To the Lurkers out there - I feel your pain

[Guest Matrix]

If you are a lurker out there - this post will not frustrate you. It will not frustrate you because I have no hot images to share with you like the others do here.

Trust me when I say the images which you can not see here are jack-off hot material.

I'm not here to be a vocal champion of making attachments available for all lurkers. I'm just here to say that I believe that all attachments should be available for all to see, whether registered or not.

I realize and respect this forums management when they say what they say about attachments versus image links which show you Ralph woods cock in one breath but use it justify their fear in another to control +18 viewership..

That's an argument I have no desire to have, but it really makes no sense.

What's happening here is a need to log-in to have the full enchilada versus a "you are not permitted to view this material" message which you get if you are not. And that also speaks to other feature here as well.

It makes no sense. Either you do, or you do not.

Now, with the droves of new visitors which may come here thru Twitter, it really comes down to a question of how many people do you want to turn away with attachments of images being viewable only to existing members and denied to new and current lurkers.

Attachments viewable only by members suck! New people will pass by an opportunity to register if the reason they came here to begin with was for images they can't even see. They will feel like they got sucker hooked into coming here and have no reason in return for coming here. Getting a "forbidden to view" message when you have a new audience is defeating any effort you may execute to get new people here.

I'm just saying that a GREAT and POPULAR new forum like this is only good for those of whom have already been here. It locks out all others of whom might register here for other reasons as well.

It's just something to think about.........

When I cant even see escort profile pics enlarged here, which I can on other sites, after leaving here, that makes me not wanting to do my business here.

I'm more than willing to pay for videos and companionship - but just to see escort pics from a site that promotes those boys - not so much when their own website which is commonly linked to their profile takes me away from here.

I've gotten off track, but image attachments, now that there is such a huge draw to that forum, should be without registration.

It turns more new people away than you would ever want to think about. Maybe even some of which you already have.

[RA1]

I don't think I understand this post. It costs no money to become a member. However, everything has a price and that includes viewing on this site.

Best regards,

RA1

[BiBottomBoy]

Yeah, registration doesn't seem like a huge price to pay.

[TotallyOz]

I'm not here to be a vocal champion of making attachments available for all lurkers. I'm just here to say that I believe that all attachments should be available for all to see, whether registered or not.

Thanks for the vocalization of your concerns. I appreciate it. We made a decision a long time ago not to allow images to be viewed by people who don't register for the site. Registration is free. It costs nothing to anyone. If they can't verify their e-mail for the site, then they don't get the privilege of viewing attachments in the forums. It is as simple as that. We don't owe lukers who refuse to register anything. If they don't feel they can complete a simple 10 second registration, then they deserve to use our bandwidth.

[Guest Matrix]

Thanks for the vocalization of your concerns. I appreciate it.

......And after 5 days of being banished to the shit can, I appreciate your fair and thoughtful response as well.

However, I am forced to question the sincerity of your appreciation toward my vocalization Oz. - as you have allowed this "appreciated" post to rot here now, as I mentioned, for 5 days without comment or concern.

You can demonstrate your true appreciation for a member's expression on these forums - By first abolishing this forum, and then, denouncing Ty's actions for creating it in the first place.

Then, and only then, can your statement of appreciation truly be viewed and accepted as genuine.

[TotallyOz]

However, I am forced to question the sincerity of your appreciation toward my vocalization Oz. - as you have allowed this "appreciated" post to rot here now, as I mentioned, for 5 days without comment or concern.

You can demonstrate your true appreciation for a member's expression on these forums - By first abolishing this forum, and then, denouncing Ty's actions for creating it in the first place.

Then, and only then, can your statement of appreciation truly be viewed and accepted as genuine.

5 days went by without comment from me as I wanted things to cool off before I said anything. That does not negate the genuineness of my comments. They were genuine. They still are.

I do not have the power to abolish this forum. Even if I did, I would not do so. When you work with other people on any project, you put your trust into them and you don't get involved every time disputes arise. Tampa Yankee is amazing to work with. He has also earned my trust and respect for many years. When he makes a decision, it is done. I stand behind him.

Honestly, I did not understand this entire issue. In between sauna boys in Brazil, I don't really have time or energy to think too much. When I saw the forum, I did chuckle. I thought, lets give it a day. Now, I think it is a great idea. When posts that we consider to much for the main forum, we move here instead of the Moderators forum or the trash can. It gives a record of posts for the site. I wish we had done this ages ago.

[Guest lurkerspeaks]

ok.. my two cents worth..

