New Movie: Ender's Game - the controversy over the anti-gay author

[Guest EXPAT]

Geeks Out has launched an online protest in anticipation of the November release of Ender’s Game, based on the book written by noted homophobe and National Organization for Marriage board member Orson Scott Card. If you have any doubt about if you need to separate the movie from the author, remember, he gets a share of the profit, which he’ll use to fight against your rights.

Here is the preview of the movie coming later this year:

[Guest hitoallusa]

Well we don't condone someone who doesn't buy a product simply because it was made by a gay guy. The same thinking process applies here. We can't boycott a movie because the script/content is based on a novel written by someone with anti-gay sentiment. His work should be evaluated as what it is without bias. I think that's a fair thing to do.

The strength of the US is allowing anyone with talent regardless of their background or religious faith to contribute in whatever field they are in. Let's cherish that practice.

[JKane]

Well we don't condone someone who doesn't buy a product simply because it was made by a gay guy. The same thinking process applies here. We can't boycott a movie because the script/content is based on a novel written by someone with anti-gay sentiment. His work should be evaluated as what it is without bias. I think that's a fair thing to do.

We don't give money to somebody who may (/ has in the past) use it suppress our civil rights. When Card worked against us in the Prop 8 fight, even though I loved the original series, I gave all his books to a local used book store.

He hurt us with his actions, sorry but I don't believe in turning the other cheek or any other such claptrap.

He's written a very interesting plea though, that basically goes even further than what we've achieved, realizing that whether you personally agree or not CONSTITUTIONALLY equal rights will have to become nationwide.

> Ender’s Game is set more than a century in the future and has nothing to do with political issues that did not exist when the book was written in 1984. With the recent Supreme Court ruling, the gay marriage issue becomes moot. The Full Faith and Credit clause of the Constitution will, sooner or later, give legal force in every state to any marriage contract recognized by any other state. Now it will be interesting to see whether the victorious proponents of gay marriage will show tolerance toward those who disagreed with them when the issue was still in dispute. Orson Scott Card

My plan is to buy a ticket for something more worthy of my dollars then slip in to Ender's Game. Hopefully others will as well.

[Guest zipperzone]

hito - I don't think you got the message. He will receive $$$ from this movie and will use this money to further his hatred of Gays. If you don't understand that, why don't you just write him a cheque?

[Guest hitoallusa]

We can not prevent someone being rewarded and compensated for his hard work and creative activities because he has different views from us. I simply can't agree to it. It's against what we stand for.

[Guest NCBored]

hito - I don't think you got the message. He will receive $$$ from this movie and will use this money to further his hatred of Gays. If you don't understand that, why don't you just write him a cheque?

How do you know that? The quote posted by JKane sounds like he realizes that opposing gay marriage is a lost cause.

btw - I don't think that opposing gay marriage always equates to 'Hatred' of gays.

[Guest zipperzone]

We can not prevent someone being rewarded and compensated for his hard work and creative activities because he has different views from us. I simply can't agree to it. It's against what we stand for.

I never said we can't prevent someone being rewarded. He is welcome to whatever revenue he can secure. He just isn't going to get any of my money. My point is that we as a group should not contribute to someone or some institution/religion/company that will use our $$$ to blaspheme homosexuality.

Would you have contributed to the Mormon Church when they were spending millions to interfere with the vote in California?

Would you patronize Chick-fillet (or however it's spelled)?

Would you contribute to a campaign of a politician that is against gay marriage?

Hopefully you would not. You can take your fuzzy wuzzy views too far IMO. Stand up for what is best for gays - otherwise don't grumble and complain when hate is spewed towards us.

[Guest hitoallusa]

Well I see your point. Thank you for taking time to elaborate your point.

I never said we can't prevent someone being rewarded. He is welcome to whatever revenue he can secure. He just isn't going to get any of my money. My point is that we as a group should not contribute to someone or some institution/religion/company that will use our $$$ to blaspheme homosexuality.

Would you have contributed to the Mormon Church when they were spending millions to interfere with the vote in California?

Would you patronize Chick-fillet (or however it's spelled)?

Would you contribute to a campaign of a politician that is against gay marriage?

Hopefully you would not. You can take your fuzzy wuzzy views too far IMO. Stand up for what is best for gays - otherwise don't grumble and complain when hate is spewed towards us.

[lookin]

Well we don't condone someone who doesn't buy a product simply because it was made by a gay guy.

If we didn't buy a product just because it was made by a straight guy, then I think your analogy would be valid.

