Dual Pricing

[DivineMadman]

I know dual pricing is a trigger issue for some.  Yesterday -- presumably in response to a complaint somewhere -- Chakran Sauna posted their "thoughts" on the TMB Group chat.  I've attached a screen grab of their thinking.  I dont think we usually get the arguments from the "other side" so I am sharing it here (not that there's much substance).  

 

In this context the dual pricing is foreigner vs. local Thai.

 

I don't actually know anything about the pricing at Chakran.  I'm not really a fan of the related VCK Cool Space massage shop.  I don't think anything they say is particularly compelling but they are up front, which is refreshing.   

 

This issue is also unrelated to Chakran Sauna's reputation as being asian-for-asian and not too welcoming of farang once they get into the sauna.  That is just its reputation, and I can't really vouch for accuracy on that.  It's a shame because it looks to be a nice facility.  

 

Personally, I wouldn't go to a massage shop or restaurant or movie theater that gave different pricing to foreigners.  But it doesn't bother me when cultural institutions (museums, parks, etc.)  supported by taxpayers have dual pricing with lower prices for locals.  But if you're going all the way to Thailand and have a hankering for fun at a sauna, I certainly wouldn't miss out or let the different pricing ruin my fun.  

 

[vinapu]

not that I'm big fan of dual pricing but as long as it's posted up front I don't mind.

 

Our protests about it's unfairness are bit sanctimonious when we take into account that often we are on receiving end of it's benefits - visa free access to Thailand for most westerners is one example.

 

Chakran's point about visa fees it well pointed, unknown to most of us is fact that some of our countries are charging hefty visa fee up front and it's not refundable   in case admission or visa is not granted.

[GWMinUS]

Yes, I feel the US Govt charges an ridiculous fee to accept, process, review, and probably deny a Tourist Visa!!!

I thought the Visa Fee was now USD240.

So why would a Thai or Filipino or other SE Asian want to come here???

Maybe the Thai Govt should open new negotiations with Mr. Trump???

[colmx]

I would rather pay the $20-30USD visa fee in Cambodia, Vietnam or Laos... than get a free Thai visa and be discriminated against by racists in Chakran....

 

The above post from Chakran (if indeed it is from them) is pure racism and deserves nothing but distain...

Meanwhile TripAdvisor reports call the place a seedy dive full of rent boys!

 

Are the foreigner fees charged equally to Chinese and Asian visitors.... or is it simply an anti-whites policy?

[PeterRS]

Its nonsense to draw a comparison between a government mandated fee and entrance to a private facility. The government here charges foreigners a lot more to enter national parks than locals. Thats fair in my book. I dont pay taxes and doubt if my contribution to the local economy amounts to much on the larger scheme of things. So unlike some moaners I happily pay that higher fee.

 

I used to visit Chakran when there was no issue with foreigners and always enjoyed the place. Now it seems to be following the example of R3 which had a much higher charge for over 50s. Both are privately run facilities. I reckon they have a right to charge whatever they want and to have different prices if they want. I may object to it but I believe that is their right. So I will go elsewhere. Fortunately there is some choice here.

 

Is it any different to my going to ritzy Central Chidlom where their croissants cost 35 baht but at the new Tops on Nanglinchee which has croissants from the same bakery they cost only 29 baht.

 

Some of us faring seem to think we have a divine right to enter any sex establishment. IMHO we fail to realise that there are many younger Thais who for whatever reason feel uncomfortable in the presence of non-Thais and really want to spend time with their compatriots. We should respect that.

 

On the other hand, Chakrans flimsy excuse is just plain nonsense and they should take it down immediately. If they don't want foreigners, post s notice to that effect. That is what the Japanese saunas did when AIDS cases started to appear in Japan. It was another stupid act as the cat was out of the bag by then. But did that cause howls from foreigners? I doubt it.

[bkkguy]

if Chakran seriously wants to "make right of inbalance economy of the world" they could perhaps start by looking in their own backyard and start asking their Thai customers to produce payslips or tax returns to show that they are low income earners and therefore qualify for a cheaper admission rate than other visitors - it would be interesting to see what the reaction to that would be from the locals!