Is it the name of the forum that is causing the dissention here, or just the fact that the forum exists? Personally, I do think it is funny, but I could see ill will coming from having what you perceive as a legit post being moved to "the shit can"...Would it help to rename it something a little less "confrontational" like "the recycle bin", "the clearance rack" or "the bargain basement"..???

[TampaYankee]

ok.. my two cents worth..

Is it the name of the forum that is causing the dissention here, or just the fact that the forum exists? Personally, I do think it is funny, but I could see ill will coming from having what you perceive as a legit post being moved to "the shit can"...Would it help to rename it something a little less "confrontational" like "the recycle bin", "the clearance rack" or "the bargain basement"..???

That does sound more PC, but less honest and direct. Shall we hint at the sweet smell of the rank stench of bullshit? Will that make it smell better?

This is not intended to offend just to remark that it is not necessarily bad to call a spade a spade.

I shall have more to say on this forum shortly. I have wanted to give it and me some time to age.

[Guest Matrix]

5 days went by without comment from me as I wanted things to cool off before I said anything. That does not negate the genuineness of my comments. They were genuine. They still are.

I do not have the power to abolish this forum. Even if I did, I would not do so. When you work with other people on any project, you put your trust into them and you don't get involved every time disputes arise. Tampa Yankee is amazing to work with. He has also earned my trust and respect for many years. When he makes a decision, it is done. I stand behind him.

Honestly, I did not understand this entire issue. In between sauna boys in Brazil, I don't really have time or energy to think too much. When I saw the forum, I did chuckle. I thought, lets give it a day. Now, I think it is a great idea. When posts that we consider to much for the main forum, we move here instead of the Moderators forum or the trash can. It gives a record of posts for the site. I wish we had done this ages ago.

So to ensure that I am comprehending what you are saying here Oz - You are saying that you appreciated my post and that you are genuinely appreciative of the effort I made [in my now banished post to the shit can] to offer personal suggestions which might better the site.

Thank you at least for that.

You're also saying that you favor such a forum which does nothing short of publicly mock, disrespect and ridicule a member's post; which once moved to this "shit can forum" publicly identifies the member and his post as garbage - and not fit for the forum it was originally posted in, nor any other forum, for that matter, at MER.

When you're on the receiving end of something like this at 2 O'clock in the morning, by the hand of an admin who has a personal vendetta to wage, and you then find out about it later in the next day, with no explanation - I guarantee you Oz, that you will not feel good about ever posting here again. And I'm sure that was exactly Tampa Yankee's motive and agenda to begin with.

I have difficulty with this Oz. I have difficulty with this because on one hand you are expressing gratitude to me for my time and my effort reflected in my post which has found itself, here, in the shit can. A place for garbage which is not fit for any other forum here at MER. But you are, nonetheless, still grateful and genuinely appreciative.

With the MER forums struggling to reach an audience outside of a hand-full of daily posters, this really is not going to achieve anything but to drive people away.

There was no need for this forum to be thrown together at 2am last Saturday morning and there was in my view no reason to place me in it.

I may not be the most popular poster here, but to establish a forum only to shit in and on my face, is cowardly.

But that's just my opinion. Perhaps you could share with me, and other members here as well, as to why I am here to begin with. If for no other reason, than to prevent others, such as myself, from becoming the public mockery and descent, which I have become here.

That would be sweet of you.

[lookin]

Personally, I'd have a moderate preference for being able to see images without being logged in, as I often don't log in when I visit. I know I miss some images that migrate downward between logins, but I definitely see the other side of the equation and respect the position that TY and OZ have taken.

But I think this thread is about more than images. I intially took Matrix's suggestion at face value, and was surprised by the seemingly outsized reaction to it. I felt bad for Matrix, and thought about posting here for awhile just to keep him company.

Now it appears that there's a disturbance in the force here that this poor Wookie just doesn't understand yet.

Seeking enlightenment, I have pinged Doobie-Wan Kenobi, Obi-wan's older brother, and a personal friend. Perhaps he knows something.

[Guest Matrix]

I shall have more to say on this forum shortly. I have wanted to give it and me some time to age.

That's a chicken shit way of rising from beneath your responsibility now that your side-kick has realized it's a necessary thing to respond to. If you needed more time to age..then I suspect your time has come and gone long before this.

I can't wait.

[TampaYankee]

Gawd, but you are a drama queen!! Lighten up. No one is asking you to be happy or forgive or forget, just stop the foot-stomping breast-thumping tantrums like a child. It doesn't present you in the best light or generate much sympathy and it won't get you anything positive from me.

