New Members coming soon

[TotallyOz]

The GayGuides.com community will soon be welcoming members from boytoy.com to our site. The two forums will merge to become gayguides.com only. The members at boytoy have an amazing amount of knowledge about South America, North America and Europe. Members of this site have more knowledge of gay Asia. The goal for this site has always been to be as inclusive of the gay world as possible and this next step will move us one step closer to that goal. Many here are members of both sites. There is no need to register on both sites as they will be merged soon. The one difference in the sites is that boytoy has always encouraged porn and xxx images. That will not come over with the site and we will remain a site without porn. We have one forum area here that I'll be cleaning up to ensure no xxx images are there. The site may go down for a day while the merge takes place as the forum company Invision, will be doing that for us to make sure all runs smoothly.

[Vessey]

48 minutes ago, Michael said:

We have one forum area here that I'll be cleaning up to ensure no xxx images are there. 

I am guessing that that might be the pictures forum?  If it is then can we assume that current crop of picture on the new thread are all ok?, If not I guess we might need a little more guidance/reminder as to what you will allow in future please? 

[TotallyOz]

3 minutes ago, Vessey said:

I am guessing that that might be the pictures forum?  If it is then can we assume that current crop of picture on the new thread are all ok?, If not I guess we might need a little more guidance/reminder as to what you will allow in future please? 

Sure. No dicks, ass, sex shots allowed. Anything that can be seen as past R rated should not be here. Sexy photos of gogo boys, etc. are highly encouraged. Just not nudes.

[Guest]

Will members of both sites end up with 2 accounts ?

How will the sites be structured ?    For instance, this site has photo threads of Asian guys.   The other has photos of big hairy farang and I'd rather they were kept separate, so I don't have to sift through those.

Finally, I've always preferred to read this site by going to "Unread Content", which covers all sub forums.

I've usually read BoyToy by going straight to the Europe section, since I have zero interest in the well supported North America section.   They all seem to be interested in getting f*cked by guys who look like professional wrestlers.  I respect their choice and welcome diversity, but don't actually want to be sifting through that.

A user configurable Unread Content filter would be much appreciated, or if that's too complicated, some way of reading the new content in the Asian sub-forums.

[williewillie]

Good move!

[TotallyOz]

11 hours ago, z909 said:

Will members of both sites end up with 2 accounts ?

How will the sites be structured ?    For instance, this site has photo threads of Asian guys.   The other has photos of big hairy farang and I'd rather they were kept separate, so I don't have to sift through those.

Finally, I've always preferred to read this site by going to "Unread Content", which covers all sub forums.

I've usually read BoyToy by going straight to the Europe section, since I have zero interest in the well supported North America section.   They all seem to be interested in getting f*cked by guys who look like professional wrestlers.  I respect their choice and welcome diversity, but don't actually want to be sifting through that.

A user configurable Unread Content filter would be much appreciated, or if that's too complicated, some way of reading the new content in the Asian sub-forums.

Users will not have 2 accounts. We are working on merging them.

Photo threads are problematic as they contain copyrighted images. I'm working on a new policy.

I don't know about Unread Content but will try to structure the forums in a way that works for all or most. To read unread content in any section should be easy if you see something is there unread.

[PeterRS]

13 hours ago, z909 said:

Will members of both sites end up with 2 accounts ?

How will the sites be structured ?    For instance, this site has photo threads of Asian guys.   The other has photos of big hairy farang and I'd rather they were kept separate, so I don't have to sift through those.

Pesonally I dread the thought of having to wade through pics of western guys in order to get a few of cute Asians  . Assuming photos meet the criteria, can there be two - one Asian, one western? Or even a third if there are those interested in, say, guys from the indian sub-continent?

How is anyone supposed to know if photos uploaded to the internet are in copyright or not? E.g. many of the photos I have uploaded originate from a Taiwanese company with many different photo sites including BlueMen, Bliuephoto and Whosemen. It posts some of the photos on its own sites as teasers. The others have come mostly from another different site. I have seen many photo sites headed by a note that if any photographs are in copyright, the owner just needs to notify the gay website owner and the photos will be taken down. Is that not sufficient?

Your comments re regulations for photos threads seems similar to this present site. But when you say that no nudity will be allowed and no "ass shots", does that mean photos of a bare ass (but not specific detail) are now out?

[floridarob]

17 hours ago, Michael said:

The two forums will merge to become gayguides.com only

Bet you were thinking, "how can I explain this as though talking to a group of elementary school children". With the incoming questions and/or whining.... you should change the price of admission 

[TotallyOz]

2 hours ago, PeterRS said:

Pesonally I dread the thought of having to wade through pics of western guys in order to get a few of cute Asians  . Assuming photos meet the criteria, can there be two - one Asian, one western? Or even a third if there are those interested in, say, guys from the indian sub-continent?

