I went to dream boys last night and drinks price is horrendous

[PeterRS]

8 hours ago, vinapu said:

After many years of trying, mostly for fun,  I must say my experience is somewhat mixed.

As is mine, although perhaps less so. I do have an expensive suitcase which I purchased only because I was taking so many long distance flights each year. It also had a 5-year warranty. Lo and behold, after 4 years and 8 months and an 8 flight trip it got damaged. The maker tried to repair it, but I was not satisfied with it. Without batting the proverbial eyelid, since this was within the warranty period, I was offered the choice of one of three brand new cases at no cost. I still have that second case after 8 years. Three of the wheels have recently had to be replaced but otherwise the money I paid for these two cases that have seen probably 100 flights or more has been excellent value for 13 years of pretty heavy use.

Also, while I have never had the enjoyment of a bottle of Chateau Mouton Rothschild, thanks to clients I have enjoyed Chateau Margaux 1961 (one of the great years for red Bordeaux), Chateau Haut Brion 1985 and Chateau Latour 1987. SInce these were in fine restaurants I have no doubt they were originals - and I thought they were fabulous! But these wines deserve excellent cusine. I am perfectly happy with a glass of reasonable Chateau plonk - or Australian, New Zealand, South African, Italian, Chilean etc. wine - in a cheap restaurant.

As for most other brand name products, though, I pass.

[reader]

In 2017, 60 Minutes aired a segment on counterfeit wines titled “corkscrewed”. It centered on billionaire Bill Koch who spent $35 million investigating how he was hoodwinked into paying $400,000 for a fake. 
The probe revealed that even the most experienced experts in the industry were no longer willing to authenticate a bottle because they admitted that there was no conclusive way to test their judgement, thereby leaving them open to law suits.
 

[PeterRS]

If you are a connoisseur, there really is no way to test a fake - unless there is something fractionally wrong with the label - than to open the bottle and try it. But if you happened to own one of the three extant bottles of 1762 Gautier Cognac, the chances of your opening it are slim. It's a collector's item (hopefully!) and it will have a very detailed provenance. The bottle was sold by Sotheby's about 3 years ago for US$118,580. Cheap at the price for a Hong Kong squillinaire!

[reader]

Agree about irregularities with label, but those interviewed in 60 Minutes segment said that even expert tasting could no longer be basis for authentication because it’s subjective judgement. In the end, it’s a case where you either trust your supplier or you don’t. Not like buying Rolex in Patpong where you’re assured of provenance. 🙂

[Shonen]

I feel Rolex is so overrated. I can afford one but I’m very happy 

 with my Citizen and Casio $200 watches. It’s the brand name Rolex that sells, like Nike. I’m a sneaker head and Nike is such junk, uncomfortable and Jordan’s are so tacky looking,imho. New Balance is way ahead of them,.

Even though my watches aren’t expensive, I would never buy a fake one. There’s plenty to choose from outside of the malls. Actually my boyfriend said to me that the real stuff is sold in the malls, for rich people, everything outside the mall is fake for the Thai people.
 

[PeterRS]

29 minutes ago, Shonen said:

I feel Rolex is so overrated.

Totally agree. I would never be seen wearing one! 

As an anecdote, my brother decided that he would like a couple of fake ones for himself and his wife. So I got them on Silom and took them on my next trip to the UK. One afternoon when my brother was working and his wife was supposed to be at work, she had to rush home to get something she had left behind. Entering their house, she thought she heard noises upstairs. She is pretty fearless and immediately shouted something. When she got upstairs the window was open and some drawers had been opened. The only things missing were the two Rolexes!  I wonder what the thief thought when he tried to sell them!

If Rolex takes your fancy, one good place to buy second hand originals is Macao. So many gamblers, it seems, sell theirs for just another evening at the tables and then cannot buy them back. There are stores galore with nothing but Rolexes!

[Shonen]

That’s a funny story. Those fake Rolex might have saved a great deal of money, had the thief stolen real stuff.

