Monk Ordination Ceremony Costs

[Guest Dax85]

My boyfriend is planning on becoming a monk short term and had started discussing the costs with me. Initially it was 150,000 but has now jumped to a whopping 300,000. He has not asked me for the full amount but has asked for me to contribute 100,000. If anyone is able to shed light on the costs involved I would be really grateful.

[NIrishGuy]

Funny how most religions teach us that money is the root of all evil ...and yet most are keen to get their hands on just about as much of the stuff as they can get their hands on, strange that eh. :-(

[Bob]

The figures you quote floor me (i.e., I don't believe what your bf is saying for a nanosecond).  Other than buying some robes and paying for the family party which usually precedes the temple ordination, what exactly are the additional costs?  I'd certainly ask and expect a detailed answer.

 

Somewhere here in Chiangmai province there is some program where westerners become a "monk for a month" at a temple and I've seen the cost of that stay (which I believe involve sleeping quarters a bit more comfy than what regular novices receive) quoted at $700.00 (about 24,500 baht).  I simply can't believe a Thai is charged that much (in fact, other than buying the robes and the cost of any family party, I can't believe there is any cost other than some very minimal money for personal expenses).

[Gaybutton]

I don't believe what your bf is saying for a nanosecond

 

Neither do I.  I've seen several monk ordination ceremonies over the years.  The most expensive I've ever seen was 14,000 baht - and that included the parties, the music, the parade, the food - everything.

 

There is no way an ordination ceremony should cost 300,000 baht 150,000 baht, or anywhere near close to that.  Nearly every Thai boy is going to be ordained as a monk around age 21.  Most don't remain as monks more than a month.  How many Thais do you suppose could possibly come up with that kind of money?

 

Of course, if they manage to get a farang to foot the bill for them, that's when they can have their ceremony catered by Maxim's of Paris and have the Black Watch lead the parade . . .

[flugg]

There is no nice way to say it. Dude, kick the boytoy asap

[Londoner]

I'm not so sure. My boyfriend was ordained fourteen  years ago, two years before I met him. He told me that it had cost his parents 70,000 bht. Inflation would account for the 100% rise.

 

Precipitous action against this guy on the basis of what I've seen in the above posts would be unforgivable.

[kokopelli]

Inflation rate in Thailand over past 15 years hovers about 1%/year so doubtful that inflation could explain that huge of an increase.

[Londoner]

My boyfriend was ordained in a poor and remote area of the north ... costs for food, music, parties etc may well be less there than in other places. Significantly, the abbot of the monastery was a relative who may have helped.

All I am saying is that the issue is not as clear-cut as some posters suggest.

[Bob]

Londoner, if possible, ask your boyfriend to itemize or breakdown (or estimate the best he can) the amount you mentioned (70,000 baht). For example:

(1)  The proposed monk is required to get and pay for a medical exam....which I'd guess is about 500 or less baht in most places.

(2)  The proposed monk is normally required to buy his own robes (I'd guess 4 of them maybe cost 3,000 baht at most) although some temples will provide them (used or new) for free.

(3)  The big expense, I'm told, is to pay for the pre-ordination party.  For 20 people (relatives and shirt-tail relatives), I suppose that might run 10,000 baht (depending on how much alcohol is downed, I suppose).  On the other hand, if you're entertaining half the local village, then obviously more.

(4)  To my knowledge, there is no (zero) payment to the temple.  

 

Edit:  Just asked my bf of 15+ years to detail the costs for him becoming a monk when he was a young teen (he was in the temple for two and a half years).  He said that back then (this would have been 24-25 years ago) no medical certificate was required but it is required now, that normally the temple provides the robes (plus he added they don't cost very much), that there is no payment to the temple, and that the big cost is the party for the family or villagers.  He also said that if the person/family has little money, then they just have a small party for the immediate family and that usually runs several thousand baht; if, however, it's a big party (with 100+ villagers attending), he said it is much more although usually most of those attending chip in to help pay for it.  A huge party, he said, might even cost as much as 100,000 baht nowadays although he again added that the attendees often chip in a big portion of that cost.

[biguyby]

My boyfriend is planning on becoming a monk short term and had started discussing the costs with me. Initially it was 150,000 but has now jumped to a whopping 300,000. He has not asked me for the full amount but has asked for me to contribute 100,000. If anyone is able to shed light on the costs involved I would be really grateful.

[Guest]

There is no nice way to say it. Dude, kick the boytoy asap

 

That's the most concise & helpful analysis there could be.

 

300,000 baht is the equivalent of 1.5 years Thai GDP per capita.

Or 1000 days working at the Thai minimum wage.

 

Now either the Buddhism is pricing out the average Thai or someone is milking the farang for as much as he can get. 

 

Mind you, it's quite funny how many new members have such extraordinary circumstances.

 

I would not pay and kick him into touch. 

Although, if you choose to be parted from your money so easily, I'll not lose any sleep over that either.

