New to Thailand - sex questions

[ChristianPFC]

Prices are on the clinics' websites,

e.g. for Pulse Silom: https://www.pulse-clinic.com/pcr-dna-test-for-14-infections

That would be the upper end, elsewhere (Pripta Chamchuri, Red Cross near Lumpini Park) in Bangkok cheaper.

[floridarob]

7 hours ago, Londoner said:

After all, we- this forum- represent the "horse's mouth" when it comes to gay  sex in Thailand.

both ends of the horse are represented here 😉

[Gaybutton]

14 hours ago, reader said:

it's prima facie evidence that this is a hoax.

Of course it is.  After all, he didn't take me up on my 1000 baht offer . . .

He did say he has a "kink" for paying.  Not so.  It's more like a "kink" of getting on boards to be a troll.  Some people are driven to do that.  The rest of us don't put up with being taken for a ride.

[YoungWesternTop]

19 hours ago, Mavica said:

Most of us posting here have been sexually active with moneyboys, escorts, etc. for decades ... so it might seem strange / odd to have someone arrive in our midst who isn't as sexperienced, asking questions.  I'll give the OP the benefit of the doubt that the questions are sincerely asked - because we've all started somewhere, oftentimes moving forward with the help of others.   

I don't know that it's risker having sex with a moneyboy / escort than with a freebie.  It's not as if there's an interview, testing, whatever before we have sex sex either.

Unprotected sex brings with it risks, some minimal (minor std's), or deadly (HIV/AIDS).  My own experience with STD's the past 50 years I've been particularly sexually active runs the gamut: syphilis, gonorrhea, Hep. A and B  ... but not HIV.  I haven't had unprotected / condomless anal sex (top or bottom) since 1985. I don't think, though, that anything I've caught originated with a play-for-pay relationship; I cannot be 100% certain.  I have encountered a few guys who wouldn't let me blow them unless they could wear a condom; always when it's been a straight guy and in Mexico. 

Newbies can be reluctant to go to a clinic to be checked-out if they suspect an STD.  I understand that.  It can be intimidating.  However, there's no judgement, just treatment.  Just go.

Thanks for the honest response. And to the other users saying I’m a hoax, I’m not. Just not experienced or knowledgeable and prefer to talk to real guys about real experiences than generic information online. When you say you got those diseases but you don’t think they were from moneyboys, where do you think they came from? And was that through unprotected receptive oral? Presumably so if you always have condoms for anal? Do you think condoms are safe to protect from STDs generally assuming it hasn’t broken?

[YoungWesternTop]

19 hours ago, Mavica said:

Most of us posting here have been sexually active with moneyboys, escorts, etc. for decades ... so it might seem strange / odd to have someone arrive in our midst who isn't as sexperienced, asking questions.  I'll give the OP the benefit of the doubt that the questions are sincerely asked - because we've all started somewhere, oftentimes moving forward with the help of others.   

I don't know that it's risker having sex with a moneyboy / escort than with a freebie.  It's not as if there's an interview, testing, whatever before we have sex sex either.

Unprotected sex brings with it risks, some minimal (minor std's), or deadly (HIV/AIDS).  My own experience with STD's the past 50 years I've been particularly sexually active runs the gamut: syphilis, gonorrhea, Hep. A and B  ... but not HIV.  I haven't had unprotected / condomless anal sex (top or bottom) since 1985. I don't think, though, that anything I've caught originated with a play-for-pay relationship; I cannot be 100% certain.  I have encountered a few guys who wouldn't let me blow them unless they could wear a condom; always when it's been a straight guy and in Mexico. 

Newbies can be reluctant to go to a clinic to be checked-out if they suspect an STD.  I understand that.  It can be intimidating.  However, there's no judgement, just treatment.  Just go.

Thanks for the honest response. And to the other users saying I’m a hoax, I’m not. Just not experienced or knowledgeable and prefer to talk to real guys about real experiences than generic information online. When you say you got those diseases but you don’t think they were from moneyboys, where do you think they came from? And was that through unprotected receptive oral? Presumably so if you always have condoms for anal? Do you think condoms are safe to protect from STDs generally assuming it hasn’t broken?