I might buy a Rolex in Macao if I got a tremendous bargain and it was below resell. 
 

What gets me is these watch guys that want to pay more because it’s a second more accurate every year. Or they can dive deeper in the ocean with it. I just wear mine for looks.

[Olddaddy]

16 hours ago, Shonen said:

I feel Rolex is so overrated. I can afford one but I’m very happy 

 with my Citizen and Casio $200 watches. It’s the brand name Rolex that sells, like Nike. I’m a sneaker head and Nike is such junk, uncomfortable and Jordan’s are so tacky looking,imho. New Balance is way ahead of them,.

Even though my watches aren’t expensive, I would never buy a fake one. There’s plenty to choose from outside of the malls. Actually my boyfriend said to me that the real stuff is sold in the malls, for rich people, everything outside the mall is fake for the Thai people.
 

Does this new generation now wear watches ?

I never see many young guys wearing watches nowadays 

[vinapu]

3 hours ago, Olddaddy said:

Does this new generation now wear watches ?

I never see many young guys wearing watches nowadays 

when I see young guys I usually look somewhere else than their wrists

[zoomomancs]

During Songkran beer at Dreamboys was 600 and there was a queue to get in.

[vinapu]

4 hours ago, zoomomancs said:

During Songkran beer at Dreamboys was 600 and there was a queue to get in.

market economy at work

[floridarob]

3 hours ago, vinapu said:

market economy at work

in one direction....not the pop band either.

[a-447]

21 hours ago, zoomomancs said:

During Songkran beer at Dreamboys was 600 and there was a queue to get in.

Yes, and I refused to go in and ended up across the soi instead.

I capitulated the next night and was shocked to see that it was virtually standing room only. They found me probably the only seat left - it was on the side of the stage - but as soon as a better one became available, I picked up my drink and rushed over and sat down.

However, the show continued from around 10:30 onwards until the end of the night, so I think 600 baht was value for money.

My regular guy in Bangkok started working there after his bar closed down due to Covid. He only lasted a couple of weeks because as he said, there were so many guys working there that the chance of an off was limited. Also limited was the numbet of rotations during the show - unless you were in the show it was hard to be noticed by the customers.

As for designer goods, they are mainly aimed at relatively "poor" people who buy them because they want to look "rich."  Witness the number of average people lived up outside Louis Vuitton, for example. The rich don't line up - there are special collections of very expensive goods made just for them. On the top floor of Louis Vuitton in Tokyo there is a "secret" shop set aside for the uber rich. 

With regards to Rolex, they are considered an investment but they are not considered to be the best watches in the world. (That title goes to Grand Seiko.) 

Rolex manipulate prices by restricting supply. You can't just walk in and buy what you want - you have to put your name down on a waiting list. I don't like Rolex, although there is one model - the green "hulk" - which I was interested in. That interest disappeared when I was told there was perhaps a 2 year wait and even then, the shop couldn't guarantee that they'd get one in. They just sell whatever Rolex deigns to send them each month, That watch was $11000 (257,000 baht) at the time. It is now selling for $29000 in Tokyo, if you can find one.

I went to the Rolex shop in Siam Paragon looking for one (a few years ago, before the price sky rocketed) but the staff totally ignored me as I was dressed in my holiday clothes and they presumed I wouldn't be buying anything.

I have a pair of Gucci shoes and a pair of Louis Vuitton boots. The designer logos are hardly visible and they are not in the usual colours expected of those brands, I've got to say that they are the most comfortable shoes I've ever owned and even after a lot of wear,  they still look brand new. If you look at them closely you can see they are extremely well made - the embodiment of perfection. So I consider them value for money.

[floridarob]

18 hours ago, a-447 said:

The designer logos are hardly visible

Logos are old now, Succession made everyone aware that people with real money don't need to show off logos.

https://www.newyorker.com/culture/on-and-off-the-avenue/lets-talk-about-the-clothes-on-succession

[a-447]

3 hours ago, floridarob said:

Logos are old now, Succession made everyone aware that people with real money don't need to show off logos.

https://www.newyorker.com/culture/on-and-off-the-avenue/lets-talk-about-the-clothes-on-succession

And yet Ralph Lauren and Hugo Boss are now writing their names in big letters all over their clothes, à la Tommy Hilfiger.

