2 Strikes and a Homerun

[TotallyOz]

Odd day yesterday as I have a few guys from the apps I have wanted to meet. As always, you can never rely on much and promises of what they can do are about as honest as a New York Chelsea Guy telling you the size of his penis (accurately).

Hookup 1: 12:00 PM Hornet - guy was cute, 29 year old Laos boy. Nice with little English. Versatile he said. But, he gets to my place, and it was just so bad that I got up after 10 minutes, said it was over, gave him the money and let him be on his way. Blocked from the app and LINE.

Hookup 2: 4:00 PM Jack'd - guy was sexy and cute and said masculine. Showed up and was much more feminine than me or the ladyboys I know so I knew where that was going and for me, that meant no where. Paid him and on his way.

Hookup 3: 8:00 PM Grindr - guy was very handsome and spoke perfect English. Best BJ I have had in years. Great sex. Great massage. No strike on this one and he is coming back Sunday AM. I just have to be sure I don't fall in love with him as this 23 year old hit all the right spots at the right time and checked all my boxes.

Back in the saddle again!

[Guest]

I'm glad to hear the third one worked out.

Paying lads fully for a terrible performance has the unfortunate side effect that the bad ones and scammers can remain in business, as long as there's a constant stream of newbie punters who they can see just the once.     I prefer to work towards a system where good behaviour is rewarded and bad behaviour is not.

On my last trip, I avoided duds by a combination of luck and explaining what they have to do to get the tip and that it's zero tip if they don't do X,Y and Z.   Of course, this usually means the ones who have no intention of performing terminate the discussion, so it never gets to the point of having to send them away with zero tip.  

Of course, I don't bother with all this when seeing the same lads again.

There remains an element of luck & I had one narrow miss, as a cute lad who was rather pushy in marketing his services with lots of hot photos was due to meet me one afternoon in Chiang Mai.  Thankfully, I heard he was meeting a friend just around the corner and when the friend had to kick him out, I cancelled our appointment.  

 

Assuming you're in Bangkok, I doubt hookup #1 would find a constant stream of newbies in the current environment. So I would expect him to try harder to do enough to get repeat business ?

[Londoner]

I've always taken the opposite view. With one guy, in particular, he came to me  strongly recommended by an experienced expat but for me could do nothing. He seemed disinterested and withdrawn.

He had come on time and wasn't rude or aggressive; we just didn't connect.  I took the view that it may be that my style just didn't work with him....my friend was much more out-going than me. Perhaps had I been more assertive and demanding sexually and socially, he'd have pleased  me as much as he pleased my friend. And after all, had I just informed him that I would that I would to him what I wanted to do, he may well have submitted. That was just not my style. I always sought a connection.

I gave him the minimum of the time (1000) and let him go after twenty minutes of failure. 

There are two more aspects to consider; firstly, the possibility of a public scene which I'd be very bad at dealing with. And secondly-  speaking as one of the alt-Right's snowflakes-  who knows what his situation was? There was genuine hunger fear of losing rooms at the time of which I speak; 1000 was nothing to me. Possibly it was vital for him. 

[reader]

3 hours ago, Michael said:

Hookup 3: 8:00 PM Grindr - guy was very handsome and spoke perfect English. Best BJ I have had in years. Great sex. Great massage. No strike on this one and he is coming back Sunday AM. I just have to be sure I don't fall in love with him as this 23 year old hit all the right spots at the right time and checked all my boxes.

Back in the saddle again!

You're  hitting .333. That's good in any league.

[TotallyOz]

Everyone is hurting for money right now. I get it. I have never minded paying someone that doesn't work out the way I want. It saves hassle and hurt feelings. To me, it is OK as I'm sure some are happy with a beautiful boy laying next to them. I'm not and he was willing to get me off just I wanted to save it for someone I that was into it as much as he was (or pretended to be).

[Guest]

On 6/19/2020 at 10:23 AM, Londoner said:

There are two more aspects to consider; firstly, the possibility of a public scene which I'd be very bad at dealing with. And secondly-  speaking as one of the alt-Right's snowflakes-  who knows what his situation was? There was genuine hunger fear of losing rooms at the time of which I speak; 1000 was nothing to me. Possibly it was vital for him. 