 

or perhaps they could just stop their pseudo-moralistic posturing and follow their own advice - if the don't like the visa fees charged by some countries then respect that and walk away without trying to change it!

 

bkkguy

[Guest abang1961]

It is their opinion that since we can afford to travel, they can charge us more than the locals.

As a foreigner, I want to point out that I (and the rest of the farang community) can opt NOT to step in such establishments anymore.  Perhaps when it hits their bottom/profit line, then they will know that we are NOT subject to their disposal.

 

I really want to see that such snobbish attitude and definitely pompous attitude can be the start of MASS EXODUS from Thailand to other neighboring countries.   Why should we be treated as aliens and pay more for our admission?  Are we occupying more space?

 

Time to act smart, time to act fast... with apps and plenty of boys available on the streets.. I seriously don't think travelling to Ari is a very attractive proposition anymore....

 

A song from the Beatles to remind Chakran and those places with SKIN TAX.

Hello and goodbye

You say YES

I say NO

..all of us should do what the Beatles did in 2.11...waving goodbyes ...

 

[vinapu]

 

A song from the Beatles

..all of us should do what the Beatles did in 2.11...waving goodbyes ...

 

 

who are Beatles, I never heard about them ? It's you favorite Singaporean band ?

[Guest abang1961]

Vin Dear,

I know you are pulling my leg..

They are Brits and most famously, in the 60s... 

 

Yes that the era when I was born and raised and of course, fed with Western Music instead of Oriental Ones.

Just say my parents were more advanced and suffering from Pinkerton Disease (from Puccini's Madame Butterfly).

 

Their music is infectious - a hard day's night, I wanna hold your hand. Hey Jude and the anthem - Imagine and Let it be.

 

***

Back to the topic -

We shall stand united for this unfair treatment by the gay establishments - as a matter of fact by boycotting them altogether.

See who gets the last laugh..

[vinapu]

 

We shall stand united for this unfair treatment by the gay establishments - as a matter of fact by boycotting them altogether.

 

since it's more than 20 years since I was last time in sauna I'm in boycott movement ever since, just not my environment , dual pricing or not

[Up2u]

Do those that are offended by dual pricing for reasons I try to understand,feel the same way about Sansuk Sauna in Pattaya where Thai pay a lower admission than foreigners and tourists? I think it is a smart business decision to encourage young Thais so the old farangs will follow.

[payless]

In my experience government and private enterprises implement dual pricing in a racist practice. The ticket sellers never ask for an Asian to show an i.d. card. I have told some that my companion is Chinese or Cambodian and I am then told,  it it does not matter, they have Thai price. "You have farang price".

[Guest abang1961]

I am not too sure about double pricing in Sansuk..I always pay THB 230 or in some cases, got in free as guest of those who stayed there.

 

I am Asian but I am treated as a farang in Thailand because I, like many of you, cannot speak nor understand the beautiful Thai language.  

 

 

Don't understand and don't read ..as in Thai writings ..(using Goggle translation)เข้าใจ

ไม่พูดไม่เข้าใจไม่เข้าใจ =-mai kkhecai

ไม่พูด - mai phud

 

The difficulty is in English ph is pronounced as f..

So, I can't read is always mistaken as mai fud...by me...which in very loose terms (pardon the pun)..I don't fuck..ha ha ha 

ไม่พูดไม่เข้าใจไม่เข้าใจ

ไม่พูด

Mị̀ k̄hêācı
mị̀ phūd

ไม่พูด

Mị̀ k̄hêācı
mị̀ 

Mị̀ k̄hêācı
mị̀ phūd

Mị̀ k̄hêācı
mị̀ phūd

[PeterRS]

As a foreigner, I want to point out that I (and the rest of the farang community) can opt NOT to step in such establishments anymore.  Perhaps when it hits their bottom/profit line, then they will know that we are NOT subject to their disposal.

Everyone can vote with their feet. Sorry that it will not work with Chakran because few farang have been going there for years. So it is not going to hit Chakrans bottom line. It is mostly Thai for Thai and wants to stay that way.

