United Kingdom as we know it is over

[Guest scottishguy]

Economics will decide.

 

Oil revenues in the gutter.

No chance of keeping £.

Joining a failing currency, the Euro.

Huge budget deficit.

Quite simply, an Independent Scotland will not be economically viable.

The Scottish people will realise that and vote at least 60% against.

 

Taking each of your bullet points in turn:

 

1. The Scottish economy is not dependent on oil - it accounts for 12-16% of GDP. Kindly refer to Standard & Poors who say "even excluding North Sea output and calculating per capita GDP only by looking at onshore income, Scotland would qualify for our highest economic assessment"

 

 

2. The £ sterling is a fully tradeable currency - any country can use it. However, given that it has turned to shit, who would necessarily want it now? Things have moved on since 2014 and it may well be an independent Scotland would adopt its own currency. It is not up to you or anyone else to tell us what we can and cannot do (as Cruella De Vil will shortly find out)

 

 

3. Have you not noticed the fall in the £ recently? Are you blind? Also the "you'll have to join the Euro" lie is so discredited it's a sign of utter desperation that you've dragged that red herring up again.

 

 

4. Kindly remember this "huge budget deficit" belongs to the UK and has been accumulated under the Union, which rather suggests the UK stewardship of Scotland's finances hasn't been anything to write home about.

Further,  the existence of a "huge budget deficit" in an independent Scotland assumes Scotland voluntarily accepts a share of the UK deficit. There is nothing in international law which forces Scotland to do so. We can simply walk away from UK debt (this was conceded by UK Govt in 2014). The reality is that iScot would only accept as share of debts in return for a share of assets

 

5. Not economically viable? Again I refer you to Standard & Poors assessment.

Plus consider the following:

 

• Scotland GDP p/capita = $47,369
• Germany GDP p/capita = $43,855
• UK GDP p/capita = $41,066
• New Zealand GDP p/capita =$39,840

 

 

6.That's your opinion and your entitled to it - but I'm just as entitled to reject it.

 

 

Possibly, however I don't understand why only Scotland gets a vote.    Both parties should be entitled to request a divorce.

 

I'd say you've got that almost right except it's not a matter of both parties, but of either party.

 

Democratically it would be indefensible to have one partner in what we are told is a "Union of equals" forcing the other to stay by virtue of weight of numbers. That's exactly what's happening with Brexit.

 

So, to take your "divorce" analogy - if the "wife" wants out of the marriage then the "husband" cannot force her to stay.

 

However, if England wants to have a vote to chuck Scotland out of the Union - bring it on.

 

Funny how that doesn't seem to be the case though - I don't see any clamour within the British establishment to expel Scotland, despite us allegedly being such a liability and economic basket case. As Brexit has revealed, it's certainly not because the English are such a tolerant inclusive lot - so you have to assume there's a bit more to it that the Daily Mail reader rhetoric

[Guest]

I'd say you've got that almost right except it's not a matter of both parties, but of either party.

 

Democratically it would be indefensible to have one partner in what we are told is a "Union of equals" forcing the other to stay by virtue of weight of numbers. That's exactly what's happening with Brexit.

 

So, to take your "divorce" analogy - if the "wife" wants out of the marriage then the "husband" cannot force her to stay.

 

However, if England wants to have a vote to chuck Scotland out of the Union - bring it on.

 

Funny how that doesn't seem to be the case though - I don't see any clamour within the British establishment to expel Scotland, despite us allegedly being such a liability and economic basket case. As Brexit has revealed, it's certainly not because the English are such a tolerant inclusive lot - so you have to assume there's a bit more to it that the Daily Mail reader rhetoric

 

Well we're almost in complete agreement on this point.  

 

Both parties should be entitled to vote on independence & if one of them wants a split, then it should happen.  Bring it on.

 

As in a marriage, either one of the couple, the husband, or the other husband, should be entitled to start a divorce.

 

Whilst the "establishment" in the rest of the UK is not pushing for Scottish independence, I believe there was one opinion poll suggesting a higher proportion of people in England would vote for Scottish independence than in Scotland.   

