Long Weekend starts tonight Wednesday December 9th throughout Thailand.,

[williewillie]

The government has instituted a 4 day weekend to help struggling hotels and other tourist destinations for the domestic market.

In Pattaya, many closed hotels will reopen and the beaches will fill up with Thai families.  It will be a temporary reprieve but welcome 

none the less.  In years past December was the start of high season, which now seems like a distant memory.

There’s a strong possibility that this will be the last month for the bars and hotels in Boyztown.  Resurrection possible starting mid 2021..

[Boy69]

IIt won't help mutch major tourist destination are almost deserted Phuket, Krabi,Ko Phi Phi, Pattaya,Ko Samui and more the main economy depends on int'l tourists without them I don't know how long they can survive.

I fear that once the Covid 19 criss will be over and the borders in Thailand will  open again many gay venues will be close permanently and Thailand won't be the same again .

[vinapu]

2 hours ago, Boy69 said:

I fear that once the Covid 19 crisis will be over and the borders in Thailand will  open again many gay venues will be close permanently and Thailand won't be the same again .

I will be happy to jump on the plane and see what's left. When demand  returns so will an offer I hope. For sure it will be changes but at end of day we need only 1 bar and one guy from that  bar to make or day / and a night /

[vaughn]

13 hours ago, Boy69 said:

I fear that once the Covid 19 criss will be over and the borders in Thailand will  open again many gay venues will be close permanently and Thailand won't be the same again .

I do share the same fears, but I try to stay optimistic, with change comes opportunity.

we might return to a skeleton of what was once the best location in the world for our interests, but there will be demand and i'm sure lots of tourist money waiting to be spent.
When those borders open and tourists can flock back in, there is going to be a mad rush, i predict hotels booked to capacity and prices going pretty high with that initial demand.

I wasn't around when Soi Twilight went through it's shutdown, but i assume many of the same fears were around at that time.. some will close, some will move, and in this case some will hold on for dear life until the return of the market.

[Boy69]

5 hours ago, vaughn said:

I do share the same fears, but I try to stay optimistic, with change comes opportunity.

we might return to a skeleton of what was once the best location in the world for our interests, but there will be demand and i'm sure lots of tourist money waiting to be spent.
When those borders open and tourists can flock back in, there is going to be a mad rush, i predict hotels booked to capacity and prices going pretty high with that initial demand.

I wasn't around when Soi Twilight went through it's shutdown, but i assume many of the same fears were around at that time.. some will close, some will move, and in this case some will hold on for dear life until the return of the market.

I wish I can share your optimisic point of you but I am sceptical,even before the Covid 19 criss there is a steady decline of the gay entertainment industry in Thailand Chiang Mai almost all gay venues shot down , Paradise Complex in Phuket is a gost town even the famous Boat Bar is closed permanently and the best go go bar  My Way not sure will re-open again ,In Pattaya Sunee Plaza is dark and almost deserted,Boyz Town is no longer gay zone anymore and boys looking more for female clients.the veteran gays are getting older or dying and younger gay generation doesn't coming,I assume there will no be shortage of boys on line but we are coming also for nightlife and fun not only for sex and I am afraid except Bangkok won't be left much once we come back to the land of smiles.

[Gaybutton]

4 hours ago, Boy69 said:

I am afraid except Bangkok won't be left much once we come back to the land of smiles.

I agree with most of your post.  I believe the best chance for a gay venue resurrection and attracting a major influx of gay farang depends on what the Thai government will do.  If they will allow the bars to operate as they were doing 15 or 20 years ago, when it was mostly "anything goes" and many bars had convenient short time rooms available, then we'll all see the good times return once Thailand allows unencumbered tourism.

The problem has been the prudish rules that ruined so much of it.  I have never understood why.  Who was being harmed?  Most, if not all, the gay venues are located in areas where the general public is unlikely to go.  Nobody can see inside the go-go bars unless they enter.  The nonsense about the bars having to close around 1:00-2:00am doesn't help and doesn't make any sense.  Is there anyone here who needs government officials to tell them what time to go to bed?  And they only come up with absurd justifications.

I'm not holding my breath for any serious changes.  Maybe if all the gay venues get together and form some sort of lobbying program they might be able to pressure the government to relent on at least some of their rules, but if they do nothing, then I don't foresee anything changing.