How is anyone supposed to know if photos uploaded to the internet are in copyright or not? E.g. many of the photos I have uploaded originate from a Taiwanese company with many different photo sites including BlueMen, Bliuephoto and Whosemen. It posts some of the photos on its own sites as teasers. The others have come mostly from another different site. I have seen many photo sites headed by a note that if any photographs are in copyright, the owner just needs to notify the gay website owner and the photos will be taken down. Is that not sufficient?

Your comments re regulations for photos threads seems similar to this present site. But when you say that no nudity will be allowed and no "ass shots", does that mean photos of a bare ass (but not specific detail) are now out?

You won't have to wade through tons of photo as the photos forum will not be part of the site unless those are photos that meet 100% criteria which is no nudity at all, and yes, that includes butt shots. Anything that can't be posted on Facebook can't be posted on this site. I have been lax and that is my bad. Now, I need to self-correct.

Any photos that you take or own or have the legal right to use are welcome. I love photos and especially when they related to travels, bars, clubs, etc. However, just taking random images from anywhere and re-posting them here is not allowed. That said, we have a Club area where a user can start any club they want and control access to only members they want and that club is not visible to the public or to me.

1 hour ago, floridarob said:

Bet you were thinking, "how can I explain this as though talking to a group of elementary school children". With the incoming questions and/or whining.... you should change the price of admission 

I truly did understand there would be lots of questions. People hate change and wonder if it will be good or bad. I do believe that the forum belongs to the members and I try to intervene as little as possible. But, when people contribute to the site, they have a vested interest in what happens on that site. We have had this site running for nearly 15 years I think. That is a long time and many changes over the years. Everyone, including you, has a voice in what the site should be. I do try to accommodate as much as possible with most requests. And, no FloridaRob, we can't fly all the Brazilian lads to Thailand for a test run to see if everything meshes together perfectly.

[PeterRS]

2 hours ago, Michael said:

However, just taking random images from anywhere and re-posting them here is not allowed. That said, we have a Club area where a user can start any club they want and control access to only members they want and that club is not visible to the public or to me.

From the above I assume the Club area could include the type of photos that I and others have been posting. But I will wait to see the new rules.

[Guest]

I have created a Club Z for test purposes.   I presume no one can read the content at present ?

[TotallyOz]

1 hour ago, PeterRS said:

From the above I assume the Club area could include the type of photos that I and others have been posting. But I will wait to see the new rules.

If the Club is private and not open for public viewing of threads, what you post in there is up to the owner of that club.

35 minutes ago, z909 said:

I have created a Club Z for test purposes.   I presume no one can read the content at present ?

You have a settings area that allow you to make certain restrictions and modifications. Once you create a forum and post a thread, you can test this.  Clubs can be visible to all but required admittance by Club Owner or even more restrictive and not visible to anyone unless invited. The Club feature is a really cool thing Invision did for members.

[PeterRS]

I have made a post on the "GayThailand is now GayGuides.com" thread which should have been made here. Apologies. Purely for ease of reading, I repost here. I hope the moderator can delete the same one on the other thread. Thank you.

There have been comments on the forum that there are now fewer posts here to keep members interested. The absence of trip reports (for obvious reasons) and the withdrawal of the photos thread (also for reasons which to many are logical) are two that have been expressed. I am sure there are more. We live in horribly difficult times and the chances that they will return to anything like normal are very uncertain.

Even if they do, though, in gay Thailand we will not just be in a new normal we will be in the new normal that has been creeping up on us with increasing rapidity for well over a decade. Some will say that should be two decades pointing to the huge difference in the gay scene before the millennium compared to just a year ago.

As most of us know and acknowledge the gay scene in some key cities in Thailand is dying. In my view it is unlikely to be revived. The scene in Phuket is near death. The scene in Chiang Mai has seen a huge number of closures in recent years. There is little left. In Pattaya Sunee Plaza and Boyztown are a desperate shadow of what they once were and may never recover. Jomtien seems alive and well but without any gay gogo bars and a dwindling number of Thai boys in favour of boys from neighbouring countries. Even the numbers who contribute to this forum has dropped over the years from a regular posting membership of 40, 50 or more to  - how many now? A dozen or so?