 

A gay mass exodus will also have no affect on Thailand except perhaps to result in a few bars and other gay venues closing down. Isnt that what the government is now saying it wants to do - change the image of the country as a sex tourist destination? The income from the tiny farang gay sex tourist market will be made up in a flash with all the new families arriving from China, India and the other new markets. 

 

By the way I love the Beatles too.

[TotallyOz]

I am not sure if the sex industry subsides that the tourists from China, India and other countries that are often cheap, never tip and do not spend big money will make up for the amount tourists spend that visit bars and clubs and saunas.

[PeterRS]

I think you  have misinterpreted my point. I am certainly not suggesting a gay mass exodus by farang will be made up by an influx of gay Chinese and Indians. I was referring to total revenue spends in the country as a whole.

 

I suppose it is a question of numbers. How many gay tourists are there and how much cash do they spend? From the forums it seems most stay in quite inexpensive hotels and dish out most of their cash in the bars and other venues. But we know from threads here that the number of western gays is down - at least those visiting the bars.  

 

On the other hand last year Thailand saw 10 million Chinese tourists. Thats nearly 30% of all tourists. Not all will have been on cheap package tours. Looking at a TAT chart of revenue sources, China tourists spent 531 billion, Tourists from the four western countries in the top ten list spent only about half at 277 billion. More important I reckon is the daily spend. The Chinese per capita spend was 53, 528. The highest non-Asian group was  from the UK who spent 76,237.

 

Last year, Chiina tourists increased by over 1 million. So if all the gay western tourists boycotted Thailand (which will never happen IMHO) the fractional loss to the national treasury will be more than made up by the ever increasing inflow of straights from Asia.

 

Us gay farang are not yet extinct or on life support. But I reckon we are a dwindling breed.

[Londoner]

When Sansuk first opened, it offered cheap admission to under twenty-fives. I haven't been for six months but there was no such offer when my boyfriend and I were last there.

I prefer an age- reduction for obvious reasons. As far as Babylon is concerned, my most productive afternoons were when the admission charge was reduced owing to the swimming pool being refurrbished. Many more attarctive guys, some of whom were very friendly.

Since I don't wish to meet other falangs and prefer us to be a minority, I welcome cheap entry for Thais. No pun intended.  

[Guest]

I visited a sauna in Singapore that had 3 tiers of pricing, based on age.    The youngest paid less and of course, I was in the highest price tier.   It was a a naked night & the building was rammed full of cute Asian lads with nothing on.  

Worth every penny dollar.

 

The typical sauna has loads of middle aged guys who are out of shape.  I would much rather they had a large discount to get young people in, just so there is someone to brighten the place up.   

 

On my last visit to Sansuk, the most attractive young guys were the staff & there were a couple of lads with farang company.   Since they discourage prostitution, what young Thai guy is going to spend over 200 baht to get in there ?   A discount for under 25s would make sense.

 

I don't really agree with charging different prices for different nationalities.   However, I've seen cases where people of certain nationalities just don't meet the behavioural expectations of others. 

Obvious examples are Indian tourists, who frequently try to loiter around in gogo bars, without buying a drink & in some cases sneering & laughing at the dancers.  They usually get shown the door, quite rightly too.  Now I expect not all Indian tourists are like that, but it seems rare for them to buy a drink & play buy the rules.  So we should not be surprised if they are not exactly welcomed into the bars.

 

I wouldn't assume that we conform to all the cultural expectations of the Thais & therefore there may be logical reasons why they want to run some businesses for predominantly Asian customers.

 

Also, in the hotel sector, a little bit of informal apartheid is no bad thing.  If the young arabs & young Indians want to stay up partying all night, that's fine, as long as they happen to be staying in a different hotel.   So if there are hotels catering to middle aged guys who sleep at night and quite different hotels catering to the people who party all night, that's a good thing.

 

This isn't racism.   I'm well aware that the youngsters from my own country also party all night on holiday, it's just that they go to Ibiza, Cyprus etc, not Pattaya.

