LOS = Land of Sleaze

[Guest laurence]

Often when speaking with people I mention my travels to Thailand and get the response " Oh, I hear Thailand is a beautiful country"! I reply, "no it is hot, dirty, smelly, dangerous and sleazy". They then say "then why do you go there?"

Without revealing the full truth I say "for the sleaze"!

 

For sure, my experiences have been in the major cities with some excursions into the countryside, but I have never really seen much beauty. Perhaps there are pockets of beauty as there are pockets of sleaze, Pattaya being the sleaziest and my favorite, with the rest being somewhat bland.

 

I would like to hear of others opinions and experiences.

[Guest TOQ]

I think you may have that wrong. If you get out of Pattaya, which I enjoy, you find that there is a lot of beauty in Thailand and only a few "pockets of sleaze" as you call it in the major cities.

 

john

[KhorTose]

Lawrence wrote----"Often when speaking with people I mention my travels to Thailand and get the response " Oh, I hear Thailand is a beautiful country"! I reply, "no it is hot, dirty, smelly, dangerous and sleazy". They then say "then why do you go there?"

Without revealing the full truth I say "for the sleaze"!

For sure, my experiences have been in the major cities with some excursions into the countryside, but I have never really seem much beauty. Perhaps there are pockets of beauty as there are pockets of sleaze, Pattaya being the sleaziest and my favorite, with the rest being somewhat bland.

I would like to hear of others opinions and experiences."

 

I tend to stay in and around Chiang Mai, just because there is very little of what you call sleaze. Most Thais I meet are good hard working people, just like you meet anywhere else in the world. Don't get me wrong, I too enjoy sleaze now and then, but overall I just prefer a more "real" relationship with the country and its people, rather then the somewhat (to me) artifical bar, boy, massage, etc. scenes. However, do not read this as a criticism of people who choose the sleaze scene. If you can keep it up (no pun intended) go for it.

[Guest ObamaBoy]

I would like to hear of others opinions and experiences.

i want 2 hear also.

[Gaybutton]

I believe beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I don't see Pattaya or Bangkok as being particularly beautiful, but I also don't see them as the modern day equivalent of Soddom and Gomorrah. In my eyes, what some people see as ugly are what I see as beautiful and vice-versa. A perfect example is Chiang Mai. A great many people absolutely love Chiang Mai. For me, Chiang Mai holds no attraction or interest at all. Different strokes for different folks.

[KhorTose]

Different strokes for different folks.

 

I could not agree more, and I also think you can find much about Pattaya to appreciate that is outside of the gay areas. Take your boy to the beach, the aquarium or to the amusement park, e.g.

Come to Chiang Mai with someone who knows the city and I guarentee you a good time. Some of the best food in Thailand, less expensive then Bangkok or Pattaya, large community of ex-pats, both straight and gay--who freely mix and socialize with each other---Handsomel boys (not in bars), and a great countryside with real mountains, water falls, animal farms, hiking trails, etc. Oh, did I mention Handsome boys. In case I forgot---handsome boys.

[Guest]

When my friends in the USA ask why I love Pattaya so much, I said it is the only place where pimps, johns, hookers and the like all live together in almost perfect harmony.

 

Like you Laurence, I like the sleeze.

[PattayaMale]

I think there is alot of beauty in Pattaya. From the condo I own in Center Condo, the view over the ocean is great.

 

Just look at many of the pictures TOQ John has posted. They represent true beauty.

 

And happily the entertainment is great too!

[Guest shockdevil]

I agree with John on this one. You will need to get out of BKK and Pattaya to see the real beauty of the land.

 

My first trip to Thailand was on a structured tour. I visited Chiang Mai, Chiang Rai, Ayutthaya and Phuket. I was amazed with the beauty of the hills in northern Thailand and the beautiful Phi Phi islands near Phuket.

 

I fell in love with the beauty of this country but return year after year for the "pockets of sleaze".

 

[Guest luvthai]

If you look only for the sleeze that is all you will see. Most people have such a narrow vision of things and won't take the time to look around to find the real thailand. I love the people.

[Guest laurence]

Well, I would agree when it comes to Thai boys one is bathed in beauty!

As far as Pattaya I think beauty would be an oxymoron; not even shabby chic, just plain sleazy which is its allure for me.

