners don't care how many hour a kid works in a sweat shop as long as they can buy cheap goods at WalMart, Big C, Lotus, or Carrefore.

 

Thai police are so corrupt that I am almost always amazed by how open and brazen the buy offs are. These arrest are a "CASH COW" to everyone from the street cop to the prosecutors office to city hall...and up from there. Why co you think that you almost never hear a follow up story? Most likely the "suspect" was found innocent the very nest morning at the local BABK. If not their passports are pulled and they are drained dry before being released or deported. The only ones that you continue to read about are the ones without the resources to pay the police. The poor ones are paraded about in the press and given over to foreign governments as proof of the Thai police's fine work and commitment to stomping out these horrible crimes.

 

BTW, the 'underage boys" work for and are paid by the police for their "services." (I have to wonder why the Thai police don't have young girls working for them in the same capacity.) Many of the locals know who these boys are and refer to them as "Radio Active."

 

And as Gaybutton pointed out in another post he has never know of a single arrest from offing a bar boy...the arrests are ALWAYS from picking up street urchins.

[KhorTose]

I think that Pattaya Male's post comes closest to hitting the nail on the head.

 

I agree with both PattayaMale's post and soi10tom's post with a very big exception. The prejudice is not against gay men. It is against men who have sex with boys. Why? Like it or not a boy is more important in Asian society then girls. I believe that many Asians have little trouble with sex with young girls, as they are still regarded in many ways as chattel. Men (boys) are important in Asian families and culture. They are the breadwinners and supporters of the parents. What happens to boys is very important, what happens to girls less so. This was how it was explained to me by Xiandarkthorne (asian) on another forum and I think he is correct.

 

To get back to Taylorsquare's comments. PattayaMale never used the word gay to signify these pedos, but Soi10Tom did repeatedly. I am gay, these pervs are not gay, they are pedophiles and we should always use that distinction. Please soi don't cater to the crowd that lumps us together with them. The only thing we gays have in common with these pedos is our common humanity and I often wonder about theirs.

[Gaybutton]

For practical purposes, does it really matter? We can analyze and guess about the reasons from now 'till Kingdom Come, but none of it alters the fact that given the numbers of arrests of the pedos diddling around with under age boys, these people must have a whole hardware store full of loose screws to take such a risk. And for what? A satisfying cum.

 

Great idea, pedos! Brilliant! Risk ruining your entire life, career, family, reputation, time in a Thai prison, time in a prison in your home country, along with a major loss of money so that you can get laid by a 10 year old. I have no sympathy for these people, but I do stand back in awe of that level of stupidity.

[Guest Soi10Tom]

I think that there is great prejudice is against gay men, to answer KhorTose

 

I understand where you are coming from, and I understand the distinction that you are wishing to make, but I think you need to face the reality of where the world is at in how it views gay and heterosexual "pedophiles."

 

Almost all of the guys we are talking about here on this board are not pedophiles at all but rather pederast. Meaning that they are attracted to post pubescent teens, which is very very different that being a pedophile attracted to kids.

 

There is no effective treatment for pedophiles....they need to be locked up because every bit of research says that they can not be successfully treated and will continue to re offend. And to answer Gaybutton's question as to why they continue do it when they know full well the consequences of their behaviors . It is simple, it is a compulsion that is beyond their control and has no connection to logic or thought. Pedophiles are driven...they can not be stopped only locked up with the key thrown away.

 

Pederast on the other hand are shown by research to be very treatable and most will not re offend after treatment. And again to answer Gaybutton's question, pederast can be treated and stopped, but will continue to offend until they go on their own or are forced to accept treatment.

 

To try to say a pedo is just a pedo flies in the face of world opinion. And as every shrink in the world will tell you, people attracted to 13, 14, 15, 16, 17 year olds are not pedophiles. But the world press goes on defining gays or hetros attracted to teens as pedophiles, when they all know that pedophiles are attracted to prepubescent kids not teens.

 

The simple truth is that the world has little interest in heterosexual "pedophiles" pederast or whatever you call them unless they do something that is totally over the top and snatches the attention of the news media. The world's attitude is, "Boys will be boys, What the hell, I wish I could have nailed that cute little fuzzy 14 year old pussy myself." And let's face it these guys are heterosexual pederast because they like girls. You never see a heterosexual pederast going after a 14 year old boy.

 

The world has a great interest in homosexual "pedophiles" pederast because most hetro men are repulsed by the very thought of gay sex, and sex with a "helpless" teen boy really sends them over the top, so it makes the news regularly. And let's face it these guys are gay pederast because they like boys. You never see a gay pederast going after a 14 year old girl.

 

Not pleasant or pretty, but this how the world works......90% of the pederast/pedophile assaults are heterosexual, but 90% of the pederast/pedophile assaults reported in the world's news are homosexual. Sad but true.

