How much to tip boy next to you

[forrestreid]

3 hours ago, reader said:

I never said "bad". You're the first one to suggest that.

And how does the fact that I've posted 4k times relate to this discussion?

My comment was based on your negative reaction to a discussion of what the going rate for a certain sexual service, considering that on this board there are constant discussions about fee rates in Rio bars, saunas in Barcelona, escorts in Prague etc. All of the issues you have raised concerning the correct way to view a fee for services rendered it would apply in those situations as well. Your disapproval of the suggestion that the “going rate“ may have been to less than what you thought appropriate was what surprised me, given your presumed familiarity with such discussions.

Regarding the point on the “business model”. Perhaps it is overly clinical term. But I just meant that the way that remuneration works in sleaze bars in Sunee is different than, say, with the guys who work in a host bar in Jomtien. There, you might be drinking with a customer who sits with you for two or three hours then he brings you back to his hotel and pays you 1500 baht. So your total earnings for the night are 1500 baht (plus your share of off fee and drinks).

However, in Nice Boys in Sunee, you might get 300 baht from a customer at 8 pm for a bit of hands-on, you make it 500 baht from a customer that sucks you off at 9 pm,  you might get 700 baht from another customer in the bar that you chuck wow for at 10 pm. You get a share of the drinks fee too, of course. So you end up with the same money for your nights work, even though you get it from three short encounters with customers over the night, rather than one long one. The fact that a customer can have a hands-on experience (as opposed to full sex) for a quite a small outlay therefore attracts more customers into the bar, perhaps including people who will go on to off a guy from a host bar in Jomtien complex later that night. The various types of bar have their own niche, and which one is the better or worst deal for the bar guys themselves is a matter of opinion.

[forrestreid]

43 minutes ago, reader said:

For once in this thread I have to agree with z909.

He'll troll you to forever if he catches you paying above scale.

You wouldnt have lasted long in the old Thailand-based boards back when i started reading them (around 2007).

Back then they seemed dominated by a bunch of low-income retired expats who used to get a fit of the vapours when anybody reported that they may have paid more than 700 baht for short-time.

If you did a trip-report in which you foolishly informed all and sundry that you gave your favourite guy, say, 1500 on your last night, they would jump on you like a bunch of hungry hyenas.

It was quite funny at times, but I am glad that phase seems to have passed too...

 

 

 

[reader]

1 minute ago, forrestreid said:

My comment was based on your negative reaction to a discussion of what the going rate for a certain sexual service, considering that on this board there are constant discussions about fee rates in Rio bars, saunas in Barcelona, escorts in Prague etc. All of the issues you have raised concerning the correct way to view a fee for services rendered it would apply in those situations as well. Your disapproval of the suggestion that the “going rate“ may have been to less than what you thought appropriate was what surprised me, given your presumed familiarity with such discussions.

I believe you have me confused with someone else. I've never been to Prague, Rio or Barcelona and have no basis or experience to discuss those locations.

I have, however, been coming three times a year to Thailand since 2002 (less the covid period when it was closed). Almost all of my time is spent In BKK.

You certainly have a good handle on Pattaya and I defer to your familiarity with those bars.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, reader said:

For once in this thread I have to agree with z909.

He'll troll you to forever if he catches you paying above scale.

If you can find one examples of me criticizing someone for paying over or under rate, please post a link.      Then we'll have it scrutinized by people with proper verbal reasoning skills. 

I think one board member said he tipped 5000 recently, as he is entitled to do.     You can start by looking for the examples of me trolling him.   

 

Some of us are trying to behave honestly here.   And on the other hand, you're criticizing people for things they haven't even said.   

 

 

 

 

[reader]

You make it abundantly clear that the boy who got his cock sucked for 10 minutes got fair compensation based on the daily minimum wage for a laborer. You can't honestly compare engaging in public sex with everyday labor. It's a ridiculous comparison yet you insist on using it as a logical rationalization. You imply that those who pay above your formula are overpaying.

You appear to view the boys who work in bars purely as service providers. You don't appreciate that guys who agree to have sex for money are engaging in something entirely different than everyday labor. They are putting their bodies and the minds at our disposal for our pleasure.

And when you refer to his pay as x times the minimum wage you belittle just how much he is actually doing for us. And what he's doing goes far beyond that. Why else would be travel great distances and endure much inconvenience in order to be able to be with that boy, in that bar, at that moment?

Forget what others say they pay at this bar or another. Forgo the formulas and "going rates." Treat each guy as the individual he is.