As for the rest of Thailand I must get out and see more of it. Just what I have seen has been bland for the most part. Not having a car and fearful of driving hinder my ability to travel far.

But really, have any of us came to Thailand for anything other than the Thai boys? Isn't that the reason for our first visit; our frequent returns; and our lasting stays? Would anyone recommend to our friends (not sex tourist types) to visit Thailand? I would think there are many other places on earth where money would be better spent on tourist attractions. Of course there are a lot of worse places!!

I do enjoy reading all your responses and appreciate the civility, unlike one receives on other boards.

 

 

 

[Guest MonkeySee]

As for the rest of Thailand I must get out and see more of it. Just what I have seen has been bland for the most part. Not having a car and fearful of driving hinder my ability to travel far.

Yes, you really do need to get out and see more of Thailand. Not having a car should not hinder your ablility to travel. Hiring a car and driver is really not cost prohibitive. If you are more adverturous, take the government bus to an area and then hire a guide. Traveling and seeing Thailand is very easy.

 

But really, have any of us came to Thailand for anything other than the Thai boys? Isn't that the reason for our first visit

No, my first trip to Southeast Asia was to visit a friend that was working in Malaysia. A friend and I visited Malaysia, Indonesia, Singapore, Thailand, Vietnam and Hong Kong. I had no sex whatsoever in my three weeks in Thailand.

 

Isn't that the reason for our first visit; our frequent returns; and our lasting stays?

Now, that I have experienced the beauty of Thailand, I do keep returning because of the people and the warm and friendly guys.

 

Would anyone recommend to our friends (not sex tourist types) to visit Thailand?

I often recommend Thailand to many people.

 

[Guest laurence]

I had no sex whatsoever in my three weeks in Thailand.

 

Wow! Not even chuck wow? You are a Saint MonkeySee. But I did have a friend visit Thailand and Cambodia just to look at birds! He did visit Pattaya and was pleasantly shocked that a waiter offered him "his services" for a tip.

 

[Guest Steve1903]

I think the "Land Of Sleaze" title is a bit much. Prostitutes can be hired in any country in the world. Agreed that some things may be more open than in other countries but if you want to avoid seeing these things then you simply don't go into those areas. Same with Amsterdam, people go on about the red light district all the time but if you dont want to see it just to go to that area.

[Guest laurence]

Well, I did choose Land of Sleaze to perk interest in my post. I was not just referring to the sex aspects of Thailand but to the overall shoddiness I have observed. For instance Amsterdam is a charming and clean city, but is there a similar counterpart in Thailand? I simply do not know since I have not traveled enough to judge. Perhaps my judgment is clouded by much of the poverty I do see everywhere.

[Guest Steve1903]

Surely the poverty in Thailand is part of the reason things don't look spic and span wherever we go.

[Guest MonkeySee]

Wow! Not even chuck wow? You are a Saint MonkeySee. But I did have a friend visit Thailand and Cambodia just to look at birds! He did visit Pattaya and was pleasantly shocked that a waiter offered him "his services" for a tip.

 

Please don’t call me Saint Monkey! I did not visit Pattaya on that first visit; otherwise things might have been different. Not even chuck wow? I guess it all depends on what your definition of sex is?

 

[vinapu]

 

 

 

Not even chuck wow? I guess it all depends on what your definition of sex is?

 

Bill Clinton had problem with this definition as well  ( " I never had sex with that woman" )

 

My apologioes for resurrecting this old thread but I found discussion very interesting 

[Guest Jason105]

Actually, my overriding reason for returning to Thailand (I had visited while in the Navy over 30 years ago) was to buy clothes.

In my profession a suit and tie is the required/expected "uniform" and I had had a suit made there.  

When I returned, the first place I went was, not a bar, but to the tailor shop.  

I spent a few days getting measured and fitted and then choosing from all the many of available fabrics and styles.  The savings in cost between what I was able to get there and what was available "off the rack" back home more than paid for my trip!

 

Also, being a great appreciator of Thai cuisine I was restaurant hopping and enjoying great meals.  

I had found a hotel that was easily three star quality but at a one star cost.