... by the hand of an admin who has a personal vendetta to wage... And I'm sure that was exactly Tampa Yankee's motive and agenda to begin with.

How over the top. How egocentric. I have no personal vendetta against you. To the contrary, I have been accused of turning a blind eye to you, if not showing you favortism.

Based on past behavior and posts, members have demanded that I dismiss you from the forum, multiple members, multiple incidents. I resisted. When you made early morning posts bordering on divulging personal information of others and making unsubstantiated announcements that could have been intrepreted as breaking site taboos, I quietly removed the offending posts and informed you privately about why. I chose to interpret your actions as falling in a gray area under extenuating circumstances rather than crossing a line. It was a judgement call. So much for my vendetta against you.

I think you are a valuable contributor even if I do not believe every contribution you make is valuable. I'm not sure that I could say differently for anyone here else either. Nobody bats a thousand, I certainly don't.

Perhaps you could share with me, and other members here as well, as to why I am here to begin with. If for no other reason, than to prevent others, such as myself, from becoming the public mockery and descent, which I have become here.

Here we go over the top drama again. You made a pissy post by my lights. Not the first time and probably not the last. Others have made pissy posts. I suspect I have some in my past too. So get over it. You are not a witch or a leper. If you wish to portray yourself as one then that is your drama trip. I'm not following.

As for explaining the forum and why your post was selected to inaugurate it, that is on me, not Oz. An explanation will be forthcoming soon, as I said earlier above.

[Guest Matrix]

Gawd, but you are a drama queen!! Lighten up. No one is asking you to be happy or forgive or forget, just stop the foot-stomping breast-thumping tantrums like a child. It doesn't present you in the best light or generate much sympathy and it won't get you anything positive from me.

That's just rich beyond belief Yankee. You who engaged this all, is now calling me a drama queen for responding.

How over the top. How egocentric. I have no personal vendetta against you. To the contrary, I have been accused of turning a blind eye to you, if not showing you favortism.

How over the top? How egocentric? really!? Really?

Based on past behavior and posts, members have demanded that I dismiss you from the forum, multiple members, multiple incidents. I resisted. When you made early morning posts bordering on divulging personal information of others and making unsubstantiated announcements that could have been intrepreted as breaking site taboos, I quietly removed the offending posts and informed you privately about why. I chose to interpret your actions as falling in a gray area under extenuating circumstances rather than crossing a line. It was a judgement call. So much for my vendetta against you.

Ok, as we say in the politics forum. Source it. Facts please. Back up this convenient out for you Tampa, with names and occasions. I encourage anyone from who may be one of those which Tampa is claiming to step forward, and speak your piece.

I think you are a valuable contributor even if I do not believe every contribution you make is valuable. I'm not sure that I could say differently for anyone here else either. Nobody bats a thousand, I certainly don't.

Eat my ass Tampa Yankee, since you're now attempting to publicly and gently lick my balls out of this. No Admin, not even deej, who thought a member was a valuable contributor, would ever have done what you have done here. You've gotten publicly called on the carpet, and you're now being held accountable for your actions - which you STILL have no answer for..

As for explaining the forum and why your post was selected to inaugurate it, that is on me, not Oz. An explanation will be forthcoming soon, as I said earlier.

You keep saying that, but that's all you've ever had to do. Since you can't explain it, you call me a drama queen, over the top, etc.

Nobody ever asked you for anything Tampa , but why. Yet you cannot even respond to that without an answer other than calling me names, over the top, drama queen, etc.

Take your time Tampa. I'll wait. It isn't like the forums here are busting loose with new, or even old members posting interesting conversations that require your attention.

[Guest zipperzone]

I think FOX is auditioning reality shows for the upcoming winter season. If none of you mind, I'm submitting your names for consideration. If they take you on I'll expect 10%

[BiBottomBoy]

Matrix is all upset over this.

Meanwhile I'm sitting here trying to dream up posts that would be so offensive that TY would have to move them to the shit can forum.

I'd consider it an honor!

Maybe a long involved post on drinking rent boy santorum out of a Christal challace?

A link to Two Girls, One Cup?

A pro stealthing post?

A guide to Ambien sex?

My true opinion, as a Mets fan, of the Yankees?

What do I need to do to make it to the shit can forum?