But Card goes beyond just being a straight guy and actively opposes rights which are important to gay folks. He would, if he could, have prevented my friends from getting married this morning. And Charlie. And Lucky.

If there were a gay guy who tried taking away the right of straight couples to get married, I wouldn't buy his books either.

Card is entitled to his views, as I am entitled to mine. The difference is I don't go around poking my big bazoo into his business.

[Guest hitoallusa]

We can disagree to his view and we have right to protest against it. But his literary work and creative activities should be respected and evaluated separately from his personal life. What I am suggesting is that give him a fair chance for his work to be appreciated. I believe that is a fair thing to do.

Card is entitled to his views, as I am entitled to mine. The difference is I don't go around poking my big bazoo into his business.

[caeron]

Card has his free speech rights. I have mine.

He has used his to attack our community over and over and over and over.

I will use mine to ask people that care about me and my community not to patronize him.

A boycott of his products is my _right_. Just as it is his right to spew hatred and filth.

Anyone's right to free speech and an opinion is NOT the right to be free of the consequences of that free speech or opinion. You have a right to say you hate homos. We then have the right to ask people not to give you their money.

[Guest hitoallusa]

Yes there are consequences for his actions but his creative activities should be left unharmed. You don't despise one's creative activities because let's say he supports communists. When a scientist has an ability to do his research well then he should be paid to do it regardless of his political and religious background. As a poster said, he actually liked his books before he found that he was anti-gay. As long as his creative activities do not contain propaganda against gay then why should we reject his good work?

[caeron]

Hit, You're a sweet person, but your position is ludicrous.

The money Card makes from the movie will finance hate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orson_Scott_Card

Card sits on the board of directors of the national organization for marriage, the largest and most powerful organization fighting same sex marriage. Here's a hint, if you sit on the board, you're normally a big benefactor! Card has used his bully pulpit to attack gays for DECADES. Go look at the link above, this isn't a one-off or just recent thing.

The idea that it's wrong of us to point out where this money will go and that somehow because it's 'creative' we have to turn a blind eye to the man's evil is frankly insulting to the rest of us. We are allowed to defend ourselves against an enemy that has repeatedly attacked our community.

He does NOT get a free pass.

[Guest NCBored]

Hit, You're a sweet person, but your position is ludicrous.

The money Card makes from the movie will finance hate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orson_Scott_Card

Card sits on the board of directors of the national organization for marriage, the largest and most powerful organization fighting same sex marriage. Here's a hint, if you sit on the board, you're normally a big benefactor! Card has used his bully pulpit to attack gays for DECADES. Go look at the link above, this isn't a one-off or just recent thing.

The idea that it's wrong of us to point out where this money will go and that somehow because it's 'creative' we have to turn a blind eye to the man's evil is frankly insulting to the rest of us. We are allowed to defend ourselves against an enemy that has repeatedly attacked our community.

He does NOT get a free pass.

Thanks for the link - it provided some insight.

Any idea if his compensation is tied to the success of the movie, or if he's already received a lump sum?

Update: I see that he is involved as one of the producers - does that mean he likely gets a percentage of the profits?

I confess to being torn here - I don't think art or entertainment should be judged by the beliefs or character of the creator, but I do see the argument against enabling someone's efforts to fight against our rights & beliefs.

[Guest hitoallusa]

I am not against people boycotting his books or movies if they have valid reasons . What I'm asking is his literally work needs to be evaluated fairly and objecively regardless of his personal views on gays. If he writes good books then he should be acknowledged for that. That's is simply my point.

Hit, You're a sweet person, but your position is ludicrous.

The money Card makes from the movie will finance hate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orson_Scott_Card

Card sits on the board of directors of the national organization for marriage, the largest and most powerful organization fighting same sex marriage. Here's a hint, if you sit on the board, you're normally a big benefactor! Card has used his bully pulpit to attack gays for DECADES. Go look at the link above, this isn't a one-off or just recent thing.

The idea that it's wrong of us to point out where this money will go and that somehow because it's 'creative' we have to turn a blind eye to the man's evil is frankly insulting to the rest of us. We are allowed to defend ourselves against an enemy that has repeatedly attacked our community.

He does NOT get a free pass.

[boiworship]

Zero tolerance for those who hate us. I've been humiliated in my teenage years for being gay and I'm not going to give up anything that we've fought and, yes, died for.

[caeron]

In response to Hit and NC, I'm not judging the art, because the quality of the art is irrelevant to the point of discussion. I'm not buying it.