[YoungWesternTop]

19 hours ago, Mavica said:

Most of us posting here have been sexually active with moneyboys, escorts, etc. for decades ... so it might seem strange / odd to have someone arrive in our midst who isn't as sexperienced, asking questions.  I'll give the OP the benefit of the doubt that the questions are sincerely asked - because we've all started somewhere, oftentimes moving forward with the help of others.   

I don't know that it's risker having sex with a moneyboy / escort than with a freebie.  It's not as if there's an interview, testing, whatever before we have sex sex either.

Unprotected sex brings with it risks, some minimal (minor std's), or deadly (HIV/AIDS).  My own experience with STD's the past 50 years I've been particularly sexually active runs the gamut: syphilis, gonorrhea, Hep. A and B  ... but not HIV.  I haven't had unprotected / condomless anal sex (top or bottom) since 1985. I don't think, though, that anything I've caught originated with a play-for-pay relationship; I cannot be 100% certain.  I have encountered a few guys who wouldn't let me blow them unless they could wear a condom; always when it's been a straight guy and in Mexico. 

Newbies can be reluctant to go to a clinic to be checked-out if they suspect an STD.  I understand that.  It can be intimidating.  However, there's no judgement, just treatment.  Just go.

Thanks for the honest response. And to the other users saying I’m a hoax, I’m not. Just not experienced or knowledgeable and prefer to talk to real guys about real experiences than generic information online. When you say you got those diseases but you don’t think they were from moneyboys, where do you think they came from? And was that through unprotected receptive oral? Presumably so if you always have condoms for anal? Do you think condoms are safe to protect from STDs generally assuming it hasn’t broken?

[YoungWesternTop]

Sorry for posting three times, it was an accident with my internet. 

[maump]

On 7/21/2023 at 3:20 PM, YoungWesternTop said:

Hello; new to this forum. I’m a 30 year old top from Europe visiting Thailand for the first time. I’m recently out and looking to experiment with my sexuality in Thailand while here. Can someone please help with my questions:

1) I’m a top and only ever wears a condom, even for oral. What’s my risk with local Thai boys, including moneyboys, both fucking them and being blown by them? I particularly love being blown so interested in that. 

2) how safe would it be to receive oral sex unprotected from a massage parlour boy or moneyboy in Thailand?

3) is it safe to use moneyboys in Bangkok / Pattaya? Both in terms of STD risks and also crime / robbery / extortion?

4) would it be good practice to always insist on seeing ID for moneyboys? I absolutely do NOT want to inadvertently do anything with a minor.

5) are there any same day STD testing services in Thailand cities eg Bangkok / Chiang Mai? I googled this and there seem to be a few advertising that they can offer test results for things like HIV where the sex act was only a few days ago. Seems strange as in Europe, you usually need at least a 14 day window for testing since last act. 

6) are there are blowjob bars in Bangkok / Pattaya?

1.   Oral is very safe.  fucking, your risk is near zero with condom. add Truvada (PrEP) and Doxycycline (bacterial prep) and you reduce it even further. Syphilis, gonorrhea chlamydial and herpes can be transmitted orally.

2. very safe, but not as safe as with condom.

3. statistics in BKK say many money boys are infected with HIV (but how many of those are undetectable and therefore safe?  I could not find a number.)

4.  when I hire off the internet I always check if I have any doubt.  from the bars I don't check.  some hotels will want their ID. 

5.  many testing services are available as well as some test at home kits.  reliability?  why test if using condom and prep?  I have had sex with HIV positive men.  some undetectable, some not.  safe sex practices and PrEP work.

6 not that I know of.

I use 2 kinds of PrEP and often bareback anal and always oral bareback.  Many here opine I am nuts.  others quietly do the same.   I think you are paranoid.   Risk is risk. be informed, do what is comfortable for you.  

Edited July 24, 2023 by maump
Removed invalid statistic on HIV rates. old data.

