Is Indicting Trump A Good Idea?

[Marc in Calif]

NEW YORK (The Borowitz Report)—Donald J. Trump claimed that the failure of the Manhattan District Attorney, Alvin Bragg, to indict him thus far is “quite frankly, a conspiracy” to keep the Republican Presidential candidate from attracting campaign donations.

“Alvin Bragg, who is a disgrace, should have arrested me by now,” Trump said. “He has treated me very unfairly.”

Trump said that he had made repeated calls to Bragg’s office to demand that he be arrested but has received no response.

“There’s something going on,” Trump said. “Obviously George Soros is telling Bragg not to arrest me. This should never be allowed to happen in this country.”

Issuing an ultimatum to Bragg, Trump said that, if he is not arrested by Friday, “I will perform a citizen’s arrest on myself.”

“We can do this the easy way or the hard way,” Trump said. “The easy way would be for Alvin to keep his promise and arrest me, but time is running out.”

[Suckrates]

5 hours ago, forky123 said:

It so isn't. Just how many senators and congressmen/women skate through crimes that would see others in prison. How many african americans see a far harsher side of the laws of the US than whites doing the same or worse crime. The current congress is being run by idiots that couldn't spell law let alone introduce one. 

Of course I AGREE with you, but I said "should be"  not "what is"......    Our country is one of privilege for the rich, and most especially the WHITE rich..... until THAT is fixed,  all these investigations and public facing theatrics are just BULLSHIT....   Trump will survive to pull-off Another insurrection in 2024, so the Dems better hunker doiwn.

[Mavica]

[lookin]

You mean I got made up and brushed out for nothing?

[Suckrates]

 

At this point Trump is BEGGING for SOMEONE to indict him... not only would it increase his base' sympathy for him, but it will also increase his coffers.   And he knows he can still run for President,  stay front and foremost in the public eye, and in his warped mind he would never be convicted by a jury.....   This entire TRUMP SHOW and "imminent indictments" by several offices is a Trump Master Class and an insult to the American people, rule of law and the judicial system.   You Go, RICH WHITE MAN !      Rest assured it will be Groundhog Day when this all replays in the 2024 Insurrection, and our government will stay focused on "the needs of Trump" for another 4 years instead of the needs of Americans.  Legislation has basically stopped and its all about TRUMP now....  We should all STOP paying our taxes....

[forky123]

1 hour ago, Suckrates said:

Legislation has basically stopped and its all about TRUMP now....  We should all STOP paying our taxes....

No taxation without representation !!

[stevenkesslar]

Stop Overthinking It: An Indictment Would Be Bad For Trump

 

I thought that headline provided a nice bumper sticker for anyone who is not for Trump and his lies and divisiveness and hate to think about.

True, Trump always seems to manage to step on third rails and not get electrocuted.  There are maybe 1 in 3 Americans who believe the 2020 election was stolen.  They will gladly believe any lie Tucker Carlson tells them so that he can get rich making them look stupid. 

I recently spent a week with a niece who believes whatever Tucker says.  So he can get rich and powerful making her look stupid.  I did not tell her she seems stupid, and why.  I didn't point out, for example, that RINO Mike DeWine is actually STILL Governor of Ohio, the state she lives in, which she did not know.  She mostly knows he is a RINO, because people like Tucker say so.  I did not ask her to explain why RINOs who at least try to govern toward the middle like him win in landslides, even on the same night that election denying flame throwers fail. 

The funny part is she is an executive with a Fortune 500 compan.  And her and her husband live in a nice fancy house in a red state.  So they are hardly poor, or academically stupid.  And we can simply enjoy going on hikes and going out to fancy restaurants.  Fortunately, she is not the kind of stupid that thinks I prefer to dine on the livers and hearts of Republican children.  But were I mention that almost every Democratic Presidential candidate in this century (except Kerry) got more votes than his or her Republican opponent, and Biden beat Trump by about 7 million votes in 2020, I probably might as well say that the blood of Republican children is a really nice vintage.

