I dont always Tip

[Alexx]

I much prefer the superficial friendliness we often see in the US over a complete lack of any form of friendliness, often seen in Europe.

 

Same with the silly complaint that many Thai smiles are fake or disingenuous, in my book. I still prefer a fake smile, knowing that the alternative would be a heartfelt frown or pure indifference.

[traveller123]

 

At least in the USA if you get terrible service and feel it is the wait persons fault you can withhold or lower the tip given. In the UK you have no such option which is why that is the place I have gotten some of the worst service in the world and still had to pay for it.

 

I do not understand this comment.

In the UK you have the option to tip or not to tip. If a service charge is added to the bill and you dont want to pay it strike it out.

I'm also surprised you have had some of the worse service in the world,that is not my experience

[kokopelli]

I dislike the idea of tipping and would prefer a system like in Japan (which I know only from internet: good service and no tipping). In the past I was inconsistent in Thailand, sometimes tip, sometimes don't tip, but now changed to this to not tipping.

 To quote Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz, 'Toto, I've a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore.' likewise we are not in Japan nor Germany, we are in Thailand. There is a vast difference in salaries paid to those in non-tipping cultures such as Japan and other countries.

[firecat69]

I do not understand this comment.

In the UK you have the option to tip or not to tip. If a service charge is added to the bill and you dont want to pay it strike it out.

I'm also surprised you have had some of the worse service in the world,that is not my experience

I should have been more clear . It varies in the UK. Some restaurants have service included on the menu, others do not.

 

But in all restaurants in London a  wait person is being paid the equivalent of about $14.00 US an hour which is almost 5x what most US wait persons get paid.  Thus the prices are inflated in order for the person to receive a living wage .

 

Thus in my opinion service is included and anything extra is entirely optional and the level of service will determine if extra tip is left. In my case I might leave 10% which is 1/2 of what I leave in the US.

[paulsf]

This all reminds me of my trip to Hanoi last March with my Vietnamese friend. We had an all day private tour. As we were dropped off at our hotel at the end of the day, I reached for my wallet to tip the tour guide. My friend grabbed my hand to stop me. He quietly yelled in my ear, No Tip. I said it was fine, we had a great day. He said. "This is Vietnam, no tip. In Thailand ok to tip, in Vietnam, no tip.

[Guest]

I see consistently the best service in Japan, where tipping is most definitely NOT the norm.

 

I suspect one of the factors governing service quality is employment regulations.  

In most European countries, once an employee is permanent, it is very difficult to fire them or apply any other form of discipline for poor customer service.  Of course, most employees will behave properly, but dealing with the minority who think the world owes them a living is another matter.

[vinapu]

It seems tipping will be always contentious issue.

 

I live in a tipping culture but still almost always when I have a meal  with  friends in restaurant,  discussion about how much to tip is guaranteed.

 

But one thing seems to be certain - if you want to tip somebody , make sure you give money to that person.If you just leave on the table or put in the tip box , chances are somebody else will get it.

 

Few days ago I bought take out meal in a bar nearby and threw a change in a tip box. Lady behind the cash told me / we speak the same language so she could be brave to say it loudly / "don't bother because our owner will take it for himself anyways" 

[traveller123]

 

 

Few days ago I bought take out meal in a bar nearby and threw a change in a tip box. Lady behind the cash told me / we speak the same language so she could be brave to say it loudly / "don't bother because our owner will take it for himself anyways" 

That is the problem with the service charge in the UK, the suspicion is always that the restaurant owner may keep it

[ChristianPFC]

that's fine but if you don't make sure you don't revisit place until they forget you, one never wants to upset people serving him food

 

Most places I eat at are non-tipping anyway. Upset? Is lack of tip something to be upset about?

 

 To quote Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz, 'Toto, I've a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore.' likewise we are not in Japan nor Germany, we are in Thailand. There is a vast difference in salaries paid to those in non-tipping cultures such as Japan and other countries.

 

As far as I know, Thailand is a non-tipping culture and tipping has been brought by tourists, and is restricted to tourist areas.

