Democracy must end. Now. By any means necessary.

[stevenkesslar]

Michigan voters file federal lawsuit seeking to toss 1.2M ballots
Rudy Giuliani claims 650,000 votes were counted unlawfully in Philadelphia and Pittsburgh

Those headlines speak for themselves.  It is just surreal. 

Call me stupid.  But as much as I feel Trump has proven he is racist, deplorable, go through the whole list of negative adjectives, this is going way past where I thought he'd go.  If only because I really didn't think he was willing to hurt America this much.  Or, more important, destroy his own reputation further.  Both in the history books, and right now.  I have to assume he has some calculation in his mind that somehow this helps him in some way.  Even if it is with a post-White House career.  But it really makes no sense.  

Some partisan part of me is just hoping he does more of this.  The message could not be more clear.  This is supposed to be the least racist guy in America.  And now what they are saying is that the votes of Blacks in Detroit are not legal, and should just be thrown out.  The votes of White progressives in Philly or Pittsburgh are not legal, and should be thrown out.  It's the most outrageous claim I've ever heard in my lifetime in the US.  That hundreds of thousands of Democratic votes are unlawful.  And yet there is still not any proof.  I have to imagine that every headline like this just loses Trump and the Republicans more future votes. I guess losing by over 5 million votes wasn't enough.

It goes without saying, but I'll say it.  I'm assuming Trump will win by about 75,000 votes in North Carolina.  That's about half of Biden's winning margin in Michigan and maybe double Biden's final winning margin in Pennsylvania right now.  I'm quite sure Democratic lawyers could whip up a nice shit list of similarly baseless claims about White voters in North Carolina.  I don't have a clue why Democrats would WANT to do that, since it would alienate Whites in North Carolina.  Why would Democrats do that?

I also assume that right-of-center suburban Republicans who are just groaning right now could forget all this in 4 years and switch back to voting for a John Kasich.  IF the Republicans nominated someone like him in 2024.  I get the idea that maybe this is a play so that Trump or Trump, Jr. or Ivanka or maybe a Trumpy Nikki Haley/Ivanka Trump ticket are the Trump Party nominees in 2024.  It just seems to me like even if this helps you get 70 % of the shrinking Republican Party on your side, that's a losing proposition.  Both in 2020, and moreso in 2024.  Again, some partisan part of me is saying, go ahead Trumpians.  Burn the bitch down if you must.  If the goal is to drive out any remaining Kasich Republicans and consolidate control of the Republican Party for the Trumps, that's a winning ticket for Democrats.  If you didn't get that in 2020, we can do it again in 2022 and 2024.

Please.  Go ahead.  Make my decade.

This is where I'll keep repeating the excellent question Ron Brownstein is asking.  Do Republicans not think that Millennials have memories?  Do Republicans not think Blacks have memories?  If the exit polls are right, 60 % of Latinos in Michigan and Wisconsin and 70 % in Pennsylvania voted for Biden.  In the specific urban areas where Trump is saying the votes should be tossed out, it was probably more like 3 in 4 Hispanics, I'd guess.  Do you think those Latinos will forget this?

So what Republicans are teaching entire generations and races of Americans is that if we don't win, you don't count.  Your vote doesn't count.  Whatever small gains the Republicans made - and all the exit polls suggest they were small - with Blacks and Latinos, this wipes it out.  Telling them their vote does not count, because they somehow cheated, just wipes away any pretense of caring about them.  Or their votes.  Outside of the ones that are committed Trumpians, I can't see how this could possibly help with alienated suburban centrists, as well.  It will just alienate more of them.

I've posted endless dorky data over on Daddy's.  But I am going to do a brief summary here. I actually hope this stuff is debated.  Because the facts underscore how totally ignorant Trump is.  And that he is willing to tear down democratic norms based on completely baseless bullshit.  The data I will refer is not polling guesses.  This is based on actual vote totals in 2016 and 2020, based on current vote totals - which I think include like 99 % of all votes cast.

In Pennsylvania and Wisconsin, statewide voter turnout is up about 10 % from 2016 statewide.  In Michigan, it's close to 15 %.  For the most part, the urban parts of those states closely reflect the state trend.  In Milwaukee County, turnout is up 10 % - same percentage as all Wisconsin.  In Wayne County (Detroit) - turnout is up 15 %, just like in all of Michigan.  in both counties I just mentioned, Biden managed to boost Clinton's winning margin as well.  So, for example,  Clinton's win of 65.48 % in 2016 became Biden's win of 69.1 % in Milwaukee County.  Blacks and Berniecrat Whites and to a lesser degree Latinos (since they are not a huge population group there) ran up big vote totals for Biden in all three states.  So what happened in the urban areas Trump wants to focus on basically reflects very closely what happened in the entire state.  Turnout was up, across the board.

Second important point.  If you are decent at math, you will understand that Trump could have won all three states if he pulled off exactly the same thing in the predominantly White parts of the state he won in 2016.  But he did the opposite.  He lost vote share in predominantly White suburbs, as well as in some predominantly White working class areas like Erie County, Pennsylvania (88 % White).  So here's a specific example.  Biden's winning vote share in Wayne County. Michigan was 322,925 votes, compared to Hillary's 290,451 winning vote margin in 2016.  Meanwhile, Biden cut Trump's winning vote share in Macomb County, Michigan from 48,348 votes in 2016 to 38,974 votes in 2020 - even though turnout in Macomb County was up about 22 %, higher than the statewide increase.  Overall, Biden turned Hillary's roughly 10,000 vote loss into his roughly 150,000 vote win in Michigan.  

So do the math.  If we're talking about fraud in Michigan, you really have to go after how White voters (often in Republican areas) fraudulently tipped the vote to Biden.  That's where he ran up most of those 150,000 votes.  Trump needs to be talking about, and proving, White voter fraud.  Even if Biden implausibly had gotten 30,000 FEWER votes in Wayne County, he STILL would have won Michigan.  Because of White voters.  Trump can't say that.  In a state Biden won by 150,000 votes, the only mathematically tenable position he can take is literally to say just take all those Black votes in Detroit away.  They just don't count. 

How racist is that?

Thank you.  I thought so, too.

If there is some logic in Trump exposing himself to be the racist, erratic, ignorant, democracy-hating monster he has always been, I don't see it.

Third important point.  There were outliers.  I just mentioned one.  Turnout in Macomb County was up 22 %, which beat Michigan's 15 % overall increase.  In Dane County (Madison), White Berniecrats drove turnout up 17 %, much higher than the 10 % statewide increase.  So if we are looking for outliers were there were unusual vote totals, those places could make more sense.  Or you could just decide that educated voters in Dane and Macomb County were highly motivated to vote.  As I said above, Milwaukee and Detroit conformed almost exactly to the overall statewide increase in turnout.

Here's an outlier I can't figure out, other to say it is what it is.  In Philadelphia County, turnout was only up 1 %, compared to 10 % in Pennsylvania as a hole.  And for reasons social scientists or activists will have to figure out, Trump's winning vote share in Philadelphia actually INCREASED.  Since it undercuts any theory of fraud in Philadelphia, I'll spell out the details as of yesterday.  Clinton got 584,025 votes in Philadelphia County in 2016, which went DOWN to 573,785 for Biden in 2020.  Meanwhile, votes for Trump went from 108,748 in 2016 to 128, 123 in 2020.  Net impact:  Clinton's winning 2016 vote share of 475,277 in Philadelphia County was shaved to Biden's 445,662 vote share.  So if everything else in the state stayed exactly the same as 2016, Trump would have won Pennsylvania by 30,000 votes more than he did in 2016 - BECAUSE OF PHILADELPHIA.  If there was farud in Philadelphia, which I don't believe there was, the vote totals suggest it helped Trump.

Why did Biden win?  In Bucks County (suburbs), he boosted Hillary's victory of 2,699 votes in 2016 to his victory of 16,395 in 2020.  In Alleghany County (Pittsburgh), Clinton's winning margin of 108,317 votes in 2016 climbed to a 146,706 winning margin for Biden.  For whatever reason, in Pennsylvania Biden's win was irrefutably grounded in White voters in suburbs and working class areas like Erie County.  He actually had to make ground he lost in Philadelphia County.  (This may have something to do with slow vote counting.  But the vote seems likes it's mostly counted.  And turnout and votes for Biden in every other blue part of Pennsylvania - like Pittsburgh - did increase a lot.)

