Bangkok Trip Report 2018: I Get Really Greedy Edition

[vinapu]

. And of course quality of boys in bkk makes it all worth the while lol.

and that sums it all neatly

[abidismaili]

Very nice post about that index, but it isn't correct for my situation. If you only do short time, so not overnight, the index reduces immensely: then in stead of doing 7 * 1000 for California, you need to do 7 * 250. And gone is already a large part of the gain.

 

Also you say a boy is about 2000 baht ($50). Not true if you use bars. You have off fee, you have at least two drinks to pay. Say in total 2000 + 500 + 500 (and then I use the cheapest bars) = 3000 baht for a boy, not 2000. But factor in that to find your boy for the night you maybe went to other bar first to talk to boy there first that is another few hundred bahts. So I wouldn't be surprised that scooting for a boy in bars brings the total to 4000 baht short time (unless the first boy you talk with in the first bar is always the one you choose).

 

So in my case it would still be profitable to go to Bangkok, but the index would be far lower than 5.54.

[vinapu]

Very nice post about that index, but it isn't correct for my situation. 

that is understandable and numazu stated clearly that " Your Monger Index may be different."

 

all boils down to how one goes about hiring suitable boys , how much they are tipped and  how tips  compare to charges local boys if any  are requring.

 

I for one don't have  those problems since I whore only in Thailand and I don't spent much energy on financial issues . If I have money I go and off boys like there's no tomorrow, If I don't,  I stay home and read books. 

 

Last thing I want to do on vacation is licking candy through the glass and depriving myself of life's small pleasures just because budget issues.

[Guest]

I look for a balanced approach to these things.

 

It's good to have fun, but I also need to save so that when I quit working, there is some money so the fun doesn't stop.  Also, when I do quit working, the trips will be longer, so I need sustainable budgets.

 

Avoiding high recurring expenses is one factor.   

If I'm in an expensive country on business, I have no problem paying 5000 baht for an hour of fun at the weekend. 

Also, it's OK to blow 3000~5000+ baht on a soi twilight visit with an off, for a few nights.

 

If I were to spend 10,000+ per night, plus flights etc for the current 30 day trips & then several month trips once retired, there is a danger the money might run out during retirement and this would not be sustainable.    Particularly after adding in other expenses and making allowances for exchange rate risk, investment performance etc.

 

I like to keep costs at a level where I don't need to save for it now and at a level where I could go on several 3 month trips each year once retired,  To do that, I can head down to Pattaya where paying 12~1300 ST & 2000 LT is just as much fun.

 

 

Some people will be making much more than me & are welcome to spend it as they see fit, or even make the same as me & enjoy it now, whilst carrying on working until 70.

 

After all, if I had a Bill Gates bank balance, I would probably fly there on a private jet with cabin crew in white speedos.  

 

So who am I to question the expenditure of other board members, who can afford a  more indulgent holiday ?

[vinapu]

 

If I'm in an expensive country on business, I have no problem paying 5000 baht for an hour of fun at the weekend. 

 

that's the logic we often employ when we travel.

 

We have no problem paying say 3000 baht for taxi from  Heathrow to the London because this is what price is ( no idea if that's correct, it's just an example ) but we will scream bloody murder if driver in Bangkok would ask for 600 for the same distance and travel time  because we know that price should be 1/2 of that  not considering that we still have 1/5 of price  we are willing to pay somewhere else.

 

I try  to remember that  on my trips specially when comes to meals and transportation, whoring is another matter  but no,  I'd not pay 5000 baht for hour of fun anywhere preferring to wait until I get to Thailand and blew the same for the whole night / drinks and off fee included.

 

It's why  an index like in original post is of great help although some people may consider factors other  than monetary like length of flight or need to justify to family and friends frequency of Thailand visits.

[spoon]

Exactly, this index is for those who have to make a choice between any countries they wanted to go for hiring boys as well as vs a staycation in your own country. The name index itself suggest a relative value vs a predetermined reference, which in this case, US vs other places. U can create your own index using the detailed step by step instructions that numazu has generously provided. And you can always tailor it to you own habits. I probably will do my own calculations later just for fun haha. Disclaimer - i am also asian. And i love maths

[Guest]

Perhaps this whole topic merits it's own thread rather than pushing into one with Numazu's wonderfui trip reports.