Disregard those who complain that "you're ruining it for the rest us" by paying more than the going rates.

 

[TotallyOz]

6 hours ago, Patanawet said:

Much sense Vessey -- you obviously actually do get out to the bars unlike some other posters here spouting their high falutin ideas without practical knowledge.

 

I guess my easily over 2,000 visits to Sunee Plaza is an understanding without practical knowledge? Not quite! Admittedly, I have not been there but 5 times in last two years, but I still think I have ample practical knowledge.

My high falutin idea is to pay for services rendered and to pay a good amount commensurate with that service.

[TotallyOz]

1 hour ago, forrestreid said:

You wouldnt have lasted long in the old Thailand-based boards back when i started reading them (around 2007).

Back then they seemed dominated by a bunch of low-income retired expats who used to get a fit of the vapours when anybody reported that they may have paid more than 700 baht for short-time.

If you did a trip-report in which you foolishly informed all and sundry that you gave your favourite guy, say, 1500 on your last night, they would jump on you like a bunch of hungry hyenas.

It was quite funny at times, but I am glad that phase seems to have passed too...

I am glad that phase ended as well. And, yes, I do remember it well.

[TotallyOz]

5 hours ago, z909 said:

Of course I left it out, since that was a different customer.

The average freelancer trading on the apps is suitably compensated by getting between 3 and 6 times the daily rate of a labourer, for one hour's short time.  

The guy in the opening post received more than the minimum daily wage for having his cock sucked for 10 minutes.      

These MB rates make sense by comparison with Thai labour rates.  

Also, Vessey's advice based on real experience in the Sunee bars is far more helpful than some daft comparison with what westerners would expect to charge for such services.  

Tough comparison. The day laborer does not often go days without any pay or benefits. There are so many differences between what a money boy can make at the top of their game and what a regular laborer makes but why not consider them professionals and base their rate on that concept. I pay my doctor 1500 baht for a quick treatment and is that not similar to a short time rate? Having spent time with many Western hookers, I know that their feeling (and mine) is that they are professionals and need to be treated as such. In Thailand, that concept is often not thought about as the tendency is to think of them as the bottom of the labor market and not the top of it. I just simply disagree with the comparison with a poorly paid laborer.

[floridarob]

48 minutes ago, TotallyOz said:

My high falutin idea is to pay for services rendered and to pay a good amount commensurate with that service.

But you're not the normal customer....ask the motobike dealerships or the Apple store (joking) 😉

[floridarob]

4 hours ago, reader said:

Start thinking of them as humans and not numbers

That's a 2-way street...We're not ATM's either, some of their negotiations/techniques would put a used car salesman to shame ....they try to use those that pay 4000 or 5000 to be the standard and think that's now the bar to cross😉

[Guest]

45 minutes ago, TotallyOz said:

Tough comparison. The day laborer does not often go days without any pay or benefits. There are so many differences between what a money boy can make at the top of their game and what a regular laborer makes but why not consider them professionals and base their rate on that concept. I pay my doctor 1500 baht for a quick treatment and is that not similar to a short time rate? Having spent time with many Western hookers, I know that their feeling (and mine) is that they are professionals and need to be treated as such. In Thailand, that concept is often not thought about as the tendency is to think of them as the bottom of the labor market and not the top of it. I just simply disagree with the comparison with a poorly paid laborer.

A comparison with the top of the market is equally valid & might be easier for people to understand.      

So 1500 baht for short time in Thailand and 1500 baht for a visit to your doctor.

What are the US figures for a similar unsubsidised doctor's visit and short time with a money boy ?

The only issue is that doctors rates are not published, so it's easier to pick something that is known and apply a suitable multiple to it to reflect money boy's deserved earning power.  

The easiest international comparison of the lot would be short time tip v average GDP per capita, since the latter is published.   Naturally, a Thai boy getting one short time trick per day is on about double the Thai GDP per capita.   Seems fair.     

 

For the avoidance of doubt, I have considerable respect for money boys.    For a start, I value honesty.  

They're a lot more honest than some legal professionals who charge by the hour & string the job out.   

Or dentists who do work which isn't needed to generate revenue.     

On average, their timekeeping is actually better than our local NHS doctor, who always arrives at least 15 minutes later than the supposed 8:30 am start.

So I rate them higher than some other professions.

 

 

 

[floridarob]

4 minutes ago, z909 said:

Naturally, a Thai boy getting one short time trick per day is on double the Thai GDP per capita.   Seems fair.     