The whole point of making it clear what services need to be provided to get > 0 baht is to avoid an argument or other scene following failure to provide services.  

Firstly, we have the ones who say they do "everything", but after going through item by item, it turns out they hardly do anything.  So I can halt the discussion at that point. 

Then the ones who promise more than they intend to deliver will usually terminate the conversation when they realize you're only going to pay them if they honour their promises. 

Hence I've never yet had to deal with a scene in Thailand or nearby countries.

 

As for the moral side of it, there are probably billions of people who can just about afford their rent.  

To get >1000 baht, all someone has to do is show up and honour the promises he made.   The ones who intend to deceive & not honour promises, deserve my money less than some random guy in the street.  

Then there's the grey area, where they show up & do everything promised, but with so little enthusiasm that it's no fun.    Of course, I have to pay these, but I've been lucky to avoid such encounters on the most recent trip.    There have been a few who were OK, but wouldn't be invited back.   The majority were good or very good.  

[Boy69]

I had the same experience through the apps the majority of the boys were good and delivered good service on reasonable price.

In general I prefer to meet boys at the reception and getting the boy straight to my room is not welcome, if the boy who showed up is not what he described or is not my type I would pay him a small amount for covering his travel expenses and send him away.by the way I always add to the agreed fee the travel expenses to my hotel and if the boy was super hot I would tip him well this assure repeating service in the future with him.

[TotallyOz]

14 hours ago, z909 said:

The whole point of making it clear what services need to be provided to get > 0 baht is to avoid an argument or other scene following failure to provide services.  

Firstly, we have the ones who say they do "everything", but after going through item by item, it turns out they hardly do anything.  So I can halt the discussion at that point.

Sometimes even with making things clear, it is not clear. Translation apps do not work well. Things get lost in conversations. I can't tell you how many times I ask top, bottom or both and they have no idea of what I am talking about. Zero. It takes a few times. I travel to Brazil and it is easy, Passivo, Activo, Total. But, harder on the apps here. At least for me. When I had a BF to travel with me they would always get it right as they would talk and tell them the expectations. Now, that he is gone, there is more confusion.  And, partly my fault.

[TotallyOz]

40 minutes ago, Boy69 said:

I had the same experience through the apps the majority of the boys were good and delivered good service on reasonable price.

In general I prefer to meet boys at the reception and getting the boy straight to my room is not welcome, if the boy who showed up is not what he described or is not my type I would pay him a small amount for covering his travel expenses and send him away.by the way I always add to the agreed fee the travel expenses to my hotel and if the boy was super hot I would tip him well this assure repeating service in the future with him.

I have to meet at reception but never want a scene in my building so I always bring to my room regardless.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Michael said:

Sometimes even with making things clear, it is not clear. Translation apps do not work well. Things get lost in conversations. I can't tell you how many times I ask top, bottom or both and they have no idea of what I am talking about. Zero. It takes a few times. I travel to Brazil and it is easy, Passivo, Activo, Total. But, harder on the apps here. At least for me. When I had a BF to travel with me they would always get it right as they would talk and tell them the expectations. Now, that he is gone, there is more confusion.  And, partly my fault.

I've also encountered translation difficulties, but it kind of depends on where I am.

In Pattaya, there are so many lads that I only really need to deal with the ones who can discuss the deal via an app.  To their credit, most have enough English to discuss the deal and some language like K*** + f*** + s*** = 1000 baht min.   No k*** = 0 baht, no f*** = 0 baht and no s*** = 0 baht is usually understood well.

Go to somewhere like Myanmar and the percentage who don't speak enough English is much higher.  Quite surprising for a former British colony.   

I've become more cautious with "poor English", since one of my last meets in Siem Reap supposedly couldn't handle much English on the phone app, but when he turns up, he's fairly fluent and studying English at University.   Of course, he was a dud.  As he hadn't committed to doing much of anything, of course he got the full tip & not a single riel more.  