I have no explanation for why Philadelphia sticks out like a sore thumb, compared to all the other big cities in Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin.  But it does.  It actually looks like somehow Trump cheated to reduce the number of votes Biden got.  Basing an argument about fraud on the actual vote totals in Philadelphia makes this more a comedy than a tragedy.  It's absurd.  Trump has no proof.  And it makes no fucking sense.  Other than to prove Trump is an ignorant monster who feels winning is more important than democracy.

Ron Brownstein often comes back to the same question.  Do you think Millennials have no memories?  Do you think Gen Z has no memories?  Do you think Blacks have no memories?  Those groups in particular turned out in droves to fire Trump.  So if the message back is that your vote just doesn't count, I am with Brownstein.  They are teaching entire generations and races to view them as deplorable for the rest of their lives.

Republicans just paid a huge price for letting Trump degrade, corrupt, and pollute their party.  The verdict is out.  But I think the price they just paid may look like a small down payment of the full cost from the vantage point of history.

 

Edited November 13, 2020 by stevenkesslar

[Suckrates]

 

This should prove to Americans that Trump has NO interest in the needs of the people or serving them.  His goal is ultimate power for him and his grifter family and creating an American DICTATORSHIP....  It's outrageous that the fate of over 300 million people is in the hands of 1 person, that his party FEARS, and whose goal is to DESTROY them, and "fiddle while America burns"..    He is holding America HOSTAGE.....

At this point I THINK we need to invoke some sort of court marshall, and ARREST & Prosecute Trump for election crime.   It should be clear that this man is mentally UNSTABLE and a threat and detriment to America and its people.   FIND A WAY & LOCK HIM UP !    He can NOT be allowed to continue in a way that is destructive to America and its democratic process and values.   Whatever he is doing is is hindering the progress we need to make in combating Covid and restoring our economy.

HE LOST....that should be enough to take some action against him, regardless of what history and the LAW dictates ?    HE has never followed the law in the 4 years of his Presidency....  WE MUST DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS !!!!!!!!   

 

Edited November 13, 2020 by Suckrates

[RockHardNYC]

7 hours ago, stevenkesslar said:

But as much as I feel Trump has proven he is racist, deplorable, go through the whole list of negative adjectives, this is going way past where I thought he'd go.  If only because I really didn't think he was willing to hurt America this much.  Or, more important, destroy his own reputation further.

Reputation? Really Steven? Where have you been?

Most people in NYC who have worked with Trump know he is bat-shit crazy. Several close ex-Trumpers have stated publicly that the man has long been unstable. It's very easy to read between the lines of ex-Cabinet members, who are not mincing words, even in public.

Never forget that Trump was mentored by Roy Cohn, one of the most devious and despicable lawyers to ever walk the face of the earth. A self-hating Jewish FAG who built a solid career running from or distorting "truth." Cohn firmly believed that all bad publicity could be manipulated and made "good." I believe he coined the term "spin."

On top of that, Trump is pathological, with serious family issues. He is a serial narcissist. In his mind, nothing survives but Trump. The Trump mind is going to be studied by the therapy industry for a very long time.

General Barry McCaffrey, among others, are very worried about the damage Trump can do in the next 60+ days. Others don't believe Trump will be permitted to go too far. Our system has guard rails and bi-partisan people in leadership positions who are watching with care. No one that I've seen believes the military would ever follow Trump into HELL.

No matter what Trump does, he's built a formidable cult following. With nearly 70 million votes, the highest in history, during a pandemic, with the worst publicity for a sitting president imaginable, Trump has proven he can kill someone on 5th Avenue and get away with it. Bring down a Democracy? No big deal as long as the media keeps printing my NAME (and shitting bricks "live" on camera).

Now that LOSER status is knocking on Trump's door, Trump is expected to behave like a caged animal. How long people in the Cabinet and Congress tolerate his mania remains to be seen.

The country is being tested, and, unfortunately, we're all spectators in this reality shit-show, whether we like it or not.

[Suckrates]

 

Apparently our country has NO Democracy because it has TRUMP !!!!

How long will it take for this deranged orangutan to get over his "temper tantrum" and stop throwing his feces at Americans, OR how long will WE tolerate it ?  

[RockHardNYC]

14 hours ago, stevenkesslar said:

Why did Biden win?  In Bucks County...

I agree, the post election analysis on Pennsylvania is fascinating. I don't think of any of the analysis in "fraud" terms. Anyone with half a brain has to ask, "How did the Democrats win the White House but fail to steal the Senate?" Trump's fraud spin is limper than my overly-heavy cock and low hangers. Furthermore, too many state Republican election leaders, especially those who experienced down-ballot gains, have gone on-record completely debunking the fraud spin. When you have 80% of voters believing that Biden won the election, it makes Trump's insecure, tiny, inverted penis look even smaller and more mushroom-capped. Have I painted a pretty picture yet?

You may have already seen it, Steven, but I encourage everyone to watch The Lincoln Project's post election analysis. When it comes to numbers, I would hire Mike Madrid in a minute. There are several post election "Breakdowns." I also recommend listening to the video where Vice Dean Franita Tolson speaks.

14 hours ago, stevenkesslar said:

Ron Brownstein often comes back to the same question.  Do you think Millennials have no memories?  Do you think Gen Z has no memories?  Do you think Blacks have no memories?  Those groups in particular turned out in droves to fire Trump.

But how reliable are they moving forward in this god-awful, narcissistic culture we live in? The famous Obama coalition failed Obama in the mid-terms. I never thought I would see such quick, youthful abandonment of Barack Obama so fast after that amazing, historical election night win. Let's face it, we're old enough to know the attention span of young folk. After a couple of sucks, their legs lift to the ceiling, begging to be fucked. No one seems to have patience for romance and foreplay anymore. Too many throw away the innocence of natural joy and pleasure so quickly. Canceled. With their faces stuck in an i-Phone.

Obama claims in his new memoir that he has faith in the newer generations. I trust on this subject he knows more than I know. I want very much to believe him. In my life, actions speak louder than words.

[RockHardNYC]

Now that Biden has taken Georgia, for a total 306 electoral votes, watch the Trump train come to a slow halt. In the latest legal defeat, a Michigan judge rejected the request to halt vote certifications.

The Republicans can demand recounts all they like, and they can pay for them, but it doesn't look like any substantive changes will be forthcoming. The numbers just aren't close enough to cause anyone concern.

"The November 3rd election was the most secure in American history. Right now, across the country, election officials are reviewing and double checking the entire election process prior to finalizing the result," the Election Infrastructure Government Coordinating Council and the Election Infrastructure Sector Coordinating Executive Committees said.

Trump's obnoxious, insecure, childish behavior is remarkably sad for a 74-year-old asshole millionaire. The longer he takes to concede or acknowledge his defeat, the more petty and small he looks. IMO, if he truly believes there's no such thing as bad publicity, then let him keep up his insane behavior and continue to bury his brand in slime and disgrace. I don't see any of his sycophant voters buying memberships at Mar-a-Lago.

And if Trump thinks he wants to compete with the Murdoch assholes, then let's see how that funding, talent, and executive search goes. Maybe Trump can ask Oprah how easy it is to build a successful network.

[TotallyOz]

4 hours ago, RockHardNYC said:

Now that Biden has taken Georgia, for a total 306 electoral votes, watch the Trump train come to a slow halt. In the latest legal defeat, a Michigan judge rejected the request to halt vote certifications.

Really? You may be right. But, I fear that is not the case. He will go kicking and screaming.

[RockHardNYC]

This video is four days old now, but it's a worthwhile, intelligent discussion about the state of things. I have always loved working with Katie Couric, and she's no slouch here with good questions. Her only guest is former Acting Solicitor General for the Obama Administration, Neal Katyal, whom I also adore.

 

[TotallyOz]

I have always enjoyed hearing both Katie and Neal and this was worth the time. Thanks.

[JKane]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[stevenkesslar]

On 11/12/2020 at 8:05 PM, stevenkesslar said:

But as much as I feel Trump has proven he is racist, deplorable, go through the whole list of negative adjectives, this is going way past where I thought he'd go.  If only because I really didn't think he was willing to hurt America this much.  Or, more important, destroy his own reputation further. 

 

On 11/13/2020 at 4:32 AM, RockHardNYC said:

Reputation? Really Steven? Where have you been?

