Taking boys on a trip outside Thailand, steely stares of disapproval

[JimmyJoe]

Sometimes board members mention taking boys to cities outside of Thailand as a treat for them/us.  How do you guys deal with the negative reactions, cold stares from the locals and especially the tourists?  I often sometimes feel uncomfortable out and about with a boy in even in Thailand. No one assumes he’s my son/grandson.

I’ve had boys hint at and ask me to take them to various SE Asian destinations and it’s sometimes tempting. But I’m not so sure how uncomfortable we might be made to feel.

Do others have positive trip experiences?

[Terry4]

I used to be concerned about it but as i got older i started now not to care what others think.

 

A remember a few years ago i took a boy 28y ( looked 18) on a flight to Chiang Mai,we went business class and a group hi so thais were pointing and laughing from the other side of the business lounge until i gave them a cold stare.

 

I dont care what others think anymore,im not here to please anyone or make others happy that i must please them.

 

As long as im not hurting anyine else or being disrespectful to others then i like to do what i want.

 

And nor do i judge others or stare at them if they are different ,eg race, disability , etc but the biggest hypocrites have to be gay men i find.

I was once in a baht bus and a large very obese man tried to climb in and i heard one of the gay farang guys sitting opposite me say out loud , (so the obese man could hear) , how “ disgusting “ some people are.

 

I was actually very tempted to shout back at this gay man sitting opposite me i felt so angry he could judge others when the large gentleman is not judging him.

 

But no i dont care what others think,there is some on this forum who going by their posts obviously have low self esteem and do care what others think even if they dont know who they are.

 

I used to take my then boyfriend to Sou Bukhao to straight places such as Murphys, and a few other places, and yes unfortunately sometimes you do get the uneducated 2 week tourists bogans/ chavs trying to make a comment but who cares i do what makes me happy, I dont own their problems ,why should i try to please them?

 

 

But I do think your personally ( correc5 me if im wrong) referring to “ young looking boys” of course of legal age but look young/ boyish which i imagine and understand you would feel uncomfortable being around in a public place, I probaly would too

[abidismaili]

Sometimes board members mention taking boys to cities outside of Thailand as a treat for them/us.  How do you guys deal with the negative reactions, cold stares from the locals and especially the tourists?  I often sometimes feel uncomfortable out and about with a boy in even in Thailand. No one assumes he’s my son/grandson.

 

I’ve had boys hint at and ask me to take them to various SE Asian destinations and it’s sometimes tempting. But I’m not so sure how uncomfortable we might be made to feel.

 

Do others have positive trip experiences?

 

Never ever experienced anything bad or strange stares. I have taken a boy to Cambodia (Siem Reap), Singapore, Japan (Tokyo) and Russia (Moscow). The number of options is limited because for most countries Thai need a visa, so I picked countries for which they don't need it.

 

Only in the last country (Russia) I was a bit worried. So I told him to not act too feminine and during the Moscow trip I also said "when people ask we will say you are the brother of my wife and you wanted to see Moscow". I also took care for the Moscow trip we had one room with 2 beds. Just to be sure.  But for the other 3 countries we walked hand in hand and no strange stares at all (maybe also because I am in my 40s and many Asians say I look younger, so it is maybe less weird then if a 75 year old would do it). Also nothing strange in Moscow but there we didn't show it, just as a pre-caution.

[JimmyJoe]

I used to be concerned about it but as i got older i started now not to care what others think.

 

 i took a boy 28y ( looked 18)

 

I dont care what others think anymore,im not here to please anyone or make others happy that i must please them.

 

But no i dont care what others think,there is some on this forum who going by their posts obviously have low self esteem and do care what others think even if they dont know who they are.

 

But I do think your personally ( correc5 me if im wrong) referring to “ young looking boys” of course of legal age but look young/ boyish which i imagine and understand you would feel uncomfortable being around in a public place, I probaly would too

 

What a long rant full of contradictions. You claim not to care what others think of you with YOUR young looking boy, and voice disdain for other board members who do care. And then say I should feel uncomfortable and you would too, if you were me...

 

As the French saying goes: You've missed a great opportunity to keep quiet.

[a447a]

 

"I dont care what others think anymore,im not here to please anyone or make others happy that i must please them."

 

I think that's a great way to lead your life; I couldn't agree more. I was about to give you a "like ".

 

But then you wrote this :

 

"And nor do i judge others...", and quickly followed it up with :

 

".....there is some on this forum who going by their posts obviously have low self esteem and do care what others think ...."

 

I'm one of those people and you are judging me. You've immediately contradicted yourself.

 

I think my self-esteem is actually quite healthy, but I definitely find it uncomfortable being stuck in a lift with mum, dad and the kids as I take a guy up to my room. I don't think that feeling uncomfortable necessarily equates to having low self-esteem. It's just a bit awkward.