[a447a]

deleted

[vinapu]

 I have told some that my companion is Chinese or Cambodian and I am then told,  it it does not matter, they have Thai price. "You have farang price".

count your blessings that you there and can pay it

[Uranus]

In my opinion there is a marked difference between double pricing for the 50+, and discounts for the under 25.

 

Many establishments, in Thailand too, have discounts for seniors and students.

[bucknaway]

From thaivisa thread

 

Thaiquila 0 Thaiquila

#93

Posted February 10, 2007

NEWS ALERT!

 

Now, there is NO MORE RACISM at the SanSuk Sauna in Pattaya! It seems enough people did indeed CORRECTLY believe the old pricing policy to be RACIST that the owner decided to mend his ways. Fan Tastic.

 

Congratulations to the owner of the SanSuk Sauna and the gay people and visitors to Pattaya for now having a fabulous new sauna with all the trimmings ... and NO RACISM!

 

Reports are the new policy are EXACTLY as I suggested:

 

ALL people of ALL RACES and NATIONALITIES (now not only Thai nationality) aged 18 to 25, now free! Did you hear that you young Russkies? Get your Russkie butts on over to the SanSuk Sauna. There is a warm welcome waiting ...

 

And now, ALL those of ALL RACES and NATIONALITIES (now not only Thai nationality) who are aged 26 to 30, get in HALF PRICE.

 

Kudos, SanSuk sauna owner! Many thanks.

 

Also, in case there are cries of AGEISM, those over 90, free! Again, all RACES and NATIONALITIES.

 

Good news for a change. See you at the tubs .

 

And

 

peter991 23 peter991

#98

Posted March 1, 2007

Updated prices from Pattaya's Sansuk Sauna:

 

Our rates aligable to any race and sitizenship:

 

# 20-25 years old - Free entry

 

# 26-30 years old - 90 Baht

 

# 31-90 years old - 180 Baht

 

# Over 90 years old - Free entry

 

Peter

 

https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/101254-pricing-policies-at-sansuk-sauna-racist-or-not-racist/?page=7

[Uranus]

In general I think anyone above 90 accompanied by a parent should be let in free.

[Guest]

Posted February 10, 2007

Maybe they tried cheap entry for youngsters in the past, but 11 years & 2 months later, the Sansuk website currently shows a flat rate price of 230 baht.

 

Since they seemed to be struggling to get customers in, even when the beach was closed on a Wednesday in high season, perhaps they need to revisit a discount for under 25s.

When in Thailand, going to a sauna to see other middle aged farang is not a competitive proposition. We need some eye candy (as the Americans say).

 

Also, the website asks people to bring trunks if they want to use the Jacuzzi or pool.

(i) That's overdressed for a gay sauna. Not the right idea.

(ii) No danger of using an unheated Jacuzzi during a cool spell in December.

 

For the first time, they were actually sending out messages on Grindr, telling us how popular the sauna was. The reality seemed to be numbers slightly down on previous years.

 

I suggest dual pricing with free or heavily discounted/free entry for cute lads from Thailand, Cambodia & Laos under 25. Show some discretion if they are still hot & slightly above 25.

[bkkguy]

The typical sauna has loads of middle aged guys who are out of shape.  I would much rather they had a large discount to get young people in, just so there is someone to brighten the place up.

 

...

 

I don't really agree with charging different prices for different nationalities.   However, I've seen cases where people of certain nationalities just don't meet the behavioural expectations of others.

 

...

 

Also, in the hotel sector, a little bit of informal apartheid is no bad thing.  If the young arabs & young Indians want to stay up partying all night, that's fine, as long as they happen to be staying in a different hotel.  

 

...

 

This isn't racism. 

 

 

any action based on nationality or race rather than actions or behavior is inherently racist and such discrimination based on race, age or body shape would probably be illegal in most of our home countries but we seem so happy to accept it to achieve a  good night at a sauna or a good night's sleep at a hotel when we travel

 

I am no supporter of mindless political correctness or over-zealous discrimination legislation and  I am not specifically aiming this at z909 but I find many of the attitudes expressed here quite disturbing

 

bkkguy