My niece actually thinks she is in the Silent Majority.  And she probably is, in her own state.  In California, not so much.  In the US, not so much.  (See 2020 election.)  I don't think there's any way to convince her of that.  Trump and Tucker have done a good job pushing the limits of how rich and powerful they can get making millions of people look stupid.

All that said, the basic idea of that article is that being in trouble with the law is NEVER a way to grow your support.  Trump is not going to grow his support by having to explain past actions.  Like paying hush money to prostitutes.  Or trying to get Republicans to steal elections.  Or trying to stop a peaceful transfer of power by inciting a riot at the US Capitol.   

Yes, there are people who will rally to him.   Some of them will actually be people who think I drink the blood of children.  So it won't be a stretch for them to believe Trump and Tucker are the innocent (and rich) victims of political persecution.  As opposed to just being mean-spirited liars who get rich making them look stupid.  Did you hear that Dominion is owned by Martians who took over the body of Hugo Chavez and eat children like those fungi in The Last Of Us?  It's true!

I think lots of Democrats overthink a lot of things about Trump, because of 2016.  But two good political whores can explain that.  Morning Joe Scarborough, who knows more than most of us about winning elections, points out that Trump lost the popular vote in 2016.  And he led Republicans to losses in 2018, 2020, and 2022.  Alan Lichtman has called every US Presidential right since 1984, in advance,  He argued in September 2016 that Trump would win because there were just enough things wrong with the Democratic Administration - like the economy, stupid - that voters would give "four more years" a thumbs down.  They did.  Had the Republicans nominated someone like Kasich, he probably would have won the popular vote.  We should probably stop overthinking the fact that Trump won once, barely, despite losing the popular vote by about 3 million votes in 2016.

Trump is a mean-spirited liar who is taking US democracy off the rails to serve his own ego.  We should not overthink that.  Every time he is indicted and has to explain why he pays hush money to hookers, or why he starts riots to undermine democracy, he is not growing his base.

[stevenkesslar]

This is me being long-winded and repetitive.  So many of the points I will quote below are basically a different way of saying what was said in the post above.  But Ron Brownstein is my favorite political pundit.  And I think he spelled out why this is not only bad news for Trump.  It is bad news for Republicans.  

Attacks on Manhattan investigation show GOP still can’t break from Trump

Analysis by Ronald Brownstein

Quote

Craig Robinson, the former political director for the Republican Party in Iowa, whose caucuses will kick off the GOP nomination fight next year, believes an indictment – or multiple indictments – of Trump could reinforce the divide between these two viewpoints in the party. Even before news of a potential indictment broke, Robinson recently said he saw a clear distinction between his business-oriented, college-educated urban Republican friends who feel, “‘Hey, we just want to move on [from Trump],’” and those in rural Iowa who “are looking for the fighter…and that’s Trump by and large.”

Quote

Those drawn to Trump are likely to dominate the initial party reaction to any indictments, Robinson said. But he also believes those voices won’t necessarily prevail when votes are cast next year. Amid the firestorm over any indictment, the mostly college-educated Republicans hesitant about nominating Trump a third time “might kind of quiet down a little bit,” Robinson said. “But this is the stuff they don’t want. This is the stuff that causes them a headache. This is the stuff they prefer to move on from.”

Quote

By moving so aggressively to defend Trump – even to the point of appearing to intimidate an ongoing investigation –House Republican leaders have made clear that while many GOP strategists or donors want the party to distance itself from the former president, they have not received that memo.

Quote

All of this followed a midterm election when Republicans underperformed historical patterns for the party out of the White House in large part because too many swing voters discontented about the economy and disenchanted with Biden still viewed the GOP alternative as too extreme.

Quote

Which is why Democrats are watching with such amazement – and a spreading sense of opportunity – as McCarthy so indelibly tattoos the Trump stamp onto the House GOP. “You now have multiple elections from 2018 forward showing that this playbook is not only extremely dangerous [for the country], it is completely ineffective” politically, said Dan Sena, former executive director for the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee. “Defending Donald Trump has never been a winning electoral strategy-ever.”

Brownstein is, as always, sniffing out powerful movements underneath the surface, I think.  The House GOP in particular is happily making itself busy smearing Trump's mean-spirited and authoritarian bullshit all over themselves.  Because that convinces people like my niece that they are NOT RINO's.  That's what she cares about.  She likes Trump, who fights the pussies who are weakening America.  

