BiBottomBoy Posted February 6, 2013 Posted February 6, 2013 They just tabled the measure to allow gays in. TotallyOz 1 Quote
Guest hitoallusa Posted February 6, 2013 Posted February 6, 2013 Well they say they are going to decide in May.. Let's hope for the best.. Quote
Guest EXPAT Posted February 6, 2013 Posted February 6, 2013 But they are leaving it up to a vote taken by 1400 delegates. Whenever you allow a vote on civil rights typically you lose. But the gay media today say their delay might be the result of HRC (Human Rights Campaign) saying on Friday that if they only approve a national measure banning it and not force the local chapters that the HRC will say that is not good enough and still encourage the money givers to stay away. That might have spooked the board into re-thinking the need to go all the way in their ban. We'll see. Quote
BiBottomBoy Posted February 7, 2013 Author Posted February 7, 2013 Or the board might just be a bunch of pussies. Quote
Members RA1 Posted February 7, 2013 Members Posted February 7, 2013 But they are leaving it up to a vote taken by 1400 delegates. Whenever you allow a vote on civil rights typically you lose. But the gay media today say their delay might be the result of HRC (Human Rights Campaign) saying on Friday that if they only approve a national measure banning it and not force the local chapters that the HRC will say that is not good enough and still encourage the money givers to stay away. That might have spooked the board into re-thinking the need to go all the way in their ban. We'll see. I am not sure I understand the comment of "whenever you allow a vote on civil rights typically you lose". If that is so, then the majoritiy of a democratic society does not approve? Isn't that how democracy is supposed to work? If the vote is "against us" then is it not incumbent upon us to persuade them of the error of their ways/thinking? There is no doubt that BSA need to get their act together to reflect here and now. But, wouldn't it be so much better if there were to agree with "new and current visions" rather than be forced by some court? Best regards, RA1 No doubt the board is a bunch of "pussies". Quote
AdamSmith Posted February 8, 2013 Posted February 8, 2013 I am not sure I understand the comment of "whenever you allow a vote on civil rights typically you lose". If that is so, then the majoritiy of a democratic society does not approve? Isn't that how democracy is supposed to work? If the vote is "against us" then is it not incumbent upon us to persuade them of the error of their ways/thinking? There is no doubt that BSA need to get their act together to reflect here and now. But, wouldn't it be so much better if there were to agree with "new and current visions" rather than be forced by some court? Best regards, RA1 No doubt the board is a bunch of "pussies". Well, this is a serious debate. We do have a legislature that functions that way. But we also have a judiciary that, when called upon, is empowered to do things contrary to the popular will, if it finds those things in law or Constitution.In Massachusetts, polls at the time of the Supreme Judicial Court's ruling to allow same-sex marriage showed popular sentiment to be against it, roughly 57% against if memory serves. But once the court ruling took effect and the populace had opportunity to watch same-sex marriage in action, within two years popular sentiment reversed: about 60% became in favor of it. Sometimes the courts' independence in advancing unpopular causes reminds why that branch exists, and is so constituted. Quote
Members RA1 Posted February 8, 2013 Members Posted February 8, 2013 I like your result but the methodology is different from how I understand the republic form of government. I have thought the legislators should choose the "better" way regardless of what the voters say and then presuade them they were correct (or lose the next election). Unfortunately we have gutless pols now and the way you describe it is how it works all too often. Aren't state courts supposed to rule on the state constitution and the federal courts fule on the US Constitution with the feds having the ultimate say so IF the issue is truly a constitutional one? Does this not preclude judges "changing" the law? I realize you raised the issue of constitutionality. Best regards, RA1 Quote
Guest EXPAT Posted February 8, 2013 Posted February 8, 2013 If you look at the history of popular votes on civil rights, they almost always fail. The reason for that is that people are not yet ready for the change which is why the courts and legislation is a much better solution to bring civil rights. The acceptance of civil rights changes always take longer than the desire of the oppressed group would like. This is why you always hear civil rights groups campaigning against taking civil rights for a popular vote and why you see many Republicans wanting these brought to a vote because they know they will lose. Quote
Guest EXPAT Posted February 8, 2013 Posted February 8, 2013 Ellen DeGeneres weighs in on the Boy Scouts issue. Quote
Members RA1 Posted February 8, 2013 Members Posted February 8, 2013 ...You? This is a direct result of most of my posts not being accepted. Is gloats an administrator here? So, I post a word or two and then edit to add the rest of whatever rambling is on my mind at the moment. Best regards, RA1 Quote
AdamSmith Posted February 8, 2013 Posted February 8, 2013 This is a direct result of most of my posts not being accepted. Is gloats an administrator here? So, I post a word or two and then edit to add the rest of whatever rambling is on my mind at the moment. Best regards, RA1 ROFL I know. That was why I poked you thus. I have a serious point about what I said. I just now got served a beautiful meal. Back shortly. Quote
Guest hitoallusa Posted February 9, 2013 Posted February 9, 2013 Hmm who is serving my AS a nice meal... Curious one wants to know.. Quote
AdamSmith Posted February 9, 2013 Posted February 9, 2013 Restaurant named Second Empire, located in this beautiful old (Second Empire, oddly enough) historic house in Raleigh: http://www.nps.gov/nr/travel/raleigh/dod.htm Meal was so good that it helped me forget entirely whatever it was that I was going to post. Must have been of world-shaking importance. Quote
Guest hitoallusa Posted February 9, 2013 Posted February 9, 2013 One of my favorite restaurants... I have met the chef before... Very interesting guy... Quote
AdamSmith Posted February 9, 2013 Posted February 9, 2013 Nice. Was my first time there. What a wonderful place. Quote
AdamSmith Posted February 9, 2013 Posted February 9, 2013 Go eat! Are you in Paris, or another city? In any event, no excuse to go hungry in France! Quote