[reader]

31 minutes ago, maump said:

3. statistics in BKK say 30% money boys are infected with HIV (but how many of those are undetectable and therefore safe?  I could not find a number.

Can you cite a current source for this claim? I recall reading a similar figure but I believe it dated to over a few decades ago.

[maump]

14 minutes ago, reader said:

Can you cite a current source for this claim? I recall reading a similar figure but I believe it dated to over a few decades ago.

It was good to challenge me on that, it came from memory of reading.   searching, I found higher numbers from the 90's data.  hardly relevant.

this is from the UN but it is extrapolated national data

This work is critical if HIV programmes are to reach and retain key population communities. In Thailand, as in the rest of Asia, these groups carry the heaviest HIV burden. Nationally HIV prevalence is 1% for sex workers, 8% for people who use drugs, 11% for transgender women and 12% for men who have sex with men. https://www.unaids.org/en/keywords/thailand

[reader]

3 hours ago, YoungWesternTop said:

Just not experienced or knowledgeable and prefer to talk to real guys about real experiences than generic information online. When you say you got those diseases but you don’t think they were from moneyboys, where do you think they came from? And was that through unprotected receptive oral? Presumably so if you always have condoms for anal? Do you think condoms are safe to protect from STDs generally assuming it hasn’t broken?

There's a difference between "generic" and "authoritative".

You want people to believe that you're a gay man coming to Thailand who has very specific questions about oral sex and you think total strangers will provide the best advice? That's nonsensical.

You claim that you're "not experienced" but in your OP said you "particularly love being blown." Sounds like experience to me.

[Mavica]

1 hour ago, reader said:

You want people to believe that you're a gay man coming to Thailand who has very specific questions about oral sex and you think total strangers will provide the best advice? That's nonsensical.

What's "nonsensical" to me is your disbelief that someone - recently joined - would come to a gay travel / behavior specific forum to ask for advice / information.  Not all gay men are as wise and experienced as you, me or others posting here think we are. We're not born as intellectual. 🙂 Surprise!  Is that now an offense, worthy of what certainly seems to be trolling itself and a violation of the Guidelines for participation on this forum?  Think the OP is insincere, game playing?  If you have  reliable information that the OP is trolling or not sincere ... post it.  Or just move-on to a different discussion.   It's no wonder some newbies avoid these forums.  

 

 

[reader]

10 minutes ago, Mavica said:

Think the OP is insincere, game playing?  If you have  reliable information that the OP is trolling or not sincere ... post it.

The proof is that you believe this stuff. 😉

[Finnseventy]

Recently, I met a bar boy in the Jomtien Complex whom I liked and planned a live-in arrangement with. I asked him to get screened for STDs, to which he agreed.

He was tested in the new STD clinic just outside the JC on Thappraya Road and tested positive for both HIV and Syphilis.

He has since been treated for the Syphilis and has started treatment for the HIV at a local government hospital.

I think it would be prudent to assume that any or most of the boys here have a STD of some kind.

 

[PeterRS]

5 hours ago, maump said:

3. statistics in BKK say many money boys are infected with HIV (but how many of those are undetectable and therefore safe?  I could not find a number.)

Finding information certainly seems more difficult than it was a few years ago. There used to be the section of a website titled AVERT which did publish statistics, although I believe it covered a more general msm percentage. I can no longer find it. A Paper issued by Australia's CSIRO in the Sexual Health section headed The Continued HIV Epidemic among men who have sex with men and transgender women in the ASEAN region: Implications for HIV policy and service programming, states re Thailand -

"HIV incidence among MSM under IBBS (integrated behavioural and biological surveillance) decreased only in Bangkok from 28.6% in 2014 to 10.3% in 2018."

https://www.publish.csiro.au/sh/Fulltext/sh20134

This is clearly illustrated in a graph showing the rate of increase/decrease in 7 major Asian cities.

If the chart is accurate, the rate of HIV among msm has decreased substantially. A major concern arising from the chart, though, is clearly the significantly rising rate in Kuala Lumpur and Ho Chi Minh.