 

But you are ignoring a big part of the equation - the feelings of the guy you are with. Afterall, they are staring at him too, and he also would feel uncomfortable. We have to take his feelings into consideration, too, and avoid putting him in an uncomfortable situation.

 

And as has already been pointed out, you contradicted yourself again in your last sentence, where you said you would feel uncomfortable if you were say, 75 years old in the company of a younger guy, thereby indicating that you may also suffer from low self-esteem.

 

I don't consider your post to be a "rant " but it is a little confusing.

[Londoner]

I've taken my boyfriend to Bali and Laos on a number of occasions.  No problems. I wouldn't take him anywhere where he felt uncomfortable. 

I wrote this before seeing a447's post-we must have been posting simultaneously- and he is absolutely correct; the feelings of our partners are paramount.    

[witty]

Being a seventy five years old is very different from being in his 40s, notwithstanding one's self-esteem. Viagra might help, but still...

[JimmyJoe]

I agree completely that it is essential to take the boys feelings into account. I also agree, the situation is very different if you are in your forties or in your seventies, in terms of the outside world's reaction to the age difference. I'll soon be sixty, so midway between the two situations. Like I said in my post, several boys have asked for these trips. So I guess their feelings would be ok. Of course, if they've never traveled abroad with an older customer they might not yet know what to expect. One boy who's been angling for a trip to Malaysia has already traveled there with a customer, albeit an Asian one. That probably changes the equation too, although I don't know.

[a447a]

Being a seventy five years old is very different from being in his 40s....

Yes, I agree.

 

But even a farang in his 40s walking around with a Thai guy in his 20s would still invite those knowing looks is disapproval. I think their "relationship" would be pretty obvious.

 

If they were both farang, the situation would be entirely different.

[abidismaili]

And as has already been pointed out, you contradicted yourself again in your last sentence, where you said you would feel uncomfortable if you were say, 75 years old in the company of a younger guy, thereby indicating that you may also suffer from low self-esteem.

 

I think you are confusing me with Terry4. I didn't brough up the low self esteem remark. I did brought up a remark about 75 year old, but only to indicate that that would maybe invite more stares.

[a447a]

Yes, I was replying to Terry.

 

And yes, I did attribute your comments regarding a 75 year old to Terry .

 

Sorry!

[paborn]

And nor do i judge others or stare at them if they are different ,eg race, disability , etc but the biggest hypocrites have to be gay men i find.

 

 

I do hope that the rancid, bitter attacks on the older members of this forum are not returning.

[vinapu]

I dont care what others think anymore,im not here to please anyone or make others happy that i must please them.

 

.......

 you would feel uncomfortable being around in a public place, I probaly would too

if we are in company of somebody we should care about that companion may feel, it's not just about us  even if  we are financing whole event. 

 

I just noticed a447 voiced similar concern above

[vinapu]

And nor do i judge others or stare at them if they are different ,eg race, disability , etc but the biggest hypocrites have to be gay men i find.

 

 

I do hope that the rancid, bitter attacks on the older ( ? ) members of this forum are not returning.

I like to draw attention to fact that cited comment did not say anything about AGE  of criticized sector of population (my underscore  and question mark ).

 

 

Otherwise I agree with you that this kind of stereotyping is misplaced. Gay men are just regular men , warts and all and only difference about us is that we are turning heads when GUY with shapely  ass is passing by why our hetro brothers are handicapped by not being able to admire  such a beauty.

[paborn]

Vinapu, I refer you back to the vile remarks at the end of the discussions on "barebacking" I noted that I detected a whiff of that and, merely, hoped that this was not returning. If I'm wrong, so be it. Still, a word of caution to the wise is not uncalled for considering history. 

 

Besides, I did not mean only "old members" in their years. But established members who post helpful and unconfrontational remarks.

[vinapu]

all clear

[Terry4]

I didnt think my post was offensive in anyway,merely just replying to the original post.

 

Im disapointed you feel that way and are offended by my comment on the example I gave of the obese gentleman and how I witnessed him being bullied by a gay farang because of his size.

 

It was an example I gave because I felt strongly that no one deserves to be bullied,especially when the bully himself would not like to be bullied or should know what it is like to be treated differently.

It certainly wasnt aimed at all gay men.

 

However please feel free to place me on ignore and I will do likewise to you.

 

Sorry, but I did not mention any comment about anyone being 75 or any age similar, you may have my post confused with another post above,

however having read that post I didnt find that particular post being age discriminatory in any way either, it seems the poster was just merely giving an example of someone older maybe stared or noticed far more because he was with a younger guy than say someone middleaged.

What a long rant full of contradictions. You claim not to care what others think of you with YOUR young looking boy, and voice disdain for other board members who do care. And then say I should feel uncomfortable and you would too, if you were me...

 

As the French saying goes: You've missed a great opportunity to keep quiet.

I didnt think my post was offensive in anyway,merely just replying to the original post.