Quiet honestly, Toto and I have been in Kansas.  I guess it distorts my perception of reality.

I did get racist and deplorable right, at least.

I should clean up something I said above about the Philadelphia riddle.

Here's what i said above.  In Milwaukee and Wayne County, turnout was up about 10 percent to 15 percent, respectively - roughly the same as all of Wisconsin and Michigan.  In Pennsylvania it was also up 10 percent.  But in Philadelphia County it was flat.  In addition, Biden's actual votes in Philadelphia County went very slightly down from Hillary 2016.  He still clobbered Trump.  But Trump got about 20,000 more votes.  So my assumption was that Blacks in Milwaukee and Detroit turned out in a way Blacks in Philadelphia didn't.

What I didn't know, being from Kansas and what not, is that Philadelphia county is the City of Philadelphia, whereas Milwaukee and Detroit are roughly half of Milwaukee and Wayne Counties.  The initial stuff I've read suggests that Black turnout in all three cities may have been more or less flat.  That's based on some initial reports about predominantly Black precincts.  Where Biden increased votes, what I've been reading suggests it was in White liberal parts of those cities.  Since Milwaukee and Wayne Counties stretch into the suburbs, it may have also been White suburban voters as well.  It's 100 % clear that Biden outperformed Hillary with suburban Whites, particularly suburban White males.

The same stories cite local Black leaders saying they've been ringing alarms all Fall.  Unlike Florida Latinos, it wasn't primarily about people of color voting for Trump.  It was about Blacks not voting at all.  Especially young Blacks, and even more so young Black males.

I think it's clear that the biggest mistake Democrats made is assuming what happened in 2018 was sustainable.  In 2018 Democratic turnout was off the charts, whereas Republican turnout was normal.  So in 2020 it was off the charts on both sides.  No surprise, some right-of-center House seats that have voted Republican for decades in some cases proved hard to defend.  We should have built the whole House campaign around that.  We got giddy.  And it may have cost us a handful of House seats we could have saved.  But there was no way to stop the Trump red wave.

That said, I think Republicans are in the same position Democrats were coming off 2018.  I think what they just did is probably even more unsustainable than what Democrats did in 2018.  History may view this as the last glorious stand of a certain part of older America that thinks of itself as "the Trump Party".  I'll be broken record on this.  They spent four years and $1 billion and knocked on 1 million doors a week to win one election on one day.  They also had the national bully pulpit of Trump framing their message every day.  And they still lost.  And it's anybody's bet whether these 10 million "low engagement" Trump Party voters who appeared out of nowhere in 2020 will vote again in 2022 or 2024.

Once the dust settles, we'll probably learn Biden won in large part on a fragile base of suburban voters who he may or may not be able to consolidate in 2022 and 2024.  If he underperformed with Blacks and Latinos, more because of lack of turnout efforts than because they voted for Trump, that actually gives us a way to pad margins if some of those suburban votes go away.  It will not help in state legislative races.  The problem there is there's a big Red Wall between the suburbs and the ex-urbs Democrats failed to breach.  But it would help win Senate seats that will be up for grabs in 2022 in Wisconsin and Pennsylvania. 

For Democrats, the mantra for the next two years has to be turnout, turnout, turnout.

 

[stevenkesslar]

On 11/14/2020 at 9:12 AM, JKane said:

 

 

 

 

The real tragedy is that The Divine Miss Graham was wrong.  It did not destroy them.  Not yet.   Trump destroyed lots of things.  But his party was not one of them.

That said, I think the "Trump Party" is the gift that will keep on giving.  I wasn't sure how to feel about the Lincoln Party types before the election.  And I don't think a lot of Republicans, including Graham, were sure how to feel.

Now it's clear.  The Lincoln Party was saying that the Trump Party will shrink and become angrier as their power diminishes.  I now believe that.  And Graham and pretty much everybody else are stuck with The Trump Party and their crappy messages.  Maybe that helps them stage a comeback.  But I doubt it.  If only 70 % of Republicans believe Trump's bullshit about a stolen election, that doesn't sound like addition to me.  That sounds like subtraction.

Meanwhile, I can't imagine contempt for democracy and fact and science will help Trump with the growing segment of voters under 50, and especially those under 30, who lean to the left.

Edited November 18, 2020 by stevenkesslar

[Suckrates]

9 hours ago, stevenkesslar said:

The real tragedy is that The Divine Miss Graham was wrong.  It did not destroy them.  Not yet.   Trump destroyed lots of things.  But his party was not one of them.

That said, I think the "Trump Party" is the gift that will keep on giving.  I wasn't sure how to feel about the Lincoln Party types before the election.  And I don't think a lot of Republicans, including Graham, were sure how to feel.

Now it's clear.  The Lincoln Party was saying that the Trump Party will shrink and become angrier as their power diminishes.  I now believe that.  And Graham and pretty much everybody else are stuck with The Trump Party and their crappy messages.  Maybe that helps them stage a comeback.  But I doubt it.  If only 70 % of Republicans believe Trump's bullshit about a stolen election, that doesn't sound like addition to me.  That sounds like subtraction.

Meanwhile, I can't imagine contempt for democracy and fact and science will help Trump with the growing segment of voters under 50, and especially those under 30, who lean to the left.

 

Yes. but the Obstacle that remains is the 73+million voters that are supporting Trump, almost HALF the countrys voters that has to be overcome.   That isnt an easy task as Trump continues to make them more and more "disgruntled".....   Miss Lindsey is an opportunist.  I am SURE that once Trump is physically out of office, Missy will see the light and revert back to her former diminutive self and find another sweet, brown bootyhole to thrust her tongue into ?    Oh, Miss Lindsey !

Edited November 18, 2020 by Suckrates

[Pete1111]

Is this going to be their next Benghazi or their next Birther conspiracy?

Fucking Republicans.  Seriously.  

 

 

....and now, something funny.

 

 

 

[Pete1111]

On 11/17/2020 at 6:52 PM, stevenkesslar said:

 

Quiet honestly, Toto and I have been in Kansas.  I guess it distorts my perception of reality.

I did get racist and deplorable right, at least.

I should clean up something I said above about the Philadelphia riddle.

Here's what i said above.  In Milwaukee and Wayne County, turnout was up about 10 percent to 15 percent, respectively - roughly the same as all of Wisconsin and Michigan.  In Pennsylvania it was also up 10 percent.  But in Philadelphia County it was flat.  In addition, Biden's actual votes in Philadelphia County went very slightly down from Hillary 2016.  He still clobbered Trump.  But Trump got about 20,000 more votes.  So my assumption was that Blacks in Milwaukee and Detroit turned out in a way Blacks in Philadelphia didn't.

What I didn't know, being from Kansas and what not, is that Philadelphia county is the City of Philadelphia, whereas Milwaukee and Detroit are roughly half of Milwaukee and Wayne Counties.  The initial stuff I've read suggests that Black turnout in all three cities may have been more or less flat.  That's based on some initial reports about predominantly Black precincts.  Where Biden increased votes, what I've been reading suggests it was in White liberal parts of those cities.  Since Milwaukee and Wayne Counties stretch into the suburbs, it may have also been White suburban voters as well.  It's 100 % clear that Biden outperformed Hillary with suburban Whites, particularly suburban White males.

The same stories cite local Black leaders saying they've been ringing alarms all Fall.  Unlike Florida Latinos, it wasn't primarily about people of color voting for Trump.  It was about Blacks not voting at all.  Especially young Blacks, and even more so young Black males.

I think it's clear that the biggest mistake Democrats made is assuming what happened in 2018 was sustainable.  In 2018 Democratic turnout was off the charts, whereas Republican turnout was normal.  So in 2020 it was off the charts on both sides.  No surprise, some right-of-center House seats that have voted Republican for decades in some cases proved hard to defend.  We should have built the whole House campaign around that.  We got giddy.  And it may have cost us a handful of House seats we could have saved.  But there was no way to stop the Trump red wave.

That said, I think Republicans are in the same position Democrats were coming off 2018.  I think what they just did is probably even more unsustainable than what Democrats did in 2018.  History may view this as the last glorious stand of a certain part of older America that thinks of itself as "the Trump Party".  I'll be broken record on this.  They spent four years and $1 billion and knocked on 1 million doors a week to win one election on one day.  They also had the national bully pulpit of Trump framing their message every day.  And they still lost.  And it's anybody's bet whether these 10 million "low engagement" Trump Party voters who appeared out of nowhere in 2020 will vote again in 2022 or 2024.