Poor Kevin McCarthy.  I think he deserves a huge amount of credit for going out and finding really good Black male and Latina female candidates who he convinced to run for the House as conservatives.  They mostly won in 2020.  They mostly won again in 2022.  I keep telling my niece that if she wants a Republican President in 2024, Republicans should nominate a multi-racial Main Street conservative capitalist like Tim Scott.  They won't.  Instead, Trump will bathe McCarthy and House Republicans in his lies, divisiveness, and soon to be indicted criminal behavior.

If I had to bet, Trump will be nominated in 2024.  Because the Republican Party will be too split to nominate anyone else.  But even if DeSantis proves to be the Golden Boy, he will still be the golden boy smeared head to toe in Trump's lies and culture war divisive bullshit.  That's not a way to grow the party, either.  Again, Republicans have lost the popular vote in every Presidential election in this century, except 2004.  I don't see how a celebration of lies, hate, divisiveness, and indicted criminal behavior is the path to victory in 2024.

[JKane]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Marc in Calif]

10 minutes ago, JKane said:

That t-shirt is a (harrowing) parody, right? 

 

[Suckrates]

Shame on ALL of us AGAIN for allowing Trump to repeat his precursor to Insurrection, this time for 2024 and not silencing him somehow.    He's telling us his agenda, rallying his minions and vowing retribution on EVERYONE "he believes" wronged him.    The man is DERANGED, a threat and a danger, and DOJ MUST do something about him, fast.....at least to GAG him.   All his recent verbal diarrhea should fall under the "illegality" of inciting a riot.....    WHY is this nutcase NOT in prison yet ?  

[EZEtoGRU]

Manhattan Grand Jury votes to indict Trump.  WooHoo!!!  I can't wait to see the perp walk and the mugshot!

https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/30/politics/donald-trump-indictment/index.html

[Suckrates]

Get ready for Trump 24/7....... He'll be attacking everyone and their mamas.   Even his brain challenged son is speaking out.....  Bottom line, Trumps luck has run out, CONGRATS to Alvin Bragg,  who is making racist Trumps life even MORE humiliating by being "a BLACK man" that took Trump down......   I hope Fani Willis in Georgia goes next....  Wouldnt that enrage the MAGAs ?     "Who do all these Black folk think they are by going against Trump "      Well assholes, THEY are elected officials "doing their jobs"....   If Trump DID his job, he wouldnt be in this position now.     

DEAL WITH IT !     

[stevenkesslar]

48 minutes ago, Suckrates said:

"Who do all these Black folk think they are by going against Trump " 

My dearest Sister In Cock.  Yes, hyperbole is always good when we are talking about 12 inch Trump.  But isn't this perhaps going a bit too far?

Fact:  This indictment is a shameless effort to interfere in a Presidential election with absolutely no merit.

Fact:  There is no racism in the Republican Party.  None.  The Black and Hispanic working class is now the very heart and soul of the GOP.  Name a Republican who is NOT a Black woman, dearest Sis.

But don't believe me.  There you have it.  A veritable ocean of Black faces at the 2016 GOP convention, chanting, "Set Hillary Free!  Set Hillary Free!"  The party of Lincoln would never stand for racism, even of the subtle type.  Let alone election interference based on so-called unindicted crimes.

[Suckrates]

5 minutes ago, stevenkesslar said:

My dearest Sister In Cock.  Yes, hyperbole is always good when we are talking about 12 inch Trump.  But isn't this perhaps going a bit too far?

Fact:  This indictment is a shameless effort to interfere in a Presidential election with absolutely no merit.

Fact:  There is no racism in the Republican Party.  None.  The Black and Hispanic working class is now the very heart and soul of the GOP.  Name a Republican who is NOT a Black woman, dearest Sis.

But don't believe me.  There you have it.  A veritable ocean of Black faces at the 2016 GOP convention, chanting, "Set Hillary Free!  Set Hillary Free!"  The party of Lincoln would never stand for racism, even of the subtle type.  Let alone election interference based on so-called unindicted crimes.