 

I consider tipping a social evil that starts a spiral of lowering wages and compensate by tips, leading to annoying behavior of staff and absurdities like employing people to hand customers a towel in the toilet in Tam Nam Kon Isan disco in Pattaya.

[captainmick]

That is the problem with the service charge in the UK, the suspicion is always that the restaurant owner may keep it

Maybe in some parts of the world but generally not within the UK. In the UK, we have TRONC systems which manage the distribution of tips and indeed the tax payable on tips. The schemes are administered by the Troncmaster who is elected by the staff. There is lots of information regarding TRONC if you search on Google. There will of course be some small independent restaurants with disreputable owners who do not distribute the tips but the TRONCS generally work well.

[kokopelli]

 

I consider tipping a social evil that starts a spiral of lowering wages and compensate by tips, leading to annoying behavior of staff and absurdities like employing people to hand customers a towel in the toilet in Tam Nam Kon Isan disco in Pattaya.

 

Is it a cum towel?

[kokopelli]

 

I consider tipping a social evil ........

Some consider prostitution a social evil so, in my mind, better not to be so judgmental in one's thinking and rationalizations.

[vinapu]

1.Most places I eat at are non-tipping anyway. Upset? Is lack of tip something to be upset about?

 

 

2.As far as I know, Thailand is a non-tipping culture and tipping has been brought by tourists, and is restricted to tourist areas.

 

I consider tipping a social evil that starts a spiral of lowering wages and compensate by tips, leading to annoying behavior of staff and absurdities like employing people to hand customers a towel in the toilet in Tam Nam Kon Isan disco in Pattaya.

1 no, it's  not what I meant.

 

If you are in non-tipping place  that all is fine but if you sense that they expect tip and you don't , then I'd avoid this place for  a while

 

2. I agree but trying to reverse it single handily will be impossible. Yes it us tourists who are  corrupting locals  but on another hand we help to create environment in which we have  fun and they have a job.

 

Brilliant statement about spiral of lowering wages. It also helps on cheating on taxes since servers tend to underestimate their tips for that purpose.

 

But problem with all included is one Traveller123 noticed above - owners , not servers get unduly share of service charges.

 

In Thailand I tip but don't consider those who don't cheap since as you noticed this is non-tipping culture.

[vinapu]

 

 

I consider tipping a social evil 

 

Some consider prostitution a social evil

Now at  least I know  I'm consistent

[kokopelli]

 

I consider tipping a social evil ........

Some consider prostitution a social evil so, in my mind, better not to be so judgmental in one's thinking and rationalizations.

[Bob]

I tip in Thailand (well, almost everywhere) and I've had nobody complain about it (although have had a couple of wait staff run after me wondering why I left 20 baht or whatever on the table).  And, admittedly,  I probably do that due to my upbringing in the US.

 

As to calling tipping a "social evil" (come on, Christian, I suppose you'll next call for the death penalty for jay walking....) or complaining about how anybody else tips or doesn't tip, such comments or complaints are simply inane.

[Guest]

As to calling tipping a "social evil" (come on, Christian, I suppose you'll next call for the death penalty for jay walking....) or complaining about how anybody else tips or doesn't tip, such comments or complaints are simply inane.

 

Well, calling tipping a social evil is over doing it.   Even if I consider tipping culture to be both irrational and to have no moral basis.

 

However, the presumption that thou shalt tip (because that's the way it's done in our home country) is flawed.  

Thankfully a lot of people have moved beyond that & there is an increasing understanding that there are other equally acceptable ways of conducting business which do not involve tipping. 

Where tipping is expected (US etc), it is probably best to tip.

Where there is no tipping culture at all and yet the service is still the best you can ever expect(Japan etc), you really should not tip.

 

However, do not expect that the rules which apply in the US (or EU etc) should be applied in Thailand.   

I think most members grasp that point now.

[kokopelli]

Well, calling tipping a social evil is over doing it.   Even if I consider tipping culture to be both irrational and to have no moral basis.

 

 

Referring to tipping as an "evil" (per ChristianPFC) certainly taints what otherwise can be considered an act of charity or kindness.