What is wrong with these people?  Especially Pattaya - how many adults do they think go to Pattaya looking for nice, clean, G-rated, wholesome holidays?  What on earth is wrong with letting adults be adults?  What is so terrible about adults enjoying sex?

Maybe the gay tourists don't amount to a major part of Thailand's tourism industry, but the whole thing needs to change.  I have yet to meet any Thais who give a damn about how the gay venues operate, so who are all these rules protecting?  I think none of these rules would have ever come into being in the first place if the powers-that-be refused to give in to outside pressure along with a few Thai prudes who managed to get powerful government positions.

I wish the powers-that-be would just leave us alone, but as I said, I'm not holding my breath.

[williewillie]

Oops!
I got it wrong about the 4 day weekend.

There is a music festival in Pattaya, on Friday (tomorrow) and Saturday. 

[kokopelli]

Thursday,  Dec. 10, was Constitution Day, a public holiday in Thailand.

You were correct, williewillie.

[PeterRS]

21 hours ago, Gaybutton said:

I wish the powers-that-be would just leave us alone, but as I said, I'm not holding my breath.

I would just keep breathing. For years the Thai elite has been determined that the country get rid of its sex tourist image. Slowly but surely that has been happening and the pandemic has been the icing on their cake. I see nothing that will change it. The saunas and the massage spas will likely continue, as will the Thai only venues that are dotted around the country where farang can never enter. I cannot see the gogo bars continuing in the medium term.

[reader]

Agree that there's a segment of older Thai elites that would love to see the visible evidence (i.e., strip clubs, go-go's) in tourist areas disappear. They are, however, prepared to look the other way if some of their elite associates benefit from the business that those venues bring to silent partners and the non-sex business in their vicinity.

I tend to think these venues will continue to exist if they are profitable. Elites may like to talk about their mores but nothing exerts a greater influence than that which perpetuates their position in society: money. It's the overriding common denominator in all elite social circles because the prevailing dogma is that those who die with the most gain ultimate face--even if it's frozen in time.

To apply a more internationally understood principle: nothing succeeds like success.

[vinapu]

16 hours ago, kokopelli said:

Thursday,  Dec. 10, was Constitution Day, a public holiday in Thailand.

 

country which changes constitutions every few years should have Constitution Day every month not just on Dec 10th

[Gaybutton]

13 hours ago, reader said:

 money. It's the overriding common denominator

That is why I fail to understand why they have been trying (and failing) to change Pattaya's paradigm.  Whether they like it or not, reputation or not, sex and the enjoyment of it plays a major part in attracting foreigners to Pattaya.  I doubt the main reasons foreigners go to Pattaya are to shop, or spend time in water parks, or watch shows.  For sun seekers there are many beaches in Thailand much better than Pattaya, especially considering Pattaya's polluted sea water.

Why on earth do people in power, and not just Thailand, want to prevent people from enjoying sex - unless, of course, it's for their own enjoyment?  There has been serious talk from Thailand's powers-that-be about legalizing prostitution.  Why am I not surprised that so far it has been only talk, but no action? 

Humans, at least normal humans, want sex.  Aging humans are usually attracted to younger - both gay, straight, and bi.  The bars provide it and it is a perfectly natural human desire.  Why do those in power always seem to want to deny it to people?  Why do they act as if sex is some sort of terrible thing that cannot be allowed - unless of course it is their way?

If they truly want to re-attract foreign tourists to Pattaya, you know what they should do?  They should just butt out.

Somehow I find it difficult to believe that many foreigners are going to take expensive, long haul flights only to find that they're going to have to use the hook-up apps to find what they want.

[vinapu]

3 hours ago, Gaybutton said:

Somehow I find it difficult to believe that many foreigners are going to take expensive, long haul flights only to find that they're going to have to use the hook-up apps to find what they want.

one of most accurate  statements in history of human race

[Guest]

Whilst I agree that Pattaya would benefit from less interference, people still want to go somewhere on holiday.   Using phone apps in Pattaya is competitive with what's on offer in most of the competing destinations.

[Boy69]

14 hours ago, Gaybutton said:

That is why I fail to understand why they have been trying (and failing) to change Pattaya's paradigm.  Whether they like it or not, reputation or not, sex and the enjoyment of it plays a major part in attracting foreigners to Pattaya.  I doubt the main reasons foreigners go to Pattaya are to shop, or spend time in water parks, or watch shows.  For sun seekers there are many beaches in Thailand much better than Pattaya, especially considering Pattaya's polluted sea water.

