Do not Post any photos

[SolaceSoul]

32 minutes ago, RockHardNYC said:

Copyright law does extend beyond recognizable faces, but I sincerely doubt headless body infractions end up argued in court. I'm not a lawyer, but I'm not aware of a body case filed and won. Let's not forget, it costs money to sue for copyright infringement. Most sex workers are not looking to spend hard-earned money on a lawyer.

Oh, I can tell you’re certainly not a lawyer — and definitely not in the field of intellectual property — because you’re confusing copyright with the right of privacy / right of publicity. The former is the ownership of the creation (the photograph), while the latter is the rights of the subject in the creation (the person in the photograph).

Also, oddly, you keep referring to U.S. copyright law when referring to photographs of Brazilian subjects posted on an American website with international reach, possibly taken by clients from different continents. There are several territories — and thus, several laws — whose intellectual property laws could apply here, not just those of the USA.

Not even mentioning the complete lack of ethics in posting someone’s photo on the internet with said person’s advance knowledge or permission (even if said person works in the sex trade), there are other legal issues in addition to right of privacy and copyright. One major liability in the USA could be the new “revenge porn@ statutes popping up in jurisdictions everywhere — making it a criminal act to share a “non-consensual image” of someone’s private parts. 

[likeohmygod]

Guys it's not a thing about law. Just as you don't wanna see your picture while half naked inside a gay sauna filled with garotos posted in the internet, don't do it with garotos. 

Without involving law which in brazil is extremely complicated 

[Badboy81]

34 minutes ago, likeohmygod said:

Guys it's not a thing about law. Just as you don't wanna see your picture while half naked inside a gay sauna filled with garotos posted in the internet, don't do it with garotos. 

Without involving law which in brazil is extremely complicated 

Well said man....Well said

[RockHardNYC]

2 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

Oh, I can tell you’re certainly not a lawyer

I already said I was not a lawyer. Do you feel more intelligent now?

2 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

and definitely not in the field of intellectual property

That's funny.

2 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

you’re confusing copyright with the right of privacy / right of publicity

No confusion at all. I am simply unaware of any lawsuit involving an escort suing over his/her right of privacy.

"You can stop a website's use of your image for three reasons: invasion of privacy, violation of right of publicity, or defamation.

Invasion of privacy can occur if you are portrayed falsely and in a highly offensive manner. For example, your photo was posted at an America's Most Wanted type of website, and you are not wanted by the law. Your privacy might also be invaded if the photo was taken by someone who intruded on you in a situation in which you had a reasonable expectation of privacy—for example, in your own home. It is not an invasion of privacy to photograph someone in a public place or at any event where the public is invited.

Another reason to stop the use is known as the right of publicity. This occurs if your image is used for commercial purposes such as to sell products or to imply that you endorse a product. If the photo is used in a commercial website—that is, one sponsored by a business or that sells products or services—the unauthorized use of your image would probably violate your right of publicity. The public must be able to identify you in the photograph.

You can also stop the website use if the photo defames you—that is, it creates a false impression and injures your reputation. For example, it would be defamatory to doctor a photo to make it seem as if you were shoplifting. The fact that an unmodified photo is unflattering is not enough to claim defamation. The photo must falsely portray you and must cause people in the community to think less of you."

2 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

oddly, you keep referring to U.S. copyright law when referring to photographs of Brazilian subjects

To put it simply, no one should post/publish a private image of anyone without their consent. Period. No matter where you live.

[TotallyOz]

Let me help. Do not post images that you do not have the right or permission to post. Feel free to take photos of guys but ask if it is OK to post them on a forum.  Feel free to link to other sites for escorts where they have uploaded those photos themselves. However, do not post images that you did not take yourself or you have the legal right to use.

[Kevie770]

29 minutes ago, TotallyOz said:

Let me help. Do not post images that you do not have the right or permission to post. Feel free to take photos of guys but ask if it is OK to post them on a forum.  Feel free to link to other sites for escorts where they have uploaded those photos themselves. However, do not post images that you did not take yourself or you have the legal right to use.