[Gwydion62]

Taking each of your bullet points in turn:

 

1. The Scottish economy is not dependent on oil - it accounts for 12-16% of GDP. Kindly refer to Standard & Poors who say "even excluding North Sea output and calculating per capita GDP only by looking at onshore income, Scotland would qualify for our highest economic assessment"

 

 

2. The £ sterling is a fully tradeable currency - any country can use it. However, given that it has turned to shit, who would necessarily want it now? Things have moved on since 2014 and it may well be an independent Scotland would adopt its own currency. It is not up to you or anyone else to tell us what we can and cannot do (as Cruella De Vil will shortly find out)

 

 

3. Have you not noticed the fall in the £ recently? Are you blind? Also the "you'll have to join the Euro" lie is so discredited it's a sign of utter desperation that you've dragged that red herring up again.

 

 

4. Kindly remember this "huge budget deficit" belongs to the UK and has been accumulated under the Union, which rather suggests the UK stewardship of Scotland's finances hasn't been anything to write home about.

Further,  the existence of a "huge budget deficit" in an independent Scotland assumes Scotland voluntarily accepts a share of the UK deficit. There is nothing in international law which forces Scotland to do so. We can simply walk away from UK debt (this was conceded by UK Govt in 2014). The reality is that iScot would only accept as share of debts in return for a share of assets

 

5. Not economically viable? Again I refer you to Standard & Poors assessment.

Plus consider the following:

 

 

• Scotland GDP p/capita = $47,369
• Germany GDP p/capita = $43,855
• UK GDP p/capita = $41,066
• New Zealand GDP p/capita =$39,840

 

 

6.That's your opinion and your entitled to it - but I'm just as entitled to reject it.

 

 

 

 

I'd say you've got that almost right except it's not a matter of both parties, but of either party.

 

Democratically it would be indefensible to have one partner in what we are told is a "Union of equals" forcing the other to stay by virtue of weight of numbers. That's exactly what's happening with Brexit.

 

So, to take your "divorce" analogy - if the "wife" wants out of the marriage then the "husband" cannot force her to stay.

 

However, if England wants to have a vote to chuck Scotland out of the Union - bring it on.

 

Funny how that doesn't seem to be the case though - I don't see any clamour within the British establishment to expel Scotland, despite us allegedly being such a liability and economic basket case. As Brexit has revealed, it's certainly not because the English are such a tolerant inclusive lot - so you have to assume there's a bit more to it that the Daily Mail reader rhetoric

Not interested in a long discussion with someone who is so detached from reality so will just make 2 points:

 

1. I made no comment regarding the % of GDP contributed by oil. I simply stated the basic fact that oil revenues have fallen dramatically. Reduced North Sea production, remaining oil being more expensive to extract and much reduced world oil prices all contribute to this. It is indisputable that this leaves Scotland in a much weaker economic position than would previously have been the case.

 

2. The SNP want Scotland to be in the EU. There is no option other than to commit to joining the Euro if they want to join this failing political union. The fact that you can't accept this shows just how utterly deluded you are.

[Guest]

There is no option other than to commit to joining the Euro if they want to join this failing political union.

There are numerous countries in eastern Europe which committed to join the Euro, but avoid all possible commitment to a date when they join.   Because they never will & their national currencies will outlast the Euro.

[KhorTose]

del

[vinapu]

There are numerous countries in eastern Europe which committed to join the Euro, but avoid all possible commitment to a date when they join.   Because they never will & their national currencies will outlast the Euro.

predicting is very hard, specially predicting the future

[Guest abang1961]

OK I'm gay and proud of it but this picture tickles me ..

Who has the better legs?  

Wait till they see mine...

[Gwydion62]

Brexit letter delivered at 12.30 UK time today.

 

[traveller123]

Brexit letter delivered at 12.30 UK time today.

 

IMG_6605.JPG

 

Not for the Brits living in Thailand with the rate of exchange

[Guest scottishguy]

17yo asylum seeker brutally attacked in London.

 

Welcome to English Brexit "blood and soil" nationalism and contrast with inclusive Scottish civic nationalism

[Alexx]

The Little Englanders have been had and it will take a while until they'll realize it. I'm looking forward to seeing the fallout. I'd guess about five years from now.

[Guest scottishguy]

HO HO HO

 

Possibility of moving position from "Now is not the time" to a de-facto #Indyref2 in the space of a month  - thanks to the totally inept Theresa May's latest miscalculation!

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39629603

 

Who the fuck elected this woman?

Answer: No-one (not even the Tories)