Lucky

No doubt that would be cruel and unusual punishment! Lookin, I don't want to kill anyone either. but as long as bad people continue to kill innocent people, then they have created their own future, as well as killing the future of their victims.

We will have to await Kjun's perfect poll!

The Sunday dialogue in today's NY Times is on their editorial against the death penalty. Some interesting observations appear, as well as one interesting name: L. Phillips Runyon III. I thought it rather pompous, so I Googled him to see if his name really was Larry. It's not. But he does wear a bow tie, and he is a part-time judge, recently thwarting an attempt by two small town police chiefs to charge illegal aliens with criminal trespass! Discussing Death

The Few, the Proud, the Perfumed!

Last night I felt that my answer was incomplete, and now, having slept on it, I realize I wanted to stay away from thee tangents of my pet peeves and just answer Lookin's question directly. He asks: If we like our own little idiosyncracies to be indulged, why shouldn't we indulge those of others? And the answer is an unequivocal yes. We want new posters, we enjoy fresh points of view to keep the forums charged, and we can indulge little idiosyncracies. Some folks just need time to adjust to the board, and sometimes the board needs time to adjust to the individual. We shouldn't give up on anyone unless and until it is clear that a match just cannot be made.

At least I can tell who read to the end of that long post! I know I could have said it all in fewer words. But that's for sissies!

Having the kind permission of Lookin to respond to him here, in lieu of both responding to him here and to his gracious and kind email sent to me personally, I will start out by agreeing with him: Much of what I say does make sense. Now that we have that out of the way, let me remind you that I was speaking in the context of what made a good board, and expressing my personal opinion, and, in one case, my very humble personal opinion. I was speaking to what I thought constituted a part of a good board. It's a nice thing about the board that everyone is welcome. Many, if not all, of us were in that position once in grade school where teams were being chosen and the dreaded spot was to be the last one chosen, usually because you threw the ball like a girl. Guys playing sports usually do so because they want to win, and pick their teams accordingly. But here you can throw like a girl and no one cares. As I said, everyone is welcome. But everyone does not make a good player, and those posting here are not unlike the boys playing the game- they want interesting things to happen, whether in the form of good conversation, interesting topics, or cute pictures. So we tend to cull out those who do not interest us, usually ignoring them, but often are not given that freedom. Keeping to my sports analogy, if you come to the ballpark to see a baseball game, you know that there is a chance, however slim, that you might get hit by a foul ball. And, if it happens, you could, if you choose, make a big scene out of it, whimpering and threatening to take the ball and go home. Or, you might encounter someone in the stands who is rooting for the other team. You could get mad and go home then too. Or you could start a fight, or you could shut up and try to enjoy the game. If you are picked for the team, your teammates have a right to expect you to play hard. Do I have to stop, before I throw the ball to you, to remember that you don't like it when I throw the ball hard? If I slide into second base hard, are you going to get upset and cry? Not likely. You'll just tell yourself that is how the game is played. If you don't like it, you can go home. And stay there! Don't keep coming back to the ballpark and expect everyone not to slide hard, or throw the ball hard. Don't keep reminding everyone that you are easily upset when you enter the game and something happens that you don't like. Just play the game, if that is your choice, and play the best you can. But for those sitting in the stands, when the foul ball comes, try to catch it. And, if you can't, let someone else have a go at it. In a nutshell, what I am saying, is that if I come to play ball, I expect to be able to play it to the best of my ability. I don't want to have to hold my throw because you can't take it. I want to say what I think without having to first consider everyone's sensibilities. But, and it is a big but, no one likes the bullies that are welcome here too. Maybe, for the sake of shorthand, you could say that no one likes the bullies or the sissies. If you enter the game, play it fairly. Learning how others react is part of being a good player. I am not going to intentionally try to irritate the other guys on the field. For me, Lookin, assuming that you are still with me here, the assumption I make when I come to the forum is that the other guys here have chosen to be here. They have chosen to enter the game, if the sports analogy holds. So they know the score, right? Feelings will occasionally get hurt, just as foul balls will occasionally enter the stands. The guys who can go with the flow and hold their own will be better players than the ones who cry and run to mother. In a nutshell, don't try to play the game if you aren't able to. The Yankees don't let people play on their team just to be nice to them. So, when I say that thin-skinned people should not participate, that's what I mean. Remember that we are talking about what keeps me interested here. I want to use the forums to have good conversations, and sometimes that means expressing thoughts that others don't agree with, or even like. If I come here and it's turned into a knitting circle, that's okay. I can go play somewhere else. And that's what I expect thin-skinned people to do too. There was also the subject raised about the regular posters and the occasional posters. I will skip the sports analogy and get to the heart of it. People who post everyday probably have more time on their hands than those who don't. A generality, for sure. But if you are here regularly, not necessarily every day, you begin to see the forum as a place of conversations. You see how they ebb and flow. You can cater your posts to that. Some one who comes in occasionally may not see that. If there are threads going with conversations that have clearly picked up traction, I am not going to ignore them and start posting a host of threads that serve mainly to push the conversation that others were enjoying down to the bottom of the page. And I am not going to start a thread on a topic that was just discussed, or worse, being discussed in another post on the same page. All of which is to say that being here regularly keeps you informed. If you (speaking generically and not to Lookin) come here after a period of absence, then catch up first. Don't just jump in the water and splash everyone around you to get attention. Finally, two things. The number of posts you make is not as important as the quality. I should know that as well as anyone, since I have a lot of posts. And second, as for the lurkers, who cares about them? They contribute nothing, and if they don't care to contribute, I don't care if my posts offend or entertain them. It simply doesn't matter. So all of this goes to my discussing what interests me. They are not rules, just my opinions. It can all go out the window anytime. Who knows, I just might learn to like knitting.