[Guest jguckert]

I don't believe I have posted much here in the past as I have mostly been active on the other site. However, for various reasons, I have become somewhat bored with the other site so I came here to check things out to see if it would be a better alternative for me. I have to say that seeing this new forum "The Shit Can", I am very discouraged about this being the better alternative. From my perspective, not knowing but frankly not caring about the history with Matrix postings, it is unimaginable to me that there would be such a forum created that clearly ridicules a poster. The mere existence of such a forum sends a message that is not very inviting to anyone considering becoming active here. Just a view from an outsider.

[TotallyOz]

I don't believe I have posted much here in the past as I have mostly been active on the other site. However, for various reasons, I have become somewhat bored with the other site so I came here to check things out to see if it would be a better alternative for me. I have to say that seeing this new forum "The Shit Can", I am very discouraged about this being the better alternative. From my perspective, not knowing but frankly not caring about the history with Matrix postings, it is unimaginable to me that there would be such a forum created that clearly ridicules a poster. The mere existence of such a forum sends a message that is not very inviting to anyone considering becoming active here. Just a view from an outsider.

I do appreciate that view as an outsider. May I ask, since you have been here for a few years and you have only posted 2 times, what is it about this thread that got to you? Do you think we are unwelcoming of newcomers? Was that your impression for the past few years?

I am sure the new forum was not meant to mock anyone. The fact that only one post has been moved there doesn't mock that poster. There may be other posts that get moved there as well. I find this an easy way to deal with posts which one of us feel over the top. In this case, a Moderator felt the topic has been discussed before many times and decided to move the post here. It was not altered. It was not deleted. Is that indicative of other sites? I don't think so.

We do welcome all here. And, if you have been keeping up with us for 3 years you should know that you are welcome here! I hope to see more posts from you in the future.

[Guest jguckert]

I do appreciate that view as an outsider. May I ask, since you have been here for a few years and you have only posted 2 times, what is it about this thread that got to you? Do you think we are unwelcoming of newcomers? Was that your impression for the past few years?

I am sure the new forum was not meant to mock anyone. The fact that only one post has been moved there doesn't mock that poster. There may be other posts that get moved there as well. I find this an easy way to deal with posts which one of us feel over the top. In this case, a Moderator felt the topic has been discussed before many times and decided to move the post here. It was not altered. It was not deleted. Is that indicative of other sites? I don't think so.

We do welcome all here. And, if you have been keeping up with us for 3 years you should know that you are welcome here! I hope to see more posts from you in the future.

I will try to answer as best I can your questions. I honestly have not frequented the forum here enough over the last couple of years to be able to say anything about being unwelcoming or really having much of an impression one way or the other. I don't feel my lack of participation is anything more than just maintaining old habits. I just decided to come back here and see how things are and of the current active threads this one was the most interesting to me because it spoke about the relationship between administrators and posters, sometimes tense but always interesting.

While the new forum was not meant to mock anyone, intentions are often one thing and how it is perceived is another. It is not the specific thread that has been moved here but just the idea of the category even existing that makes me feel a bit ill at ease. The category is described as "A repository for pissy threads and garbage not fit for other forums". What is pissy or garbage to one person may be constructive criticism or a feast to someone else. If something is judged by someone as being over the top, what real harm is there to just let it be where it is and not be identified specifically as pissy or garbage. I may be very sincere in starting or contributing to a thread but if it is somehow judged that it should be moved to "The Shit Can", can you imagine how I would feel about my attempt at contributing?

One thing that I must say that I applaud is the point about not altering or deleting the thread and that is a very encouraging element of this forum. I am sure I have not articulated myself very well and went on a bit long but I hope you get a general feeling of what makes me uncomfortable with this category "The Shit Can". I appreciate the effort you have made to make me feel welcome and I assure you that I will make a sincere effort to be much more active here.

[Guest Matrix]

Stumping for change and growth – will never be a one spit in the bucket campaign.

To grow, and to become or remain relevant, one must always be re-evaluating one's position in the marketplace. Whether you are building automobiles, or creating website destinations that offer entertainment and interactive tools to draw and maintain an audience, one must always be willing to review his business model and adapt change where change is beneficial.

I stumped for change here at MER for the manner in which images and videos were presented. I made few friends in doing so, and had little support from others while making my case. Some were supportive – but it was the constant drumbeat of a better way – which finally resulted in a much more user friendly forum to visit today.

Today, Mer's Pornification forum is one of the most visited forums here according to my stats and that's because of the efforts of those who post images and videos there now have an exclusive destination where those images and videos can be found and archived, enjoyed and appreciated with one click of your mouse - by all.

Revitalizing a website from the brink of extinction - which these forums were just a short time ago, is not an easy thing to do. One of the first lessons one learns in these situations is not repeating the failed business model which lead to that point in the first place.