It’s sad that this has to be said.  

[sanddunes]

There are two theories I have on why someone would tell garotos about photos here:

1).  A board member who is upset that other clients are sharing garotos photos, so tells the garotos in order to get the garotos angry and cause everything to blow up - with the end result nobody posting pics here anymore.

2).  A client trying to win favor with the garotos by letting them in on inside information.  The motive would be to gain the garotos trust and elevate himself as a preferred client to the garoto.

In my opinion pics posted on a closed forum such as tomcal’s is not really the same as posting on an open forum.  Those photos are not indexed, google searchable, and the garotos family, friends, coworkers etc. would not be able to find them.  Only a handful of people had access to them.

The whole situation sucks, but as the saying goes it only takes one bad apple to ruin the whole bunch..

Edited December 16, 2018 by sanddunes

[tassojunior]

Well here's a photo I took yesterday in Key West of my friends from Czech Republic who escort and do porn for Bel Ami. They may put it in their ad. 

[SolaceSoul]

6 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

Not even mentioning the complete lack of ethics in posting someone’s photo on the internet with said person’s advance knowledge or permission (even if said person works in the sex trade)...

This should’ve said “withOUT said person’s advance knowledge or permission”.

I hate not being able to edit posts after a few hours.

[TotallyOz]

2 hours ago, sanddunes said:

In my opinion pics posted on a closed forum such as tomcal’s is not really the same as posting on an open forum.  Those photos are not indexed, google searchable, and the garotos family, friends, coworkers etc. would not be able to find them.  Only a handful of people had access to them.

3

Let me be clear, I have not heard of any issues in the Club area. Those are all private. Those photos were not shared.  Only the ones in the open forums were shared. The Clubs area was added to avoid this issue.  However, that often limits the number of people participating and that is fine for me with photo threads. I also use photography as do many of you with never an issue. The Club areas are available for all to use and create and are as safe and secure as the owner (the Club originator) opens them. 

[RockHardNYC]

6 hours ago, sanddunes said:

There are two theories I have on why someone would tell garotos about photos here:

There are plenty of self-absorbed, insecure gay men who don't want other men having more fun. Any theory that involves envy, jealousy, and one-upmanship works for me.

6 hours ago, sanddunes said:

pics posted on a closed forum such as tomcal’s is not really the same as posting on an open forum.

If my memory can be trusted, pics were originally posted on the open forum. That's how I know about them. All it takes is one mistake like that and the bad apple has his worm.

6 hours ago, tassojunior said:

Well here's a photo I took yesterday in Key West of my friends from Czech Republic who escort and do porn for Bel Ami. They may put it in their ad.

There's nothing special about that photo. It's out-of-focus, and it's not very flattering to either actor. A model's face should never be placed on the outer edge of a lens to avoid lens distortion. BelAmi boys have access to seriously talented photographers. Why on earth would they put that unflattering photo in their ad? Sounds to me like someone enjoys the feeling of escort tongue up his ass. (Can't say there's anything wrong with that.)

4 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

I hate not being able to edit posts after a few hours.

+1

4 hours ago, TotallyOz said:

I have not heard of any issues in the Club area. Those are all private.

Sharing a photo on the internet in a private area is only "private" if you trust every member of that club. Sharing a photo with an in-person friend is not the same thing as giving that photo to a friend. Any photo shared on the internet, private or not, is a gift. It can be stolen and used with negative intent. Typically, I fall into the camp of trust no one in order to secure less disappointment.

Edited December 16, 2018 by RockHardNYC

[SolaceSoul]

Even though I agree with @RockHardNYC that when it comes to the internet, nothing is really private, @TotallyOz has already stated that these photos in question were posted in the public forum. There are a few posters who enjoy posting photos of garotos they met during their escapades, along with the alleged acts and prices, and a few of them are easily recognizable by their photos (face blocked or not). I believe that at least one of the young men whose photos were posted about, along with details of the alleged sexual activity and prices, is livid about this exposure. 