Why on earth do people in power, and not just Thailand, want to prevent people from enjoying sex - unless, of course, it's for their own enjoyment?  There has been serious talk from Thailand's powers-that-be about legalizing prostitution.  Why am I not surprised that so far it has been only talk, but no action? 

Humans, at least normal humans, want sex.  Aging humans are usually attracted to younger - both gay, straight, and bi.  The bars provide it and it is a perfectly natural human desire.  Why do those in power always seem to want to deny it to people?  Why do they act as if sex is some sort of terrible thing that cannot be allowed - unless of course it is their way?

If they truly want to re-attract foreign tourists to Pattaya, you know what they should do?  They should just butt out.

Somehow I find it difficult to believe that many foreigners are going to take expensive, long haul flights only to find that they're going to have to use the hook-up apps to find what they want.

I assume it's because the conservative trends started at Taksin government and continuing till today and it's not going to change in the near future unfortunately.

[Gaybutton]

10 hours ago, Boy69 said:

I assume it's because the conservative trends started at Taksin government and continuing till today and it's not going to change in the near future unfortunately.

I think that is correct, along with pressure from religious NGOs and some foreign governments whose prudes want to tell Thailand how to run their internal affairs.  The frustrating part is how Thailand so readily gave right in and began ruining things for us, as well as straights.  And yes, it is difficult, perhaps impossible, to reverse it to the way things were before this nonsense began.

As Thomas Wolfe said, "You can't go home again".

I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me why sex is such a bad thing.  Regarding sex, the ancient Romans and Greeks had it right.  Sadly that way of thinking is long gone.

[PeterRS]

10 hours ago, Boy69 said:

I assume it's because the conservative trends started at Taksin government and continuing till today and it's not going to change in the near future unfortunately.

Thaksins Social Order Campaigns certainly started the downward trend. The zoning of entertainment districts and the earlier closing times brought criticism even from the General Manager of the famed Mandarin Oriental Hotel who tried to remind the government that tourists were not interested in visiting a city that closed soon after midnight.

While this forum focuses more on gogo bars, most did survive the Campaigns, but many of the major dance clubs collapsed. The massive Ministry of Sound, Tantra, Mystique, 87 and the Bed Supper Club are just some of many that died. Investors have no interest in putting up cash for clubs that have to close early. Even in staid old Singapore, the 30 year old Zouk Bar remains one of Asia's great clubs and is open till 4:00 am at weekends.

But it was not just the elites that were pleased with the Social Order Campaigns (although their children were not). Several countrywide polls showed that they were popular throughout the nation. For a time the arch religious bigot Interior Minister Purachai was even more popular than Thaksin. Given that, it is hard for expats and tourists to complain and have any effect.

[Gaybutton]

12 hours ago, z909 said:

Whilst I agree that Pattaya would benefit from less interference, people still want to go somewhere on holiday.   Using phone apps in Pattaya is competitive with what's on offer in most of the competing destinations.

I think some will, but most won't.  It is much less expensive to just stay home and, if nothing else, hire an "escort". 

Speaking only for myself, there is no way I would pay thousands of dollars, be quarantined for two weeks, only to end up using primarily hook-up apps in a quest to find willing young gents.

In the post above PeterRS says, "While this forum focuses more on gogo bars, most did survive the Campaigns".  I'd say that depends on your definition of "survive".  Many might have survived initially, meaning they remained open, but it didn't take long for many of the go-go bars to start closing down.

Meanwhile, the bars that did survive were forced to make a lot of changes in the way boys were presented and behavior of the boys and customers.  It just wasn't the same after all this got started.  For people who remember the way things were in Thailand 15 or 20 years ago, it's a different world now and became so,  long before anyone ever heard of Covid-19.  Now there is almost no comparison.

While there are still a few go-go bars and "off", the way it used to be is now extinct and I believe it would take a miracle for there to be any kind of significant resurrection.  We can all hope for that, but will anything come of it?

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Gaybutton said:

Speaking only for myself, there is no way I would pay thousands of dollars, be quarantined for two weeks, only to end up using primarily hook-up apps in a quest to find willing young gents.

There are other reasons to visit Thailand.   For instance, it's often cold, wet and gloomy in the winter back home.   If we consider everything,  a visit to Thailand is worth considering.

 

8 hours ago, Gaybutton said:

Meanwhile, the bars that did survive were forced to make a lot of changes in the way boys were presented and behavior of the boys and customers.