When I asked the shop owners why, they said the change in policy was brought about by young people who need their social media followers to see what they are wearing.

[Shonen]

I’ve been wearing minimal sneakers for a few years, Oliver Cabell, Koio. They look classy and you can wear with most outfits. I’m bored of them now and I’m into New balance 9060s, 327s, 2002s, 1906s. Very comfortable but very popular and I’ve had to pay resell prices on eBay and StockX.

I had a friend who bought a pair of Gucci for $600 and regrets it now, but they were the bold green and red type.

[floridarob]

22 minutes ago, a-447 said:

that people with real money don't need to show off logos.

The few people I know personally with "real money" wouldn't be caught dead with a visible logo.....

23 minutes ago, a-447 said:

by young people who need their social media followers to see what they are wearing.

Sell to the masses, live with the classes.....

[Shonen]

Logos can look very tacky, as well as graphic t-shirts. 
in Pattaya it seems anything goes. I know it’s hot, and it’s more acceptable to wear flip flops and shorts. I like to see what people are wearing when I’m just sitting at an outside bar. Some real good dressers and equal amount of bad ones.

I try to stick with neutral colors and avoid neon or primary colors. Not that I’m a great dresser. I really like band collars popular in Asia, rarely seen in the west. 
 

I tried on what looked like a great white shirt with a band collar in Uniqlo and realized it just emphasized how old I looked. Much better on a younger person.

 black compliments wrinkles and shadows which is why it’s not recommended for older people. Many Asians wear black because it matches their hair, I’m noticing many young people in America wearing black also.

[a-447]

As I've mentored here before, for me, value for money is more important than price - which is why I don't mind paying for expensive drinks in the bars if there is a show to enjoy. But I object to being asked to pay ridiculous prices for a drink just to sit and watch the rotation.

On a recent trip to Japan I bought 2 pairs of Onitsuka Tiger Nippon Made sneakers. They cost twice as much as their made in Vietnam models. They are hand made in Japan using only Japanese materials. And given the Japanese obsession with perfection, they are exactly that.

https://www.onitsukatiger.com/au/en-au/nippon-made/c/ou10651000/

There is a specially sneaker maker situated in the Asakusa district of Tokyo which makes sneakers using kimono fabric.  I bought a pair featuring the dark blue used in men's traditional clothing. They cost a lot more than Nike (which are cheap in Japan) but again, what price quality? When you take into account the amount of time and effort needed to make them - and the fact that each pair is unique - they are incredible value for money.

https://tokyokimonoshoes.com/

If you are ever in Japan and want to buy something unique and perfectly made, check these stores out. 

[Boy69]

6 hours ago, a-447 said:

They cost a lot more than Nike

Nike is a garbage I stopped buying their lousy sneakers long time ago.

[floridarob]

3 hours ago, Boy69 said:

Nike is a garbage I stopped buying their lousy sneakers long time ago.

When you guys start talking about Sketchers....then we'll be in business 😆

[vinapu]

7 hours ago, Boy69 said:

Nike is a garbage I stopped buying their lousy sneakers long time ago.

look at bright side, shittier shoes ( or any other garment) are , more often you have something new

[a-447]

8 hours ago, Boy69 said:

Nike is a garbage I stopped buying their lousy sneakers long time ago.

I've got a rather large collection of sneakers, 95% of which are Nike. 

I've got to say mine have all lasted well - most of them are the AIR models and some are probably over 15 years old. I've never had a problem with Nike. Maybe it depends on where they are made. (I haven't checked but I presume the Nike's I've bought in Japan over the years aren't made there.)

Maybe it's because I own so many that they don't get worn all that often and so last longer. But I do have my favourites which get worn often and they are still hanging in there.