Some posters here either don’t know or conveniently shrug off the cultural differences in places like Brazil. Sure, sauna work and even prostitution are legal there, but machismo Brazilian and Latin American culture still dictates that one keeps that kind of work quiet. Just as clients, other than the outest gayest, would cringe at the thought of being exposed on a website, so would 85% - 95% of the sauna workers. Also, many (most?) garotos, due to the same cultural norms, are going to state in public that they are ativo (tops), and would be mortified to learn that not only are they being photo ID’d by name, but they are also talked about as passivo (bottoms).

[Latbear4blk]

I may be wrong, and in that case I will be glad to be corrected, but this is what I think it happened.

Some time ago pictures shared in the open Latin American forums were shown to the GPs depicted in them. Because of that incident in the open forum, @Tomcal created the private Club. Once in the private club, the problem occurred again. Tom considered cancelling everyone's membership and asking to re-apply. This time is the third occurrence, and Tom just closed the club and decided not to post anymore here.

I think it was very naive from all of us to even consider that we would be able to control pictures sharing amongst people we do not really know. Plus the deeper concerns brought by @RockHardNYC from the very beginning of this thread. 

I will be more careful and more respectful of others' privacy. 

[Riobard]

I think that defamation law in Brazil technically has its bar set lower, extending beyond libel/slander where the truth of the matter is disputable.

Insulting someone, offending their honor and dignity, irrespective of the veracity underpinning such insult, may be taken more seriously and be more prosecutable than many of us might think.

Some of you might say, in relation to our forum, "But the offended person would not likely pursue and draw further attention". However, they may be backed into a corner and capitulate to demands from familial/social networks to launch an ersatz 'duel at dawn' via legal recourse. Or, heck, a civil suit ... who knows?

Pic poster beware. 

 

 

 

[Riobard]

10 hours ago, sanddunes said:

There are two theories I have on why someone would tell garotos about photos here:

1).  A board member who is upset that other clients are sharing garotos photos, so tells the garotos in order to get the garotos angry and cause everything to blow up - with the end result nobody posting pics here anymore.

2).  A client trying to win favor with the garotos by letting them in on inside information.  The motive would be to gain the garotos trust and elevate himself as a preferred client to the garoto.

Might I add a 3) for good measure? A client with Board access who feels scorned and cheated within negotiations, and wants to maliciciously shove into a garoto's face, while maintaining a third-party degree of personal impunity, that there is evidence, beyond verbal exchange hearsay, that said garoto's services of such-and-such a nature could be had for such-and-such a price by such-and-such client/poster who wrote and illustrated about it all. 

Along with ego, follow the money. 

Edited December 16, 2018 by Riobard

[SolaceSoul]

38 minutes ago, Riobard said:

Might I add a 3) for good measure? A client with Board access who feels scorned and cheated within negotiations, and wants to maliciciously shove into a garoto's face, while maintaining a third-party degree of personal impunity, that there is evidence, beyond verbal exchange hearsay, that said garoto's services of such-and-such a nature could be had for such-and-such a price by such-and-such client/poster who wrote and illustrated about it all. 

I’ve witnessed this third scenario before at two other message boards involving gay-for-pay escorts. I don’t trust anonymous posters as far as I could throw them (and some of them, being very portly and corpulent, couldn’t be thrown at all!).

[Latbear4blk]

10 hours ago, sanddunes said:

2).  A client trying to win favor with the garotos by letting them in on inside information.  The motive would be to gain the garotos trust and elevate himself as a preferred client to the garoto.

We are playing with possible explanations without any information here, but if I can only choose between your two options I am strongly inclined for #2. With a caveat.

With the wording you chose the client seems to be in control, aware of and manipulating the situation. I think it is probably quite different. Someone very insecure, who actually thinks is sharing intimate information with the garotos, who actually feels this as a personal, emotional, and special bound with the boys. 

