LIVING IN THAILAND IS LESS FUN

[Guest]

5 hours ago, DivineMadman said:

If I go to the UK I am not entitled to get the same free health care as Brits.  I don't think that's an attack.  Same same for Canada, etc. 

Firstly, in the UK, healthcare is funded by the taxpayer.   So our healthcare is not free as we pay taxes for it.    It is only reasonable that tourists from overseas countries have to pay for healthcare (unless of course, there is a reciprocal deal on healthcare).

As far as I know, the private hospitals in Thailand are NOT funded by the Thai taxpayer.    So that's a completely different situation to the UK.     The hospitals in Thailand will charge customers different prices based on race & have different profit margins for them.  

Actually, I generally agree with the sentiment of your post & just felt the need to mention this specific point.   Rather than moan about the situation, learning to get on with it is likely to be more productive.

 

[DivineMadman]

46 minutes ago, z909 said:

Firstly, in the UK, healthcare is funded by the taxpayer.   So our healthcare is not free as we pay taxes for it.    It is only reasonable that tourists from overseas countries have to pay for healthcare (unless of course, there is a reciprocal deal on healthcare).

As far as I know, the private hospitals in Thailand are NOT funded by the Thai taxpayer.    So that's a completely different situation to the UK.     The hospitals in Thailand will charge customers different prices based on race & have different profit margins for them.  

Actually, I generally agree with the sentiment of your post & just felt the need to mention this specific point.   Rather than moan about the situation, learning to get on with it is likely to be more productive.

 

I'm confused.  It's Thai government hospitals where the arguably new policy for dual pricing has been announced.  (There are some government hospitals where this was already the practice (apparently), so for some it may be more of a codification of existing practice.)

And I actually was also very careful to note that it is the government hospitals.  ("I personally don't think dual pricing at Thai government hospitals is an attack." and "So I read the news about the change in pricing at government hospitals, . . . (emphasis added)).   Really hard to be clearer than that.

And the link that Martinsen had in his post also says government hospitals.

Thai government hospitals.  Thai taxpayer supported.  So it's not really a completely different situation at all.  Actually, I think it's exactly the same situation.

[martinsen]

Divine, you continue to suffer from a desire to paint a beautiful picture of Thailand and its government.  You have blinded yourself if you believe that they are not trying to make it as difficult as they can for expats to remain here.  And, exactly what tax base is paying to the government hospitals here?  Certainly not the Thai people who go to these hospitals. I won't pretend to know where the money comes from to finance the Thai government but I do not believe it is from taxes. Also, for your divine information, I use a private hospital here because I don't want to sit for 8 hours waiting to see a doctor as most of the patients who are there have to do.

With regard to Thai culture, I firmly believe that it cripples this land.  The desire to never disagree with or tell someone they are wrong is ridiculous.  You try to make it appear that I am thoughtless and do not understand Thai people.  I have lived here 13 years and during that time I have met many Thais and have had many good times with them but their culture also makes them hypocrits and sometime liers.  There was an occasion when a group I was with, consisting of 5 people, 3 of which were Thai, were playing cards and talking.  One of the Thais was lying about some serious things he said and none of the Thais would challenge him.  Yes, this is a small example but I have seen it on many occasions.  It is the same thing with directions.  Thais will almost never tell you they don't know.  Better to give an incorrect answer than to say they don't know and, due to their culture, loose face.

I think that you love Thailand because of the sex available to you.  That is not bad but don't let it blind you to underlying facts about Thailand and its people.

[DivineMadman]

36 minutes ago, martinsen said:

I won't pretend to know where the money comes from to finance the Thai government but I do not believe it is from taxes.

Hilarious.

[reader]

3 hours ago, martinsen said:

With regard to Thai culture, I firmly believe that it cripples this land. 

Thanks for the heads up. There are, I'm sure, now thousands of foreigners canceling their trips.

3 hours ago, martinsen said:

There was an occasion when a group I was with, consisting of 5 people, 3 of which were Thai, were playing cards and talking.  One of the Thais was lying about some serious things he said and none of the Thais would challenge him.

Thankfully you, an honest farang, were there to call him out and expose his lies.