 

 

My "index" was a money boy tip to gdp per capita ratio, although I also reference to the minimum wage.

 

Thailand has a GDP per capita of $6591  and the minimum normal tip for short time is 1000 baht ($30.30).

Germany has a GDP per capita of $44550 and perhaps the minimum tip is Eur 50 ($58.44)

 

So Thai GDP per capita per day = $18  and the minimum tip is  167% of the daily GDP

German GDP per capita per day = $122 and the minimum tip is 41% of this.  

 

Even if I have the wrong figure at Eur 50, it's got to go up a long way to go past 167%.

 

So whilst we do well in Thailand compared with costs at home, they are also earning quite well when compared with the local GDP.     Also, I believe the minimum wage is still THB 300 per day ?

[santosh108]

Fantastic!!  A win - win situation.

[Jasper]

I believe minimum wage has gone up this year to 330 baht a day.

[CurtisD]

I had never thought of making this comparison, possibly as I do not hire escorts back home as it has no appeal, but it provides an interesting insight.

 

Putting my own costs into Numazu's equation  - higher hotel and airfare costs, no daytime boy only overnight in Thailand and only a boy for a couple of hours back home not overnight (ok, from my statement above this should be zero, but let's assume I break out of the mold a little) - I am ahead going to Thailand just on the basis of the Index.

 

Then I factor in the non-Index factors (I really like Thailand, health benefits) and I need to travel to Thailand much more regularly than I do. 

 

The fact that I like Thailand does not require elaboration.

 

The health benefits are less obvious so I will elaborate. 

 

I am at an age at which, if I focus on diet and exercise, I can look pretty pulled together (for my age) but also, if I let my focus slip, which with travel and social rounds is all too easy, I quickly get out of shape. My three best motivators to keep in shape have nothing to do with all I know about living a healthy life. They are:

   (i) Vanity. Cloths starting to get tight drives me nuts. But if they are tight, I have already gained pounds. So vanity only works as a boundary condition. 

  (ii) Meeting an Ex. I am on good terms with two ex's who are now in different cities. If I know we are going to meet I am very focused on being in shape, even though nothing is going to 'happen'. Partly it's vanity and partly a sort of respect. We look out for each other and I know they will be keeping an eye on me, so I don't want to disappoint or give cause for concern. However, we only meet a couple of times a year.

 (iii) Knowing I will be spending time in Thailand. Partly this is a stamina issue. If there is going to be a prolonged period of heightened sexual activity, I need to be up to it. Partly it is also a sort of respect. I like Thai guys and think that even if I am paying,they should enjoy themselves, and there is more chance of that if I am in shape. 

 

My insight from Numazu's Index is that my best chance of consistently keeping in shape (while having fun) is to visit Thailand more often.

 

So now I need to go beyond the Index and do some sort of regression analysis to determine how much more time I should spend in Thailand.

 

Any of you math enthusiasts have a formula for that?

 

Is there an angle here for the Tourism Authority of Thailand and medical systems everywhere ("forget the pills, let me prescribe a week in Thailand")?

[Londoner]

An interesting discussion. I'd add another factor which makes Thailand a good choice. It relates to safety and confidence. As a regular in Thailand for more than twenty years, I feel entirely safe when offing and meeting via apps...confident that the authorities won't intervene in my pleasure and that the guy I meet, if treated appropriately, will not turn nasty or manipulative. I am happy to pay for this.

[spoon]

So i tried to do some excel spreadsheets comparing some costs of services between kuala lumpur vs bangkok tailored to my own habit. It includes massages cost as well, with a minimum and maximum for each category (normal massage, gay massage, money boy (little or no massage in kl vs gogo boy in bkk).

 

For massages, its further divided into time spent, 60-90-120min. Without even considering hotel costs and air travel, it seems like there is two categories where its cheaper for me to do in bkk compare with in kl, one is the normal massage prices, where its slightly cheaper. However for gay massages, for 60min duration, its about the same, anything longer, its cheaper here.

 

For moneyboy, gogobar, i include at least the price of off fee and tips for st and lt, where in kl, there is no off fee, its cheaper to get in kl vs bkk, but for lt, or overnight, bkk wins by a lot. Anyway, as i mentioned before, quality and quantity of offable boys or muscular masseurs in bkk far surpass what kl have to offer.