Edited December 16, 2018 by Latbear4blk

[RockHardNYC]

The desire to speculate must be human nature. A lot of people seem to enjoy it.

[RockHardNYC]

3 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

when it comes to the internet, nothing is really private

Just look at all the deleted tweets that still have a life. There must be a screenshot-capturing cottage industry somewhere. And given the nature of cache, words and photos could be up on the internet for one second, then deleted, and still be around for plenty of time to take a screenshot or steal the image.

3 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

There are a few posters who enjoy posting photos of garotos they met during their escapades

Posters like that need to be broken from their enjoyment.

2 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

I don’t trust anonymous posters as far as I could throw them

It's difficult enough to trust family and friends.

2 hours ago, SolaceSoul said:

and some of them, being very portly and corpulent, couldn’t be thrown at all!)

[tassojunior]

I didn't notice the thread was under the Latin American forum. The title makes it seems like no photos of escorts at all anywhere. and I post a lot of my guys' photos. I think the type pic I posted is fine and doesn't risk any libel or slander because they openly publish as escorts and are in porn films in fact. 

We love our pics in the Prague thread. 

[mark123]

6 hours ago, Latbear4blk said:

Some time ago pictures shared in the open Latin American forums were shown to the GPs depicted in them. Because of that incident in the open forum, @Tomcal created the private Club. Once in the private club, the problem occurred again. Tom considered cancelling everyone's membership and asking to re-apply. This time is the third occurrence, and Tom just closed the club and decided not to post anymore here.

 

Then that directly contradicts what Oz has asserted, and the private clubs are then absolutely part of the problem.  

IF true, then dismissing this information out of hand and instead promoting the use of such clubs in the wake of what happened is very wrong and only exacerbates the issue - and the probability of a very ugly recurrence.

Have to agree with Rock on this one.  A private club on the internet is only as "private" as each and every one of its (anonymous) members make it.   

Edited December 16, 2018 by mark123

[axiom2001]

18 hours ago, Kevie770 said:

It’s sad that this has to be said.  

It's not sad, just very specific and direct for ALL to follow if they desire to post photos at this site!

[RockHardNYC]

When surreptitious video like this is becoming more and more popular, many people will continue to lose all sense of boundaries. Dangerous for us all. Or fun, depending on how you feel about your privacy.

(Be sure to catch the video before Tumblr porn ends.)

[TotallyOz]

15 hours ago, tassojunior said:

I didn't notice the thread was under the Latin American forum. The title makes it seems like no photos of escorts at all anywhere. and I post a lot of my guys' photos. I think the type pic I posted is fine and doesn't risk any libel or slander because they openly publish as escorts and are in porn films in fact. 

We love our pics in the Prague thread. 

The Prague thread is amazing. But, remember, they get a different type of client in Prague.  There are some men that live to go to the saunas in Brazil and haggle with the boys to get them dirt cheap.  

13 hours ago, mark123 said:

Then that directly contradicts what Oz has asserted, and the private clubs are then absolutely part of the problem.  

IF true, then dismissing this information out of hand and instead promoting the use of such clubs in the wake of what happened is very wrong and only exacerbates the issue - and the probability of a very ugly recurrence.

Have to agree with Rock on this one.  A private club on the internet is only as "private" as each and every one of its (anonymous) members make it.   

I do not remember the club issue being a problem with photos. I thought it was lack of participation that made Tomcal close it.  That said, if you have a Club with only people you know or trust, there is no issue.  If you open a Club to anyone who wishes to join, then, thus an issue can easily arise. 

[Lucky]

I didn't join the club. I post no pix of guys from the saunas. I enjoy tomcal's posts and think he is a Boytoy hero for his contributions to this site. Whoever showed the pics to the garoto and upset him should be banned from the forum if, in fact, they were from this private club. Otherwise, the site is open to the public, and we can't govern the actions of people who want to share it with others.