We think of Texas as a big death penalty state, and they do gas 'em with gusto, but the Golden State also loves it. The LA Times reports today: About two-thirds of Californians support the death penalty, according to Field Poll survey results released Thursday. The level of support -- 68% -- remains at about the same level as it has for the last few years, but is down from the 1980s and early 1990s, when 80% or more of California voters responding in the poll said they supported the death penalty. Republicans were far more likely than Democrats to support keeping the death penalty -- 81% versus 57%. Those who identified themselves as liberals were the only subgroup in which more respondents supported doing away with the death penalty than keeping it, with 49% saying it should be abolished and 46% in favor of keeping it. Although most respondents said they did not want to abolish the death penalty, many saw life in prison as a preferred alternative. When asked what penalty they personally would prefer for someone convicted of first-degree murder, 48% said life in prison without parole, while 40% opted for death. That shows a change in views since 2000, when 44% of respondents said they would prefer the death penalty and 37% opted for life in prison. The survey was a random sample of 1,001 registered voters, with each question asked to a random subsample of either 481 or 520 voters, with a maximum margin of error of 4.6 percentage points. *********** In my opinion, the death penalty in practice has become a mess. It takes way too long for the appeals to run their course, and too many people later turn out to be innocent. Oops, sorry about that. But, in theory, I do support the death penalty. John Wayne Gacy, William Bonin both murdered multitudes of young boys who would otherwise be alive and enjoying life today. I am glad they got the death penalty, and I'd vote for it now for the same level of criminal. I think we have to have some measure of what society thinks are the most abhorrent crimes, and the death penalty is it.