Another thing to mention, for gay massage, i used arena for minimum, senso for maximum. Similarly in kl, i use the cheapest male massage center and the trendiest one, which is still not up to senso standard ( massage on table vs king size bed). Eitherway, itll never be apple to apple comparison, so why not have both of the goods haha.

 

Also worth to mention, aside from normal massage, everything else is illegal here.

[vinapu]

 Either way, it'll never be apple to apple comparison, so why not have both of the goods haha.

 

 

and that's the proper attitude -use all your opportunities with both hands instead spltiitng hair in four to find the best deal

[Guest]

 the guy I meet, if treated appropriately, will not turn nasty or manipulative. I am happy to pay for this.

Me too.   They have the right attitude in Thailand.

[vinapu]

Me too.   They have the right attitude in Thailand.

I agree but it pays not to use too rosy glasses.

 

VERY RARELY but  it happened to me that boy repeatedly offed and always generously compensated took it for granted and tried either to bump up his tip ,  to slack off a bit or sneak out before time agreed which is cardinal sin for paid encounters in my book.

[ggobkk]

I thought the cardinal sinner was in Washington...and then the one in Australia

[Guest]

I agree but it pays not to use too rosy glasses.

 

VERY RARELY but  it happened to me that boy repeatedly offed and always generously compensated took it for granted and tried either to bump up his tip ,  to slack off a bit or sneak out before time agreed which is cardinal sin for paid encounters in my book.

 

The attitude in Thailand is one of the best there is, but yes, I have seen complacency and slacking off amongst certain repeat offs.

One example, seems to have forgotten some of the delightful behaviours that resulted in multiple offs on previous trips.   So on the last trip, he got just the one time.  Next time I will take control of the situation and state clearly what's needed if he wants to come around again.

 

Actually, I've even had a case where a first time Gay Romeo lad was holding back & I reminded him what was necessary to get the tip and the attitude immediately picked up. 

 

On the other hand, I can think of one case where I will just not bother again.  The guys used to offer great conversation, be good in bed, do long time and was in great shape.   Two years later, he's more overweight than me,  couldn't do long time, no offered conversation & wasn't good in bed.    

 

All very well, but that's not what I pay for, so I am unlikely to off him again.   Of course we will probably have a short chat in the street, but if he want's a meeting & brown notes, then I will be making my excuses.  

 

I still say the attitude of boys in Thailand is amongst the best there is.

[numazu]

Day 1.5: Under Moonlight

 

When in Thailand, I usually don’t off twinks. Not because I am not attracted to them, but because I usually get some twink action when I’m back home. There are many reasons why I pay for sex overseas, and an important one is my search for variety: I’d rather get hunky or muscley Asian men in Thailand because I don’t usually hookup with them much at home. But of course, there are always exceptions, and ShanBoy is one perfect example. But this is why at the beginning of my Thailand adventures I would normally park my ass in Tawan, for the muscle men, DreamBoy, for the gorgeous Thais, and (old) Jupiter, for the hunks.

 

This is the same reason why I was excited about the boy bar Moonlight, which is really a reimagined, more streamlined version of (old) Jupiter. New Jupiter seems to be cut from the same cloth, but more sanitized and gentrified to attract a more general type of audience. That is where the money is, obviously, and it is working for both bars. Much to the chagrin of course to most of us who long for the more sleazy Bangkok boy bars of the past. These are bars I would be comfortable bringing my boyfriend (or my sister really) to for a solid night of entertainment and staring at gorgeous guys, without the veil of sleaziness one associates Thai bars with.

 

So I hoof it from FreshBoys to Moonlight, carefully minding the tuktuks speeding past me in Surawong. I get to the familiar old Jupiter street close to Surawongse hotel. The façade itself was pretty inviting:

 

 

There were also two model types hanging around the front of the bar. Two hunk types that I would usually off in a heartbeat. But of course I shouldn’t just off them now and not go in the bar to see what it was about. I pay the entrance, a very reasonable 300 baht with one drink, and get escorted into the premises. Once inside, I was kind of surprised I was able to be seated in the second row, which was elevated and has a better viewing angle than the first row, which was just at the edge of stage and therefore you had to look up to view the show. I mean, if you wanted to be closer to the bulges and the boys, that was where to go, but I wanted to be comfortable, and have a wider viewing angle. I was also surprised that the back half of the bar was full. The customers are too shy to sit up front. Why was that.

