How much do you think boys like working in bars?

[PattayaMale]

I bring this up because in the last few days some of the boys I have talked with have said they wish they did not have to work in the bars.

 

I sure understand this. But is it really true I wonder. Sure the job pays well. But is it just money?

 

Your thoughts?

[Guest]

Well, if it was lucrative I could tolerate the parading on stage in underwear part, but wouldn't like to go to bed with Farang 2x or 3x my age.

Maybe Thai bar workers have similar views.

 

At the end of the day, they will mostly have the option of earning typical Thai wages in ordinary jobs, but they make the voluntary choice to work in bars.

 

Most seem to cope with it very well, but just occasionally I encounter one who can hardly bear to look at the client in bed. I make a point of not offing them again.

[Guest pingalicker]

Very good question, one that I have often asked to myself. But also a bit difficult to try and answer. In my seven trips to LOS, I have offed many boys, I think all of them were "gay for pay", as the truly gay boys who work in the bars to me seem to be very femme, not my type. It is a choice he made to work in a bar, and seems once they get a taste of the money that can be made, stay with it for awhile. I always engage in conversation with the boys, and they are very inquesitive, asking many questions about my life in the USA. They seem to enjoy meeting people from around the world, I know I do. From my last trip in October 08 the boy I was with had lost his job at a Pattaya bar, then lost his apartment, two months prior, and had lived in the woods on Budha hill for a couple of weeks until he got another job at a go-go bar that came with an apartment, so he was very happy to be working there. He was of the mind set that he really "owed" the mamasan of the bar for giving him the job and apartment, and the mammasan is one of the most pleasant to be around I found out after our meeting.

I think they enjoy the friendships they make with the other boys they work with as they all seem to have close friends they work with. I'm sure the job has a lot of perks, such as what I have done before, taking a boy with me while traveling around Asia. In the end, my thinking is it is a job, that most enjoy, most of the time. My latest boyfriend was very willing and eagar to talk about his "work" and would say things along the lines of "Some Farang fun to be with, some Farang no talking, some fat, some skinny". He looked at it as a job, that I got the understanding he enjoyed.

[Gaybutton]

But also a bit difficult to try and answer.

It's not difficult for me to answer. With very few exceptions, most bar boys tell me they hate it.

[Guest RichLB]

It's not difficult for me to answer. With very few exceptions, most bar boys tell me they hate it.

Isn't the original question incomplete? A more reflective question would be how much do the boys like working in the bar instead of pulling rice, working construction, digging trenches for streets in the hot sun, etc. I'm not surprised that many young men newly out from Mama's wing find work abhorent. But when faced with the many available alternatives I think those that elect to work in the bars obviously prefer it.

[Guest shebavon]

Rich,

 

I think you hit it right. When you think of the long hours one has to work on farms, in hotels, restaurants, construction, etc... maybe 6000-8000 baht per month, it is not wonder many prefer the Go-Go, massage, or host functions.

 

Of course your success here is based on your sex appeal to different markets. What Japanese tourists on the whole find attractive (more tattoo the better, for instance), Americans may find, again on the whole, a turn-off (less or no tattoo preferred).

 

Generally your usefulness in this career is short, perhaps through 30, but if one is smart and can bank money, your outlook for later life may be more fortunate. I know quite a few bar workers who have used their earnings to improve the family farm, open businesses, an go to school. Others let the money go up in yaba, partying, gambling, and other excess.

 

A popular go-go or host worker can easily get offed 4 times a week, get residual on the bar fines and drinks, and earn about 12-16000 baht per month. In addition, will probably have regulars to increase this total. Only the drug trade would rival these earning prospects for these young folk.

 

Not bad for one with so little education nor other prospect.

[Guest MonkeySee]

It's not difficult for me to answer. With very few exceptions, most bar boys tell me they hate it.

Walk around Sunee or Boyztown and look at the clientele, and then ask yourself if you would like to go to bed with those clients. I don't blame the boys for saying they hate it, most people would. But like the previous posts say, it may be better than the alternatives.

[Gaybutton]

like the previous posts say, it may be better than the alternatives.

Of course it's better, but it still stinks. The boys I know don't view it as a good job. They view it as the lesser of the evils.

[Gaybutton]

A popular go-go or host worker can easily get offed 4 times a week, get residual on the bar fines and drinks, and earn about 12-16000 baht per month.

Whether popular or not, few boys seem to hold on to the money. As you said, most either squander it or send most if home to mama, who squanders it herself. For many of these boys, saving money is a totally alien concept. I've certainly seen plenty of times when no matter how much money the boy has today, by tomorrow it's gone . . . all of it.

