This is scary!

[Guest fountainhall]

There's a small piece in today's Bangkok Post about the arrival off Phuket of the box jellyfish, a frequently deadly species rarely seen before off Thailand. Apparently a tourist already died from a sting in April. A much longer piece appeared in Sunday's edition of the South China Morning Post in Hong Kong. This is just an extract -

 

The woman screams, runs out of the water onto Patong beach, rolls on the sand and dies in agony within three minutes. She has been stung by a box jellfish.

 

The wounds from the tentacles are shocking. Within a month, tourists stop coming, resorts begin to close. The sea will be alive with the creatures. Phuket's holiday heaven is at an end.

 

That's the nightmare scenario triggered by the discovery of the fearsome box jellyfish on the island's east coast and the death of a Swedish tourist off the neighbouring destination of Krabi in April.

 

Nobody can say for sure that this scenario will happen. But nobody can say with certainty that it won't, either.

 

Two kinds of box jellyfish have suddenly appeared in the Andaman region, expanding their territory and turning up in numbers in places where they were previously unknown. While the jellyfish seem to prefer shallow tidal foreshores near mangroves, marine biologists, health officials and the entire tourism industry have become deeply concerned about what might happen next.

 

Virtually every day that researchers check, immature box jellyfish are being found near an east coast mangrove forest at Nam Bor Bay, about 4 km from the island's capital, Phuket City.

 

On Wednesday last week, three were caught up in small stake traps set by local fisherman. On Thursday, after heavy rain, there were 10 more in the traps . . . Local scientists don't yet know much about the jellyfish - first discovered off Phuket in July - including the scale of the infestation. But if two small traps net the jellyfish regularly, it's probable that thousands more are already in the water. "This is new to us," said Dr Somchai, who is now finding out all he can about the marine creature . . .

 

Unsurprisingly, the discovery of the box jellyfish has also raised concern about the reporting of drownings and marine attacks. As all three box jellyfish deaths reported in Thai waters since 2002 have been foreign tourists, speculation is rife that many more Thais might have died. Phuket's marine biolgists have raised the alert and are now handing out bottles of vinegar, the only effective treatment for box jellyfish stings, yet other local tourist officials have often proved keen not to alarm tourists.

 

In August, Hong Kong visitor Vinncci Wai Chi-chan was with her family on a weekend excursion to the small outlying island of Yao Noi when she was attacked by a stingray. "The pain was unbearable," said the school teacher. "I have never known such agony."

 

Stingrays made a return in numbers to the island's waters after an absence of several years. But the locals neglected to tell the tourists . . .

 

After the death of the Swedish girl in April, Peter Fenner of Australia's James Cook University told the Phuket marine biologists: "Making the knowledge of this possible danger public will not detract in the long term from Thailand tourism, whereas ignoring it - with subsequent deaths of tourists - will."

[Gaybutton]

In Pattaya, at least, I have never heard of any sting ray attacks. Every so often stinging jellyfish appear, but they are a different species. Their presence is usually short lived and the stings are minor unless you are allergic.

 

By the way, if you ever do get stung by a jellyfish, try to get a papaya. Papayas are readily available in Thailand year round. What you want to do is scoop out the pulp and place the exposed rind on the sting.

 

Papayas are rich in papain, an enzyme that breaks down protein. If you are familiar with Adolph's Meat Tenderizer, look at the label. You'll see that the key ingredient is papain, and that's why it works. Jellyfish stings are protein stings, so the papain in papayas works quickly to provide relief.

 

The Thai word for papaya is pronounced "mah-lah-GAW."

 

There's also a way to avoid sting rays wherever you are. Sting rays settle on the bottom and wait for their prey. Most people who get stung stepped right on top of a sting ray and bingo! Right in the calf! So, it's quite simple. Don't walk forward in the water. If you do, you have to lift your foot to take a step and if there are sting rays around, you could step on one. Instead, walk backwards in the water. That way you can easily drag your feet, rather than lift them. Sting rays will feel the vibration long before you're close enough to be stung and they'll swim away.

[KhorTose]

I have never worried about sting rays or jellyfish. My biggest worry about the beaches in Thailand is whether or not the water is clean, or I am swimming in someone elses ..... You get the point.

[Gaybutton]

You get the point.

 

Unfortunately, yes.

[Gaybutton]

Here's a little bit of clarification about the "cure" for jellyfish stings. I thought I had made it clear that the papaya trick works on minor stings. It's not going to work on a major sting, such as the box jellyfish.