 

As I sit down I get a “Ni hao!” from the waitstaff.  I guess I’m Chinese today. A captain asked me what my drink order was. I give it to him and 5 minutes later he comes back with my drink. I peruse the male offerings on display at the stage. Some average to good looking boys on tonight. Where were the hunks? The captain sits by me. “Where are you from?” he asks me. “USA. California” I answer. The captain suddenly gets excited. “I thought you are from China. Are you Asian?” I tell him of course, I am Asian, and I tell him my heritage. It’s a question I always have to answer here. The captain then tells me that he has been to the USA before. We talk about USA for a bit. He was very friendly.

 

I then tell the captain to buy himself a drink. If he was going to sit with me for this long he might as well be comfortable (or I guess in this case, compensated). As we talk, the boys suddenly leave the stage and a host gets on the stage. And then one by one, the hunks were introduced. Wow, these guys are really really gorgeous. I ask the captain if they were offable. He said some of them yes, but the others have to be convinced. But said that if I wanted anyone off the hunks shelf I am sure something can be arranged.

 

From my experience in Thailand, hunks of these quality usually don’t bottom, don’t kiss passionately, and only built for worship and objectification, not for intense sexual sessions. So I preempt myself from asking stupid questions and just tell the captain “They don’t bottom I am sure.” The captain nods, “Only top.” “They don’t kiss as well?” “Some do. Depends on the customer. Maybe you yes.” I laugh. That would probably mean more $$$. Still, I do find myself worshipping about half of these boys. Curiosity sometimes takes a backseat to sexual gratification for me, especially overseas, and more often than not I am surprised by the result.

 

The captain asks me what my normal type was. I tell him the truth: a bottom would be nice. He then thinks about his selection of boys. He asks me for my Line and I give it to him. After a minute I get a couple of photos from him (censored as per GayThailand’s policy):

 

 

 

 

“Wow!” I exclaim. Forget about the hunks. This boy was HOT. “He is Cambodian,” the captain tell me. I ask him if I could off him. The captain goes and finds the boy. Suddenly, behind me, I hear someone creep up to me. “Numazu!” a boyish voice calls out. I was about to turn around but strong arms suddenly engulf me from behind. Who was this guy? The boy sits beside me. It was MonBoy. Remember him?

 

He takes off his shirt revealing his tan and fit torso. He takes off his pants to reveal very strong thighs and large calves. He was wearing loose fitting boxer briefs, which was less sexy than what I am used to seeing with these gogo boys. But I see the reason why he wears loose underwear. Peaking out at the bottom of his boxers briefs was his cock, soft but long enough to see at the bottom seam of the boxers. That was a monster. He definitely needs loose fitting briefs to accommodate that appendage. He adjusts his cock and puts it back into hiding. This was amazing already.

 

He sits next to me on the couch. His body was more amazing up close. He sees me looking at him and poses. He adjusts his cock with his hand over his briefs and makes it big. Holy crap that’s huge. I touch it and confirm the size with my bare hand. I tell him its really big. I tell him I see why customers like him. And I tell him that even if I want to have sex with him, I would like to know him too, pointing to his brain and his heart. He nods and smells me again. Man, he does like to smell me.

 

I ask him the basics. How old he was (he says 23). I ask were he is from (some mid-sized town in Mon State in Myanmar). I ask him how long he has been working in Jupiter (2 weeks). I ask what he was before he was a gogo boy (he was a farmer – lots of vegetable crops). I ask why he is a money boy (he needed money to finish his house, it takes too long to save money being a farmer). And I ask him if he likes being a money boy (he doesn’t but he has no choice).

 

He kisses me full on the lips. As like before he was not shy about giving me affection. I was not sure how this PDA would go over in the bar, but I didn’t care at this point. The feelings come back. I was very happy to see him. He was still handsome, maybe looks happier tonight. He was in the usual Moonlight tank top and briefs uniform. He seems a little bit more muscular than before. His thighs were massive. He was more tan. His arms were toned. And his smile of course. That stupid engaging smile. It was a big smile, very genuine. He was giddy that he saw me again. I was giddy too. I can’t believe he is working again in Moonlight.