[steveboy]

My boyfriend is planning on becoming a monk short term and had started discussing the costs with me. Initially it was 150,000 but has now jumped to a whopping 300,000. He has not asked me for the full amount but has asked for me to contribute 100,000. If anyone is able to shed light on the costs involved I would be really grateful.

 

100,000 baht is about US$ 3,000.  

How can a Thai guy ask another person, a friend, family, whoever, to contribute this amount of money so that he can live the life of a monk?  Is there a fundamental reason of medical or spiritual health for a person to be a monk? Aren't there less expensive ways to become a monk?  What is the return on investment of these 3000 dollars in benefits to society? (not to mention benefit to he who contributes it)?   Why doesn't this Thai guy get a job and make an honest living?

 

There is a difference between investing for the BF to become a monk and investing in his education. The latter I understand, the former I don't.   

 

What a pity to see how distorted the mind of these Thai boyfriends can become when they think that they can exploit their farangs like that!   That poor boy needs his mind be corrected by receiving a proper NO answer to his request.  Maybe this is better than kicking his ass out the door,  it gives him a chance to reconsider and mature.

[Londoner]

They don't live their lives as monks but in the vast majority of cases do a short term....a bit like National Service in the UK in the 1950s, but much shorter. It is believed that all Thai males should serve at least once in their lifetimes and this is why a poor family, like my boyfriend's, do their utmost to raise the money.. Even the King was a monk for a short period.

My boyfriend was a a monk for one month. His best mate did a few days-less than a week-  a couple of months ago and he's thirty-four. 

I often see guys on the scene who have recently been monks- their hair takes weeks to grow back and their eyebrows even longer!e 

Steveboy may be right in this case but I suspect a degree of undue cynicism which my twenty years of visits (and twelve with my one-and-only boyfriend) doesn't support. You have try to to understand the motivations of Buddhism and the issue of monkhood is very different to the traditions which we in the west have developed.  

[steveboy]

They don't live their lives as monks but in the vast majority of cases do a short term....a bit like National Service in the UK in the 1950s, but much shorter. It is believed that all Thai males should serve at least once in their lifetimes and this is why a poor family, like my boyfriend's, do their utmost to raise the money.. 

------

Steveboy may be right in this case but I suspect a degree of undue cynicism which my twenty years of visits (and twelve with my one-and-only boyfriend) doesn't support. You have try to to understand the motivations of Buddhism and the issue of monkhood is very different to the traditions which we in the west have developed.  

 

The Western traditions are not so different.  We have Mormons here who send their young out to proselytize for a year, something not so different from going to a monastery.  And there is mysticism and spirituality here too.  People go to retreats, if they can afford them.

 

But you are right about my cynicism, which has to do with the 3000 dollars (or the 9,000 dollars of the total 300,000 bahts)

One should question the seriousness of monasteries who accept people becoming "monks" for such a short time. If each one has to bring a certain amount of money, here we have a BUSINESS.

 

Mysticism should not be tied to any currency.  I don't think that Buddhism needs to make a business out of initiating monks.

[faranglaw]

My Thai husband did the same short term monk initiation in 1998. He tells me the total cost was 20,000 baht at the most. When I told him about the 300,000 baht, he laughed and said, "Are they inviting the whole village?"

 

So no, inflation would not explain this. It seems to me that if you really think this relationship has long term potential, you need to have a talk with your boyfriend about honesty in a relationship, because he is clearly not telling you a true story, or the whole story. If it does not have long term potential, time to toss this fish back into the river,

[faranglaw]

Also, the real quote, as I understand it, is not "Money is the root of all evil." It's "The love of money is the root of all evil." In other words, the issue is what is inside us, not what is outside.

[Bob]

But you are right about my cynicism, which has to do with the 3000 dollars (or the 9,000 dollars of the total 300,000 bahts)

One should question the seriousness of monasteries who accept people becoming "monks" for such a short time. If each one has to bring a certain amount of money, here we have a BUSINESS.

 

Mysticism should not be tied to any currency.  I don't think that Buddhism needs to make a business out of initiating monks.

 

While I've agreed with the concept about the seemingly excessive amount of money being requested, some of your comments in this thread unreasonably disparage both the religion of Buddhism and the cultural traditions of Thailand. 

 

(1)  First, maybe you ought to learn why they go into a temple.  It's to honor and provide blessing for their parents (or for a deceased relative or even because of a need to change their life) and that's just a wee bit difficult to criticize.  And your comment about the "seriousness" of the monasteries accepting lay people into their fold (permanently or temporarily) is totally goofy.

 

(2)  Second, if you understood the process (or even read most of this thread), you'd learn that the temples do not make money off the deal.  You say that Buddhism makes a "business out of initiating monks."  A false and silly statement....and reflects your inability to distinguish between Buddhism (the religion/philosophy) and Thai cultural traditions.  

 

The OP has asked about the amount of money being requested and clearly is not asking anybody to question let alone take a swipe at either the religion/philosphy or cultural traditions.  