 

In the future let's try to at least try to use the right vocabulary on this board.

 

Most all of the guys we see as headline news both in the press and on this board are being advertised as "ANOTHER PEDOPHILE ARRESTED" when they are not pedophiles at all. They are pederast...which is a very very different thing.

 

I would be quite willing to bet that there is not one guy on Earth, gay or straight, who has not had a fantasy about having hot sex with a cute teenager that they saw at the beach or the mall......dose that make all men at least pederast at heart??? I'll leave you with that thought swirling your head.

[KhorTose]

I think that there is great prejudice is against gay men, to answer KhorTose

 

I understand where you are coming from, and I understand the distinction that you are wishing to make, but I think you need to face the reality of where the world is at in how it views gay and heterosexual "pedophiles."

 

I would be quite willing to bet that there is not one guy on Earth, gay or straight, who has not had a fantasy about having hot sex with a cute teenager that they saw at the beach or the mall......dose that make all men at least pederast at heart??? I'll leave you with that thought swirling your head.

 

Okay, nice response and you are correct. You cannot be a pedophile if the child is past puberty which may or may not be 12, 13 or 14 or in some cases 15. You are a pederest, but now that brings us to the legal end of the issue. Science, not religion has shown us that sex with a young adult (For the sake of this post anyone between 13-18) can and is harmfull to the young adult who is not muture enough to deal with the strong feelings and emotions associated with sex. So to determine what is safe for the young adult, every country has an Age Od Consent (AOC), which if the world was perfect would be determined by psychologist not morality. Most of the world sets this at 16 and, when it is lower, they usually have some other requirement; like it is forbidden if the person is more then so many years older, or money or cohersion are involved. Also, sex with a young adult or an adult past the AOC can be very tramatic if the person who initiated the sex was in a position of authority or trust. (Minister, psychologist, doctor, cop teacher, etc.) Often there are laws to cover this type of relationship, or you get sued and lose your job.

 

All of the Western nations I know do prosecute males (homo and hetro) who have sex with young adults below this AOC. With the good old USA being the strongest enforcer with an almost uniform AOC of 18. Now I completely agree that both hetrosexuals and homosexuals often spy someone under the legal AOC and feel an attraction. I have seen some very hot young adults that definitely make my heart quiver, and I doubt I am not alone. However, I do not give into that impulse and the person who does give in should correctly be called a child abuser rather then a pederest. Yes, I will concede that we may all be pederest at one time or the other, but we are not child abusers, because unlike the child abuser we have normal adult impulse control and they do not. Quite often they have issues with drugs, or are sociopathic in some sense. So my suggestion to is to use the words pedophile for those who have sex with children under puberty, child abuser for those who have sex with those under the AOC, and gay for the rest of us. What do you think?

[Guest taylorsquare]

Some of you are saying that peds should be locked up who are having sex with 10yo boys,but its partially ok with a 14yo.

The law in most countries is 16yo without any cash or kind exchanged.including Thailand.

 

The thing is in most western countries ,UK,Australia etc,the govts are treating 16/17yo still as children.

Thus 17yo boys now have the mentality of 10yo,they are far more immature nowadays.

Parents are running arund saying lets protect our kids whilst their 16yo slut daughter is walking the streets on a friday night with groups of older guys.

in most states of Australia to have sex with a 16yo both homosexual and other as long as no cash has exchanged is legal

 

One wonders why the Australian federal Police are not concentrating on Sydneys Kings Cross area where underage sex and heroin is sold openly.

whilst i dont like these "boylovers" as they call themselves,i cant stand hypocrite police either.

 

 

No we dont want to know what happens in our backyard.

However i agree these men who seek out younger than the min ag e,eg 16yo are not gay.

They dont believe in their own mind they are doing anything wrong.morally or otherwise.

They have their own forums ,much bigger than this one.

Years ago,i heard apparently they tried to march with gays in a pride but were turned away.

The authorities should know,dont lump gay men in the same cat

 

[KhorTose]

Some of you are saying that peds should be locked up who are having sex with 10yo boys,but its partially ok with a 14yo.

 

No one is saying that. We agree with you, but we are discussing what terms (semantics) to use to seperate the pedophiles, and the child abusers from gays. Suggest you reread soi's and my post.

?????????????????

[Guest Soi10Tom]

I accept what ever the law says in a given place/country as the reality of that culture, based on what ever they use as their gauge. The use of the word Abuser is much more appropriate, and I think that is probably the best word available to describe the legal transgression of the law.

 

But, as a moral issue I don't know that a 15,16 or 17 year old that knows exactly what he/she is doing and has set out with a plan to get "laid" can be the "victim" of an older person.