 

I was impressed by the spiritual devotion and the proliferation of temples as well as the courtesy and gentle nature of the people.  I went to see the ruins of Ayuttaya and rode an elephant.  I have since been to Chiang Mai and the Burmese border, enjoyed the breathtaking views of the mountains and the colorful, traditional culture(s) of the northern Thai people.  I have had personal guides who explained about the things that make Thailand unique and showed me many aspects of Thai life that you have to look for to discover.  

 

And all of this has been made even more interesting by the presence and abundance of truly beautiful people...not just boys but folks on the street, in shops and most everywhere you go.

 

So, yes, I recommend that my friends and acquaintances visit Thailand.

If they are inclined to pursue "sleaze" it is available.

If they want to visit a truly interesting country, which, although politically troubled and somewhat unstable, still manages to be fascinating, friendly and fair value then Thailand is a good bet.

 

all the best

[vinapu]

For me for first 8 trips Thailand was transit country  on my way to or from somewhere in the region.

First time I arrived at night and first thing in the morning after breakfast I went to Saphan Taksin BTS took boat to Grand Palace  and before arrived there I fall madly in love with the country.

 

Sure , later on in the day  I tried my first  massage and in the evening first bar but by that time my feelings were established and had nothing to do with sleaze which is existing of course and thanks God for that.

 

Truth is while abundant  most of sleaze is well hidden, not too many people wander to soi Cowboy or Nana Plaza by chance. Patpong 1 and Walking street are a bit different but if somebody is not interested  after few steps will notice what is going on and can escape easily with grace.

 

Yes I also had my suit made to measure and 14 years later proudly use it for weddings and funerals, still squeezing in easily which makes for good feeling. And great deals on multi stars hotels are as easily to be had like they were then making Thailand one of the best existing deals for the money with Third World prices for First World values.

 

While not particular big fan of Thai food chicken with cashew nuts notwithstanding  I like what is on offer at any given time feasting mostly on fruits.

 

But Thailand biggest asset are her people, welcoming and warm. It’s just enough to sit in famous Bangkok traffic for while to realize that in every other place on the wide world it would be cacophony of honking cars  and swearwords while there everybody somehow manages to keep composure.

 

So while sleaze is accessible and well organized  for which most of us here are grateful I ’d not call Thailand Land of Sleaze sticking to smiles instead.

 

And anybody who doubts in Thailand charms apart from Soi Twilight and Boyztown just start reading Christian’s blog since he is doing outstanding job finding all those both hidden and well visible charms for us. 

[williewillie]

Back in 2008, when this thread originated, sleaze was more prevalent, especially in Sunee Plaza. Today, far less

so in the boy bars. Krazy Dragon/Krazy Pub was sleaze central way back then. So many boy bars from that

time are history now

[t0oL1]

Surely the poverty in Thailand is part of the reason things don't look spic and span wherever we go.

I blame the humidity and heat for the blackish mildew over all the white concrete buildings

[forky123]

Well, I first visited Thailand in February. My second trip is in October, I loved it that much. For me, what I think surprised me most was that although there is obvious poverty and hard living everywhere, the Thai people still have pride in what they are building, especially in Bangkok. In London, if I went just about anywhere there would be graffiti on the walls and very little pride in the surroundings. In Bangkok it was hard to find any.

 

In contrast to Vinapu, there was not a single thai dish I tried that I didn't enjoy. Some items were rather spicy, and I began measuring spicyness by how much of my face was numb at the end of the meal. That being said, most places I tried served great food. The sole exception being when a Thai lad I was with convinced me to go to an Irish Pub where the food was moderately bad.

 

Land of Sleaze? Not really. You can certainly find sleaze if you look for it, and I did, but the vast majority of what I saw there was anything but. Amazingly friendly people, working two or three jobs to support their families. After one visit I love the place. 97 days and counting till I am back.

[TMax]

Sleaze for me is a side dish and saved for the massage places, I don't go there for sleaze but I do love just about everything about Thailand and the fact that I can have some good sex at the end of the day is a bonus

[kokopelli]

Good to see that this post has been resurrected as the real Laurence has gone to a better place but his spirit lives on.

 

For me, when in Thailand my time is spent in Pattaya where sleaze also lives on. One could use other terms to describe Sodom by the Sea such as seedy, tacky, trashy and squalid. I do love it! Well more like a love-hate relationship.