Once the dust settles, we'll probably learn Biden won in large part on a fragile base of suburban voters who he may or may not be able to consolidate in 2022 and 2024.  If he underperformed with Blacks and Latinos, more because of lack of turnout efforts than because they voted for Trump, that actually gives us a way to pad margins if some of those suburban votes go away.  It will not help in state legislative races.  The problem there is there's a big Red Wall between the suburbs and the ex-urbs Democrats failed to breach.  But it would help win Senate seats that will be up for grabs in 2022 in Wisconsin and Pennsylvania. 

For Democrats, the mantra for the next two years has to be turnout, turnout, turnout.

 

Stacy Abrams' initiative in Georgia got enough new voters registered to put Biden on top there.  Will the Democrats take that model nationwide, and perhaps promote Abrams to help?  Doubt it.

The Dems thought having Eva Longoria at their convention was sufficient to win Latino vote.

The Dems have a knack for not understanding winning strategy.  Maybe it's from maintaining the worldview of too many old straight white guys, still affecting decisions.

[JKane]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Suckrates]

 

It is absolute LUNACY that one man has captivated, and is being allowed to hold an entire country, over 300 million TAX paying people HOSTAGE...  Any many of these people are being allowed to DIE because the Covid crisis is being stonewalled by Trump and his administration.   

Our government should not allow this.  Trump is not even a politician.  He's a criminal and con man.  How can this be happening ?

This scumbag needs to be dragged away in handcuffs kicking and screaming "but I WON" !!!!!!

It does not seem we are living in Democratic America... it seems more like Communist Russia.  

[JKane]

 

 

 

 

--Also, he only pardoned the white meat...

[Adam4muscle]

On 11/12/2020 at 11:05 PM, stevenkesslar said:

Michigan voters file federal lawsuit seeking to toss 1.2M ballots
Rudy Giuliani claims 650,000 votes were counted unlawfully in Philadelphia and Pittsburgh

Those headlines speak for themselves.  It is just surreal. 

Call me stupid.  But as much as I feel Trump has proven he is racist, deplorable, go through the whole list of negative adjectives, this is going way past where I thought he'd go.  If only because I really didn't think he was willing to hurt America this much.  Or, more important, destroy his own reputation further.  Both in the history books, and right now.  I have to assume he has some calculation in his mind that somehow this helps him in some way.  Even if it is with a post-White House career.  But it really makes no sense.  

Some partisan part of me is just hoping he does more of this.  The message could not be more clear.  This is supposed to be the least racist guy in America.  And now what they are saying is that the votes of Blacks in Detroit are not legal, and should just be thrown out.  The votes of White progressives in Philly or Pittsburgh are not legal, and should be thrown out.  It's the most outrageous claim I've ever heard in my lifetime in the US.  That hundreds of thousands of Democratic votes are unlawful.  And yet there is still not any proof.  I have to imagine that every headline like this just loses Trump and the Republicans more future votes. I guess losing by over 5 million votes wasn't enough.

It goes without saying, but I'll say it.  I'm assuming Trump will win by about 75,000 votes in North Carolina.  That's about half of Biden's winning margin in Michigan and maybe double Biden's final winning margin in Pennsylvania right now.  I'm quite sure Democratic lawyers could whip up a nice shit list of similarly baseless claims about White voters in North Carolina.  I don't have a clue why Democrats would WANT to do that, since it would alienate Whites in North Carolina.  Why would Democrats do that?

I also assume that right-of-center suburban Republicans who are just groaning right now could forget all this in 4 years and switch back to voting for a John Kasich.  IF the Republicans nominated someone like him in 2024.  I get the idea that maybe this is a play so that Trump or Trump, Jr. or Ivanka or maybe a Trumpy Nikki Haley/Ivanka Trump ticket are the Trump Party nominees in 2024.  It just seems to me like even if this helps you get 70 % of the shrinking Republican Party on your side, that's a losing proposition.  Both in 2020, and moreso in 2024.  Again, some partisan part of me is saying, go ahead Trumpians.  Burn the bitch down if you must.  If the goal is to drive out any remaining Kasich Republicans and consolidate control of the Republican Party for the Trumps, that's a winning ticket for Democrats.  If you didn't get that in 2020, we can do it again in 2022 and 2024.

Please.  Go ahead.  Make my decade.

This is where I'll keep repeating the excellent question Ron Brownstein is asking.  Do Republicans not think that Millennials have memories?  Do Republicans not think Blacks have memories?  If the exit polls are right, 60 % of Latinos in Michigan and Wisconsin and 70 % in Pennsylvania voted for Biden.  In the specific urban areas where Trump is saying the votes should be tossed out, it was probably more like 3 in 4 Hispanics, I'd guess.  Do you think those Latinos will forget this?

So what Republicans are teaching entire generations and races of Americans is that if we don't win, you don't count.  Your vote doesn't count.  Whatever small gains the Republicans made - and all the exit polls suggest they were small - with Blacks and Latinos, this wipes it out.  Telling them their vote does not count, because they somehow cheated, just wipes away any pretense of caring about them.  Or their votes.  Outside of the ones that are committed Trumpians, I can't see how this could possibly help with alienated suburban centrists, as well.  It will just alienate more of them.

I've posted endless dorky data over on Daddy's.  But I am going to do a brief summary here. I actually hope this stuff is debated.  Because the facts underscore how totally ignorant Trump is.  And that he is willing to tear down democratic norms based on completely baseless bullshit.  The data I will refer is not polling guesses.  This is based on actual vote totals in 2016 and 2020, based on current vote totals - which I think include like 99 % of all votes cast.

In Pennsylvania and Wisconsin, statewide voter turnout is up about 10 % from 2016 statewide.  In Michigan, it's close to 15 %.  For the most part, the urban parts of those states closely reflect the state trend.  In Milwaukee County, turnout is up 10 % - same percentage as all Wisconsin.  In Wayne County (Detroit) - turnout is up 15 %, just like in all of Michigan.  in both counties I just mentioned, Biden managed to boost Clinton's winning margin as well.  So, for example,  Clinton's win of 65.48 % in 2016 became Biden's win of 69.1 % in Milwaukee County.  Blacks and Berniecrat Whites and to a lesser degree Latinos (since they are not a huge population group there) ran up big vote totals for Biden in all three states.  So what happened in the urban areas Trump wants to focus on basically reflects very closely what happened in the entire state.  Turnout was up, across the board.

Second important point.  If you are decent at math, you will understand that Trump could have won all three states if he pulled off exactly the same thing in the predominantly White parts of the state he won in 2016.  But he did the opposite.  He lost vote share in predominantly White suburbs, as well as in some predominantly White working class areas like Erie County, Pennsylvania (88 % White).  So here's a specific example.  Biden's winning vote share in Wayne County. Michigan was 322,925 votes, compared to Hillary's 290,451 winning vote margin in 2016.  Meanwhile, Biden cut Trump's winning vote share in Macomb County, Michigan from 48,348 votes in 2016 to 38,974 votes in 2020 - even though turnout in Macomb County was up about 22 %, higher than the statewide increase.  Overall, Biden turned Hillary's roughly 10,000 vote loss into his roughly 150,000 vote win in Michigan.  

So do the math.  If we're talking about fraud in Michigan, you really have to go after how White voters (often in Republican areas) fraudulently tipped the vote to Biden.  That's where he ran up most of those 150,000 votes.  Trump needs to be talking about, and proving, White voter fraud.  Even if Biden implausibly had gotten 30,000 FEWER votes in Wayne County, he STILL would have won Michigan.  Because of White voters.  Trump can't say that.  In a state Biden won by 150,000 votes, the only mathematically tenable position he can take is literally to say just take all those Black votes in Detroit away.  They just don't count. 

How racist is that?

Thank you.  I thought so, too.

If there is some logic in Trump exposing himself to be the racist, erratic, ignorant, democracy-hating monster he has always been, I don't see it.

Third important point.  There were outliers.  I just mentioned one.  Turnout in Macomb County was up 22 %, which beat Michigan's 15 % overall increase.  In Dane County (Madison), White Berniecrats drove turnout up 17 %, much higher than the 10 % statewide increase.  So if we are looking for outliers were there were unusual vote totals, those places could make more sense.  Or you could just decide that educated voters in Dane and Macomb County were highly motivated to vote.  As I said above, Milwaukee and Detroit conformed almost exactly to the overall statewide increase in turnout.