 

He hugs me tightly. He kisses my hand, my forearm, my neck. “Good to see you again,” he says. “You ok?” I ask. “Yes, now I OK.” I knew he has been through hard times in the past year (from his facebook). But now he looks radiant and carefree. We talk for a bit about how long I was here for and my plans. He kisses me again. This was getting out of hand. I appreciated the attention but he was getting a lot of stares from other customers.

 

The captain comes back. He tells me the gorgeous boy was offed for the night and left early. He said the boy was fairly popular. But he said I can back tomorrow and the captain will reserve the boy for me. I tell him to do just that. I think I have my boy for tonight.

 

The captain, seeing the obvious unbridled affection Monboy was showing me, asks me if we knew each other. I tell him a short version of what happened before. I even show the captain a photo of the hickeys I’ve received from MonBoy last year when I offed him in new Jupiter. I told the captain the boy knew how to be with me. And it was obvious that he wanted to be with me again. Maybe it was out of necessity, or maybe he really wanted to connect with me. I was actually nostalgic and wanted him tonight. I asked MonBoy if he can be offed tonight. He tells me yes but he has a couple of numbers in the show tonight. And asked me if I could wait. I wanted to see the show anyway so it was just fine.

 

I won’t elaborate on what the show entails because everyone can watch it in Moonlight’s live feed in the Facebook page. But of course, that live feed pales in comparison to seeing it live. The model boys were super gorgeous and god-like sexy, and their parts in the show were well-choreographed and maximized their sexiness and appeal to the audience. The other numbers were great as well. Very well done and the choreography was excellent. It was a far cry from the indifferent dancing that plagued the old Jupiter before. Moonlight was on the top of its game, from the excellent numbers to the gorgeous models to the great boys, down to the social media presence and promotional materials available. If this was the future of Bangkok boy show bars, I was fine with it. Others of course disagree.

 

While the show was happening the captain continues to engage me with some tidbits about the bar and the boys. He was really friendly and helpful, and not at all annoying. I am the weird Bangkok sex tourist who actually doesn’t mind getting pestered by mamasans and captains. I find that I get a bit more  out of the evening with their help. And sure enough I do get more from this captain. I’ll elaborate on this later.

 

MonBoy does his two show numbers and sits back down with me. I tell him to put on street clothes. The show has made me really horny for my short-time with MonBoy. I pay for the off fee and the extra drink by the captain. MonBoy returns and kisses me on the lips and sits down and takes my hand. It was 11:10 PM. I still had that one boy that I offed in FreshBoy that I was gonna meet at midnight. I better get moving. I tell MonBoy we should go. I say goodbye to the captain and tell him I’ll be back tomorrow for the Cambodian.  MonBoy takes my hand and we leave the bar holding hands.

 

Reacquainting myself with MonBoy, next…

[Boy69]

Great report Namzu as usual,very interesting to know how you managed to squeeze 2 boys at such a short time gape. LOL .

[spoon]

i also find mamasan at moonlight has been very helpful, though too bad i didnt off anyone when i got there. U cant show me those gorgeous models and asked me to settle for less haha. And yes, that boy above, is also recommended to me by the mamasan. While he is indded handsome, i find him a tad bit fem for my liking but i guess its normal for a bottom?

[Jasper]

I can’t say I am surprised to hear MonBoy is back from the village.

The lure of baht is too strong I guess.

At least we now know what happened to the MonBoy from your previous story.

Thank you.

[traveller123]

I can not be alone in wanting to know what happened to Mon Boy

[Boy69]

I can’t say I am surprised to hear MonBoy is back from the village.

The lure of baht is too strong I guess.

At least we now know what happened to the MonBoy from your previous story.

Thank you.

The easy money is very tempting their alternative is to work hard on regular job for pinuts.

[vinapu]

I can not be alone in wanting to know what happened to Mon Boy

just wait patiently for numazu's next installment  

[GWMinUS]

Yes, very interesting that MonBoy returns to the Story.

I wondered what had happen and why he was not the guy to meet you at the Airport...

Leaw pob gun mai!!