[Gaybutton]

4 hours ago, martinsen said:

don't let it blind you to underlying facts about Thailand and its people.

"The day I don't like living in Thailand anymore, I know where the airport is."

- Geezer

[martinsen]

2 hours ago, reader said:

Thanks for the heads up. There are, I'm sure, now thousands of foreigners canceling their trips.

You are talking about vacationers.  I'm talking about people who live here.

Thankfully you, an honest farang, were there to call him out and expose his lies.

No. You simply refuse to understand my point

 

[martinsen]

Divine, you are lost in a fog of your own creation.

"There never was a man so blind as one who wouldn't see."

[paulsf]

It’s hard to take you seriously. Almost every post you’ve made over time is negative.   

[faranglaw]

So if anyone disagrees with you it’s because they don’t understand?  Is that what you think?

[Gaybutton]

2 hours ago, faranglaw said:

So if anyone disagrees with you it’s because they don’t understand?  Is that what you think?

Seems to me that's the way it comes across.

 

"Everyone is entitled to an opinion.  I didn't know it had to be yours."

-  Ed Asner (Lou Grant), 'Lou Grant'

[reader]

2 hours ago, martinsen said:

You simply refuse to understand my point

Actually I understated your point all too well and I find it irrational.

You claim to have lived in Thailand 13 years and you've come to the conclusion that Thai culture is ruining Thailand. And in all those years you haven't noticed that "saving face" is one of the foundations of Thai--and Asian---culture. Apparently it didn't occur to you that that might be the reason that the two other Thai players didn't embarrass their friend at the card table.

Oops, I forgot. You do know all about "saving face" because you blame that tradition on the Thais who keep giving you bad directions.

You feel oppressed by the government, Thais in general and certainly their ruinous culture.

But you did a ballsy thing in going after the card player who was telling untruths. Put him in his place, you did. And I'm sure your admonishment was well received, coming from an opinionated farang.

You did have the courage of your convictions and do that, didn't you?

In any case, Marty, bear in mind that just because you're paranoid doesn't mean that they're not really out to get you.

[Boy69]

Thai culture respect solidarity, respect to the elders, parents, religious and authorities. Thai people in general are very kind,shy and polite. Although it's not perfect there with double pricing system and trying to charge more tourists when I needed help always found kind local Thai to help me.

 

[martinsen]

12 hours ago, Boy69 said:

Thai culture respect solidarity, respect to the elders, parents, religious and authorities. Thai people in general are very kind,shy and polite. Although it's not perfect there with double pricing system and trying to charge more tourists when I needed help always found kind local Thai to help me.

 

You are absolutely correct.  There are some very good things about Thai Culture such as respect to the elders, parents, religious and authorities.  There is a downside to this and I have said what I believe about that.  Do you live here?  Regardless of if you live here or you are an occasional tourist I hope that you continue to enjoy yourself.

[martinsen]

Yes, I am opinionated.  But I am not alone in feeling that Thailand is not the great place to live that it once was.  Here are two very recent items about this issue:

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1122066-thailand-drops-in-ranking-of-best-places-for-expats-but-which-country-is-number-1/?utm_source=newsletter-20190906-1235&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=news

 

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1122071-thailands-foreign-businesses-balk-at-stricter-immigration-tracking/?utm_source=newsletter-20190906-1235&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=news

[Boy69]

Unfortunately I have to agree with .In the past I consider Thailand as my retirement destination once I will retire but not anymore, Nevertheless it is still fine destination for short time trips.

[PeterRS]

19 hours ago, martinsen said:

Here are two very recent items about this issue:

Martinson, you told us you have lived here for 13 years and the reason now is primarily your boyfriend. I assume you are retired - please correct me if I am wrong. But if I am right, you have posted one link to a survey that specifically relates to where it is best for expats to work. The issues are not identical. I cannot see that "Job Security" has much interest to retirees.

On the other hand, I totally agree about the TM30 nonsense.

[Gaybutton]

On 9/5/2019 at 4:23 PM, z909 said:

It is only reasonable that tourists from overseas countries have to pay for healthcare

Does the UK have the same problem Thailand claims to have - foreigners getting hospital treatment and then skipping out on the bill?