Here's an outlier I can't figure out, other to say it is what it is.  In Philadelphia County, turnout was only up 1 %, compared to 10 % in Pennsylvania as a hole.  And for reasons social scientists or activists will have to figure out, Trump's winning vote share in Philadelphia actually INCREASED.  Since it undercuts any theory of fraud in Philadelphia, I'll spell out the details as of yesterday.  Clinton got 584,025 votes in Philadelphia County in 2016, which went DOWN to 573,785 for Biden in 2020.  Meanwhile, votes for Trump went from 108,748 in 2016 to 128, 123 in 2020.  Net impact:  Clinton's winning 2016 vote share of 475,277 in Philadelphia County was shaved to Biden's 445,662 vote share.  So if everything else in the state stayed exactly the same as 2016, Trump would have won Pennsylvania by 30,000 votes more than he did in 2016 - BECAUSE OF PHILADELPHIA.  If there was farud in Philadelphia, which I don't believe there was, the vote totals suggest it helped Trump.

Why did Biden win?  In Bucks County (suburbs), he boosted Hillary's victory of 2,699 votes in 2016 to his victory of 16,395 in 2020.  In Alleghany County (Pittsburgh), Clinton's winning margin of 108,317 votes in 2016 climbed to a 146,706 winning margin for Biden.  For whatever reason, in Pennsylvania Biden's win was irrefutably grounded in White voters in suburbs and working class areas like Erie County.  He actually had to make ground he lost in Philadelphia County.  (This may have something to do with slow vote counting.  But the vote seems likes it's mostly counted.  And turnout and votes for Biden in every other blue part of Pennsylvania - like Pittsburgh - did increase a lot.)

I have no explanation for why Philadelphia sticks out like a sore thumb, compared to all the other big cities in Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin.  But it does.  It actually looks like somehow Trump cheated to reduce the number of votes Biden got.  Basing an argument about fraud on the actual vote totals in Philadelphia makes this more a comedy than a tragedy.  It's absurd.  Trump has no proof.  And it makes no fucking sense.  Other than to prove Trump is an ignorant monster who feels winning is more important than democracy.

Ron Brownstein often comes back to the same question.  Do you think Millennials have no memories?  Do you think Gen Z has no memories?  Do you think Blacks have no memories?  Those groups in particular turned out in droves to fire Trump.  So if the message back is that your vote just doesn't count, I am with Brownstein.  They are teaching entire generations and races to view them as deplorable for the rest of their lives.

Republicans just paid a huge price for letting Trump degrade, corrupt, and pollute their party.  The verdict is out.  But I think the price they just paid may look like a small down payment of the full cost from the vantage point of history.

 

Hi Steven,

Before I begin, I'd like to wish you a Happy Thanksgiving and please ask you to consider having a civil conversation and not to just respond to me with negative labels and epithets.  We're both part of the gay community that at one time prided itself on diversity & equality & valuing each other's differences in making up all the colors of the rainbow.

It's important to remember that before I say anything more. 

 

 It's not acceptable nor realistic to say we want to be accepted by society at large for our diversity and for being different and then watch as members of our own community start subscribing to a communist way of thinking - expecting and tacitly requiring that diversity and differences are only to be accepted & embraced provided that everyone in the community subscribe to a rigid monolithic definition of what differences and diversity are acceptable to the "progressives", when in fact the hatred and exclusion your side is exhibiting is no different (and in my mind actually worse) than what we've worked so hard to "overcome" in society for being gay - only to have it come back in an even more authoritarian and dangerous manner from members of our own community.

Please think about what I've said, and please don't rush to respond to convince me that you're "right".  I ask you to breathe, pause and just think about what I'm saying and take some time to reflect before you respond.  Waiting a bit won't change anything and may actually help the situation.

The way that true progress occurs in society is one person speaking to another person a day at a time.  Where each person doesn't see the other person or the other side as their "enemy" but rather another human being with a different perspective and only by understanding that and having both parties being willing to listen and speak to other in a civil manner without dismissing the other person or the other side or reverting to unnecessary and untrue labels that immediately shut down any chance at dialogue and progress, nothing constructive can be achieved.

Ok...that said...

I ask that you suspend your perspective for just a moment and ask yourself - is it possible that I'm not accurately describing the situation of what's currently happening or could there be another possible explanation for why I'm seeing things currently as I am -- and is it possible its clouding my ability to see things from another or possibly a more accurate perspective of what's going on?

With that in mind, I ask if you've ever heard of or read about Saul Alinsky and his teachings and his objectives for US Society?  Or who some of his most fervent followers have been?   If not, I encourage you to take some time on Thanksgiving day to turn off social media and the TV and just read about him and his absolutely diabolical impacts on our US society and culture as it exists today.   I think you're going to be very surprised with what you read.

in short and without knowing it,  what you are promoting and reciting in your posts are actually the words of and the desired goals of Saul Alinsky - to take the US from a Democracy to an autocratic totalitarian communist society by creating chaos in society - dividing us along all sorts of racial and 'identity politics' label categories - so that the end effect is hatred, divisiveness and suspicion of our fellow American - no longer seeing them as fundamentally the same as  us with different viewpoints & lifestyles - and replacing that view with fellow Americans we don't agree with as "subhuman", our "existential enemy" and a "dangerous scourge that must be removed from society".

Not only was this the view of the Stalinist/Marxist Regimes during the Bolshevik Revolution in the Soviet Union -- which led to a dangerous, oppressive, autocratic totalitarian communist regime which worked to wipe out "enemies of the state" for having differing viewpoints,  shutting down freedom of speech, censoring the masses from all opposing views that were not "sanctioned by the state", and posed an existential threat to the world during most of the 20th century particularly as their stockpile of nuclear weapons proliferated -- but also reflects the same way the Nazis viewed both the Jews in Europe and the Bolsheviks in Russia to the East as these same things - "subhuman" "existential enemies of the German people" and a "dangerous scourge to German society" which Hitler worked to eradicate from the face of the earth by slaughtering more than 6 million Jews as part of the Nazi's "Final Solution".

When WWII ended - the world said it couldn't and wouldn't ever happen again.  And yet, in 2020, we seem to be right back where we were in the 20 or so years leading up to WWII where the same dynamics are taking hold - but unfortunately not in Nazi Germany or in Communist Russia, but in the United States of America.

So before you say that it's not possible or not the same, I implore you to read over what you've wrote and to think about it seriously.  Because while I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt that you didn't know about it,  you are reciting the exact extremely dangerous, divisive and explosive rhetoric that Karl Marx, Joseph Stalin, Adolf Hitler and Saul Alinsky have embraced and conveyed to the world in their words and in their actions.

Saul Alinsky, in particular, being the most recent and most relevant to the US and current times - not only because he was an American from Chicago, but also because 2 of his most staunchest followers were none other than Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton.  YOU MUST READ ABOUT THAT AND INFORM YOURSELF BECAUSE ITS SO DEADLY WHAT YOU'RE PROMOTING - particularly because you are part of a minority group like me, and yet you are reciting a philosophy of regimes that worked themselves to eradicate "our kind", and without knowing it, you're playing right into Saul Alinksy's playbook of serving as a "useful idiot" (his words not mine) to do the bidding and serve the needs of the state "cause" to destroy democracy, dehumanize & eradicate those we don't agree with, and worst of all...and again I'm assuming unbeknownst to you...

...use the untrue state propoganda talking points which have been brainwashed into your head and yet are simply not true.

DT is the opposite of what you claim him to be.  This is not about him or JB.  It's about our country and the future of our democracy and constitutional republic which cannot exist if there we cannot have complete and unwavering confidence in our election system.  And the fact is we don't.  In 2020, we witnessed the most blatant and flagrant and criminal forms of election and voter fraud in American history.  It's been perpetrated on all of us - YOU AND ME - by the dangerous forces at work to institute the vision of Saul Alinksy and his disciples to create a Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State with complete control of the masses from the top - removing all of our civil rights, personal freedoms and fundamentals of American society that have served us well for 245 years.