As far as I know, it is typical for producers to share in the success of the movie, so yes, I would expect if the movie does well that Card benefits. I don't think we can know for certain, but if the movie does well there will likely be others so he would benefit that way.

[Guest NCBored]

In response to Hit and NC, I'm not judging the art, because the quality of the art is irrelevant to the point of discussion. I'm not buying it.

As far as I know, it is typical for producers to share in the success of the movie, so yes, I would expect if the movie does well that Card benefits. I don't think we can know for certain, but if the movie does well there will likely be others so he would benefit that way.

Caeron, I realize that you're not pre-judging the movie, and I respect your right to boycott and to express your views.

In my view, this is not just Card's movie - many people 'own' it and will be affected by its success or failure. Some of them probably are pro-equality. I also hate to see someone's opportunity to create suppressed because of beliefs they may hold that aren't even expressed in their works.

[Lucky]

Sadly we see gay homophobia all of the time. Congressmen and senators who are themselves gay take strong anti-gay positions either to appeal to their constituency or to cover their own identity. The there was Ken Mehlman, who did irreparable damage as a big Republican, only to reveal that he was gay when he was losing favor with the bigots. Give Larry Craig credit- he never admited to being a bigot and asking for recognition from the gay community for seeing the error of his ways.

Homophobia does not escape message boards devoted to gay topics such as this one. Many* are ashamed of who they are, afraid to reveal themselves to their families and friends. Some even defend homophobes in their posting here, not caring that if we give them money they will use it against us. It's called self-loathing, and it's sad that in this day and age gays still feel that way.

*Now, I have long since learned that not everyone can come out to their families for various valid reasons, and i do not include them in this description of self-loathing gays. Many of them proudly assist the gay community while keeping a low profile, and I understand that. That's not self-loathing.

[Guest NCBored]

Sadly we see gay homophobia all of the time. Congressmen and senators who are themselves gay take strong anti-gay positions either to appeal to their constituency or to cover their own identity. The there was Ken Mehlman, who did irreparable damage as a big Republican, only to reveal that he was gay when he was losing favor with the bigots. Give Larry Craig credit- he never admited to being a bigot and asking for recognition from the gay community for seeing the error of his ways.

Homophobia does not escape message boards devoted to gay topics such as this one. Many* are ashamed of who they are, afraid to reveal themselves to their families and friends. Some even defend homophobes in their posting here, not caring that if we give them money they will use it against us. It's called self-loathing, and it's sad that in this day and age gays still feel that way.

*Now, I have long since learned that not everyone can come out to their families for various valid reasons, and i do not include them in this description of self-loathing gays. Many of them proudly assist the gay community while keeping a low profile, and I understand that. That's not self-loathing.

Daring to say that homophobes have rights = self-loathing? That's both absurd and offensive.

I don't think anyone has defended Card's homophobia.

[caeron]

Caeron, I realize that you're not pre-judging the movie, and I respect your right to boycott and to express your views.

In my view, this is not just Card's movie - many people 'own' it and will be affected by its success or failure. Some of them probably are pro-equality. I also hate to see someone's opportunity to create suppressed because of beliefs they may hold that aren't even expressed in their works.

No, it isn't just Card's movie. But, everybody who signed on agreed to associate with Card, a producer. At some point you get to hold people responsible for the company they keep.

[Guest NCBored]

No, it isn't just Card's movie. But, everybody who signed on agreed to associate with Card, a producer. At some point you get to hold people responsible for the company they keep.

I don't think agreeing to make a movie from his work constitutes an endorsement of any views/beliefs he holds that aren't present in the work.

I guess none of his books should ever have been published, by your logic. That's a slippery slope - no one should publish, support or patronize anything unless can give the owner or creator a moral stamp of approval?

Your statement sounds, to me, very much like 'guilt by association'.

Again,, I have no issue with your desire & right to boycott the movie and anything else created by Card, but I'm wary about making judgments & assumptions about everyone who doesn't make the same choices as you.

[Lucky]

Daring to say that homophobes have rights = self-loathing? That's both absurd and offensive.

I don't think anyone has defended Card's homophobia.

You weren't paying very close attention there. Please re-read what I wrote. I am not talking about Card at all. And I would encourage you not to characterize other's posts as absurd. You are on the edge of becoming a mean girl yourself.

[Guest hitoallusa]

Here is a trailer for the movie..

[Guest hitoallusa]

Asa Butterfield is very intelligent.. I hope he can start a good career from this movie..