Why not retire to Thailand?

[Olddaddy]

Would be quite interesting to see just how many gay farangs are nstill retiring to Thailand particularly Pattaya 

The current 50yo to 65yo age gay farang group is very different to the generation of 25 years ago.

More wealthier,more knowledgeable, far more different,I don't think as "settled",

I can't see the new generation of gay retirees doing what the past generation did 

Do any of you agree with that?

 

[Boy69]

5 hours ago, Olddaddy said:

Would be quite interesting to see just how many gay farangs are nstill retiring to Thailand particularly Pattaya 

The current 50yo to 65yo age gay farang group is very different to the generation of 25 years ago.

More wealthier,more knowledgeable, far more different,I don't think as "settled",

I can't see the new generation of gay retirees doing what the past generation did 

Do any of you agree with that?

 

Yes I agree the west culture is much more open to gays ,  more gay enentertiment venues.the internet, apps and smartphones made hook up more easily then it used to be before .gay peoples have  more opportunities in their home countries nowadays . Thailand is no longer the great escape destination.

Many years ago I had the opportunity leaving at Pattaya  couple of month every time and it was a gay heaven I had everything I needed there and rarely leaved the city limits nowadays it's still fun but not close compare to the past after a week l find myself bored and prefer traveling more other destinations in Thailand. 

[PeterRS]

With younger gay tourists seemingly wealthier and travel hopefully soon to become less expensive, I'm rather surprised that there seem to be no tour companies around organising gay tours to several countries on one trip. Many will recall the Utopia Tours company which was based in the Tarntawan hotel lobby. It did organise multi-country tours. Sadly it became the subject of a scandalous court case (the scandal surrounded the judge!) and later shut up shop. I believe it was reincarnated as Purple Dragon Tours. But even that no longer exists. Anyone wanting to know more about that case can check here -

https://web.archive.org/web/20050606015724/http:/www.yawningbread.org/arch_2005/yax-435.htm

I know that Siam Roads provides excellent guides around the region.  But it does not include Malaysia, Hong Kong or Taiwan nor make transport and hotel arrangements. Once the covid entry restrictions in all countries are removed, I expect the gay scenes in these cities to be fully open to tourists again. Perhaps the new breed of sex-related tourist might wish to include at least 2 if not 3 destination countries rather than always sticking with Bangkok and Pattaya.

[Londoner]

But what would we leave behind if we were to locate?  I decided back in 2004 when this issue was uppermost in my mind,  that frequent visits were the better option for me.

And then came Covid.  

 

[Olddaddy]

2 hours ago, Londoner said:

But what would we leave behind if we were to locate?  I decided back in 2004 when this issue was uppermost in my mind,  that frequent visits were the better option for me.

And then came Covid.  

 

I guess you would leave behind family,friends?

Maybe medical services you don't have to pay for .

I just can't see the same level of gay farangs living in Pattaya say in 10 years like there is now,and even now many of the older ones have left and are slowly leaving.

I'm not sure how the gay  beer bars are surviving,I guess to many owners it's just a hobby.

 

 

[Olddaddy]

3 hours ago, PeterRS said:

With younger gay tourists seemingly wealthier and travel hopefully soon to become less expensive, I'm rather surprised that there seem to be no tour companies around organising gay tours to several countries on one trip. Many will recall the Utopia Tours company which was based in the Tarntawan hotel lobby. It did organise multi-country tours. Sadly it became the subject of a scandalous court case (the scandal surrounded the judge!) and later shut up shop. I believe it was reincarnated as Purple Dragon Tours. But even that no longer exists. Anyone wanting to know more about that case can check here -

https://web.archive.org/web/20050606015724/http:/www.yawningbread.org/arch_2005/yax-435.htm

I know that Siam Roads provides excellent guides around the region.  But it does not include Malaysia, Hong Kong or Taiwan nor make transport and hotel arrangements. Once the covid entry restrictions in all countries are removed, I expect the gay scenes in these cities to be fully open to tourists again. Perhaps the new breed of sex-related tourist might wish to include at least 2 if not 3 destination countries rather than always sticking with Bangkok and Pattaya.

Very interesting link 

As for gay tour companies I can see a future,but I think they will concentrate on the middle aged wealthier gays particularly the gay couples ,I very much doubt Pattaya will be high on their list,many I see like the Greek islands,Turkey,Boracay ,Rio ,I doubt moneyboy Pattaya has much appeal for middle-aged gay couples .

Even the mature aged gay man as you mentioned now can use apps & far far more gay destinations

 

[Olddaddy]

That link to Utopia travel was very interesting read , it did happen nearly 20 years ago but nothing has changed.

That matter was caused by the Australian government at the time but nothing has changed in Australia the people & media are still homophobic to a degree .

Of course this sort of stuff went in years ago where pedophiles did prey on children in Thailand but in them days they linked gay men to that and pedophiles should never be thought of as part of the gay community.

I often cringe sometimes when I read on gay Asian forums the use of the word "boys" to describe young men of 18plus ,the Karen's will soon have a field day when they start reading these forums .