[Shonen]

7 hours ago, floridarob said:

When you guys start talking about Sketchers....then we'll be in business 😆

Sketchers, run by the former management team that owned LA Gear, are the sketchiest sneaker maker.

Known for ripping off designs from other companies. The one in Central Marina in Pattaya seems to never have any customers there, same for the one in Central Festival for that matter.

Having said that, one of my favorite pair of sneakers is from Sketchers. But I was standing too close to a mosh pit one night and damaged them. Can’t throw them away.

[PeterRS]

On 7/5/2023 at 11:11 AM, a-447 said:

As for designer goods, they are mainly aimed at relatively "poor" people who buy them because they want to look "rich."  Witness the number of average people lived up outside Louis Vuitton, for example. The rich don't line up - there are special collections of very expensive goods made just for them. On the top floor of Louis Vuitton in Tokyo there is a "secret" shop set aside for the uber rich. 

That may certainly be true in Tokyo, but I have been in Paragon in Bangkok several times in the last fortnight. You cannot keep people away from quite long queues at the stores of most designer labels, especially Hermes, Gucci & co. And these are certainly not "poor' people given the way they dress. Some will unquestionably be foreign tourists, but quite a few are youngish Thais. That said, I don't think I have ever seen older Thais queuing.

I can recall the decade of stagnation (the 1990s) in Tokyo when department stores were very concerned that those who had previously purchased extremely expensive designer goods were almost afraid to wear them in public. So there would be special nights when owners of such goods could come to wear them and wander around the stores showing off their purchases! Somehow I find it funny to think of middle-aged ladies popping into the loos to change from their Burberry macs to show off their sable fur coats.

On 7/5/2023 at 11:11 AM, a-447 said:

With regards to Rolex, they are considered an investment but they are not considered to be the best watches in the world. (That title goes to Grand Seiko.)

The world of high-end watches is far larger than most of us probably expect. The most expensive is said to be the Graff Diamonds Hallucination watch valued at US$55 million (I never heard of Graff before today!) I have heard of Patek Philippe, though, but not of its Grandmaster Chime - a snip at US$31 million!

A very long time ago when I left one company after 8 years, I decided I'd like a nice watch. I'd always fancied a classic and classicallly simple Patek Philippe with an extremely simple dial with Roman numerals, a small second hand and a gold dimpled surround. I knew the most I'd get from the company would be a lunch but thought I might give it as a present to myself. Discovering it was US$5,000 there was no way I'd buy it. However, it so happened that one of our clients was the agent for Patek Philippe. I called him, told him how much I loved that watch and would like to have one. I expected him to offer a discount. No such luck. "Not company policy."

He later called me to say there were none of this make of watch in stock. But a new batch would soon arrive. As he was leaving on vacation, he'd told his manager to have one set aside for me. As I was about to say there was no way I could afford it, he said for me there would be a 50% discount! Even then, it was far too expensive and I did not pursue the matter.

Just as well because if you do have a high end watch, it is important that it is serviced every 3 years. I cannot believe that is especially cheap!

I'd never have a Rolex, though, because I am certain around half the price I'd pay would be what Rolex pays in advertising at events like Wimbledon. Same with Nike which pays humungous amounts to athletes to wear their swoosh. It paid Michael Jordan US$60 million annually. As a result of royalties, that has risen today to US$100 million per year. Roger Federer got US$100 million for a 10-year deal. Rafael Nadal is said to make slightly more.  Before his fall from grace and form, Nike paid Tiger Woods US$100 million for 5 years. Rory McIlroy gets US$200 million for 10 years. 

But Nike's biggest sponsorshp is for the aging soccer star Cristiano Ronaldo now playing in Saudi Arabia. He earns US$24 million per year from the company.

And it is the youth market that the biggie sponsors are after. Soon we will know what mega-deals 20-year old tennis Grand Slam winner Carlos Alcaraz will be signing. He has fantastic skills, youth, good looks and great manners on his side. Assuming he goes on winning and attracting gazillions to his social media, I'll put money on the table that the total will be in excess of anything so far dished out!