I compare what the same service costs in a similar country...Colombia, Brazil, Cuba, Mexico, Indonesia, Philippines...for example.

As anyone that has read Namazu's recent trip review,  his Brazilian friend has  pointed out how inexpensive Thailand is to Brazil. So how to justify the fairly large price differential for a MB ?

I don't tip any differently percentage wise in restaurants or hotels between any of the countries I mentioned....confused why the expected rates are so different for MB's?

[alvnv]

3 hours ago, z909 said:

If he's on stage next time you go in the bar, do let us know what his response is.   My guess is he will be almost inviting himself to sit next to you. 

I agree. We won’t know how HE felt about the tip until the next time he encounters OP. Unless, of course, there was a clear reaction  right after the interaction that we do not know about. In general, I believe that tipping should include 1. Minimum for the time spent + 2. Compensation for any extra services provided above the expected minimum based on the quality of that experience.

I don’t believe in capping the maximum tips - it really depends on an individual to whom the services are rendered. There’s nothing worse than underpaying someone who puts himself out there for you pleasure and satisfaction.

as far as the PDA is concerned, in any human interaction, one’s behavior should be based on reading the room and the person with whom you’re interacting. If at any point your partner does not feel comfortable with your actions, you should stop and look for an alternate location, or partner.

[Guest]

Am still waiting for your answer.       I note you found the time to write one more malicious & dishonest post, since.     If you have time for the attacks, find time to post the corresponding evidence.

4 hours ago, reader said:

For once in this thread I have to agree with z909.

He'll troll you to forever if he catches you paying above scale.

If you can find one examples of me criticizing someone for paying over or under rate, please post a link.     

I think one board member said he tipped 5000 recently, as he is entitled to do.     You can start by looking for the examples of me trolling him forever.

[forrestreid]

1 hour ago, TotallyOz said:

My high falutin idea is to pay for services rendered and to pay a good amount commensurate with that service.

That is all very well, commendable even, but as I said in an earlier post, if one is asked about the "going rate" in a visitor-oriented message board, I think it is only fair to give the "going rate" rather than the "generous guy" rate.

You can urge generosity if you want, even say the "going rate" is far too low if you like,  but I think if people make a regular habit of giving the answer that they think should be given, rather than the actual answer, to such questions, it will only cause the board to lose credibility in the long run.

[reader]

1 hour ago, z909 said:

Am still waiting for your answer.   

 Practicing patience is good for you. You pride yourself in having the last word, the final say. And always getting the best price possible out of an off.

 

[Gaybutton]

12 hours ago, TotallyOz said:

IMHO, you suck the boy, a minimum of 1,000 baht.

My opinion:  If the boy initiated it -500 baht

If you initiated it, I agree with TotallyOz - minimum of 1000 baht, emphasis on minimum, especially if he reciprocated. 

That's my recommendation for Pattaya.  Bangkok, you would probably be expected to pay at least 500 baht more.

Also, I forget where I read it - I think it was a z909 post - saying there is nothing wrong with negotiating the price, even sitting right there.  I agree.  Some might feel awkward about it, but I think one would end up feeling a whole lot more awkward if you are planning to tip 500 and the boy is expecting 2000.  So, this is where "business before pleasure" comes in.

[12is12]

Venessey,

What did u mean when u wrote "fuck u in the bar"?

Is there actual "all the way" fucking going on in public btw clients and MBs?

[Vessey]

This thread is getting toxic - which is a shame.

A couple of observations if I may please:

Lets keep with my experiences in Nice Boys in Sunee Plaza and take one boy in particular, Dui, who I have been seeing a few years now on my regular holidays to Pattaya. If I off him and take him back to my room, I pay him 2k baht. An exPat friend who visits the bar a couple of times a week, only pays him 1,000 baht to go back to his apartment. And if my long, long time feels horny at any time and wants this lad to come and fuck him in his room, he pays him 200 or 300 baht. Different rates from different folk to the same boy for essentially the same service, but Dui is happy with all his 'customers'.

Secondly, how much you pay a lad for a Chuck Wow, or a short time, or whatever sexual service, is, for me at least, only part of the equation. It's also about how you treat the lad while he is with you, the respect you show him, the little kindnesses you show him. Taking him out to eat, to drink, or to party in a karaoke bar, or whatever?; showing him a good time while he is with you. 