Lurkerspeak's question repeats itself here with familiarity. The message center seems to have its ups and downs, and those of us who post regularly probably care more than those who post occasionally. We have mentioned before that posting in reply to topics is just as important as posting a new thread. People who post something like to know that it is appreciated, in the sense that they feel vindicated or receive approval for bringing up something of interest. We do that by responding to their post with an opinion or reply of some sort. Many threads continue to become conversations, and those are considered to be the most successful threads. Some threads are just meant to give information. For me, so many topics have already been covered in my almost 12 years of posting that when I see something come up again, I am less likely to respond, but for many it is the first time they have seen the topic. No way around that. I also couldn't care less about most television, so I don't join those threads. I am here mostly for gay content, but not exclusively. What I like is theater, gay subjects, politics, and cute guys, not that any of those subjects cannot be overdone. I sometimes think that if people put the energy into the Pub that they seem to put into finding pictures, we'd have a more successful forum. But as I look back to the so-called "glory years" of the message boards, when it was all new to us, there was more of a sense of camaraderie that made coming to the board more rewarding. What the ingredients of that are I cannot quite discern, I just know it when I see it. It's people feeling an affinity for the board, if not each other, but there has to be some interest in what others think and do to keep topics alive. You can post all of the threads you want, but if no one responds, then it's not much fun. Fun boards for me have always included a certain amount of teasing, poking, and prodding. When it is meant in good fun, then it works, and the board is better for it. Those who are thin-skinned really should look for their fun elsewhere, in my humble opinion. Locker rooms have always included some of the interactions I describe,and men seem to thrive in them. I know my response didn't come out particularly well, but when we have a good message board, we will know it. No one will need to ask why participation lags. We won't have to encourage people to post more often. There is no shortage of material out there. It's just getting the posters in sync.

BLOWN!!! And what a night of baseball. The Yankees had a 7-0 lead against Tampa, Boston was beating Baltimore and headed for the playoffs. But Tamp[a came from behind to tie the Yankees, ending up winning it all in the 12th with a walk-off home run. Meanwhile, Jonathon Papelbon, Boston's best closer, was shutting down Baltimore...that is, until he too blew it and Baltimore came from behind to beat Boston, giving the playoff spot to Tampa, who started September NINE games behind Boston! Oh, what a night!

When I signed off last night, I was the top poster for the day, so don't know what lurkerspeaks is talking about there. But I do agree that only a few seem to carry the message board, and the lack of reply to threads is discouraging. Beyond that, no offense to anyone, but some of the threads are simply not of interest to me. It seems there is a contest to see who can post the silliest stuff.

But SFGate.com (The Chronicle) puts it more optimistically, heading the article "Same-Sex Couples Jumped 80% In Decade" Same-sex households jumped 80 percent in decade Kevin Fagan, Chronicle Staff Writer Tuesday, September 27, 2011 (09-27) 15:43 PDT SAN FRANCISCO -- Emboldened by advances in gay and lesbian legal protections and overall acceptance, the number of Americans reporting that they are living as same-sex couples skyrocketed by 80 percent over the past decade, according to the U.S. Census Bureau. Census figures released Tuesday showed there were 646,464 same-sex households in the United States in 2010, compared with 358,390 in 2000. Twenty percent of couples living in same-sex households last year listed themselves as married, the Census Bureau said. In California, there were 98,153 same-sex households last year, of which 29 percent listed themselves as married. Same-sex marriage was legal in California from June to November 2008, but some couples may be listing themselves as spouses by personal interpretation under domestic partnerships, private ceremonies or other recognitions, census officials said. The same applies for the national figures. "The overall increase in same-sex couples is clearly a result of decreased stigma since 2000," said Gary Gates, a Census Bureau consultant and researcher at UCLA's Williams Institute, which conducts research into gay and lesbian demographics. However, this also was the first time the bureau made an aggressive effort to tally gay and lesbian couples, and Gates said that made a difference. "For the first time, they did specific outreach to the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender community to ask them to fill out forms, and they actually distributed materials urging it," Gates said. That was crucial in obtaining an accurate count of same-sex households, because gays and lesbians are still regarded with hostility in many communities, Gates said - so much so that he estimates about 10 percent of same-sex couples listed themselves as "roommates" rather than same-sex households out of fear. "This is still a difficult issue for many people and for many faiths," Gates said. In 2000, there were no states that allowed gays and lesbians to marry - the first was Massachusetts, in 2004. When the 2010 figures were compiled, five states and the District of Columbia were issuing marriage certificates to same-sex couples. Even with gay and lesbian marriage illegal in California since the passage of Proposition 8 in 2008, more than half of all same-sex couples in the country who report being in civil unions or domestic partnerships live in this state. Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/09/27/MNVJ1LABRU.DTL#ixzz1ZCX7MqyN

Hopefully the bf and I still count! Bye Bye Gays

I seriously doubt that is true. The Yankees are very competitive and want t win. If they were throwing it, why let Boston win Sunday night? More likely the umpire last night was on the take as he called some very dubious strikes on the Yankees, then went out of his way to start a fight with the Yankee catcher so he could toss him from the game.