There have been several other reports including data from 2014, but they require a great deal of time to analyse exactly what they mean since all seem based on different modelling methods and results which are extremely difficult to compare. Worrying, though, there is one paper dated July 16 2021 in Britain's highly respected medical journal The Lancet regarding an 18-month Study which suggests that "MSM will represent over half of all new HIV infections by 2025." This figure refers only to Bangkok. All reports I have looked at indicate a rise in the number of syphilis cases in Bangkok.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(21)00313-8/fulltext

[hojacat]

2 hours ago, PeterRS said:

Finding information certainly seems more difficult than it was a few years ago. There used to be the section of a website titled AVERT which did publish statistics, although I believe it covered a more general msm percentage. I can no longer find it. A Paper issued by Australia's CSIRO in the Sexual Health section headed The Continued HIV Epidemic among men who have sex with men and transgender women in the ASEAN region: Implications for HIV policy and service programming, states re Thailand -

"HIV incidence among MSM under IBBS (integrated behavioural and biological surveillance) decreased only in Bangkok from 28.6% in 2014 to 10.3% in 2018."

https://www.publish.csiro.au/sh/Fulltext/sh20134

This is clearly illustrated in a graph showing the rate of increase/decrease in 7 major Asian cities.

If the chart is accurate, the rate of HIV among msm has decreased substantially. A major concern arising from the chart, though, is clearly the significantly rising rate in Kuala Lumpur and Ho Chi Minh.

There have been several other reports including data from 2014, but they require a great deal of time to analyse exactly what they mean since all seem based on different modelling methods and results which are extremely difficult to compare. Worrying, though, there is one paper dated July 16 2021 in Britain's highly respected medical journal The Lancet regarding an 18-month Study which suggests that "MSM will represent over half of all new HIV infections by 2025." This figure refers only to Bangkok. All reports I have looked at indicate a rise in the number of syphilis cases in Bangkok.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(21)00313-8/fulltext

The 1 in 3 or 1 in 4 people engaging in MSM being HIV+ in Bangkok is a bit old data. Remembering reading about it before my first trip to Thailand in 2008.

It's true that Thailand was a pioneer in SE Asia about providing antiviral medicine and prep to the the general population, even  heavily subsidized or completely free and even though it can be argued that things could have been done better, looks like it has paid off.

Surprised about the trajectory of KL. According to my good Malay friend, prep is free in government clinics. He comes though from a upper class family, so things might be more accessible to him. No surprised at all about Saigon and I actually think the numbers are underreported. BB sex is almost de rigueur over there, but access to Prep and HIV medicines is still quite complicated. I know at least two guys there that became HIV+. Unfortunately there is still a big stigma about poz in Vietnam, even among the medical staff. They have told me quite a few ugly episodes they had to face.

However, syphilis rates are really high in BKK, and that's easy transmissible through oral sex, especially if you engage into deep one. Using a condom though for oral seems like a hard sell to me,  if you don't plan to engage in paid sex.  cause if it's true one receiving oral sex with a condom on doesn't feel much, for the one giving it is pretty unpleasant. Yes, Thai guys can be pretty accommodating if they like you and you treat them nicely, however not many probably would enjoy the taste of latex in their mouth. I guess if you use one of those fruit-flavored condoms, it might be kinda doable.

[spoon]

Free prep in malaysia only just started this year. And intake seems encouraging but still many hesistant to take for lack of trust in the gov clinic privacy of personal data. If one can afford it, prep is easily available at several private clinics nationwide too, for quite a cheap price comparatively. 

[YoungWesternTop]

Would Prep be worth taking if one is only engaging in oral sex though?

[YoungWesternTop]

9 hours ago, hojacat said:

The 1 in 3 or 1 in 4 people engaging in MSM being HIV+ in Bangkok is a bit old data. Remembering reading about it before my first trip to Thailand in 2008.

It's true that Thailand was a pioneer in SE Asia about providing antiviral medicine and prep to the the general population, even  heavily subsidized or completely free and even though it can be argued that things could have been done better, looks like it has paid off.

