Why not retire to Thailand?

[Olddaddy]

33 minutes ago, Londoner said:

As a newbie, in olden times, I was diffident being seen in a MB's company. When I offed a guy, I whisked him into Ambiance or wherever as fast as I could.

After years of this, I met P and recall taking him to Tuc Com to buy a phone-  yes, yes, I know that's a cliché- and suddenly realised that it was the first time I'd ventured out of Boyztown with a companion.

Now I don't give a d**n, whether it be Thailand, Laos, Bali and (I hope) London soon.  But the memory of that couple on the Phi Phi trip still vexes me. And P as well, who'd been looking forward to that day for a long time.

But they actually didnt make any comments to you both did they?

Is it possible we can imagine what others are thinking?

I'm not saying this happened in your case,just sometimes I can be like that where I imagine or think thoughts which have no evidence 

[zombie]

Interesting the important issue Londoner raises with taking a younger guy into the straight world and getting bad vibes etc from straights esp Karen types.

Anyone got any ideas how to handle this? 

 I suppose just adopting the attitude not to care less what others think but easier said than done.

Seems unfair that straights can come to our scene such as Soi 4 in Bangkok and no problem; but try bringing a gay boy with you to a straight dominated area and things are different...or am I being too sensitive? 

 

[Olddaddy]

1 hour ago, zombie said:

Interesting the important issue Londoner raises with taking a younger guy into the straight world and getting bad vibes etc from straights esp Karen types.

Anyone got any ideas how to handle this? 

 I suppose just adopting the attitude not to care less what others think but easier said than done.

Seems unfair that straights can come to our scene such as Soi 4 in Bangkok and no problem; but try bringing a gay boy with you to a straight dominated area and things are different...or am I being too sensitive? 

 

No I don't believe your being sensitive at all 

But I believe there has to be "evidence" to think that way ,many a time my Filipino boyfriend has corrected my negative thoughts.

 

 

[a-447]

I go out to restaurants with my 2 guys all the time and don't give it much thought, even though I know some people - especially farang customers- probably look down on me. But I don't pay them any attention. I do remember the owner of a Thai restaurant in Central Festival giving us a hard time. We never returned.

What I can't stand is being in a lift with straight people who do not try to hide their distain. I feel trapped. I find this situation occurred from time to time when the Ambiance decided to open up to straight people. 

On the baht bus in  Pattaya my guy and I sit apart and ignore each other.  I think he would feel uncomfortable being stared at by the locals in the confines of the bus.

Walking around the streets of Pattaya with my guy is not a problem, although one evening as we were walking back from Sunee one of the baht bus touts on Second Street said something to my guy and called out "You boom boom him tonight!" so that everyone could hear. As it was said in a disparaging way and intended to embarrass me I walked up to him and said :" Yes. Boom boom. One hour I give him 2000 baht. Good for him, eh"?

The smirk quickly disappeared from his face.

[Londoner]

I didn't mention  this but an old Italian guy was sweet to us....I think he too felt the unease. P and I didn't discuss it until after lunch; we both felt it simultaneously.

By the way, P was about thirty-two at the time.   

I concur with a-447 as regards Pattaya. And Chiang Mai and Krabi though a Phuket khatoey show girl was offensive to him once in Patong's Walking Street.. probably out of jealousy!

[traveller123]

I think I have been fortunate.

In the UK I lived in a small cul de sac of probably 20 houses mostly occupied by retired people.

After I had met my partner while I was on holiday in Hua Hin and visited him three or four times I invited him to stay with me in England for three months, at the time I was 63 and he would be 27/28.

Probably a little to my surprise my neighbours were very friendly and would invite him into their homes when I was at work, a couple of years later we had a UK Civil Partnership and one of the neighbours brought across a wedding cake they had baked.

It certainly helped that my partner has a very open smile and responds quickly if he feels people like him.

[vinapu]

1 hour ago, a-447 said:

... . called out "You boom boom him tonight!" so that everyone could hear. As it was said in a disparaging way and intended to embarrass me I walked up to him and said :" Yes. Boom boom. One hour I give him 2000 baht. Good for him, eh"?

The smirk quickly disappeared from his face.

Risky as your guy could be even more embarrassed by clearly labeling him moneyboy

[spoon]

Straight old guy seeing with a young girl are also frowned upon in many places. Disparity of age will always gets the stares. Life is too short to bother about them though. In the end, what did they do to even deserve our attention?

[fedssocr]

I agree that a big age difference is a problem for many people. I have several friends who have older partners here in the US. I've never asked any of them about it, but I suspect there have been comments made about their partners being "sugar daddies".  

Some people have a hard time minding their own business and enjoy being judgmental of others. I think some of us might have some of our own discomfort with being gay or being with much younger men whom we are paying for their companionship. So it's more of an internalized issue than anything. 