 

This is all a very interesting area filled with emotional and legal land mines. I taught school for many years and I have never seen a High School where at least one of the teachers was not married to an ex student. There are always students with the "hots" for a teacher...and there are often teachers looking to give a little unneeded guidance. Having spent a great deal of my life around teens; I have seen many things. Teens can be stupid and naive; they can be horny creatures in a predatory search of sex; they can be delightfully charming and obnoxiously stupid. They can be as mature as a 30 year old and as child like as a 3 year old. Human sexuality and sexual behaviors will continue to baffle man and the law long after we are gone.

[Guest lvdkeyes]

It all really boils down to this: Anyone in Thailand who has sex with a boy or girl under the age of 18 is just plain stupid. They know the law and if they break the law they have to be prepared to pay the price. All of this talk about pedophile vs pederast and whether it's boys or girls or any of these other topics doesn't matter in the long run.

[Gaybutton]

It all really boils down to this: Anyone in Thailand who has sex with a boy or girl under the age of 18 is just plain stupid.

Exactly. I agree with every word of your post including the part about the pointlessness of going into what defines what or why the media reports whatever it reports. It doesn't matter. Pedo, pederast, or anything else. None of it changes the fact that if someone comes to Thailand, seeks out boys under 18 years old for sex, and gets caught, then he's going bye-bye. I fail to see what difference the rest of it makes.

[Guest laurence]

. What do you think?

 

I think that you KhorTose and Soi10Tom are right in what you post. It is not an easy position to take a stand on, because there is no white and black. Although all can agree the 18 yo rule is one not to violate without consequence.

 

Tonight, at a Thai restaurant, in the US, a friend commented on how "cute" was our waiter. Now this guy is into older, muscular, "bear" type guys but our waiter was , shall we say, "below the 18th parallel". Nonetheless my friend was taken by the grace and beauty of this young guy. My friend is not a pedophile or pederast, but just a normal, healthy homosexual, just like the rest of us.

 

[Guest GaySacGuy]

Okay, nice response and you are correct. You cannot be a pedophile if the child is past puberty which may or may not be 12, 13 or 14 or in some cases 15. You are a pederest, but now that brings us to the legal end of the issue. Science, not religion has shown us that sex with a young adult (For the sake of this post anyone between 13-18) can and is harmfull to the young adult who is not muture enough to deal with the strong feelings and emotions associated with sex. So to determine what is safe for the young adult, every country has an Age Od Consent (AOC), which if the world was perfect would be determined by psychologist not morality.

 

I think as far as "is harmful to the young adult who is not mature enough to deal with...sex" that there is a world of difference between seducing some young person who had no intention of having sex with you until they were seduced....vs......someone who is trolling for sex to make some money or other payment and is planning (and has planned in the past) to have sex with anyone.

 

I know the same law applies, and I agree with that...but the effect of the act is tremendously different!!

[Guest MonkeySee]

Science, not religion has shown us that sex with a young adult (For the sake of this post anyone between 13-18) can and is harmfull to the young adult who is not muture enough to deal with the strong feelings and emotions associated with sex.

Science has shown that young adult engaging in consenual sex is harmful? I would like to read more about that. Sure, unprotected sex acts can be harmful to everyone, but normal sexual urges in teens ARE HARMFUL? Sounds more like religion than science to me.

 

[PattayaMale]

Science has shown that young adult engaging in consenual sex is harmful? I would like to read more about that. Sure, unprotected sex acts can be harmful to everyone, but normal sexual urges in teens ARE HARMFUL? Sounds more like religion than science to me.

 

Do you remember the South Pacific song, "Carefully Taught"?

 

You've got to be taught

To hate and fear,

You've got to be taught

From year to year,

It's got to be drummed

In your dear little ear

You've got to be carefully taught.

 

You've got to be taught before it's too late,

Before you are six or seven or eight,

To hate all the people your relatives hate,

You've got to be carefully taught

 

From "The World History of Male Love" Click Here

 

The most civilized culture in antiquity also developed a highly evolved form of homosexual love. In ancient Greece love between males, or more precisely, love between young men and adolescent boys, was harnessed for the good of the state and of the lovers. Though not strictly gay love as we know it today, it was founded on the erotic passion between two males. It was held that the youth was enriched by the friendship of his lover and that the man strove to attain heights of achievement, in battle, sports or his profession, to be worthy of his beloved. These partnerships of lovers were said to make men undefeatable in battle. Seen in that light, one wonders what all the fuss is today in the US about gay soldiers.