[Londoner]

Olddaddy asks what i would leave behind, well... yes, the NHS was the factor for an ageing diabetic. Particularly when I saw what happened to an American expat friend whose insurance ran -out as he lay in hospital with cancer.

Family and friends, yes....though sadly, not really true seventeen years later.

But classical music, Chelsea FC (live, not on TV!)and  my political activities would all have been deeply missed.

And the changing of the seasons- the advent of autumn and of spring in particular. The winter, since you may ask, is ideally spent as much as possible here in Thailand!

1 hour ago, Olddaddy said:

Maybe medical services you don't have to pay for .

  

[Olddaddy]

I think once I retire fully ( I'm still not retired at 62) but once I do I may consider a few months a year in Pattaya, but as someone posted above ,you can meet guys anywhere nowadays via apps and there are gay bars in nearly every city ,so why Pattaya ?

[bkkmfj2648]

2 hours ago, Olddaddy said:

so why Pattaya ?

Good question Olddaddy.

For me, the choice for Pattaya/Jomtien - was that I did not like the alternative choices - which from my Western point of view were:

• USA, Italy, and Hungary  - where I saw how the non-elderly gay community treated the elderly gay retirees - as if they should just be invisible and to be ignored.  I did not want to finish the last chapters of my life in this way - especially when the point arrives in our lives when we will need assisted living care - in some assisted care center where the life there is conservative and to be out and gay is frowned upon.  So, it would mean to go back into the closet.  No thanks!!   Of course, if you are extremely wealthy in the West you can negate most of this by hiring gay staff to give you the illusion of not having to be invisible.
• Thailand - I saw in the vibrant gay ex-pat retiree communities of Bangkok and Pattaya that it is not necessary to be invisible and ignored.  Why?  because us elderly retirees are numerous - and we have created our own infrastructure and support systems - where being old, gay, and elderly - with all of our special needs does not need to be looked down upon.  In fact, it can be a very positive experience.

Here is a proof-in-point story.   During my last trip to Thailand, in 2020 - I saw a VERY elderly feeble Western gentleman, who could barely walk, be assisted by two kind Thai guys to help him walk from his apartment in Jomtien to his favorite table at his favorite Jomtien Supertown bar.  It made me cry - in happiness - that this gentleman would be taken care of by the kind likes of our Thai guys.  In this way, I do not need to DREAD what it would be like to be so old in Thailand - to still have dignity and respect to enjoy our lives right up until the end.  For me, Thailand is the pot of gold at the end of our gay rainbow.

Lastly, why Pattaya and not Bangkok?  My dream has always been to retire at the seaside.  Although Pattaya City is situated on the seaside - it is too urban and congested for my tastes.  I truly enjoy the Dongtan seaside area - especially the seawalk from Thappraya road all the way north to Phra Tam Nak 5 - that piece of seafront is truly lovely and peaceful for me.  I do love the energy of Bangkok - but thinking long-term, I find that Bangkok can be stressful from a moving around point of view - as I like to walk a lot.  So, I will probably head over to Bangkok every 4 to 6 weeks for 3 to 4 days to get my high energy fix.

So Olddaddy - let me ask you a question.  Where on our Planet Earth - do you believe are the best places to retire for us elderly gay guys with our particular needs and care issues ?

[Olddaddy]

 Dumamagette or Palawan  in Philippines, a lot of farangs.

Philippines has also a lot of handsome boys , and very loving of  older mature western men, a lot less moneyboys than Thailand in my experience there the last few months although I don't like Manila I like Davao City and parts of Cebu/ Mactan island etc.

Filipino boys seem to be more boyfriend type experience than the Thai boys I experienced 

 

 

[fedssocr]

I wonder if language barrier issues could be part of that difference?

[Londoner]

Good point; I'd be interested to know how many retirees have learnt enough Thai to function in rural areas? or whether the thinking is "why bother?"

[Gaybutton]

13 hours ago, Londoner said:

Good point; I'd be interested to know how many retirees have learnt enough Thai to function in rural areas? or whether the thinking is "why bother?"

The answer is both.  It depends on how and why you would be in a rural area.  After living in Thailand as long as I have, I can tell you the more Thai you learn to speak the better off you'll be.  The ability to speak Thai usually is not absolutely imperative when traveling to a rural area, even if you are traveling alone, but it certainly helps.  You might be surprised by how many people, even in those areas, who can speak at least a little bit of English.  Think about the bar boys who speak enough English to get by.  Where do you think they got it?

I think I speak Thai quite well.  When I travel to a rural area I don't have any problems communicating.  I can speak it well enough and I can understand it well enough.  But I've never even tried to learn to read it.  I've never found it necessary.  Almost everywhere signs and even restaurant menus are in both Thai and English. 

Most of the time if I travel to a rural area it is with a boy.  No problem communicating with him, but if we're visiting family and/or friends, without the ability to speak a good amount of Thai you won't be able to communicate very much with them.  You certainly won't be able to participate in conversations and you'll spend much of the time feeling left out.  You know why?  Because you'll be left out.