Slandering and humiliating MER members by moving their contributions to the shit can forum – which is defined as a repository for garbage not fit for any other forum (that would include the member and his post) is not a way to achieve this goal.

Tampa Yankee will probably argue, (I have no idea what he will claim at the moment - if anything) that my post was a repetition of a post which I once made before, somewhere else, during another time – which I already knew the answer to. And that since I already knew what position he and Oz were taking with attachments in the pornification forum, I shouldn't have made it. And that will probably be his reasoning and bent logic, for, his "fit of pique" at 2 O'clock in the morning last weekend when he created the shit can forum and then dragged me and my post into it; to scold, embarrass and humiliate me, a MER member, because of it.

He sure didn't mind my "relentless" stumping for the pornification forum when I was so doing so and in the end, even he will probably admit, it was the right way to go. But to further my point, even though there's a great forum which defines content, the forum is now simply one huge forum of attachments. Now I'm sure that TY and Oz are enjoying the additional page views which clicking all these attachments generate, but whether you are a member or not, if you're not logged in, they are worthless.

I won't delve into Ty's claims that attachments protect the site from underage viewers. Simply by allowing image url's which allow anyone to view hard cocks fucking ass and mouth, etc., without being logged-in conflicts with not only this misguided notion of this, but of Oz's claim above, which provided a much more honest account of the attachments issue and why it is now, and was in the beginning, simply a collaborative site decision between himself and TY to get people to register. We see how well that went. But at least Oz is honest about it in his accounting's.

So what I will say in closing to all of this, is simply this:

If you're really interested in salvaging these forums from the brink of extinction – instead of spending your time in the wee-hours of the morning creating forums which are designed only to humiliate, embarrass and alienate others from participating – try spending those hours learning about, and understanding, the many social platforms available, which are currently being used by others to attract, draw and maintain new people into the countless number of successful websites and forums found throughout our community.

Otherwise, this site will continue to be the dying failure it has been for so very long.

You don't have the luxury of being arrogant to the point where your actions lose membership.

[Guest Matrix]

Because media sharing here reflects nothing other than youtube links as apposed to embeds from every other source where video exists for us all today.......This is all I can really link to because these forums are so unfriendly and deficient to anything else. Nonetheless, this works. sort of.

Thanks, and my very best to every one and each of you...

[BiBottomBoy]

Matrix, I liked you until your last comment - because I sense that you like stirring up shit as much as I do.

But... I can't respect anyone who listens to Queen or Hall & Oates.

Both groups are signs that there is no benevolent god.

[xenophile]

But... I can't respect anyone who listens to Queen...

Them there's fightin' words, put up your Dukes, frenchie! Since we're in a sandbox, it's pounding time.

Both groups are signs that there is no benevolent god.

Though I can't argue at all with that one... god is a Sadist & loves a good fight!

[BiBottomBoy]

Queen made what were essentially rip offs of Andrew Loyd Weber show tunes and tried to convince the world that it was rock and roll.

Meanwhile, Hall & Oates tried to convince the world that white people had soul - and failed.

[Guest Daddy]

I've been following this cluster fuck of management choices to build a kinder and more gentle forum environment for everyone who visits here to enjoy since this thread began.

While matrix can be an aggressive poster here from time to time it is clear to at least this poster that he was singled out to be the Yankee's whipping boy because of his continuous contributions to try new ideas to draw in new members. That was an unfortunate miscalculation in my view which only highlighted an easy upper hand mentality against someone who had obviously gotten under someone else's skin for whatever reason that may be.

To use an existing member as a guinea pig and whipping boy for a new concept in segregating what some may feel are undesirable posts lacks forethought and foresight.

That is just my opinion about this not necessarily how I feel about a forum of this type in general.

[TampaYankee]

I've been following this cluster fuck of management choices to build a kinder and more gentle forum environment for everyone who visits here to enjoy since this thread began.

While matrix can be an aggressive poster here from time to time it is clear to at least this poster that he was singled out to be the Yankee's whipping boy because of his continuous contributions to try new ideas to draw in new members. That was an unfortunate miscalculation in my view which only highlighted an easy upper hand mentality against someone who had obviously gotten under someone else's skin for whatever reason that may be.

To use an existing member as a guinea pig and whipping boy for a new concept in segregating what some may feel are undesirable posts lacks forethought and foresight.

That is just my opinion about this not necessarily how I feel about a forum of this type in general.

Where do you guys come up with delusional stuff like this? <---- rhetorical question