I have a small gang of 'regulars now' from various bars, some gay, some straight, but lads I have known for up to six or seven years now and we frequently go out of an evening together. I believe I pay them reasonably, perhaps a little too reasonably sometimes, but although I remain their 'customer', I like to think we are also friends. But, if we are friends, it is as much to do with how I treat them as how much I pay them  

[Vessey]

15 minutes ago, 12is12 said:

Venessey,

What did u mean when u wrote "fuck u in the bar"?

Is there actual "all the way" fucking going on in public btw clients and MBs?

If they were not too busy in Eros Bar, and by special arrangement in Good Boys, you could get fucked in the bar. Not done so myself, but witnessed it several times in Eros Bar, and had it reported to me in Good Boys. 

Both bars are closed now, and, as far as I know, that is no longer possible in any of the current Sunee Bars.

[vinapu]

8 hours ago, Olddaddy said:

I tipped 500 ,bought him a drink,sucked his dick around 10 minutes 

I think it s fair as long as neither one of you cum. In such case regular short time rate should apply as well as  bar,s off fee which was and perhaps still is Nature Boys policy.

I only hope you were first customer who sucked that guy that evening as taste of somebody else,s dentures  could be bit exotic to put ot mildly.

Why is that discussion about somebody else's money always generates so much heat ?

[reader]

6 minutes ago, Vessey said:

It's also about how you treat the lad while he is with you, the respect you show him, the little kindnesses you show him. Taking him out to eat, to drink, or to party in a karaoke bar, or whatever?; showing him a good time while he is with you. 

I have a small gang of 'regulars now' from various bars, some gay, some straight, but lads I have known for up to six or seven years now and we frequently go out of an evening together. I believe I pay them reasonably, perhaps a little too reasonably sometimes, but although I remain their 'customer', I like to think we are also friends. But, if we are friends, it is as much to do with how I treat them as how much I pay them  

I wholeheartedly agree with these comments. You're treating him as an individual and, as you say, showing him respect.

You travel a long way to be with these guys and I'm sure they appreciate the way you take care of them.

[TotallyOz]

2 hours ago, z909 said:

A comparison with the top of the market is equally valid & might be easier for people to understand.      

So 1500 baht for short time in Thailand and 1500 baht for a visit to your doctor.

What are the US figures for a similar unsubsidised doctor's visit and short time with a money boy ?

 

Sure, I have a doctor in NYC that is 200 for a visit and the escorts are 300 for a short time.

I use the Whopper as a means. You can buy a Whopper in USA and other places. For an escort in the USA, you would never tip the cost of a Whopper for service but some in Thailand try this.

In Thailand Whopper meal cost 219 Thai baht. So, the cost of a short time is about 10 Whoppers (using 2,000)

In USA, the Whopper meal cost is 6.50 USA. So, the cost of a short time is about 31 Whoppers (200 USD, even though most in bigger cities charge more).

Yeah, Yeah, I know cost of living, etc. But, IMHO, tipping someone the cost of a meal at Burger King for a blow job is insufficient. Perhaps, cruel even.

This thread has been fascinating and I think a good debate among many to see different views. I expect more see my view in Bangkok than in Pattaya. But, maybe no one does and that is OK. We all have different ways of tipping and taking care of the people who take care of us.

As @floridarob pointed out, I may gift too many motorcycles to guys that are good to me and I have never felt guilty with that. I have also never tipped the cost of a Whopper for a sexual service and I have felt guilty for that. I have one long term boyfriend who I have gifted 10 motorbikes, two cars, and more. And, I still feel that he has not gotten the full amount he deserves for his kindness to me over the years. Hell, today I'll be taking him for a Whopper for sure.

Thank you all for your various points of view. I would buy each of you a Whopper but I'm afraid you would feel the need to put out and I don't do over 40s.

[Olddaddy]

1 hour ago, vinapu said:

I think it s fair as long as neither one of you cum. In such case regular short time rate should apply as well as  bar,s off fee which was and perhaps still is Nature Boys policy.

I only hope you were first customer who sucked that guy that evening as taste of somebody else,s dentures  could be bit exotic to put ot mildly.

Why is that discussion about somebody else's money always generates so much heat ?

Omg your right !

I will have to carry hand sanitizer

I tipped 500 baht to suck him...but if I was just wanting i think 300 is ok.

They seem to have a "time limit" on the drink maybe 10 minutes?

 

[Shonen]

I pay 300 and a drink in Nice Boys for a guy to chuck wow. But it usually doesn’t stop at one and the bill adds up.

I tipped a guy who gave me a nice hand job in the pulpit 1,000 baht. I overpaid probably but he was very happy with the tip. He watched me play pool at their pool bar and applauded evert time I made a good shot.