So now, the only time I'm going to date someone who can't discuss the deal on a phone app is if I'm somewhere where there isn't much other choice around.    As an example, I had a narrow escape in Mae Sot, where there wasn't much choice.   The lad who arrived was more overweight than his photos suggested and looked rather sullen & disinterested on arrival, which is a bad sign.  However, he'd forgotten his ID card and was of an age where I couldn't overlook that.   I'd twice reminded him to bring his ID & he failed, so I just sent him away.   With zero baht, since that error was his responsibility. 

The other option would be for me to learn the local language, but if I visit 5~6 different countries in a year and there are at least 3 different alphabets, this isn't realistic for all of them.   Of course, I do need to do more with Thai.

 

 

[Boy69]

6 hours ago, Michael said:

I have to meet at reception but never want a scene in my building so I always bring to my room regardless.

You can always get out of the building and discuss the issue with the boy , when you take the boy to your room you are obligated to pay him even if he's not what he described  .IMO it's a mistake.

[anddy]

11 hours ago, Michael said:

I can't tell you how many times I ask top, bottom or both and they have no idea of what I am talking about. Zero. It takes a few times.  [...]    And, partly my fault.

Yeah I'd say you spend enough time in Thailand to learn some basic essentials such as that (where google translate or similar won't help).

Top= รุก
Bottom = รับ

[Boy69]

It's not always translation confusion with the boys sometimes they prefer to pretend that they aren't excatly understanding your demands just to show up in your room and get their tip with no intention to fulfill your desirres.

[floridarob]

"I fuck you" or "you fuck me" while pointing has worked for me 

[TotallyOz]

3 hours ago, floridarob said:

"I fuck you" or "you fuck me" while pointing has worked for me 

That works for me in a bar. But, not in an app.

[Guest]

20 hours ago, anddy said:

Yeah I'd say you spend enough time in Thailand to learn some basic essentials such as that (where google translate or similar won't help).

Top= รุก
Bottom = รับ

Thank you.  Of course, we probably need to learn a little more in order to clarify who is the top.  Top could mean "I am top" or "I am looking for a top".  Unless the Thai language incorporates some unique assumptions ?

 

16 hours ago, Boy69 said:

It's not always translation confusion with the boys sometimes they prefer to pretend that they aren't excatly understanding your demands just to show up in your room and get their tip with no intention to fulfill your desirres.

Yes, exactly as my Khmer lad describer earlier.   Pretended he couldn't converse on the app, despite being near fluent in English.     Fortunately, in places like Pattaya the majority easily speak enough English to ply their trade, so there's no need to take risks with someone who's avoiding the questions.    

 

[anddy]

4 hours ago, z909 said:

Thank you.  Of course, we probably need to learn a little more in order to clarify who is the top.  Top could mean "I am top" or "I am looking for a top".  Unless the Thai language incorporates some unique assumptions ?

No unique assumptions here. You could just use the Thai words in an otherwise English statement or question. Like:

"I am รุก"

"(Are) you รับ?" [you can omit the unnecessary and (for a Thai with rudimentary knowledge of English) somewhat complicating grammatical "are" - KISS=keep it short and simple]

[DivineMadman]

1 hour ago, anddy said:

No unique assumptions here. You could just use the Thai words in an otherwise English statement or question. Like:

"I am รุก"

"(Are) you รับ?" [you can omit the unnecessary and (for a Thai with rudimentary knowledge of English) somewhat complicating grammatical "are" - KISS=keep it short and simple]

On a slight linguistic tangent.  For some reason I am constantly fascinated and amused by how รับ can be used in Thai.

Of course there's the most beloved of all รับ = bottom (has a connotation of accepting or receiving)

So there's "I am+" เป็น+รับ (เป็นรับ)

OR another way to say it is งาน+รับ (งานรับ), where งาน usually means something in the area of "work" or "job".  So work + bottom (งานรับ) means I'm a bottom or my "role" or "position" (hehehe) is bottom รับ.  [Already a bit of a joke, because we all know the tops do all the work.]

But then if you reverse the two, รับ + งาน (รับงาน), it basically means working or technically more along the lines of "accepting work".  So the yummy guy in Hornet who says "รับงาน" is in it for the money. But he may not be a รับ.   A top (รุก) working might say รุกรับงาน (or similar variations).

