My recent trip to Pattaya and BKK

[firecat69]

Just returned from 28 days in Thailand and thought I'd share some thoughts.

 

I am well aware that individual perceptions are colored by many things so dont think anything I say is written in stone , rather just my feelings on this trip.

 

Arrived in Pattaya on march 6 and would have to say I found the bars and beach fairly slow. Certainly not High Season.

 

Sunee Plaza has really gone down hill in the quality of the boys IMO.

 

I went to Jimmy Jimmy James 3 times early and found no one that could be described as really cute, handsome or whatever. This is quite a change from my last trip in November. Kaos was always a llittle young for me but at least some really good looking ones, this time very few attractive ones again IMO.

Krazy Dragon has fallen the furthest. In November I could never walk in there without seeing 5 or 6 boys who tweaked my interest . This time the number was Zero. So overall I found Sunee to be a disaster except for the food at Po Pot which ranged from decent to exceptional when considering the price.

 

Boystown was a little better. The new Wild Wild West had plenty of cute boys as did Dynamite and Dream Boys. Other bars sometimes had at least 1 or 2 cute ones.. They also seemed to have more customers.

 

The beach at Jomtien was very slow and almost no eye candy on a daily basis. I usually spend most dys at Jomtien at the orange chairs but this trip found myelf going there seldom.

 

BKK is totally different enviroment . Once you get by the outrageous drink prices I do believe there were better looking boys in BKK then Pattaya. I'm not sure I ever felt that way before. The other difference in BKK is the existence of many good massage parlors where the boys can be very handsome and the massage and extras very good. I do not find anything comparable in Pattaya. IMO Future Boys is the best in BKK with over 100 boys most nights and something for everyone.

 

I found the airport easy on arrival and departure except for the placement of carts when you arrive at departure and the small carts once you are through immigration. I found the lines fast in both directions and the walks bearable with the moving walkways. I also did not have a problem finding mens rooms.

[Gaybutton]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but I don't know what point you are trying to make without providing some sort of description as to what constitutes handsome or good looking in your eyes. For example, many people like muscles and lots of definition. For others, that's precisely what they don't like. Some people say a cute face is what they look for first, but what is cute to some is ugly to others. Some people like the "rough trade" type. Others like the more feminine type. It's all a matter of individual taste, isn't it?

[TotallyOz]

Having known Firecat for more years than I can remember, his tastes in guys have always been impeccable. He has introduced me to 3 of my favorite boys in all of Canada. The boy in the company of him on this trip is simply divine and a true catch. He normally goes for the sexy boy next-door type with a sexy smile and a nice body. Yes, I know it all depends on what type you like. If you go for only the muscle boys or lady boys, his tastes may not be for you.

 

I can say that I would trade most guys I have ever met in LOS for one night with one boy he introduced to me many years ago in Montreal and I see every night I am in that amazing city.

 

Plus, my first Thai boy was with me for over 2 1/2 years. He introduced him to me.

 

Thanks for the report Firecat. It is appreciated!

[Guest pete1969]

My BF has told me that a large number of boys from Phuket are now working at Future Boys. I would agree that bar is one of BKK's best, although the two hottest guys I saw in LOS the four months I spent there last year both were working at Jupiter 2002.

 

The drink prices at the Soi Twilight bars in BKK are over twice what I pay for well drinks and beers here in the US (at the current exchange rate, drinks in the most popular BKK bars are running about $7.50 USD).

 

The last time I was in LOS, I found the rotation of boys in and out of My Way in Phuket to be astonishing (I use this bar as an example because I was there at least 5 times per week for three months). On some nights, not a single guy I really liked. On other nights, there would be 10 guys I thought were superstars. My dream guy (for looks) only worked three of the nights for the three months I was in Phuket! Another favorite was only there 5 times in three months. I think a lot of the quality one finds in go-go bars depends on the night or the week or the season. Sure, some go-go bars never have much that appeals, but in most, a different night can really bring a change of faces.

 

Pete

[firecat69]

My BF has told me that a large number of boys from Phuket are now working at Future Boys. I would agree that bar is one of BKK's best, although the two hottest guys I saw in LOS the four months I spent there last year both were working at Jupiter 2002.