 

I received a message from Topjohn5, who works in the medical field, with the following information, and his information is obviously far more reliable than mine:

_____

 

First, I am not a doctor but I am a paramedic (EMT) and I have a lot of first hand experience in trauma situations including deadly stings and venom injections.

 

I remembered reading about vinegar and the common home cures on these stings in one of my text books many years ago. So, I went and did a quick check online since my text books are in boxes somewhere, lol. I will be happy to provide you good medical text sources if you need it but a real quick read on the subject is on Wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cubozoa

 

Wikipedia does not always get it perfect sometimes but in this case they do a good job.

The bottom line is that the compound in vinegar which is acetic acid is the ONLY reliable cure for this deadly sting and not papain.

 

Of, the 19 box jellyfish species really only two can kill you and then they need to inject enough venom in you as well to do kill you. But, unfortunately, there are many deaths from these 2 creatures and acetic acid is the only thing that blocks the stingers (called nematocysts) from firing. It doesn't help the pain at all except by not allowing more injections of venom but it can save a life by blocking the firing of the stinger.

 

Papaya is one of the many urban legands that are a cure for this sting. You are right about the meat tenderizer (papain) in papaya and it does help relieve stings of all minor types which would include your basic jellyfish. But papain does nothing for this venom which is one of the most deadly animal venoms in the world.

 

Now, to be fair where there could be confusion with papaya as a cure (beside the meat tenderizer one above) could be simply from the fact that acetic acid is found naturally in small amounts when many foods especially fruits breakdown. So, it is possible that someone a long time ago got stung (but not a deadly sting) and then a rotten papaya was applied to the wound site (if there had been a rotten apple it would have worked the same way though). Since trace amounts of acetic acid were present in that papaya and, if the sting was minor, the papaya could have disabled the weak venom (very very weak venom and not this animal) and some minor relief could have occurred with the patient. But, there is NO, possible way that there is enough acetic acid in a rotten papaya (or any fruit) that would help a dying human stung by one of these creatures!

_______________

 

So, there you have it. I guess if you take along some papaya and some vinegar, but are lucky enough not to be stung, you can at least make a salad . . .

[Guest fountainhall]

My biggest worry about the beaches in Thailand is whether or not the water is clean

 

In my experience, the water off Pattaya is pretty murky, but it's mostly crystal clear off Phuket.

[Gaybutton]

In my experience, the water off Pattaya is pretty murky, but it's mostly crystal clear off Phuket.

 

You don't have to go very far from Pattaya to find crystal clear waters. Try some of the beaches toward Sattahip, to the south.

[Guest Steve1903]

The water at Pattaya is pretty much disgusting. As a seaside resort they really ought to try to clean the place up a bit. Also I find the sand very coarse on the feet. Would it be softer at other venues?

 

[Guest fountainhall]

I'm reopening this thread because there's a report on Thai Visa about the appearance of what some say are box jellyfish off Krabi. This is not unusual, given the proximity of Phuket and Krabi. But it is worrying that there is still very little in the Thai media about this. I don't want to be over alarmist, but these jellyfish kill. Two deaths were reported last year. I repeat again the comment made by a marine biologist quoted in my original post -

 

"Making the knowledge of this possible danger public will not detract in the long term from Thailand tourism, whereas ignoring it - with subsequent deaths of tourists - will."

 

[KhorTose]

Very dangerous. Experienced divers wear wet suits even in warm water where the box jellyfish is common. However, to return to my original comment, the jellyfish would never survive in Pattaya's water due to all the other things floating in the water off your beach. If I lived in Pattaya all my swimming would be in a pool.

[Guest fountainhall]

I agree with you about Pattaya - but I'm starting to think twice about spending a lot of time swimming off Phuket and the beaches in the south. Even if I just go in to cool off from the sun, I'll make sure I have a bottle of vinegar in my bag on the beach - just in case!

[Gaybutton]

I'll make sure I have a bottle of vinegar in my bag on the beach - just in case!

It may not help the sting, but at least you'll smell like salad . . .

[Guest fountainhall]

It does help the sting (so I'm told), but if the handsome first aid worker was moved to lick the salad, I'm sure I'd recover much more quickly

[Guest xiandarkthorne]

I don't know about vinegar or papaya but having worked at beach resorts in Penang for some years, I can tell you that the usual way the beach boys deal with jellyfish stings is to pee on the affected areas. I don't know if there's any medical basis for it but it seems to work.

[Gaybutton]

the usual way the beach boys deal with jellyfish stings is to pee on the affected areas.