The numbers of gay western and Australasian tourists has been going down for years. Those who do visit are ageing faster than they can be replaced by younger guys. I suspect airfares may be at promotional rates once international flights restart. But those rates absolutely have to rise significantly after that short initial period. The airlines have unbelievable debts and these have to be repaid. Many gay venues will die without the Chinese who will surely come in ever increasing numbers in the new normal. They will still be joined by other short haul north east and south east Asians. But their interests have always seemed more in massage spas and the Asian for Asian saunas. The outlook for gogo bars seems bleak.

None of the above has not been expressed before, both here and elsewhere. The point of raising it again concerns the direction of this forum. I can understand that commercial reasons may have prompted the amalgamation. Until this morning I had never visited the boytoy site but I believe the vast majority of its membership is in the USA. What i find strange is that its home page has nothing about threads on Europe, South and Central America. All I see is a section on General Chat and another on Far Far Away. The latter has only two sub threads - Gay Asia and Gay Africa. Gay Asia threads are already mostly about Thailand - and incidentally contain one that has a post that would certainly contravene the lese majeste act. I hope threads on the boytoy site are gone through with a fine tooth comb before the merger or we might find this site disappears altogether.

Reading more posts, I note one poster querying the disappearance of the sections on Europe, Central and South America. I wonder why since this was to be a key factor in the merger.

But the first post I read from I presume the owner/moderator states "the site is slow at times". I look further down and see a post "This small horny community ..." Yet more posts vigorously lament the taking down of the porn threads. One suggests that the boytoy site will merely become one for those interested in overseas travel. I had no idea boytoy was a small site.

What all this preamble leads up to is this. As I read it (maybe incorrectly), there are two sites with dwindling memberships joining forces. One is based in the USA (I think). I expect many of its posters do vacation in the sex districts in Central and South America. Given the much higher cost of travelling to Asia, how many will actually even consider making the trip, I wonder? They may read the forums here but will they fill the gap in the dwindling gay western tourism numbers? Something tells me the answer is no.

Then once the sites are merged, if that happens in the near future, all the new readers will be able to see are the doom and gloom threads here about the dwindling sex scene in Thailand (sorry, I know this post will not help). And all the closures. And the Chinese taking over. Is that going to be much incentive to travel here or even read about Thailand? I don't really want answers to my questions. I merely want to raise them, possibly for discussion. Please shoot me down.

[Guest]

Thank you Peter RS.

0  A discussion on the gay scene probably belongs on a different thread, even if the comments are mostly correct.

1  I do participate on Boy Toy, but rarely.  You are correct about posts that are risky ref lese majeste.

2  A "Far Far Away" title is insulting for people who consider Asia or Europe as home.   Some people really do live outside North America.   

3  My only reason for visiting Boy Toy was to browse the Europe section for ideas and sometimes the Latin America section.   If they are gone, so is my interest.   Excuse my prejudices, but I have little interest in Africa, due to legislation that's often homophobic.

Any suggestion that we might use the search function for Europe wouldn't solve the problem.   If there's a thread on Kiev, I discover it because it's in the Europe section.  I don't  search for every country and city in Europe.

Incidentally, if the software remains as it was last year, it's impossible to seach for Hua Hin, as we need 4 letters in search words.

4 A merged forum probably needs separate sections for each continent, with it made very easy to view all new content in sub-sections and equally importantly, exclude stuff and continents we have zero interest in.     I hope the software can do that, but I haven't noticed  such functionality.

5 Ultimately Michael will do as he pleases, which is how it should be.  I hope this forum remains welcoming, since we are down to 3 Thai forums and not all those are particularly active.  For several years, Boy Toy has been the only forum I know of covering the European scene.  There was another, but it closed long ago.

[PeterRS]

26 minutes ago, z909 said:

4 A merged forum probably needs separate sections for each continent, with it made very easy to view all new content in sub-sections and equally importantly, exclude stuff and continents we have zero interest in.     I hope the software can do that, but I haven't noticed  such functionality.

Totally agree, but I am sure Michael has considered this. For readers of this chat room it will be a great shame if Thailand and other Asian countries are covered only in one forum rather than a series of separate sub forums.

26 minutes ago, z909 said:

5 Ultimately Michael will do as he pleases, which is how it should be.  I hope this forum remains welcoming, since we are down to 3 Thai forums and not all those are particularly active.  For several years, Boy Toy has been the only forum I know of covering the European scene.  There was another, but it closed long ago.

As the Board owner, Michael clearly must do as he pleases. I only highlight this point for two reasons. I am staggered that there is only one forum for the whole of Europe. Do you mean only one forum in English? Surely there will be forums in each country in their own languages. That's true in Asia.

The second is what I suppose my long thread was all about in the first place. Given the reduction in the number of forums and the overall number of posters, in addition to the number of other sites now on the internet with information for gay men about many countries and the increasing prevalence of the apps, for how long will there be a place for chat rooms like this? As with the gay scene in general in Thailand, might its days be numbered?