 

Love between men in China begins with the very beginning of history, with the first (semi-legendary) ruler, the Yellow Emperor. Historians claimed he was the first to establish the custom of taking a male bedmate. Many, if not most Chinese emperors had gay lovers. The tradition was known as the Way of the Cut Sleeve, or the Way of the Bitten Peach. China also stands out as one of the richest sources of erotic homosexual art. Sadly, only a small fraction has been preserved, as most of it was destroyed in the "Cultural" Revolution.

 

Now as others have written, it matters what the law says in each country more than song verse, historical writings and far ago cultural practices. But it is interesting to debate and discuss these issues. And yes, in my view, much of "law" is religiously inspired.

[Gaybutton]

much of "law" is religiously inspired.

Here's one of my favorite quotes. I've posted it before,and it seems appropriate now:

 

"The only good thing that ever came from religion is the music." - George Carlin

[Guest Soi10Tom]

Exactly. I agree with every word of your post including the part about the pointlessness of going into what defines what or why the media reports whatever it reports. It doesn't matter. Pedo, pederast, or anything else. None of it changes the fact that if someone comes to Thailand, seeks out boys under 18 years old for sex, and gets caught, then he's going bye-bye. I fail to see what difference the rest of it makes.

 

I would agree with your legal and consequential opinion that the law and the enforcement of the law is what it is and all of the rest makes little difference in that context.

 

Here is the difference. Words are very powerful and using word incorrectly only leads to more ignorance.

 

Once new knowledge has been shared with you and you declare it that, "It doesn't matter.". and then you continue to use incorrect vocabulary to describe those arrested you are willfully conveying incorrect information. Also, the tone of your post and the thought process revealed says that you are going to go right doing what you are doing and thinking what you are thinking even though you now know that it is incorrect. It seems to me that you are of the opinion that you already know all that you need to know, and unnecessary facts and knowledge will not be used to confuse you. I find your lack of intellectual curiosity and unwillingness hear facts....well, very Bush like.

[Gaybutton]

I find your lack of intellectual curiosity and unwillingness hear facts....well, very Bush like.

Well, that certainly brings tears to my eyes. Is that what you find? I didn't even know you were looking.

 

My friend, if you want to go by strict definitions and quibble about it, that's your affair. Just because you attach great importance to that doesn't mean everybody else has to do the same thing. New knowledge? That's a presumptuous assumption. Quite frankly, I actually have enough command of the language to already have known the differences long, long before your post. I never said I'm unwilling to hear facts or that I lack intellectual curiosity. That's your opinion. If you think you're telling me anything I didn't know before, well . . . you're mistaken. I already know the facts, thank you very much. I also know the phrase about a rose by any other name.

 

In all honesty I'm neither interested nor do I give a damn. My interest is in the practical side. Quibbling about words and dictionary definitions is of no importance to me at all, especially in light of another fact: The last time I checked, English is not a static language.

 

I'll tell you what. The next time someone is arrested for being a pedophile, but in reality he's merely a pederast, just have him open his dictionary for the police. I'm sure that will make a huge difference.

 

If this makes me very Bush-like, so be it. I disagree with that interpretation. I thought it makes me very Nixon-like.

[KhorTose]

Here is the difference. Words are very powerful and using word incorrectly only leads to more ignorance.

 

GB, I have concur with Soi 100%. I do not mean to gang up on you, but you really are wrong on this one. I am very impressed that Soi10 has expressed this so well, and so clearly. I know I could not have put it so clearly. My hat is off to you Soi.

 

The only other person I know that said this took quite a few more words. His name was Michael Foucault, and he is somewhat difficult to read. As many of his ideas and writings became important to the world-wide gay movement, I would recommend that you read one of his books called "The Order of Things". Just found a URL which gives a concise summery of this book. Read from from 4.0 down.

 

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/foucault/

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest lester1]

I cannot let all this interesting debate carry on without putting in my sixpennath, as we say in the UK. What is strange is that I pretty much agree with everybody so far. Gaybutton, when confining himself to the practicalities of how to behave in Thailand, is quite correct. In the current climate you would be a complete fool to be seen anywhere near a boy under the age of 15 in any context that could be either misconstrued or taken advantage of by anybody watching. This is a great shame because it perpetuates the idea that is common all over the world at the moment that if you are a stranger and talk to a child then you must be a child molestor. Now of course, in the narrow world of the Plaza etc that might just be the case. This is further complicated by the fact that young people who roam these areas are as much a predator as the farang visitors, and could even be more sexually aware and experienced. I couldnt help noticing one of the eye candy photos on this board of a boy in his mid twenties who works in a well known plaza beer bar and who was, when illegally young, according to several informed sources, extremely available and extremly talented.

Other posters here who are locked into trying to find definitions that suit everybody in this legal and moral mindfield are also correct. Their main trouble is that I get the feeling that they are working towards making the 'act' somehow more acceptable, and thus more forgiveable. In many cases it isnt, but in some, it can be. More later!!