What you have laid out in your emails are nothing more than the talking points that have been drilled into your head by the State through their governmentally-controlled media - over and over and over again.  THOSE TALKING POINTS ARE SIMPLY NOT TRUE.   It's a well known tactic of Saul Alinsky and his "Rules for Radicals" as well as what exactly was done in George Orwell's 1984 (which I encourage you to re-read).  In 1984, the State had "loud speakers" set up everywhere so that state propoganda was consistently drilled into people's heads over and over and over again.    And by doing so,  the masses were slowly brainwashed into believing that the lies drilled into their heads were true.  When in fact, they weren't - they were still lies - but the masses had become so brainwashed they didn't know any better and came to not only believe the lies as truth - but then to use the lies as their own talking points to do the bidding of the state as "useful idiots".

If you don't believe me, please read this from the BBC - a well-known leftist global news outlet - talking about such dangerous propoganda used by the Nazis, etc. 

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20161026-how-liars-create-the-illusion-of-truth

And is also the charter of Alinsky, Obama, Clinton, etc - to get the "useful idiots" of society to first be brainwashed by their propoganda to achieve control over the masses.  And then once theve been brainwashed into believing the lies as gospel - and to also see others in society with opposing views as existential enemies and subhuman - they have then manipulated them into doing the bidding of the state for the leaders and also serving as "useful idiots".

My friend, this has happened to you.  Everything that the left has spewed, you have subscribed as fact, when in fact its not.  Everything that they have accused the other side of doing has actually turned out to be nothing more than projections to the other side of the very things they were doing themselves!  It's also a well known tactic of Alinsky.  Project on to your enemy the exact things you're doing and keep the pressure up and keep them off balance while you continue all the things you accuse your enemy of.  Examples:

1.  Russia  Russia Russia - turned out to be a hoax - concerned about other countries interfering in our elections in 2016.  Said it was a huge threat.  Was made up and supported by Big Media and Big Tech and the Deep State.  Fast forward to 2020 - the most secure election we've ever had (according to deep state leftist operatives - since been fired) - it wasn't.  The worst election and voter fraud in American History.  The left clearly working with foreign governments both on the "Russia Gate" hoax and now in 2020 with Venezuela, Cuba, China, Spain and Germany, (the ones we know for sure at this time) who conspired and did interfere in our 2020 election and up til now stole the election from the AMERICAN PEOPLE (this is not about one man - its the future of this country).

2.  JB said that (and Hillary supported) in the first debate he would not concede if he lost and he not accept the outcome of the election until all the votes were counted and all constitutionally protected challenges were explored.  DT is within his constitutional authority during this time to explore and challenge all instances of vote tampering, election fraud and voter fraud (just as JB said he would do and Hillary encouraged if he "lost" (which he did). More to follow.

a.  The media doesn't have the constitutional authority to call an election.

b.  The state operatives - even those who claim to be objective and have the power to certify the vote in a given state-- do not have the constitutional authority to do so (which can be explored and litigated for remedy in the legal court system up to the Supreme Court) if there is evidence of them not serving the people of their state by abusing their position of power and trust by either being corrupt themselves or turning a blind eye to corruption because they've been paid off or their families have been paid off.   Or, that they failed to follow the constitutional requirements for Presidential elections in their states by usurping the power and authority from the State Legislature to make election-related decisions - which rest solely with the state legislatures - not with the Governor through Executive Order, not with the Secretary of State in a given state and not with the Election Commission.

You will see this is the case in Pennsylvania, Georgia, Michigan, Wisconsin, Arizona and Nevada.    Constitutional election laws were thrown out in specific states to serve a partisan agenda, state officials were paid off, the system as a whole was corrupted by outside foreign governments and powerful people with big money, and there was widespread election and voter fraud as a result.

When most Americans went to bed at 2am on Election night (which was now November 4th), I've attached the vote counts as they existed in all 6 of the battleground states -- all of which had HUGE LEADS for DT.  By 6am when I and many Americans began to wake up, the story was quite different - and it will be shown that these are the hours in the middle of the night when hundreds of thousands of fraudulent ballots were brought in (and corraborated by hundreds of sworn affidavits) to steal the election.

 

AGAIN LET ME SAY THIS IS NOT ABOUT ONE MAN - ITS NOT ABOUT HIM - ITS ABOUT US.  YOU SHOULD BE JUST AS WORRIED BUT YOU'RE NOT. I'LL ARGUE THAT THE POINTS YOU OUTLINE HAVE ALREADY OCCURRED!  WE'RE NO LONGER LIVING IN A DEMOCRACY WHEN A FREE AND FAIR ELECTION IS STOLEN IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT BECAUSE VERY SINISTER AND POWERFUL FORCES HAVE CONSPIRED FOR THAT TO HAPPEN - SUPPORTED FULLY BY A CORRUPT MSM AND BIG TECH ALL WORKING TOGETHER "FOR THE GOOD OF THE STATE".

Do you really think they would care about you or me once you've done their bidding as a "useful idiot" to help them achieve their objectives?? What do you think would happen to you to me to society if they were able to achieve this?? Have you stopped for a minute to think about that?  Are you really under the false impression that somehow their end game,  which you've recited brilliantly in brainwashed propoganda, would create some type of societal utopia??  It won't!

They'll gladly use the support of useful idiots - just like they did in the lead up to WWII in Nazi Germany in getting the vast majority of Germans to conform to the "Utopian" goals of the State-- and then when you least expect it (just like what happened in Nazi Germany), things will become very authoritarian, the government will exert total control (were seeing it now with the fake Corona Virus which has helped them on their way to achieiving their goal by breaking the backs of society and trying to make everyone dependent on government (don't work!  We'll send you checks - stay home!).

Then, when we least expect it - the screws will come down - it's already happening:

 

1. The World Health Organization says that regardless of the vaccines, that masks and social distancing may be here to stay - THINK ABOUT THAT FOR A MOMENT!!  WHy would they be here to stay? Read about the "Great Reset" outlined by the World Economic Forum head (representing interests of all Billionaires) https://www.sgtreport.com/2020/10/what-you-need-to-know-about-the-great-reset/

https://www.sgtreport.com/2020/10/what-you-need-to-know-about-the-great-reset/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJTnkzl3K64  (not true btw - only true if we're all forced to stay home - the anger is because governments want to take away our civil rights and wants to brainwash us with fear and force us to stay home)

 

2.  In Communist Russia and Nazi Germany - the dictators made these same utopian predictions to bring the populace into submission and they never had any intention on providing those things but to force their people to help the dictators achieve their dangerous objectives.  THOSE THINGS ARE HAPPENING NOW - It's exactly how they can say business travel should end to save the planet but they're exempt to have their own private jets and fly all over the world.  It's how they can tell the masses to stay home and wear a mask and then the leaders can go to very expensive restaurants in San Francisco, have trips to Maui - all without Masks or Social Distancing - while society's useful idiots conforms to help them achieve their objectives and do their bidding.

 

3.  They accuse DT of being the Dictator but that is exactly what they're projecting on their enemy which they are doing!  They have to make him the 'enemy of the state' so that the useful idiots keep their focus on him when in fact it should be on the them!  ANOTHER TEXTBOOK TACTIC OF SAUL ALINSKY AND HIS RULES FOR RADICALS.

See here:  https://bolenreport.com/saul-alinskys-12-rules-radicals/   https://www.bizpacreview.com/2020/10/15/the-democrat-plan-to-steal-this-election-and-many-more-984897

 

4.  Finally, the most important thing that has occurred which 99.9% of Americans don't know - because it was completely censored by the MSM - but appears on the website of the US Supreme Court see here:   https://www.supremecourt.gov/search.aspx?Search=november+20+2020&type=Site

READ THE FIRST ONE "MISCELLANEOUS ORDER"  

The Supreme Court Justices have been installed in each of the lower Circuit Courts (for which they have constitutional authority to do so) because they are well aware of widespread election fraud and are accelerating the process to hear the and rule on the cases without interference from lower courts who have a history of trying to stall these cases to "run out the clock".  It's a very subtle order and like I said it was buried by just about everyone

 

https://channel411news.com/2020/11/21/supreme-court-unveils-new-circuit-assignments-for-justices-here-is-the-breakdown/

 

So I hope you will take this email to heart - it took me two hours to write it and IT IS FUNDAMENTALLY WRITTEN THAT WE ARE ON THE SAME SIDE AS AMERICANS AND AS GAY MEN - BUT YET FOLKS WHO MAY SEE THE WORLD DIFFERENTLY.  BUT WE'RE NOT ENEMIES AND I DON'T THINK OF YOU AS SUBHUMAN - YOU NEED TO SDO THE SAME WITH THE OTHER SIDE AND TO SEE THAT YOU MAY JUST HAVE DRANK THE KOOL AID OF SAUL ALINSKY AND THE COMMUNISTS WITHOUT EVEN KNOWING IT SIMPLY BY RECITING ALL OF THE TALKING POINTS OF THE STATE RUN MEDIA - ALL OF WHICH ARE IN THE TANK FOR THE SAME AGENDA AND THE FACT THAT A LIE IS A LIE IS A LIE IS A LIE IS THE TRUTH IF ITS RECITED OFTEN ENOUGH AND BY SO MANY.