[Guest]

I mean I only KNOW of one forum, in ENGLISH that covers the European gay scene, including money boys.

There used to be another, called firstly something like malemodels.cz and then Rentboysworld if I remember correctly.   I prefer a more subtle title.  That used to be quite good for the Prague scene.  It closed several years ago.  I once met the owner, in Chiang Mai.

As for other languages,well German is the only one I can read, so searches are limited. 

So I very much hope that Michael keeps a European section.

Like you, I also favour keeping sub forums for Asian content, as if anyone is thinking of visiting (say) Cambodia, it's much easier to find everything in one sub-forum, than to search for Cambodia, Seim Reap, Battambang etc etc.

That all works nicely on a purely Asian forum, since we can still use the "New Content" option to check all updates.   Once merged, I fear "New Content" is likely to include all of the North American threads, typically salivating over some huge hairy caucasian top.  Whilst people are welcome to do that, I have zero interest.    I might not be alone.

 

EDIT: The Boy Toy European section remains, but is only visible after logging in and if I read correctly, for people with a minimum of 10 posts.  Fine for existing members.

The side effects will be a reduction of new members discovering that section to near zero and it might be a deterrent if they have to post 10 times in other forums to he allowed in.   There might be advantages, such as increased freedom on content ? 

[vinapu]

23 hours ago, PeterRS said:

., all the new readers will be able to see are the doom and gloom threads here about the dwindling sex scene in Thailand (sorry, I know this post will not help). And all the closures. And the Chinese taking over. Is that going to be much incentive to travel here or even read about Thailand? 

I always was of opinion that all I need is  one bar and one boy from that bar so definitely doom and gloom will not discourage me from going to Thailand  but Thai government with excessive and prolonged restrictions may do that job specially if other countries in the region will open faster.

[vinapu]

22 hours ago, PeterRS said:

for how long will there be a place for chat rooms like this? As with the gay scene in general in Thailand, might its days be numbered?

don't worry too much, so are our days

[PeterRS]

1 hour ago, vinapu said:

I always was of opinion that all I need is  one bar and one boy from that bar so definitely doom and gloom will not discourage me from going to Thailand  but Thai government with excessive and prolonged restrictions may do that job specially if other countries in the region will open faster.

I take your point about one bar and one boy. But has not the primary attraction of gay Thailand traditionally been the fascinating buffet it offered? It was the volume of gogo bars, of great massage spas with willing Thai guys and of saunas that welcomed all and sundry. That buffet has been whittled away to a fraction of what it used to be. Even the lovely Thai guys are being replaced rapidly with those from nearby countries. i really wonder how many gay tourists in the years to come will be happy with one boy from one bar.

You are right about governments. For years the Thai government and the elites who keep it in power have been doing their best to get rid of the international publicity that labelled Thailand the sex capital of Asia. I cannot see this changing.

[williewillie]

I am fortunate to enjoy young Asian guys in their 20’s to early 30’s.  I also enjoy Latinos and have decided to visit

Brazil and some Spanish speaking countries as soon as feasible. I’m fortunate that facial hair doesn’t bother me in the slightest and 

like muscular gays way more than slim twinks.  My main aversion is to feminine lady boys..hairy backs and hairy asses  another aversion.

I’ve viewed boytoys more often than gay Thailand/gayguides and love variety.  There is a gay world beyond hairless

Asian teenage boys.  Kudos to Michael for encompassing the worldwide gay scene.

I’m fully aware I’m in a small minority on this forum.  

[PeterRS]

With new members joining and some possibly looking at vacations in Thailand and maybe other parts of Asia, I took a look at the layout of this site. I believe we were told the sections other than the chat room forums would be upgraded. Having now looked at it, I must say it looks great. The designer has done an excellent job and everything is well laid out.

I wish I could say the same about the content. I realise this is no doubt a work in progress. But there are some major errors and omissions. First in the list of Thai cities. These are the obvious ones, Bangkok, Pattaya, Phuket and Chiang Mai. Unfortunately there are definitely some copyright photos of boys in those sections. Surely these have to be removed in line with the Board's new policies?

Second there is a lot of incorrect information. These are some. In Chiang Mai only one bar is mentioned other than the gogo bars and the two saunas. This is Yokka Dok. But that bar closed between 3 and 5 years ago. No mention of the other bars which have relocated to Charoen Prathet Soi 6. In Phuket for hotels it highlights the Royal Thai Yacht Club Hotel on Nai Harn Beach. That hotel has not been known by that name for at least ten years. It became a Mandarin Oriental before changing again. It is now known as the Nai Harn Resort Hotel. In Pattaya it suggests spending afternoons at the gay beach where at around 4:00pm the boys will come out to frolic and play volleyball etc. I don't know how long ago it was since the beach stopped being a magnet for a clutch of cute young Thai guys in the late afternoons. It also suggests a Sunee Plaza that is more like the thriving area it was some years ago than one now in its death throes.