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Gaybutton said:

Does the UK have the same problem Thailand claims to have - foreigners getting hospital treatment and then skipping out on the bill?

Most of the healthcare in the UK is a state run centrally controlled monopoly (NHS).   There is some private healthcare, but since we get no tax rebates on this, it's an expensive option for ordinary people.  

I've never seen a payments desk in an NHS hospital, although I suppose they may exist.   I read all sorts of stories about overseas visitors not paying for healthcare.  I suspect it's partially because the NHS is too dumb to check their ID and secure payment if they are not eligible for free care.

Remarkably, I have seen people argue that we should treat these people for free, even though there is no way we would be entitled to the same in many of the overseas countries AND it's diverting our tax revenue away from our own healthcare.  Some people are rather naive.

I'm somewhat dissatisfied with the lack of choice with UK healthcare, like many other people, although probably not a majority of the population.  I see no reason why those who want choice should not be given some kind of tax rebate on private health insurance.  Eventually competition should improve the offering.

Unfortunately, opponents of my view will immediately quote the US healthcare system as a fine example of what can go wrong with private healthcare.    However, that is not the only alternative model.   There are plenty of other countries where ordinary people can choose their healthcare insurance provider and have some element of choice in their treatment.   Including within the EU and Asia.   This seems to work very well.

 

 

 

[NIrishGuy]

4 hours ago, z909 said:

  I read all sorts of stories about overseas visitors not paying for healthcare.  I suspect it's partially because the NHS is too dumb to check their ID and secure payment if they are not eligible for free care.

You'll be glad to hear that according to my ( NHS employed and based on an NHS ward daily) BF they ARE now clamping down a lot on medical tourism and people turning up trying to get treated FOC. Apparently they DO check immigration status and entitlement now as a matter of course BEFORE any treatment is carried out.  I think in cases of medical emergency the treatment is still carried out no matter what the persons status etc, but for things like child birth ( where mothers were flying in before hand and then turning up heavily pregnant to get both free treatment and perhaps more importantly VISA /Passport rights for their child THAT too seems to have been tightened up - about bloody time eh !  

[thaiophilus]

On 9/4/2019 at 12:14 AM, DivineMadman said:

Even more power to you if you live a home country that allows people from anywhere to stay in your country for as long as they want without any immigration restrictions, procedures, red tape, corrupt or incompetent people, nationalist batshit crazy anti-immigrant haters, etc.  Would love to know that country.  Sounds ideal.  Canada?  

I wouldn't think so. A friend of mine (British, white, male, 50s) was seriously hassled by Canadian immigration a couple of years ago, basically because he had (in their view) too many Thai stamps in his passport. And he was only proposing to spend one night there between flights.

[thaiophilus]

On 9/4/2019 at 12:14 AM, DivineMadman said:

Even more power to you if you live a home country that allows people from anywhere to stay in your country for as long as they want without any immigration restrictions, procedures, red tape, corrupt or incompetent people, nationalist batshit crazy anti-immigrant haters, etc.  Would love to know that country.  Sounds ideal.  Canada?  

I wouldn't think so. A friend of mine (British, white, male, 50s) was seriously hassled by Canadian immigration a couple of years ago, basically because he had (in their view) too many Thai stamps in his passport. And he was only proposing to spend one night there between flights.

[thaiophilus]

oops, somehow the last message was posted twice. Please don't think I think my words are so important they need repetition

[faranglaw]

Canada also will not cover health care for visitors or non-permanent residents. There have indeed been issues here with people arriving, needing expensive care, and then not paying. Even for Canadian citizens, if you leave the country for more than six months, seven in some provinces, you are dropped from the Canadian health plan for the first three months after you return. And our treatment of Aboriginal people and our record on climate change are both appalling. 

Canada looks good from outside only because we are next door to you-know-who. 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, thaiophilus said:

A friend of mine (British, white, male, 50s) was seriously hassled by Canadian immigration a couple of years ago, basically because he had (in their view) too many Thai stamps in his passport.

Is there any law against this in Canada, or is it another case of immigration officials being given more power than their tiny brains are capable of processing ?

I would have thought it's none of their damn business and if every entry stamp is matched with an timely exit stamp,  that's a track record of behaving.