 

 

Pete ,

 

I agree with you that some of the best looking Athletic boys I have ever seen are at Jupiter.

 

For me the problem at Jupiter is the boys rarely deliver what is promised and expect the highest rates around. Their attitude changes drastically once you have offed them. At least that has been my experience

[Guest pete1969]

FC,

 

MY current BF worked for two years at Jupiter, and he would agree with you 100%. I have never offed a Jupiter guy, and my BF would not let me. "Too expensive," he said, "and not do enough for the money."

 

The Jupiter guys know they are at the top of the go-go food chain, and really most of them don't much care for Western farang taking them off anyway. They want Asian customers who on average tip better, have smaller bodies and smaller dicks, and expect less. My BF tells me that most Asian customers are fairly vanilla, don't press for much in the sex department, are more than willing to accept a hand job or a quick f***, and certainly are usually better tippers and more generous with gifts and shopping. The Jupiter staff would be very happy if only Japanese customers patronized their bar. YES, there are exceptions, but for the most part, it is true. My BF told me he rarely consented to even go off with a Westerner customer when he worked at Jupiter unless it was after midnight, and he needed the off.

 

HOWEVER, as my BF also tells me, what many of these Jupiter guys and other go-go sticky rice queens have not yet learned is that Asian customers are really only interested in go-go boys as paid staff. Asian customers are nice and generous, but the vast majority have no desire to have a relationship with a Thai go-go boy (face and social status are major concepts in all Asian countries, not jsut LOS). They may communicate with a favorite boy, return to see them, and may even send a little money when needed (although rare), but at the end of the day it will always be a customer-service provider relationship.

 

So a Westerner may not be as good a customer on the first date, but if a Thai go-go boy wants to find a BF, settle down, and build a life away from the bars with a partner who doesn't treat him as little more than a servant, it will almost always be with Western guy. So give them a couple of years, and those cocky Jupiter guys might be a little more eager to please (although they probably won't be working at Jupiter then--it is no surprise I met my former sticky-rice queen BF at My Way and not at Jupiter).

 

Pete

[Guest xiandarkthorne]

FC,

 

MY current BF worked for two years at Jupiter, and he would agree with you 100%. I have never offed a Jupiter guy, and my BF would not let me. "Too expensive," he said, "and not do enough for the money."

Actually not true for all the boys. I've had both very good and bad ones from there - same as any other bar.

 

They want Asian customers who on average tip better, have smaller bodies and smaller dicks, and expect less. My BF tells me that most Asian customers are fairly vanilla, don't press for much in the sex department, are more than willing to accept a hand job or a quick f***, and certainly are usually better tippers and more generous with gifts and shopping.

 

I'm not sure if this isn't racist but I'll let it pass. On the other hand, I can assure you that I am not vanilla at all (I am an outed BDSM Dom after all) and anyone I off will certainly earn his money. Oh and one more thing...like most Penangites, I am to put it kindly, highly thrifty. If you've ever visited any of the BDSM dating sites, you'll also find a very high number of Asians who'd happily put a rentboi through his paces...if they could afford to pay him enough for it or if they could just overcome their own inhibitions long enough to approach a rentboi about the kind of things they wanted to do. Lucky me! I am completely shameless about what I like doing...I'm just too stingy to pay for it very often!

 

...Asian customers are really only interested in go-go boys as paid staff. Asian customers are nice and generous, but the vast majority have no desire to have a relationship with a Thai go-go boy (face and social status are major concepts in all Asian countries, not jsut LOS). They may communicate with a favorite boy, return to see them, and may even send a little money when needed (although rare), but at the end of the day it will always be a customer-service provider relationship.

 

I can't speak for all Asians (just like some people shouldn't speak for all Occidentals) but I think just as many Orientals get heartbroken by Thaiguys for the same reasons. If you've ever had a look at any of the Asian gay men's groups and their postings, you'll find the same kind of complaints and fears being aired as you see here. To put it crudely, Thai guys are just as much a fabled commodity in Singapore, Malaysia and Taiwan as they are in the west,

 

So a Westerner may not be as good a customer on the first date, but if a Thai go-go boy wants to find a BF, settle down, and build a life away from the bars with a partner who doesn't treat him as little more than a servant, it will almost always be with Western guy.