As for Bangkok, under the Bars section the first is Maggie Choo's. I wonder why. This is not a gay bar. It is gay on Sundays but if gay visitors went on a Friday evening they would be sorely disappointed. Then in Soi 4 it lists Telephone Bar but Balcony is nowhere to be found. DJ Station is listed as a bar.   Maggie Choo's is also listed a s a Club!! Only one sauna is listed - Babylon. There are 9 centrally located massage spas but no V Club 7 (part of Chakran sauna) and quite a few others.

I can remember the days when there were several monthly gay publications available at many of the gay venues. One complaint was that their listings and maps were always incorrect for one or more reason. I cannot imagine how anyone can compile and keep up to date any gay listings. But if there are going to be listings, surely they have to be reasonably up to date and not years out of date. My view is that this task has to be delegated to one person who perhaps has to be paid to do all the regular checking.

Third concerns the list of cities. Most will be of interest to those travelling to Europe and the Americas (although the inclusion of Moscow in a gay guide may be questionable). In Asia, apart from the Thai cities I have mentioned, only Hong Kong is listed. That has no information whatsoever about any gay establishments. It merely mentions two gay beaches, without adding that it requires an hour and a half at least to get to the main one as it is located far from anywhere on Lantau Island. For dining it includes only Lan Kwai Fong which is now one of the most expensive dining options in the city. Nearby  less expensive SoHo has been more popular for about 20 years. What about all the bars and saunas? Then why is there a listing for Melbourne but not the gayer and much more visited Sydney?

If any Gay Guide is to be accepted as a serious guide to Asia, surely it must also include at least Tokyo, Osaka, Seoul, Taipei and Singapore, with perhaps one section on the entirety of mainland China. As it stands, there are at least a couple of other gay Asia destination guides on the internet that have a great deal more information and up to date information.

Sorry, I know this is not going to be a popular post!

[Guest]

1 hour ago, PeterRS said:

Sorry, I know this is not going to be a popular post!

When discussing how to succeed with a website or other enterprise, it's better to offer accurate and well thought out views than try to be popular.

Looking elsewhere, I can't think of one other website that's risen to the challenge of providing a comprehensive and continually updated gay guide (edited guide, not forum).   Sites I found useful 5-10 years ago are rarely of any use now.   Sites like Nighttours used to be very helpful, along with several other sites covering Europe and Asia.

So for the Guide aspect of this site to be useful and popular, it's going to need a continual and relentless effort to maintain accuracy and incorporate updates.  A big challenge.  

I hope this site breaks the mould, but there's some way to go.

[PeterRS]

4 hours ago, z909 said:

When discussing how to succeed with a website or other enterprise, it's better to offer accurate and well thought out views than try to be popular.

Perhaps I can make a positive suggestion to counter the negative ones made earlier. Rather than each city/destination having separate sub links for Gay Bars, Gay Massage, Gay Clubs, Gay Hotels, Gay Restaurants and Gay Saunas, could not the main establishments be incorporated into the text of the city descriptions? In Bangkok I suspect most visitors would be happy enough to learn about Telephone and Soi 4; Arena, Prince and Senso; DJ Station; a handful of gay friendly hotels and restaurants at different price ranges; and Babylon, Chakran and Sauna Mania (with caveats about Chakran being more Asian for Asian and Sauna Mania's price discrimination). It would at least give readers places to start as they explore gay Bangkok. 

That would obviously be less comprehensive but would avoid the need for constant updating. Special events like Maggie Choo's Sunday gay days could also be incorporated. I also think it would be useful to have a small section about genuine gay guides for each city. Over on the sawatdee site Moses advertises his Siam Roads guides located in many Asian cities. Judging from the comments of those who have hired the guides, these good looking young guys provide an excellent service in showing visitors their cities and nightlife.

[Guest]

I also wish my thoughts on the challenges of producing and maintaining a Global Gay Guide could be expressed in a slightly more positive tone.  

Particularly when recognising I'm merely sat on the sideline commenting, whilst Michael has the ambition to start and produce something.

[vinapu]

11 hours ago, williewillie said:

.... I’m fortunate that facial hair doesn’t bother me in the slightest and like muscular gays way more than slim twinks.  

I’m fully aware I’m in a small minority on this forum.  

but not alone, rest assured