Sounds good to me. Does it have to be one's own or would the offerings of willing donors work? Just take a whiz into an empty container, seal it up, and go to the beach. Then you'll be ready for anything. I wonder how a few beers prior to the stings would affect how well the pee works. They say red wine has health benefits. Maybe a glass or two prior to entering the infested waters would enhance the effectiveness of the pee.

 

If pee works, I wonder if a good ol' turd would work even better. If it does, then guess what I'm going to bring to the beach. When they say "take a shit," I guess I really will . . .

[Rogie]

If pee works, I wonder if a good ol' turd would work even better.

 

Imagine the scene many moons ago, many millennia in fact

 

a box jellyfish victim is brought ashore

 

the rescuers know it can be fatal, but one of them has a weak bladder and the victim revives

 

how else did all the knowledge possessed by communities arise, if not by either accident or experimentation?

 

if Gaybutton has thought of it, so must his forbears, thus I deduce it was first tried long ago and found wanting.

 

[Gaybutton]

by either accident or experimentation?

Maybe that's it, then. Maybe at just the right time, someone had a little 'accident.'

[Guest xiandarkthorne]

I don't know how it came about but I do remember once seeing this poor woman who'd been stung and she was surrounded by four or five beach boys anxiously peeing on her thigh. I guess if she didn't die of the jellyfish stings, the embarassment alone would have been enough to kill her...hahaha!

 

Seriously, though, I went to the beach to check this mornng and I was told that the boys now keep bottles of vinegar within easy reach. So it looks as if pee doesn't work on all stings.

[Guest fountainhall]

A thread has appeared on another forum about the appearance of box jellyfish off Thailand. This is in fact nothing new, as this thread here started four years ago makes clear.

 

The poisonous box jellyfish used to be extremely rare off Thailand, but the warming of the sea is thought to have encouraged them to drift north. In the South China Morning Post article I quoted at the start of this thread, local fishermen said that 13 had been caught in traps over two days. That probably means there were hundreds, if not thousands, around which did not get caught. And that was four years ago!

 

These jellyfish can kill. If you plan on going to the beach in or near Phuket, always take a small bottle of vinegar with you. If you are stung, get out of the water fast and apply the vinegar to the sting area for at least 30 seconds. That takes out the venom from the tentacles. Then get yourself to hospital quickly.

 

Their venom is considered to be among the most deadly in the world, containing toxins that attack the heart, nervous system, and skin cells. It is so overpoweringly painful, human victims have been known to go into shock and drown or die of heart failure before even reaching shore. Survivors can experience considerable pain for weeks and often have significant scarring where the tentacles made contact.

 

http://animals.natio.../box-jellyfish/

 

Looking through google, I note there was a report of box jellyfish off Krabi, also in late 2008. In Khao Lak in June this year, there was another attack, as reported on tripadviser.

 

Yet the Thai government continues to keep tourists and locals in the dark. Compare that to Hawaii or Australia where beaches are immediately closed if there is a box jellyfish attack - or one is even seen. It is only reopened after the authorities are sure the jellyfish have disappeared.

[Moses]

Yes, vinegar is good for first AID. In general words - ANY acid will work good. For example - juice of lime or lemon will help too.

 

It also will help with injuring by spines of sea urchins if parts of spines were broken and left under human skin. It is hard to extract, but easy to "melt" by acid.

[Rogie]

Here's a little bit of clarification about the "cure" for jellyfish stings. I thought I had made it clear that the papaya trick works on minor stings. It's not going to work on a major sting, such as the box jellyfish. I received a message from Topjohn5, who works in the medical field, with the following information, and his information is obviously far more reliable than mine: _____

 

"First, I am not a doctor but I am a paramedic (EMT) and I have a lot of first hand experience in trauma situations including deadly stings and venom injections. I remembered reading about vinegar and the common home cures on these stings in one of my text books many years ago. So, I went and did a quick check online since my text books are in boxes somewhere, lol. I will be happy to provide you good medical text sources if you need it but a real quick read on the subject is on Wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cubozoa Wikipedia does not always get it perfect sometimes but in this case they do a good job. The bottom line is that the compound in vinegar which is acetic acid is the ONLY reliable cure for this deadly sting. . ."

 

Yes, vinegar is good for first AID. In general words - ANY acid will work good. For example - juice of lime or lemon will help too.

 

There seems to be a difference of opinion here.

 

Vinegar is 3% acetic acid in water. Acetic acid is CH₃COOH. Lemon juice is about 5% citric acid in water, plus very small amounts of other substances. Citric acid is H₃C₆H₅O_7.

 

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_difference_between_lemon_juice_and_vinegar

 

http://www.livestrong.com/article/462039-citric-acid-vs-vinegar/