[emailbroken]

It is probably very distressing for the original poster, but the simple fact here is that the numbers just don't add up.  Some of the additional detail about the significance of becoming a monk is of course interesting, but doesn't change the fact  that the numbers make no sense. 

 

It's tough but there seems to be only one conclusion that can be drawn here.

[Jasper]

I was a watching a documentary on TV about a young boy becoming a monk short time like OP described in Myanmar not in Thailand.

The cost of ceremony quoted was $8,000 USD (278,000Bhat)

Including a party of 1,000 guests. They also paid for other kids of poor relatives.The family saved the money for 15 years and the boy's father said although he has no money now he is happy because he will be in nirvana after life.

[Guest buckbee]

I got ordained at the same time as my ex boyfriend. There was a 100 baht fee to get our names added to the dept of religion register, about 3000 baht for the robes etc and the village street party was the major and only other cost about 20,000 baht all up for 2 of us. The whole village came out and celebrated. I gave mum 10,000 baht, that's all she wanted and the family came together and gave the rest I guess. The only other costs would be food etc for daily alms but that would just be a few thousand baht over a month 

[steveboy]

While I've agreed with the concept about the seemingly excessive amount of money being requested, some of your comments in this thread unreasonably disparage both the religion of Buddhism and the cultural traditions of Thailand. 

 

(1)  First, maybe you ought to learn why they go into a temple.  It's to honor and provide blessing for their parents (or for a deceased relative or even because of a need to change their life) and that's just a wee bit difficult to criticize.  And your comment about the "seriousness" of the monasteries accepting lay people into their fold (permanently or temporarily) is totally goofy.

 

(2)  Second, if you understood the process (or even read most of this thread), you'd learn that the temples do not make money off the deal.  You say that Buddhism makes a "business out of initiating monks."  A false and silly statement....and reflects your inability to distinguish between Buddhism (the religion/philosophy) and Thai cultural traditions.  

 

The OP has asked about the amount of money being requested and clearly is not asking anybody to question let alone take a swipe at either the religion/philosphy or cultural traditions.  

 

I stand by my comment.

 

I don't criticize Buddhism nor the Thai traditions.  A religion is more than its practitioners.  If as you say the monasteries don't make money out of initiating monks, I'm glad to hear this.   I was raised a Catholic, and I dislike the way this church profits from the business of marrying people, for example.  

 

I know more about Buddhism that you seem to be willing to recognize. And so I am perfectly justified in my criticism about thousands of dollars changing hands for a person to find spiritual growth in a monastery or temple.  And I question how much growth you can achieve in one week, even one month.  This is the extent of my criticism,  and you have blown it out of proportion.

 

You are not the OP,  and I wonder what makes you a judge of what I should post here.

[Guest buckbee]

Also you'll need the yellow Thai Buddhist chant and prayer book, about 80 baht to factor into costs 

 

[steveboy]

I was a watching a documentary on TV about a young boy becoming a monk short time like OP described in Myanmar not in Thailand.

The cost of ceremony quoted was $8,000 USD (278,000Bhat)

Including a party of 1,000 guests. They also paid for other kids of poor relatives.The family saved the money for 15 years and the boy's father said although he has no money now he is happy because he will be in nirvana after life.

 

I would like my critic "Bob" to read Jasper's post and evaluate it from his high horse of Buddhism.

 

Where will you find in the teachings of Gutama Buddha any exhortation that a poor family saves money for 15 years so that they can pay a ceremony of 8,000 USD so that their son becomes briefly a monk, with expectations that he will be in nirvana after life?

 

I suspect that Gutama Buddha would turn around in his grave reading this.

He would just do this, since he seem to have been more peaceful than Jesus Christ, who got angry and chased the merchants out of the Jewish temple with a whip. 

[ct2005]

It seems people, rich or poor, would give up almost anything when it comes to religion & beliefs. I, too, am surprised by the high cost of monk ordination in Thailand or Myanmar. It is very similar to the Muslim Mecca pilgrimage or the Catholic Rome pilgrimage whereby the believers had to visit the holy place at least once in their lifetime.

From what I understand of Buddhism, through reading books & attending dharma talks & courses, the believe that by going through monk ordination process will promise nirvana after life is not in line with the principles of Buddhism. Having said that, I wouldn't argue with someone of their beliefs 'cos I know it is pointless. The monk ordination process is important to the Thais and they are happy or someone else is happy to pay for it and that's all that matters.

[Bob]

Sorry Stevie Boy, you've missed the point and, while you could go back and attempt to actually understood what I and others have said in this thread, I won't hold my breath that you'll understand it now.  But, if it'll help, the monks and temples (or Buddhist manuscripts or teachings) have nothing to do with the pre-ordination party at all.  And there often is a significant difference between custom/tradition and a given religion.

 

P.S.  You clearly made the comment about Buddhism making money off the deal and now (for what reason, god/Buddha only knows why) you add that the Catholic Church makes (apparently significant) profits by officiating weddings.  While that latter comment is slightly off topic, it's as erroneous as the first comment.