Turn to Fox News and listen to Jesse Waters spin on the indictment.....  Its the Jews and Blacks (Soros & Bragg)  just trying to take Trump down to fulfill a goal of Braggs and make his mark for re-election.    According to Waters, Trump did nothing wrong.....  Bill Clintons indiscretions were MUCH worse.    And then, Jesse goes on to offer the GOP some advice, "when you take back the White House in 2024, you MUST get even with those Dems....and indict EVERY person in office"     (but he forgets to offer that there isnt ANY reason to indict these people)      He must have missed the memo that Trump committed criminal acts.? 

[Marc in Calif]

https://queenseagle.com/all/2023/3/30/queens-man-indicted

Queens man indicted
March 30, 2023

By Ryan Schwach

A Queens man was indicted Thursday for allegedly making hush money payments to a porn star shortly before he was elected president of the United States in 2016. 

Although the exact charges against former president and Queens native Donald Trump are still unknown, Trump will be the first former president to ever face criminal charges and is expected to be arrested, fingerprinted and quite possibly handcuffed in the coming days, the New York Times reported. 

Court sources told the New York Daily News that the grand jury handed up their indictment vote around 5:30 p.m. on Thursday. The grand jury had been deliberating in lower Manhattan as part of an investigation led by Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg into hush money payments the former president raised in Jamaica Estates made to porn star Stormy Daniels just before the election in 2016. 

Trump allegedly made the illegal payments as a way to keep Daniels from going public about the alleged affair he had with her in 2006. 

Former Trump lawyer Michael Cohen first brought the story to light in 2018, saying that he handled the illegal pay off, and that Trump did it “for the principal purpose of influencing” the 2016 presidential election, the Daily News reported. 

The $130,000 payoff was taken out by Cohen through a home equity line of credit, the Daily News said, and wired to Daniels.

The charges come about a week after Trump called for protests outside of Bragg’s office and threatened “death and destruction” if charges were to be brought against him.  

Trump became the first man from Queens to be impeached in 2019. Two years later, he became the first man from Queens to be impeached twice. 

[Suckrates]

NEWS FLASH :   Nikki Haley says "Trumps indictment is all about Political revenge".   We should move past this and focus on things the American people are interested in."

Someone should ADVISE Ms Haley that Jim Jordan and his Faux weaponization committee is simply and purely ALL about Revenge and nothing more,,,  WHY dont the GOP move past Trump and investigating the investigations simply to rewrite fact and change the narrative in their favor.   WHY dont they discuss issues American people care about ?

Perhaps one thing the majority of American people CARE about is seeing Trump held accountable for his crimes and attack on our Democracy ?   Yeah, I think that's whats Really on their minds now Nikki ?  

[Suckrates]

 

GOP bad boy Josh Hawley reacts to the Trump indictment "THEY WILL REGRET THIS"...

Tell u Josh, what ya gonna do ?   How ya gonna make us regret it ?   Maybe run like a little punk-ass pussy the way you did when your "friends" attacked the Capital on Jan 6th and you were trying to save your ass?     

You talk like a BIG Boy, but are just a cowardly turd.....   Make us regret it now Josh !   

[Suckrates]

 

Condolences for Lindsey Graham

Dont miss Lindsey Grahams appearance with Hannity yesterday on Faux Fox News where he was on the verge of tears over the Trump indictment, begging viewers to support Trump and SEND HIM MONEY to help him fight his American injustice....   Hannity did all he could to refrain from offering Ms Lindsey a tissue.... It was soul crushing, the pain on the Southern flowers face as she practically sobbed.....

And all this drama while TRUMP,  on his Truth social rag  raged about being "INDICATED".......   This bloated orange moron deserves to be in prison and cant even distinquish the difference between being INDICTED from being INDICATED.........   Maybe D.T. Jr can explain it to him ?  🤣

And THAT is the man that 30+ % of Americans WANT as their President and leader.   Shameful. 

[lookin]

I've been indicted
And I just can't hide it
I'm about to lose control
And I do not like it

[stevenkesslar]

5 hours ago, Suckrates said:

And THAT is the man that 30+ % of Americans WANT as their President and leader.   Shameful. 