 

Not always true either. I had a Malaysian friend who sold his car, gave up his job and went to live with a Swedish man who proceeded to throw him out without a single cent after three weeks of making my friend cook, clean and service him sexually. My friend had to borrow money from other Asians he met at his Swedish language class (for which he paid from the little money he took to Europe) to get back to Malaysia.

 

There are two reasons why barboys prefer Western men and they are both quite simple and typical of many Asians' mentality. To put things in perspective truthfuly - and painfully - most financially challenged Asians think that Occidentals have more money - and can offer better opportunities if they marry an Asian legally and take him home to Europe or Australia or America or whatever. Remember that in this part of the world, it is still considered honourable to 'sacrifice oneself' for the benefit of one's family (grandpa, grandma, papa, mama, brothers, sisters and the rest of the village),

 

Better-off and better educated Asians want to marry/form LTR with men from the west because they feel that being carted off to an Occidental nation (okay, I could have said 'being swept off their feet' I know...) means that they will have the freedom to be themselves - read 'uninhibitedly gay' - and not have to worry about disgracing their families within their own communities with their 'unmentionable perversion' among other things.

 

My apologies if I've burst anybody's bubbles here.

 

Xian

[Guest pete1969]

Xian, I have little experience with Asian tourists in LOS as far as communicating with them and really knowing if what I wrote is true or not true from their perspective. You are one of very few Asians on these boards.

 

I'm merely repeating what my BF has told me and what his views are. I never like to speak in absolutes and realize that there are always exceptions. I think the perceived differences between Asian and Western customers is an interesting discussion. It is very nice to have some input from an Asian person.

 

Pete

[Guest xiandarkthorne]

Xian, I have little experience with Asian tourists in LOS as far as communicating with them and really knowing if what I wrote is true or not true from their perspective. You are one of very few Asians on these boards.

 

I'm merely repeating what my BF has told me and what his views are. I never like to speak in absolutes and realize that there are always exceptions. I think the perceived differences between Asian and Western customers is an interesting discussion. It is very nice to have some input from an Asian person.

 

Pete

 

Hi Pete,

Your boyfriend was right in many ways, too. I hope I didn't imply that he was all wrong. And I can certainly understand that there are numerous differences in perception from the points of view of the bar workers, the farang tourist and the Asian visitor especially.

 

Even among the Asians, there are fundamental differences. The Singaporeans, Taiwanese and Japanese are the ones with the most money to spend - the younger ones (Malaysians included) are the more likely to be 'vanilla all night' because they are also less likely to be as emotionally determined (I hate to say 'hardened') and because of that, much more inhibited in their play. They are also more likely to fall for 'buffalo die, send money' tricks, judging from the number of posts I saw on the matter at a certain Asian gay group.

 

Older ones like me are probably less shy, I hope I'm not wrong to say, and have more money to spend on getting what we really want - even if we are also much more careful about how we spend it. But then, most Asian men my age or close to it either side of 50, are also not in particularly good physical condition and probably do not carry repeater rifles in their pants (my friend's wife says twice in one night every three days is their best...how she knows, I didn't dare ask....).

 

On top of that, older Asians' more conservative upbringing is such that they aren't likely to want to 'cuddle all night' like younger and less jaded ones seem to want to do. Some of the members of this board who know me from other boards can tell you that I like highly erotic naked cuddling and its consequences until dawn though I've seldom had much success getting it in LOS...but that's another story...

 

Oh dear...I'm pontificating again, aren't I? Well, you should take what I say with a very large dose of salt because I am not your typical Asian in any way - if you read my blog, you'll see how and why. To be honest, I am more a combination of all the Asian types above, only in much better physical condition, more randy and with a fair bit of quirky kink thrown in for good measure.

 

Incidentally, I don't think I am one of the few Asians here. If you look at the profiles, you'll see many. But I think I can safely say that I am one of the few happily out and about ones with the linguistic skills to articulate (okay, okay...pontificate...happy?) my thoughts and impressions. I suppose I'm also one of the few who actually take the trouble to think about such things in depth instead of simply joining and hoping for quick hook-ups with movie star lookalikes. Hah!