The basic lesson is that in Thailand it's much easier if everyone is just verse.  

By the way, these aren't the only uses of รับ.  A massage guy will say รับ + massage (นวด) = รับนวด.  But it doesn't mean I'll "accept" a massage.  It means I will perform the massage.  nothing passive about that.

[anddy]

12 hours ago, DivineMadman said:

Of course there's the most beloved of all รับ = bottom (has a connotation of accepting or receiving)

it's not really just a connotation, "to receive , to accept" and similar are the original meanings of รับ, the gay bottom meaning is rather a slang meaning (that makes a lot of sense, needless to say), which is why it's not in the regular dictionaries. Only in the context of a discussion or statement of the sexual role does it become "bottom".  That's why there is nothing odd about the examples you gave, it's just our distorted gay perception that make those a tad odd haha  

Incidentally, the same is true of the English word "bottom" and its true and gay meanings lol

[spoon]

There isnt any word used in malay to describe top or bottom. Naturally, we just adopt the western word for it. However, in chinese, people use I and O or rather 1 and 0 for top and bottom. Ive used this as hand symbol in the thai gogo bar successfully to indicate top and bottom as well lol

[anddy]

1 hour ago, spoon said:

There isnt any word used in malay to describe top or bottom. Naturally, we just adopt the western word for it. However, in chinese, people use I and O or rather 1 and 0 for top and bottom. Ive used this as hand symbol in the thai gogo bar successfully to indicate top and bottom as well lol

lol, so it's simply the resemblance of the shape of the letters or numbers I / 1 and O / 0 to you-know-what that indicate it's meaning? That's funny but very practical  

[DivineMadman]

2 hours ago, anddy said:

it's not really just a connotation, "to receive , to accept" and similar are the original meanings of รับ, the gay bottom meaning is rather a slang meaning (that makes a lot of sense, needless to say), which is why it's not in the regular dictionaries. Only in the context of a discussion or statement of the sexual role does it become "bottom".  That's why there is nothing odd about the examples you gave, it's just our distorted gay perception that make those a tad odd haha  

Incidentally, the same is true of the English word "bottom" and its true and gay meanings lol

my point was that in other uses it doesn't mean receive.  That was the point.

[Vessey]

I have never had all that much success with the 'Apps' in terms of successful meet-ups, although I accept that right this moment it is probably the only way to go.  

Give me the bar-room interview over a drink any day of the week before deciding whether to pay bar for the lad or not. Only that way can I gauge whether boy is sufficiently 'in to me' or not to give a good time. We can talk expectations - on both sides, and a mamasan is usually around to translate if required (they have heard it all before haha). 

[anddy]

3 hours ago, DivineMadman said:

my point was that in other uses it doesn't mean receive.  That was the point.

oh I got that wrong then, maybe because of your initial comment about being "constantly fascinated and amused" about the uses of รับ. Having said that, to me in all the examples you gave it is still a form of receiving or accepting, as in taking up a task such as a massage รับนวด = taking up/accepting the task/work of giving a massage. Just making it VERY short, as they like to often do in Thai. Of course it's NOT about receiving the massage itself in this case. Again, it's is very contextual here.

But we probably shouldn't be boring other members with splitting hairs over รับ, but rather give some more useful advice in this regard, such as the pronunciation:

รับ rup
รุก rook (as in book or look)

[DivineMadman]

1 hour ago, anddy said:

oh I got that wrong then, maybe because of your initial comment about being "constantly fascinated and amused" about the uses of รับ. Having said that, to me in all the examples you gave it is still a form of receiving or accepting, as in taking up a task such as a massage รับนวด = taking up/accepting the task/work

I certainly don't understand why the fact that I thought it was fascinating or amusing changes anything.  Also, not sure why my particular examples lead anyone to then say no, this is something that must be corrected.  

The word has several different meanings depending on how it's being used.  รับ the phoneme can also mean "take" or "get" (as in go get) and others.   

Yes the bottom is taking it, as in "take it baby, take it."  But I thought I could just say that in that context the sense was the "receiving" sense.  

Here I thought I was just making a fun lighthearted non-controversial observation.  Much less one that was wrong and in need of correction.  But so be it.