 

The sending money home to mama thing is so deeply ingrained in so many of these boys, they're willing to live in what by our standards would be considered deplorable conditions, with little to do and even less money to spend doing it, so they can send as much money home to mama as they possibly can.

 

A very common problem a farang encounters when he makes one of these boys his boyfriend is the expectation that he will start taking care of the boy's family financial problems. Some farang are wealthy enough to do that without much difficulty, but if you're not so wealthy or not willing to do that, then you better set ground rules about it right at the outset of your relationship, before you fall into that trap. Once you start providing 'help' there's no end to it.

[Guest GaySacGuy]

It's not difficult for me to answer. With very few exceptions, most bar boys tell me they hate it.

 

I have to agree with GB on this one. I have had the opportunity to spend some time with all the boys from one bar in an offsite party. There were a couple who liked the bar, but most were just doing it to make the money and not work the farm.

 

They were all on the outlook for something better.

[Guest fountainhall]

Well, if it was lucrative I could tolerate the parading on stage in underwear part, but wouldn't like to go to bed with Farang 2x or 3x my age

 

I agree with this and most other comments posted so far. I cannot imagine how they can really enjoy it. Sure, there are some pluses - money, the camaraderie, chance to see the big cities, and perhaps some older guys who do treat them well etc. But I wonder what these boys feel once they quit the game. Do they look back with any sense of regret/disgust at some of the things they did/had to do? Or does Thai logic enable them to block that out and just look forward?

 

I pretty much qualify in the 3x category and do try to respect any reserve a boy may have once he's out of the bar. I just put myself in his place and know what I'd feel.

[Guest RichLB]

I pretty much qualify in the 3x category and do try to respect any reserve a boy may have once he's out of the bar. I just put myself in his place and know what I'd feel.

 

Perhaps I'm a callous clout, but I think that's the problem - you are not in their place and I doubt they feel the same way you would. It seems to me that in the West we have connected sex to romance, religion, homophobia, and all sorts of other things. In Thailand, I think it is more a recreational (or commercial) activity - sex is for fun (and/or profit). Sure, the guy would undoubtedly prefer coupling with someone who is more appealing to him, but being paid to have an orgasm isn't such a terrible thing. If you visit any of the gay saunas you might be surprised to see how many young Thai guys actively persue old, more than chubby, farang. No money is involved so it must be that they find something to appreciate in us that eludes me. I find that those who say they hate working in the bars actually just hate working.

 

[Guest Astrrro]

but wouldn't like to go to bed with Farang 2x or 3x my age.

 

Although there may be a few yogurt eating Ukrainians twice my age, there's no one on the planet 3X.

 

But to answer the question, I think it depends on the boy. For some, it's like going away to college, where you can hang out with like minded friends with no parents around.

 

And if you all of a sudden you find you're one of the more popular boys and making good bucks I suppose it can be fun.

 

But it must be agony for a straight boy to have to bottom, but i guess they can always refuse.

 

I think the primary long term problem is catching HIV.

 

I suspect most of the boys will not be scarred emotionally.

 

As far as drugs go, I know plenty of farangs who did lots of drugs in their youth yet turned out OK.

[Guest fountainhall]

Perhaps I'm a callous clout, but I think that's the problem - you are not in their place and I doubt they feel the same way you would

 

I actually agree with you. I think for most Asians, sex does not come with all the baggage that has been loaded on to it for centuries in western civilization. And for many it does not really mattter who they are with, especially if they are getting paid quite nicely for it. But I also think there are limits. Not every boy in a bar will particularly enjoy going out with someone old enough to be his grandfather. He'll tolerate it and do his best to give the punter a good time. But enjoy? After a while, I am sure it must get prettty mind-numbing.

[Guest shebavon]

But I wonder what these boys feel once they quit the game. Do they look back with any sense of regret/disgust at some of the things they did/had to do? Or does Thai logic enable them to block that out and just look forward?

 

It reminds me a story of a 30 something beach massage worker who had said to someone "My son, My son he do farang." Said in the tone of voice a mother in the states would reserve for My Son, the Doctor.

 

When asked how old his son was, the reply. "Almost 15".

 

Many parents are in favor of this career move.

[Guest shebavon]

If you visit any of the gay saunas you might be surprised to see how many young Thai guys actively persue old, more than chubby, farang. No money is involved so it must be that they find something to appreciate in us that eludes me.

 

 

A visit to Sansuk or Babylon supports this theory. Of course, I am a sexy guy.

 

At least that is what all the doormen tell me.

[Guest buckeroo2]

Of course it's better, but it still stinks. The boys I know don't view it as a good job. They view it as the lesser of the evils.