[a-447]

48 minutes ago, vinapu said:

Risky as your guy could be even more embarrassed by clearly labeling him moneyboy

We walked past those baht buses every night, so the touts knew he was a money boy. Mind you, I was one of many older farang with a young guy in tow who walked back and forth between Sunee and Boyztown.

But over the years there was only this one arsehole who couldn't resist commenting.

He never commented again.

 

[Mavica]

19 hours ago, Olddaddy said:

But unfortunately the Western Countries can have people who are very judgemental especially people our age group and above and even some quite nasty "Karen's" who won't mind their own business.

Any country you visit or live in has some of the people you seem so very concerned about.  I live my life, and partake in my entertainment, for me ... not to please others.  Of course there may be situations, worldwide, where we find ourselves in danger because of an outward expression of affection when in public.  I confine romantic expressions to places where I can be private.  I don't care what someone else thinks.  

[floridarob]

7 hours ago, a-447 said:

"You boom boom him tonight!" so that everyone could hear.

I have had the same thing happen, I tell him, because he was no good last night, I found someone new, 😝

[Olddaddy]

6 hours ago, Mavica said:

Any country you visit or live in has some of the people you seem so very concerned about.  I live my life, and partake in my entertainment, for me ... not to please others.  Of course there may be situations, worldwide, where we find ourselves in danger because of an outward expression of affection when in public.  I confine romantic expressions to places where I can be private.  I don't care what someone else thinks.  

A lot true what you say , 

I live in a "gay area" so constantly see two guys holding hands in my area in the street,of  course they would know better not to do that in the outer suburbs where there is a big Muslim population or in "working class" type areas .

But yeah I agree with you ,lead the life that makes you happy not to please others .👍

[reader]

12 minutes ago, Olddaddy said:

I live in a "gay area" so constantly see two guys holding hands in my area in the street,of  course they would know better not to do that in the outer suburbs where there is a big Muslim population or in "working class" type areas .

Hey, don't sell all of us working class types short.

[Olddaddy]

I must say though in reply to "Mavica" that not everyone wants to be known as gay even though they are in a gay area .

I remember being in the jomtien complex in late June watching the Gay Pride🏳️‍🌈 march and decided on taking a few pictures, up jumped a older farang that demanded I stopped taking them 

I told him to move away from the camera and area of the parade if he didn't want to be in the pics !

" I'm visiting here ,he said standing over me, " I'm visiting here I don't wish anyone to know I'm here !😳

Well then move away I said, 

I'm expected by him to STOP taking pics of something I enjoy ( gay pride march in jomtien complex) because he doesn't want anyone to know he is gay that could see him in the pics !🙄🙄I

wished I had asked him if he was doing something he shouldn't be ,he has to keep a secret life so none of us can take pics of events because he wants to sit in the middle,scared of a camera !;;

I mean if your that secret or ashamed of being gay don't go to the Pattaya gay bars, they have recording cctv in that area anyway so it's not like your there in secret.secret.

and us who are not ashamed of  being gay should suffer because we have to keep your life secret,so no photos 🙄

 

[Gaybutton]

1 hour ago, Olddaddy said:

up jumped a older farang that demanded I stopped taking them

I suppose he must have thought you were the only person with a camera taking photos that day.  And he also must have supposed you intended to publish the pictures on the internet. 

Anger and making demands are the wrong reactions.  If he explained his situation a politely asked that you delete any photos that include him, he might have gotten somewhere.  But anger and demands coming from someone you've never met or heard of - that kind of person gets no sympathy from me.

I believe your story because I've seen it happen before, more than once, when someone becomes irate if he thinks his face might show up in  photo where his face isn't supposed to be. 

In any case, that's his problem, not yours.  If someone is truly worried about showing up in a photo and the wrong person might spot it, then he shouldn't be at that location or he can wear a mask or otherwise disguise himself.

No matter what reason a person might not want to be photographed, in this day and age virtually everybody has cameras on their phones and they use them.  It is useless to get upset with one photographer unless he is stalking you like paparazzi.

The reality is if you want to be absolutely sure not to be photographed at certain locations or circumstances, then don't put yourself at those locations and circumstances.  That's the only way I know of.

[PeterRS]

The only time I have been 'concerned' about being with a guy younger than me was in a country with anti-gay laws. My first real bf after I moved to Asia was a Japanese. I flew to Tokyo for a long week-end every month to be with him and he twice came to Hong Kong to stay with me for 3 weeks. Obviously I loved spending all that time with him. At the same time I was concerned that Hong Kong still had the draconian Victorian law about gay sex. Every year 3 or 4 guys were sent to jail for 2 years after being found guilty of that 'offence'. (That law was finally repealed in 1990)

Worse, the contract with my company stated that if I was ever convicted of any offence in a court of law, the contract would be immediately terminated and I would lose the standard end of contract perks - return air fare to the UK, loss of bonus in lieu of pension etc. So I was sometimes a bit over cautious. For example, when we went to restaurants, I would always go in first just in case there was someone there whom I knew from business and I could explain away my being with my Japanese friend as just a business associate.