[Guest BKKvisitor]

Have to say that I find all the comments on this thread fascinating. Pete always has something useful to report about gay life in the LOS and xiandarkthorne's contributions have a way of putting things in relief. He's in a position to offer what I consider truly unique takes on situations that I admit baffle me. His posts mostly confirm what I've found to be true--or should I say accurate--about relationships between Thais and westerners and, more expansively, with other Asians. The distinctions he make provide a lot of insight. Keep it coming, guys!

 

 

[Guest wowpow]

Jupiter certainly has the best choreographed show of any Bangkok Go-go bar and their all new athletic acts are going down a treat.

 

I dropped in there yesterday and it was packed to the ceiling with no seating remaining for the 10.40 show. As it was also rather smoky I did not stay.

 

I have always been aware that this bar attracts a higher percentage of Asians than the other bars. I have often been the only farang in the place.

 

The few boys that I have offed from there have been spectacular in bed and very lubelaw and happy with my regular tip amount.

 

For me it is certainly among my top three Bangkok bars and I don't baulk at paying 200 baht for a drink and a pretty professional show. I think it may be 20 baht more on Fridays and Saturdays. Outrageous - puleeze!

[TotallyOz]

Several very interesting comments in this thread. It has my mind working overtime. Thanks guys for a few new perspectives.

[Guest pete1969]

I know with my BF that he was mostly used to Japanese and Tawianese customers with a few Singaporeans and Malaysians thrown in. It seems to be well discussed among bar staff (both men and women) that Japanese customers are by far the best: the best tippers, the most polite, the least likely to exhibit bad or rude behavior in bed. My BF loved Japanese customers because "they smelled the best and were always very clean." I guess many Westerners don't come out very well in that regard. LOL.

 

One of the more interesting things my BF has his ear to the ground about is what impact mainland Chinese tourists will have and how they will pan out as customers. He thinks that tourism from gays in China will boom in the next few years as more and more middle and upper class Chinese come out (or at least feel comfortable going into a gay bar in another country). Of course, he is half Chinese and speaks fluent Chinese, so he may be a bit biased.

 

Wowpow, thanks for the update on Jupiter. I too love that bar and the show. I just wish the seating was a little more comfortable. Interestingly, it is actually owned by a straight woman whose husband is a high ranking police official. I think she also owns the Suriwong Hotel. She is a smart lady and runs a great bar.

 

Pete

[Guest buaseng]

Interestingly, it is actually owned by a straight woman whose husband is a high ranking police official. I think she also owns the Suriwong Hotel. She is a smart lady and runs a great bar.

Don't know about the bar, I have only used it once because of the rip-off drink prices and uncomfortable seating, but the Suriwongse Hotel is the PITS !

 

It must be, by far, the worst 'tourist' hotel in the whole of Bangkok. It is dirty, noisy, smelly, cramped and with appalling reception and house staff service. The restaurant, with its sub-standard food and indifferent waiter service is, frankly, crap.

[Guest BKKvisitor]

Pete wrote:

 

"My BF loved Japanese customers because "they smelled the best and were always very clean." I guess many Westerners don't come out very well in that regard."

 

This could probably qualify as a topic on its own merit. I am always careful to shower and scrub before going out and before joining a friend in bed. I've had more than a few guys comment: "you smell good" or something similar. If you are in the LOS even for a short period, you know how much attention Thais pay to personal hygiene. I love the smell of Thai guys.

 

The Skytrain experiment always confirms my suspicions. When a farang raises his arm to grab the strap, within a second or two I anticipate the odor. Many times it's obvious that the odor is the result of not wearing freshly laundered clothes (a particular problem with some tourists).

 

Well on the subject, oral hygiene is also a Thai obsession but frequently overlooked by farangs.

[Guest buaseng]

Well (While ?) on the subject, oral hygiene is also a Thai obsession but frequently overlooked by farangs.

They need to maintain good oral hygiene, just look at the amount of cock and cock juice that goes into their mouths.