I exchange messages with a lot of guys on gayromeo. I always ask where in Thailand they come from and what work they do in Pattaya. I am always surprised by the high percentage of 18-25 yr old guys who tell me they do not work at the moment or that they are looking for work. I just take that to mean that they are free lancing. It seems to me that there is honest work to be had if they wanted a some sort of job. But I also wonder about the number of guys who choose to come to Pattaya and then decide to do free lance work rather than work in bar or massage parlor. I am not sure what that says about how they feel about working in a bar. Maybe there is a stigma attached to working as a bar boy that isn't attached to not having any job at all.

[Guest lvdkeyes]

Maybe there is a stigma attached to working as a bar boy that isn't attached to not having any job at all.

Yes, there is a stigma and if a guy is working freelance he has more freedom to refuse to go with anyone. A boy working as a go go must be at the bar at appointed time or he gets fined. He also has an expectation of how many times per month he is offed. Some prefer their freedom.

[Guest RichLB]

Yes, there is a stigma and if a guy is working freelance he has more freedom to refuse to go with anyone. A boy working as a go go must be at the bar at appointed time or he gets fined. He also has an expectation of how many times per month he is offed. Some prefer their freedom.

 

Well, if we're comparing a boy working in a go go bar as opposed to working freelance, that might be a different story. I think in most bars there IS an expectation the guy will actually show up - but isn't that true for any job. However, it is my understanding the boys are not required to go with any farang they do not wish to. Of course, if he doesn't he receives no tips; but he is not forced to go off or have sex with anyone. It is his choice. I actually has a friend who works in the bars and never goes off with a farang. He says he does quite well just milking tips by sitting with customers. He is a good friend and I think he's telling me the truth.

[Guest laurence]

One of the ex-gogo boys I know said the job was great when he was having many offs and getting good tips. When he first arrived in Pattaya he had no money and the go-go bar was a life saver. But as they get older and less desirable they look for a farang to "sponsor" them.

[KhorTose]

Well, if we're comparing a boy working in a go go bar as opposed to working freelance, that might be a different story. I think in most bars there IS an expectation the guy will actually show up - but isn't that true for any job. However, it is my understanding the boys are not required to go with any farang they do not wish to. Of course, if he doesn't he receives no tips; but he is not forced to go off or have sex with anyone. It is his choice. I actually has a friend who works in the bars and never goes off with a farang. He says he does quite well just milking tips by sitting with customers. He is a good friend and I think he's telling me the truth.

 

I know in my heart of hearts that it is kind of silly, but that is the main reason I seldom go into a go-go bar unless it is to see the show. In a host bar if the boy goes with me, I can rationalize that he could have said no if he wanted. Of course, he made need money really bad that night, etc., but someone it makes me feel a little less like I am exploiting him. Before a flame war starts, I know all of this is in my head. I will never judge anyone who likes go-go bars or call them exploitative. Please do not get me wrong, THIS IS NOT A JUDGMENT ON GO-GOS OR THE PEOPLE WHO FREQUENT THEM. It is just how one man's---this one man's---brain works.

[Gaybutton]

Before a flame war starts

There will be no flame war. Not on this board. If someone tries it, his post will quickly be gone and maybe so will he if he persists.

 

My experience tells me that while so many boys hate working in the bars, that has nothing to do with their willingness to go with farang. It's the bar work itself they dislike, but going with farang is the reason they put up with the bar work. The boys tell me going with farang is exactly what they want and working in the bars gives them the best opportunity to "have farang."

[Guest fountainhall]

The boys tell me going with farang is exactly what they want and working in the bars gives them the best opportunity to "have farang."

 

Interesting insight! I would never have thought that. Do you reckon this is "have" as in sex, "have" as in the tips, or "have" as in relationship? Or a mixture of the lot?

[Gaybutton]

Do you reckon this is "have" as in sex, "have" as in the tips, or "have" as in relationship? Or a mixture of the lot?

I take it to mean either a customer or a relationship, whether short term (as little as a few hours) or long term.

[Guest joseph44]

I take it to mean either a customer or a relationship, whether short term (as little as a few hours) or long term.

 

Isn't it a question that should be asked to everyone working in the 'industry', wherever?

Nobody likes to work as a prostitute, male or female, gay or straight, but money compensates most of the negative feelings that go along with the 'job'.

 

In whatever country (so not only in Thailand) people work in the 'industry' for the 'easy' money: to pay for their education, drugs, living, family, etc. In every country people can work in 'decent' jobs, but won't make enough to fullfill their needs.

 

Of course, not being gay and working in a gay bar makes things more complicated, but the money compensates a lot.