 

Happy Thanksgiving to you and I wish you peace happiness, health and a willingness to take another perspective on your perspective.

A

 

 

 

 

[Suckrates]

 

 

@Adam4muscle, Dude.......  cut the crap already !   EVERYONE (except Trump cultists) have decried the Election to be FAIR, without tampering or Fraud.   He LOST by a Landslide, live with it..... now go sulk for the next 4 years like WE had to do when Trump won....  there is absolutely NO way to defend Trump here, and his behavior is Despicable and Anti-American, or as HE would call it...TREASONOUS !

The time of Trump getting HIS way and getting away with it HAS ENDED !!!!!

 

Edited November 26, 2020 by Suckrates

[RockHardNYC]

8 hours ago, Adam4muscle said:

it took me two hours to write it

Sad that you took two hours of your precious life and wasted it on so much bullshit. Truly sad. The writing isn't bad. Just goes to show that educated people aren't immune to falling prey to Trumpism.

I have no desire to engage with radicals. My time left on earth is too sacred. I'm grateful this country has enough Republican election officials who know how to follow the legal process for counting votes, and who still respect the U.S. Constitution and their sworn oath.

Here's a simple fact that doesn't take more than two minutes to type:

Michael Flynn, a retired United States Army lieutenant general and the former National Security Advisor for Trump, intentionally lied to FBI agents and Vice President Pence. Flynn plead guilty twice for his crime, and is now pardoned by Trump. It doesn't take much brainwashing for me to know how one defines CORRUPTION. 

I could write so much more, but like I said, I prefer not to engage with people who have fallen too far down the rabbit hole.

 

[RockHardNYC]

I suppose it's comforting to know that I'm not the only one separated from my (distant) family this Thanksgiving. (I refuse to sit at a table with Trump apologists.) Maureen Dowd has long made public her rift with fellow family members over Trump.

Today, she gives her column to her brother Kevin (seated center), who wrote in praise of Trump. It's a fascinating, intelligent read.

Oh, Brother! Tears for Trump

(Love the headline.)

The Comments section on the opinion piece is just as fascinating, and those numbers are growing. This early comment from a Nevada psychiatrist, The Pessimistic Shrink, jumped out to me:

"I am telling Kevin that he and his millions do not feel what they think they feel. Love is not angry. It does not minimize entire ethnic groups. It does not admire a sociopath who likely never had a kind or giving thought in his head. You cannot simply say a word and make it so."

AMEN!

Edited November 26, 2020 by RockHardNYC

[RockHardNYC]

13 hours ago, Adam4muscle said:

The World Health Organization says that regardless of the vaccines, that masks and social distancing may be here to stay - THINK ABOUT THAT FOR A MOMENT!!  WHy would they be here to stay?

Pandemics have been a part of human history for as long as humans have been keeping records. Some people are smart. They study history and they learn from history. We now know that pandemics can be controlled, if people will follow safety guidelines.

For many years I did business in Asia. I will never forget the first time, in the early 80's, when I witnessed so many people in the streets of Asia wearing masks. I asked my Asian host to explain that behavior. She said masks are often worn to protect everyone from compromised immune systems. Not only the person who may be sick or getting sick, but also the person who may be vulnerable standing next to you. Most ordinary people can't afford to go without work. Many businesses don't offer "sick days" to their employees. So, if you must go to work with the threat of illness looming in order to keep your job, it is considered polite to wear a mask when health conditions, however private or personal, affect you. You don't need to explain your particular situation to anyone. You wear a mask and your fellow man respects you for it.

I was dumbfounded. Gobsmacked. What a brilliant idea! How considerate of yourself and your neighbor. I told my host I wish we could adopt such humane thinking in our culture in America, but I feared we Americans are too selfish and too righteous. Furthermore, wearing masks to prevent ill health is a concept U.S. drug companies have long not supported. In a Capitalist society, unfortunately, money trumps smart health policy for its citizens. If more Americans wore masks in public, fewer people would get sick, even from the common cold, especially from the common cold, a $40-billion annual business in America. And that behavior would have a serious financial impact on the Republican-driven drug lobby and Republican-owned drug companies.

Here we are four decades later, and look what is going on in America with the simple, polite concept of mask wearing. It is a disgrace. Trump is a disgrace. He politicized a pandemic and paid the price. Not big enough price, IMO, but time will tell.

All Trump had to do to control the pandemic and save "his economy" was tell everyone to wear a mask and fully explain the reasons. Even with mask production dominated by China, all Trump had to do was use the Defense Production Act of 1950 to get American companies to manufacture the PPE we needed. Had Trump done this early last February, millions of lives would have been spared. I believe he might have won re-election based on that singular act.

Instead, Trump made a serious mistake. He chose to politicize a serious health crisis and turned the Trump Party into a Death Cult. Many more Republican voters are going to die from Covid, especially now with numbers rising in middle America. The majority of Democrats are wearing masks. We'll see how this plays out, but none of it is good for the country. Trump failed to lead. FAILURE is now his legacy.

Edited November 26, 2020 by RockHardNYC

[stevenkesslar]

On 11/25/2020 at 11:56 PM, Adam4muscle said:

what you are promoting and reciting in your posts are actually the words of and the desired goals of Saul Alinsky - to take the US from a Democracy to an autocratic totalitarian communist society by creating chaos in society

Congratulations for writing something that makes me look terse by comparison.

I don't see the direct line between Nazi Germany, Communist Russia, Saul Alinsky, Barack Obama, and Hillary Clinton.  One small detail that popped into my mind when I started to read what you wrote is that Alinsky was a Jew.  So that's not a super good logical fit with him being associated with anything involving Nazi Germany.  But when I got to the part about me being brainwashed by untrue state propaganda it clicked.  Me being brainwashed, of course I wouldn't be able to understand how this all fits into the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State.  The fact that what you wrote doesn't quite make sense to me could actually confirm that I was brainwashed, so as not to be able to see the true general realities as you see them. 

If you made any specific points, like how there was proof that  "x" number of votes were stolen using "y" method in "z" state, that would provide a framework for saying you are right or wrong.  But since this is all very general and somewhat vague, it's hard to say if you are right or wrong.  But I get the jist of your argument.  First, with me being brainwashed and the state operatives of the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State being able to change the election results between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m. as we slept, these are pretty clever people.  Second, of course they are not going to leave any evidence behind.  Third, in all honesty I actually thought I stayed up from 2 a.m. to 6 a.m. watching as results kept coming in.  But then it struck me that all that was maybe me being brainwashed.  In fact, maybe it was between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m. when they brainwashed me when everybody else was asleep so nobody else could see.  Or at least reinforced the brainwashing that I guess the untrue state media has been gradually pounding into my brain.  Fourth, all that probably just goes to show I am brainwashed.

The really fucked up part of this is that if you are right and they are out to "destroy democracy, dehumanize & eradicate those they don't agree with" that leaves me in a truly fucked up position, brainwashed or not.  Quite honestly I might be okay with the destroying democracy part, seeing as it doesn't effect me personally.  But if I'm going to be dehumanized and eradicated - well, I'm not really up for that.  So I'm thinking I should probably agree with the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State if only to avoid eradication.  And then I thought if I am brainwashed I don't have a choice as to whether I agree with the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State, anyway.  So, push come to shove, it feels like I am basically totally fucked.