If you're retiring in Thailand, but don't plan to live in a major city, I would definitely advise spending much of at least your first year attending Thai language classes or hiring a good tutor.  You'll learn enough of the basics to be able to pick up a vast amount of the language on your own.  Just as important, don't forget that Thai is a tonal language.  You'll need to work on getting the tones right.  A lot of farang have a quite a bit of trouble with the tones, but without getting them right many Thais won't understand what you're trying to say.  I can't stress strongly enough how important it is.  And remember that most of the time if the word is more than one syllable, the emphasis is usually on the last syllable. 

Even if you're going to live in a major city, I would still advise language lessons.  The more Thai you can speak and understand the easier life will be and the more meaningful life will be.  I know several farang who retired to Thailand, but eventually gave up and went back to wherever they came from mainly because of the language barrier.  They never made a good effort to learn the language.  If it is going to be a few years before you retire to Thailand, I would recommend starting Thai language lessons wherever you are.  The more you know even before retiring the better off you'll be.  The same, by the way, goes even if you only travel to Thailand for holidays.  The more you know, the better.

[spoon]

Just a thought. Retiring in thailand or pattaya specifically doesnt mean u are stuck there. The same way u are travelling for few months now to thailand, u could very well do the opposite when u make thailand your base. If this is the case, would anyone here feel changing your base to thailand easier?

[gerefan]

1 hour ago, spoon said:

Just a thought. Retiring in thailand or pattaya specifically doesnt mean u are stuck there. The same way u are travelling for few months now to thailand, u could very well do the opposite when u make thailand your base. If this is the case, would anyone here feel changing your base to thailand easier?

That would mean vacating the place you own for very long periods of time rather than just a few months per visit. 
It would probably mean selling my place which I am very loath to do. So for me it’s live in the UK and spend long holidays in Thailand.

[bucky13]

X

[scott456]

I would suggest a long stay > 1 year in Thailand before planning the final retirement to Thailand.  I did my long stay for 1.5 years, and I decided it is not for me.

[kjun12]

5 minutes ago, scott456 said:

I would suggest a long stay > 1 year in Thailand before planning the final retirement in Thailand.  I did my long stay for 1.5 years, and I decided it is not for me.

My belief is that your idea is very good advice.  Spend some time checking Thailand out before making a commitment to set up life here. Certainly before buying a condo and any real property because, let's face it, that is a major financial commitment that is not easy to get out of.

[Boy69]

6 hours ago, scott456 said:

I would suggest a long stay > 1 year in Thailand before planning the final retirement to Thailand.  I did my long stay for 1.5 years, and I decided it is not for me.

You raised a good point living in Thailand permanently is completely different thing then staying there limited time for vacation,  Can you explain why you decided it's not for you ?

.

[Olddaddy]

7 hours ago, scott456 said:

I would suggest a long stay > 1 year in Thailand before planning the final retirement to Thailand.  I did my long stay for 1.5 years, and I decided it is not for me.

Very interesting,

What kind of things made you think otherwise Scott?

Did you base your stay in Pattaya and/or Bangkok areas ?

What was your daily routine,was it far different than your normal one where you live?

[Olddaddy]

13 hours ago, gerefan said:

That would mean vacating the place you own for very long periods of time rather than just a few months per visit. 
It would probably mean selling my place which I am very loath to do. So for me it’s live in the UK and spend long holidays in Thailand.

Yes not a good idea to sell up everything in your own home country and then be left with nothing if Shit hits the fan.

[10tazione]

On 7/31/2022 at 7:04 AM, PeterRS said:

travel hopefully soon to become less expensive

What makes you hope this?

Hotels, at least  in Thailand, have  been ridiculously cheap for the last 2 years and are probably only back to 80% of prepandemic price level. I wouldn't expect them to lower again.
Flight prices now are higher than before Covid but why would they go down with all those fuel crisis, co2 crisis etc?
What am I overlooking?

[Olddaddy]

20 hours ago, spoon said:

Just a thought. Retiring in thailand or pattaya specifically doesnt mean u are stuck there. The same way u are travelling for few months now to thailand, u could very well do the opposite when u make thailand your base. If this is the case, would anyone here feel changing your base to thailand easier?

Well not really.

If you sold your house in farangland wherever that may be ,and make Thailand your home then it's going to be expensive to go back to your own country unless you had somewhere to stay cheaply.

 

[PeterRS]

17 hours ago, 10tazione said:

What makes you hope this?

Hotels, at least  in Thailand, have  been ridiculously cheap for the last 2 years and are probably only back to 80% of prepandemic price level. I wouldn't expect them to lower again.
Flight prices now are higher than before Covid but why would they go down with all those fuel crisis, co2 crisis etc?
What am I overlooking?

I was not referring specifically to Thailand. Travel pricing depends on a host of factors and there is no reason to believe that, as in the past, high prices are here to stay in the long run.

Re air fares, of course they are higher due to much greater than expected demand after covid, oil price, high inflation rate, finding new staff fast, peak summer demand etc. But airlines have been through similar price hikes before and prices have eventually come down. Remember when oil was almost $150 per barrel? That was in 2008 and 2012 and was followed by predictions of doom and gloom for the travel industry. By 2016 it was down to around $60. Just yesterday alone there was a cut of 12% in the price of jet fuel.