I don't quite understand this part.   About 200 m down the road from Boyztown, there are gogo bars with girls in their birthday suits.   Now if that style of presentation is permitted there, it ought to be permitted in the boy bars.   I don't know what the difference is, unless it's because the girlie bars can afford to pay more tea money ?

If there's any other aspect to presentation changes that I've missed, please enlighten me.

[firecat69]

36 minutes ago, z909 said:

 

 

I don't quite understand this part.   About 200 m down the road from Boyztown, there are gogo bars with girls in their birthday suits.   Now if that style of presentation is permitted there, it ought to be permitted in the boy bars.   I don't know what the difference is, unless it's because the girlie bars can afford to pay more tea money ?

If there's any other aspect to presentation changes that I've missed, please enlighten me.

And there we have the answer Bangkok will probably survive because the Bars generate  a lot more Tea money .

[Gaybutton]

3 hours ago, z909 said:

About 200 m down the road from Boyztown, there are gogo bars with girls in their birthday suits.

please enlighten me.

Please enlighten me.  I know of no Pattaya go-go bars where the girls are fully nude.  As far as I know, those same powers-that-be prudes put the kibosh on that years ago.

[Travellerdave]

5 hours ago, z909 said:

There are other reasons to visit Thailand.   For instance, it's often cold, wet and gloomy in the winter back home.   If we consider everything,  a visit to Thailand is worth considering.

 

I don't quite understand this part.   About 200 m down the road from Boyztown, there are gogo bars with girls in their birthday suits.   Now if that style of presentation is permitted there, it ought to be permitted in the boy bars.   I don't know what the difference is, unless it's because the girlie bars can afford to pay more tea money ?

If there's any other aspect to presentation changes that I've missed, please enlighten me.

My impression is that currently in Europe, N America and Australia there is a huge pent up demand for holidays. Many who have retained jobs or business are flush with cash due to lack of spending opportunities in the lock downs. My hope is that when the vaccines start to defeat COVID probably next May to July that dam will burst and tourist friendly resorts such as the Thai ones will experience a  boom. Numbers of Gay visitors will arrive in Pattaya and Bkk to enjoy the sun, nightlife, value hotels and the exotic atmosphere and of course interaction with attractive young Asian guys. Opening a closed gay bar or Gogo takes little capital, only perhaps a little generosity to the boys in brown. I personally would not like the Gogo boys to dance naked regardless of what goes on in girlie bars. Perhaps variety away from the whities maybe more towards thongs jocks or speedos.

[vinapu]

23 hours ago, Gaybutton said:

While there are still a few go-go bars and "off", the way it used to be is now extinct and I believe it would take a miracle for there to be any kind of significant resurrection.  We can all hope for that, but will anything come of it?

Look at bright side, because of age  some us us may not even see complete collapse  because we will be either gone or too old to travel that far anyways  

[vinapu]

9 hours ago, Travellerdave said:

My impression is that currently in Europe, N America and Australia there is a huge pent up demand for holidays. Many who have retained jobs or business are flush with cash due to lack of spending opportunities in the lock downs. 

looking at the mirror I must say there's quite a bit of truth in that. I put some money aside for vacations in the  beginning on May as all that pile is intact 8 months later waiting in vain for an opportunity to be wasted 

[Guest]

11 hours ago, Gaybutton said:

I know of no Pattaya go-go bars where the girls are fully nude.  As far as I know, those same powers-that-be prudes put the kibosh on that years ago.

That's probably because you haven't looked, which is understandable.  I took over a decade to investigate, but after spending years participating in discussions just like this one, I decided  it was time to see how the other side operate.  So earlier this year, i decided to make my first ever visit to some girlie gogo bars.   So I'm now qualified to comment.

Go down the alley opposite the school and first on the right, you will find The Dollhouse, which has a mixture of 50% fully nude and the remainder wearing skirts so high that nothing is covered.   A beer is about 110 baht. 

In a nearby street is Windmill,where most wear skirts so high that nothing is covered and others wear nothing.   Beer 80 baht.   

There are at least a couple of other bars nearby with similar offers.   Customers were all western or oriental.   ie no Arabs & Indians. 

So there is a big difference in "presentation" between gay bars and girlie bars.   Anyone visiting Toy Boys recently would apparently have been fobbed off with boys in jeans for their 200 baht drink.