Something else odd struck me when I was lying in bed thinking about this.  If you abbreviate Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State you gets CATS.  So is it just a coincidence that "Cats" is also one of the longest running musicals in London and New York City and wherever it has played?  It also turns out Andrew Lloyd Webber is an agnostic.  Which makes him a perfect fit for Nazi Germany, Communist Russia, Obama, Clinton, and Alinksy, since agnostics don't believe in anything.  So what if the state operatives are using an agnostic AND a Jew?  No disrespect to Alinsky's Rules For Radicals, but if you really want the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State to do a deep brainwashing you don't go for just one book.  You go for the play that is around forever and that some people have seen like a dozen times.  The better to brainwash you even though you don't know you are being brainwashed.

And then the whole thing suddenly fell together in my mind that one of my favorite songs is "Memories".  Now just think about that.   If you were going to brainwash someone wouldn't you want to use a song like "Memories" so as to make a "useful idiot" like me think I remember everything?  When in fact I am totally brainwashed?  I know it sounds far-fetched but these are people who stole an entire national election between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m.  (well, just the Presidential race, I mean) so if they can do that they can sure as fuck mess with Webber and his play.

Now check this out:

’Tis the final conflict
Let each stand in his place
The International Union
Shall be the human race.

So now it is obvious.  We know from The Internationale  that the Marxists and Bolsheviks tried to unite the human race.  But the big mistake was saying you are uniting the entire human race.  Which makes it really obvious what you are up to.  So people were able to fight back and hold the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State at bay for quite a long time.  

So what did they do?  They fucked with our minds real good, didn't they?  They went into disguise.  They made it about "cats", not people.  And you brainwash them by making it about "memories" even though they are not memories at all actually.  So everything is the opposite of what you think it is.  Facts are lies and lies are facts.  Which explains why Trump is the only one telling the truth when actually the untrue state propaganda says it is the opposite and DT is the one who lies.  And here is the actual proof which is undeniable:

If you touch me,
You'll understand what happiness is
Look, a new day has begun

You see how clever they are?  That is of course the final part of "Memories" which everyone has implanted in their brain.  It is basically the exact same as The Internationale only it is in disguise.  So is it a coincidence that just at DT was on the verge of Making America Great Again the China virus comes along from Communist China?  And what does everyone do?  Freak out and go into their little pod.  So the whole thing is you can only touch that actual person in your pod where you are all brainwashed and they say it as a "new day" which means when we wake up we are all brainwashed.  And despite all that DT still won because all these rural people didn't go see Cats just the people in the cities like Philadelphia and Milwaukee and Detroit.  So he still won.  So they actually had to change it all between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m.  So I wake up being brainwashed and thinking "Oh, Joe Biden won." Which is exactly what the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State wants.  And everybody else who has NOT been brainwashed wakes up and says, "Holy shit!  They stole the election."

Holy shit!  Now I got it!  Thank you!

You'll have to excuse me.  But I have this feeling I better get the fuck out of here while there's still time.

 

Edited November 28, 2020 by stevenkesslar

[Pete1111]

 

On 11/28/2020 at 2:22 AM, stevenkesslar said:

Congratulations for writing something that makes me look terse by comparison.

I don't see the direct line between Nazi Germany, Communist Russia, Saul Alinsky, Barack Obama, and Hillary Clinton.  One small detail that popped into my mind when I started to read what you wrote is that Alinsky was a Jew.  So that's not a super good logical fit with him being associated with anything involving Nazi Germany.  But when I got to the part about me being brainwashed by untrue state propaganda it clicked.  Me being brainwashed, of course I wouldn't be able to understand how this all fits into the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State.  The fact that what you wrote doesn't quite make sense to me could actually confirm that I was brainwashed, so as not to be able to see the true general realities as you see them. 

If you made any specific points, like how there was proof that  "x" number of votes were stolen using "y" method in "z" state, that would provide a framework for saying you are right or wrong.  But since this is all very general and somewhat vague, it's hard to say if you are right or wrong.  But I get the jist of your argument.  First, with me being brainwashed and the state operatives of the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State being able to change the election results between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m. as we slept, these are pretty clever people.  Second, of course they are not going to leave any evidence behind.  Third, in all honesty I actually thought I stayed up from 2 a.m. to 6 a.m. watching as results kept coming in.  But then it struck me that all that was maybe me being brainwashed.  In fact, maybe it was between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m. when they brainwashed me when everybody else was asleep so nobody else could see.  Or at least reinforced the brainwashing that I guess the untrue state media has been gradually pounding into my brain.  Fourth, all that probably just goes to show I am brainwashed.

The really fucked up part of this is that if you are right and they are out to "destroy democracy, dehumanize & eradicate those they don't agree with" that leaves me in a truly fucked up position, brainwashed or not.  Quite honestly I might be okay with the destroying democracy part, seeing as it doesn't effect me personally.  But if I'm going to be dehumanized and eradicated - well, I'm not really up for that.  So I'm thinking I should probably agree with the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State if only to avoid eradication.  And then I thought if I am brainwashed I don't have a choice as to whether I agree with the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State, anyway.  So, push come to shove, it feels like I am basically totally fucked.

Something else odd struck me when I was lying in bed thinking about this.  If you abbreviate Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State you gets CATS.  So is it just a coincidence that "Cats" is also one of the longest running musicals in London and New York City and wherever it has played?  It also turns out Andrew Lloyd Webber is an agnostic.  Which makes him a perfect fit for Nazi Germany, Communist Russia, Obama, Clinton, and Alinksy, since agnostics don't believe in anything.  So what if the state operatives are using an agnostic AND a Jew?  No disrespect to Alinsky's Rules For Radicals, but if you really want the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State to do a deep brainwashing you don't go for just one book.  You go for the play that is around forever and that some people have seen like a dozen times.  The better to brainwash you even though you don't know you are being brainwashed.

And then the whole thing suddenly fell together in my mind that one of my favorite songs is "Memories".  Now just think about that.   If you were going to brainwash someone wouldn't you want to use a song like "Memories" so as to make a "useful idiot" like me think I remember everything?  When in fact I am totally brainwashed?  I know it sounds far-fetched but these are people who stole an entire national election between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m.  (well, just the Presidential race, I mean) so if they can do that they can sure as fuck mess with Webber and his play.

Now check this out:

’Tis the final conflict
Let each stand in his place
The International Union
Shall be the human race.

So now it is obvious.  We know from The Internationale  that the Marxists and Bolsheviks tried to unite the human race.  But the big mistake was saying you are uniting the entire human race.  Which makes it really obvious what you are up to.  So people were able to fight back and hold the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State at bay for quite a long time.  

So what did they do?  They fucked with our minds real good, didn't they?  They went into disguise.  They made it about "cats", not people.  And you brainwash them by making it about "memories" even though they are not memories at all actually.  So everything is the opposite of what you think it is.  Facts are lies and lies are facts.  Which explains why Trump is the only one telling the truth when actually the untrue state propaganda says it is the opposite and DT is the one who lies.  And here is the actual proof which is undeniable:

If you touch me,
You'll understand what happiness is
Look, a new day has begun

You see how clever they are?  That is of course the final part of "Memories" which everyone has implanted in their brain.  It is basically the exact same as The Internationale only it is in disguise.  So is it a coincidence that just at DT was on the verge of Making America Great Again the China virus comes along from Communist China?  And what does everyone do?  Freak out and go into their little pod.  So the whole thing is you can only touch that actual person in your pod where you are all brainwashed and they say it as a "new day" which means when we wake up we are all brainwashed.  And despite all that DT still won because all these rural people didn't go see Cats just the people in the cities like Philadelphia and Milwaukee and Detroit.  So he still won.  So they actually had to change it all between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m.  So I wake up being brainwashed and thinking "Oh, Joe Biden won." Which is exactly what the Communist Authoritarian Totalitarian State wants.  And everybody else who has NOT been brainwashed wakes up and says, "Holy shit!  They stole the election."

Holy shit!  Now I got it!  Thank you!

You'll have to excuse me.  But I have this feeling I better get the fuck out of here while there's still time.

 

It's gotta hurt for Trump to hear a Jew, Saul Alinsky, was behind the vote count fraud,

especially when he has always stood by Jewish guys as the most trusted for doing the counting at his casinos. 

Today's WAPO article on Trump's voter fraud craziness includes a clip from Fox where Trump claims the FBI should be investigating how many dead people voted, but they (the FBI) "are probably in on it".

I hope there is a way to make Trump pay for all this.  He is a nasty man, IMO.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/11/30/cybersecurity-202-chris-krebs-fiercely-defends-election-while-president-trumps-attacks-it-get-weirder/