 

Im disapointed you feel that way and are offended by my comment on the example I gave of the obese gentleman and how I witnessed him being bullied by a gay farang because of his size.

 

It was an example I gave because I felt strongly that no one deserves to be bullied,especially when the bully himself would not like to be bullied or should know what it is like to be treated differently, it certainly wasnt aimed at all gay men .

 

However please feel free to place me on ignore and I will do likewise to you.

 

Sorry, but I did not mention any comment about anyone being 75 or any age similar, you may have my post confused with another post above,

however having read that post I didnt find that particular post being age discriminatory in any way either, it seems the poster was just merely giving an example of someone older maybe stared or noticed far more because he was with a younger guy than say someone middleaged.

 

Once again my apologies you were offended.

[a447a]

Terry, I certainly didn't find your post offensive. I actually think you made some good points

 

I agree with your reaction to the rude guys on the baht bus. There are a couple of members of the gay boards who love to criticise the size, age, appearance and clothing choice of farang they see, especially in Pattaya. Sometimes I wonder if those members are not secretly describing themselves!

 

And I admire anyone who has the ability to ignore those disapproving looks. Unfortunately, I'm not one of them.

 

I was simply a little confused by the last sentence in your post.

 

And speaking of being confused, I mistakenly attributed the comment about the 75 year old to you; I've apologised for that.

[sglad]

A remember a few years ago i took a boy 28y ( looked 18) on a flight to Chiang Mai,we went business class and a group hi so thais were pointing and laughing from the other side of the business lounge until i gave them a cold stare.

 

I find this hard to believe.  Polite Thais generally don't point and they certainly wouldn't in an enclosed place where their actions would easily be visible and scrutinised. They wouldn't want to attract attention to themselves in an environment where people generally behave. If they're middle or upper-middle class, they would have mastered the art of seeing but not looking (which is a different skill from looking but not seeing, which they're also great at).  A quick once over maybe, a glance, a smirk possibly or a disapproving glare but not pointing and laughing.  If they're upper class they wouldn't even  look at you.

[sglad]

 agree completely that it is essential to take the boys feelings into account.

 

Fair.  But unless your "boy" is fresh off the boat and you're his first ever farang, chances are he's used to it all and has learnt to shrug it off.  Also there may be other reasons why a guy might not want to go to a particular venue with you - he had just been there two nights before with a different customer; you're his boyfriend (or potential boyfriend) and he had been there three nights before with his OTHER boyfriend; he feels that YOU may not be the right fit for the venue and doesn't want to tell it to your face...a myriad of other possibe reasons.

[sglad]

I’ve had boys hint at and ask me to take them to various SE Asian destinations and it’s sometimes tempting. But I’m not so sure how uncomfortable we might be made to feel.

 

Firstly you've got to ask yourself whether YOU'd be comfortable coz if you're uncomfortable then your friend would be able to pick up on it and he might end up feeling uncomfortable too.

 

I used to wait tables at a a five-star-hotel restaurant here in Sg when I was at uni and occasionally we would see older white and younger Asian couples (MF, MM).  We didn't treat them any differently.  As long as you're dressed appropriately for the venue and behaved accordingly, there's no reason for us to not give you our best service.  Would the other guests form a certain opinion or gossip about you?  They might but that can happen anywhere, even in Pattaya!  You can't control people's thoughts and demand acceptance.

 

If you're really not sure, then maybe you can take your special friend travelling WITHIN Thailand first, if anything to get to know him better and to see if both of you are suited for travel elsewhere.

[paborn]

"Once again my apologies you were offended. "  Terry4

 

To be clear, I was not at all offended by your post and agreed, as did others, with some of your points. However, when you began to speak of gay hypocrisy I detected ( I admitted I might be wrong in my remarks ) a whiff of the attitude you displayed before your unfortunate and I hope lamented tirade. I expressed a hope that we were not going there again.

 

 

[Boy69]

I have had some boys for long term including long trips with them and I really can't remember any offensive incident, and to tell the truth I really don't give a dam what other people think and concentrate enjoying myself with my boy .

[colmx]

I've taken my BF to: Singapore, Malaysia, Hong Kong, Laos, Macau, Vietnam, Cambodia and Ireland on numerous occasions

 

Never had any homophobic issues in 16 years travelling together

 

Only issue we ever encountered was in a gay bar/club in Ireland where one of the local queens took offence to his spikey hairstyle and poured a pint of beer over his head. BF took it in his stride though and went straight to the security guard (aka Bouncer) and had the guy thrown out of the club... Certainly showed more restraint than I would have had I been in his shoes

[joshhb]

This year, me, a 58 y.o, farang and my 25 y.o Thai fiancé have been to Malaysia, Myanmar (twice), UAE (twice), Laos and Turkey. 3 out of the 5 are Muslim counties. No problems whatsoever. Just be respectful to local culture around locals. The ex-pats have no problems.