More like 40 % plus.  I like the way Bragg's office framed the issue in their response to the House Republicans (aka Team "Lock Her Up"):

Quote

“As Committee Chairmen, you could use the stature of your office to denounce these attacks and urge respect for the fairness of our justice system and for the work of the impartial grand jury,” she continued. “Instead, you and many of your colleagues have chosen to collaborate with Mr. Trump’s efforts to vilify and denigrate the integrity of elected state prosecutors and trial judges and made unfounded allegations that the Office’s investigation, conducted via an independent grand jury of average citizens serving New York State, is politically motivated.”

The thing that is most worrisome to me, if I isolate this one moment in time, is that anyone can make a great argument to sweep this under the rug.  If all this is about is hush money to a hooker, which is like tip money to a billionaire, it's not worth the drama and division.  

Nobody thinks this trial will be done within the next year.  So there's every reason to believe by the time any verdict is delivered, Trump will have been indicted again.  And again.  That makes a difference.  Which is worse:  hush money to hookers, lying about losing a Presidential election, or starting a riot at The Capitol to hang democracy?   And Mike Pence?  Let the juries decide.

The polls are clear that over half of Republicans have a simple approach to democracy now:  FUCK DEMOCRACY.  If democracy means Trump loses, well then obviously it's not democracy.  The election must have been stolen.  And now polls show over half of Republicans have a simple approach to the law:  FUCK THE LAW.  If there's an issue between Trump and the law, well then obviously the law is wrong. He can't have broken the law.  We don't need evidence.  We don't need facts.   He's just a victim.

If it were just about a nice sweet guy like DJT making a simple mistake in paying hush money to a hooker, that would be one thing.  Maybe it would be best to just sweep that under the rug.  This is very different.  It is a systematic and deeply felt attack on democracy, elections, and the law.  And over half of one of America's two major political parties is caught up in it.  You can't sweep that under the rug.  Nor does Team MAGA or Trump want to sweep it under the rug.  They are spreading the toxic lies and civic pus continuously.

Meanwhile, most Democrats, the vast majority of Independents, and a significant minority of Republicans - which is to say a vast and not silent majority of Americans - are on the side of democracy, elections, and the law.

I keep coming back to what Obama politico David Plouffe said back in 2018 or so.  Defeating Trump's attack on democracy and legal and government institutions isn't going to take four years.  It's going to take four election cycles.  If we are lucky 2024 will be the last straw.  But Trump clearly and passionately wants this fight.  And my guess is he has a big enough minority behind him that this is what he'll make 2024 about.

[unicorn]

That would be quite something if the indictment increased his popularity among Republicans and they nominated him. Other than his base, it won't go well. If Republicans nominate him, he'll lose. 

[forky123]

On 3/31/2023 at 11:16 PM, stevenkesslar said:

The thing that is most worrisome to me, if I isolate this one moment in time, is that anyone can make a great argument to sweep this under the rug.  If all this is about is hush money to a hooker, which is like tip money to a billionaire, it's not worth the drama and division.  

It's not about hush money to a hooker which is entirely legal. It's about recording those payments as business expenses and tax evasion. 

Republicans phrase it as "just about hush money to a hooker" as that isn't illegal whereas the rest is. 

[forky123]

1 hour ago, unicorn said:

That would be quite something if the indictment increased his popularity among Republicans and they nominated him. Other than his base, it won't go well. If Republicans nominate him, he'll lose. 

I truly believed the US couldn't elect him in 2016 then sat in horror as they did. I will never again believe Americans aren't stupid enough to elect him again. 

[Marc in Calif]

10 hours ago, forky123 said:

It's not about hush money to a hooker which is entirely legal. It's about recording those payments as business expenses and tax evasion. 

At a much higher level of seriousness, it's about bribing the hooker to remain silent three weeks before an election to influence the results in Drumpf's favor.

And that's definitely illegal. It will be one of the more serious charges announced by the judge tomorrow at the arraignment hearing. Some pundits say that there might be 30 charges included in the Grand Jury's indictment.