As for tipping being irrational with no moral basis I would disagree. Kindness, charity and benevolence especially to those who are less fortunate than oneself  is a virtue. 

[firecat69]

Referring to tipping as an "evil" (per ChristianPFC) certainly taints what otherwise can be considered an act of charity or kindness.

As for tipping being irrational with no moral basis I would disagree. Kindness, charity and benevolence especially to those who are less fortunate than oneself  is a virtue. 

+1

[Guest ryanasia]

People that criticize tipping are usually concerned that when people tip and they don't it makes them look like the cheapskates they are. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKKxfeNl4uk

[Bob]

Come on, Z, nobody is saying that anybody shall (or your biblical "shalt") tip.  My first point is I do it because it seems natural to me and I choose to do it.  My second point, which I really didn't make very clear above, is that I don't care to hear anybody else tell me what I should or shouldn't be doing.  You don't want to tip?  Fine, that's your business.  Likewise, it's nobody else's business if somebody else chooses to do so. 

 

In my view, this isn't all that different from the comments/arguments heard for years about "over-tipping" the boys for services.  Some would bitterly argue that the over-tippers (those that paid more than some declared or perceived norm) were "ruining it for the rest of us."  While I'd respond that it was none of the complainer's business, my inner thoughts were never so kind.

 

I've never had a Thai friend, sex-worker, waiter, or whatever directly or indirectly suggest that my tipping practices were inappropriate or unappreciated....and, of course, it would only be their opinions that would interest me in the first place.

[vinapu]

 

 

 I suppose you'll next call for the death penalty for jay walking....) 

this would reduce overpopulation big time

 

Kindness, charity and benevolence especially to those who are less fortunate than oneself  is a virtue. 

 

This is how I see tipping issue - my microscopic part in spreading world's wealth more evenly

 

People that criticize tipping are usually concerned that when people tip and they don't it makes them look like the cheapskates they are. 

 

 

 / my underline /

Can't agree with that, lots of people simply don't tip because whole practice is foreign to them and their culture they grew up within.

 

 

Some would bitterly argue that the over-tippers (those that paid more than some declared or perceived norm) were "ruining it for the rest of us."  

there were whole threads devoted to the  issue but nobody ever said that paying 1500 $ for a flight which could be had for 1000 or 100 $ for a  hotel room which could be had for 60 $ is doing the same ruin.

 

I'd say If I'm paying over the 'norm" I'm ruining it for myself first as chances are I will be visiting place again on the same trip so boy and his friends will expect no less next time. Still do what I think it suits me best.  

[Guest]

My second point, which I really didn't make very clear above, is that I don't care to hear anybody else tell me what I should or shouldn't be doing.  You don't want to tip?  Fine, that's your business.  Likewise, it's nobody else's business if somebody else chooses to do so.

I'm not quite sure if we disagree, but the only kind of situation where I'm saying you shouldn't tip is somewhere like Japan, where the service is in the price and tipping is certainly not the done thing, but is almost insulting.

Even there, you are welcome to ignore me.

 

Equally, I don't much like people telling me I should tip, based on the tipping culture in their home country, rather than the tipping culture in Thailand. [Not that I am suggesting you are one of those people].

 

Anyway, by and large, the more we debate the same old subject of tipping, the more people seem to understand there are different cultural expectations & one mindset is no better than the other.

[kokopelli]

If, by chance, I come across as Mr. Big Tipper and everyone should tip as I, I wish to clarify that.  I am not telling others what they should/should not do, rather that they should not demonize "tipping" and perhaps consider the good it may do in a society where money is hard to come by and a few extra Baht can make a difference in someone's life. Likewise, as mentioned in above posts  the tipping culture in other countries such as USA(big tippers) or Japan(no tipping) are not applicable in Thailand.

[Alexx]

Exactly, Thailand is somewhere in between these extremes, and in many cases it is quite literally "up to you". I've progressed to tipping more, mostly because I think an extra 20 baht or so helps the minimum wage earners more than it hurts me to give it away.