Surprised about the trajectory of KL. According to my good Malay friend, prep is free in government clinics. He comes though from a upper class family, so things might be more accessible to him. No surprised at all about Saigon and I actually think the numbers are underreported. BB sex is almost de rigueur over there, but access to Prep and HIV medicines is still quite complicated. I know at least two guys there that became HIV+. Unfortunately there is still a big stigma about poz in Vietnam, even among the medical staff. They have told me quite a few ugly episodes they had to face.

However, syphilis rates are really high in BKK, and that's easy transmissible through oral sex, especially if you engage into deep one. Using a condom though for oral seems like a hard sell to me,  if you don't plan to engage in paid sex.  cause if it's true one receiving oral sex with a condom on doesn't feel much, for the one giving it is pretty unpleasant. Yes, Thai guys can be pretty accommodating if they like you and you treat them nicely, however not many probably would enjoy the taste of latex in their mouth. I guess if you use one of those fruit-flavored condoms, it might be kinda doable.

Is syphillis easily transmissible through oral thought? What if you’re the person receiving the BJ? And how likely if you wore a condom to contract it?

[reader]

[Boy69]

With all these fears I am not sure you will be able to enjoy your sexual encounters in Thailand,  why don't you use condoms all the time including when doings oral sex to avoid all this paranoia?

[Mavica]

10 hours ago, hojacat said:

However, syphilis rates are really high in BKK, and that's easy transmissible through oral sex, especially if you engage into deep one. Using a condom though for oral seems like a hard sell to me,  if you don't plan to engage in paid sex.  cause if it's true one receiving oral sex with a condom on doesn't feel much, for the one giving it is pretty unpleasant. Yes, Thai guys can be pretty accommodating if they like you and you treat them nicely, however not many probably would enjoy the taste of latex in their mouth. I guess if you use one of those fruit-flavored condoms, it might be kinda doable.

The Washington Post is featuring an article today about the U.S. Center for Disease Control and Prevention plan to release guidelines later this summer for deploying a morning-after antibiotic pill, a treatment known as DoxyPEP, in hopes of addressing fears among medical professionals that preventive use would fuel antibiotic resistance — and the rise of drug-resistant superbugs.

Quote

It is the latest advancement as the sexual health field shifts to preventive medicine — not just condoms, abstinence and tests — as the best hope for quashing the pathogens that can spread during sex. ... For the past decade, people have been able to have unprotected sex with a low risk of contracting HIV thanks to daily pills known as PrEP, or pre-exposure prophylaxis. But they were still susceptible to bacterial bugs, including the recent spike in syphilis, gonorrhea and chlamydia — until  now. ... Recent studies show the antibiotic doxycycline taken after sexual encounters works as a post-exposure prophylaxis to prevent those infections.

Link:  DoxyPEP offers an alternative to condoms to prevent STDs - The Washington Post  (there may be a paywall for some readers)

 

[maump]

1 hour ago, YoungWesternTop said:

Is syphillis easily transmissible through oral thought? What if you’re the person receiving the BJ? And how likely if you wore a condom to contract it?

Syphilis spreads from person-to-person by direct contact with a syphilitic sore, known as a chancre. Chancres can occur in, on, or around the penis, vagina, anus, rectum, and lips or mouth. Syphilis can spread during vaginal, anal, or oral sex.  Syphilis is a bacterial infection transmitted transmitted by infected fluid contact with mucus membranes. even kissing can spread these STDs.

Condoms, DoxyPrEP and DOxyPep can minimize the probability.  additionally it is still relatively easy to cure with antibiotics.

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/nih-funded-study-finds-doxycycline-reduces-sexually-transmitted-infections-two-thirds

 

[Mavica]

Deleted, because I was writing then posted essentially the same information as did @maump.

[hojacat]

4 hours ago, YoungWesternTop said:

Would Prep be worth taking if one is only engaging in oral sex though?

I think you should, since you are so worried about catching diseases. Start taking it a week before heading to Thailand and continue till at least one week after you're back home. So at least you don't have to worry about catching the most serious of all the STDs.

As for using a condom for oral, it's truly up to you to decide what's an accepted pleasure-risk ratio.