Looking back, it all seems so silly! It's not as though I was in my 60s and he in his 20s or that we were having sex in the bushes by the gay beach. He was indeed 25, but then I was only in my early 30s! Soon after I finally realised how stupid that was and I gave up the pretence. I finally felt free.

[Olddaddy]

49 minutes ago, PeterRS said:

The only time I have been 'concerned' about being with a guy younger than me was in a country with anti-gay laws. My first real bf after I moved to Asia was a Japanese. I flew to Tokyo for a long week-end every month to be with him and he twice came to Hong Kong to stay with me for 3 weeks. Obviously I loved spending all that time with him. At the same time I was concerned that Hong Kong still had the draconian Victorian law about gay sex. Every year 3 or 4 guys were sent to jail for 2 years after being found guilty of that 'offence'. (That law was finally repealed in 1990)

Worse, the contract with my company stated that if I was ever convicted of any offence in a court of law, the contract would be immediately terminated and I would lose the standard end of contract perks - return air fare to the UK, loss of bonus in lieu of pension etc. So I was sometimes a bit over cautious. For example, when we went to restaurants, I would always go in first just in case there was someone there whom I knew from business and I could explain away my being with my Japanese friend as just a business associate.

Looking back, it all seems so silly! It's not as though I was in my 60s and he in his 20s or that we were having sex in the bushes by the gay beach. He was indeed 25, but then I was only in my early 30s! Soon after I finally realised how stupid that was and I gave up the pretence. I finally felt free.

Did you ever keep in touch with him?

[PeterRS]

2 hours ago, Olddaddy said:

Did you ever keep in touch with him?

For several years. One of the supreme ironies of my short relationship was that he eventually left me for an older Englishman. I knew it was more difficult for him being in Tokyo working in a job he did not particularly like than for me when I was in a job I loved but gave me little free time. I knew too from my last visit when I stayed with him in his tiny little room (how cosy that was!) that he had met someone else who was rich and might be offering him to be his companion on a round-the-world trip. I'll leave aside how we discussed that further. Suffice to say the Englishman he hooked up with also lived in Hong Kong and my one-time lover came to live with him! 

We still met occasionally as good friends until a few years later. Having tea one afternoon, he told me he was not feeling well. As they were leaving for a holiday in England a few days later, he said would get a check-up if he had not recovered. I then heard nothing for almost two months when his partner called me to say he had died, a victim of AIDS. So sad! I flew all the way to London just to go to the funeral.

[Mavica]

On 8/8/2022 at 6:17 PM, Olddaddy said:

I must say though in reply to "Mavica" that not everyone wants to be known as gay even though they are in a gay area .

 

 

  And to that I repeat an earlier suggestion of yours"

Quote

But yeah I agree with you ,lead the life that makes you happy not to please others .

 

[Londoner]

Olddaddy is correct; sadly. An old friend  died recently; I was the only person in the world who knew he was gay, apart from a few mbs I persuaded him to meet on trips To Thailand with me. 

When I was at his funeral, I looked around at the mourners, family and friends,  and realised that I was the only person at that grave-side who "knew" him, including two brothers, one of whom was a twin. It was a feeling both disconcerting and depressing. 

[scott456]

1 hour ago, Londoner said:

 realised that I was the only person at that grave-side who "knew" him, including two brothers, one of whom was a twin. It was a feeling both disconcerting and depressing. 

Perhaps the twin brother is gay too.  I heard the possibility is very high for twins.

[Olddaddy]

1 hour ago, scott456 said:

Perhaps the twin brother is gay too.  I heard the possibility is very high for twins.

Interesting you say that ,I have a work colleague who is gay and his twin brother too😳

I was very shocked when he told me that 

[scott456]

58 minutes ago, Olddaddy said:

Interesting you say that ,I have a work colleague who is gay and his twin brother too😳

I was very shocked when he told me that 

Well, identical twins are supposed to IDENTICAL, aren't they?

[Londoner]

Not in this case....at least, the twin had a wife and a daughter. But who knows? My generation is full of closet-dwellers. After all, I was forty-five before I had  gay sex.

One thing I've mentioned before is that I was struck , on my first visit to Pattaya where I met other men for whom gay sex had come late to their lives. Very late in the case of one guy, who was in his late seventies when his wife died. He came straight to Pattaya where I'd see him frequently walking through Boyztown, hand -in hand with a young Thai.

I found it touching.