Even the very hot Jacoby Ellsbury is getting worried!

$378 for one quadrant? That's very high. Our local dentist wants $105, but says that is a discount from the usual rate of $220. But he's getting a of of quadrants. What was the laser supposed to do after you had already been deep cleaned?

Despite beating the Yankees last night, Boston has succeeded in being one of the teams to have the worst collapse in baseball history. Earlier this month they had a nine game lead over Tampa for a wild card spot. Tonight they are tied with Tampa, having lost to lowly Baltimore yet again, while the Tampa team bet the mighty Yankees. Two games remain in the season. This is one reason I love baseball! It's exciting to the last.

EXPAT, telling others on the board how they must respond to a tv show is crass and dictatorial; it's an insult to your fellow posters. Beyond that it is just stupid. It isn't going to work. I don't support Chaz on this show. I can think of venues where I do support him- like courtrooms.

We all know that Chaz is not on the show because of his dancing ability. He brings with him a whole media circus based upon who he is, and what he was. I wish him well, but do wonder why he took this on. The reason I don't think he will last is partly due to his mediocre skill at dancing, but more due to the right-wing vote coming in for Nancy Grace, a *** if there ever was one. (See- I can self-censor!) Having said all of that, I wonder why a lot of folks take that show on.

Tristan, so hot and such a good dancer. Val, the same. Derek too. Was anyone else on the show? OH, Nancy grace, who will easily get the right wing vote. If Chaz lasts a week, I will be dumbfounded. What a circus he is. And that Carson guy. Is this what America sees as a gay man? What bugs me is that either Tristan, Val, or Derek could be gay and America will never know it until one of the closet guys has the guts to come out. Until then, Carson represents the gay community.

LOL. How intense does it have to be? And this was a gang rape, even if they didn't show each guy. Rape as entertainment is only entertaining until it's you or your family or friend getting raped. Then it's not funny at all. What kind of society are we, really, where this becomes mainstream entertainment?

Known for their history of slumping late in the season, the Boston Red Sox are at it again. They had lost 11 of their 14 last games, and today are only ahead of the Tampa Bay team by 1 1/2 games. It was nine just awhile ago. It's going to be an interesting week. Boston plays the weak Baltimore Orioles, then the Yankees, and then the Orioles again. Whereas the Rays play the Yankees, Toronto, and then the Yankees again. So Tampa has a harder road to go, plus starting behind. But Boston seems to love to collapse at the end of a great season. They lost to the Orioles this morning, and are winning the night game of a double header. Team W L PCT GB NY Yankees 92 60 .605 - Boston 87 66 .569 5.5 Tampa Bay 85 67 .559 7.0 From mlb.com: BOSTON -- "Playing significant games in September" has been a mantra among Rays players and management the past several years. Well, they don't get as significant as the 10 remaining on the team's 2011 slate. After Sunday's 8-5 win over Boston, the Rays find themselves two games behind the Red Sox for the American League Wild Card spot. Tampa Bay (85-67) won for the 11th time in its past 15 games since Boston (87-65) held a nine-game lead on Sept. 2. The Rays have now won eight of their past nine games from the Red Sox, and they claimed a 12-6 advantage during the season series. Should the Rays manage to earn a spot in the playoffs, they will make history. No team in Major League history has overcome as high as a nine-game deficit through Sept. 2 to earn a spot in the postseason.

Well, I for one do not wear sandals. And I totally oppose the idea of showing your toes in public, especially restaurants, where they tend to slip the sandal off and go barefoot. Not appetizing for me!

Well, thank you tomcal! I enjoyed reading it, and also looking at the photo. Nice to know that Prague is coming into its own as a gay mecca. I was there in 1995 and it was dull, boywise.

He didn't age so well.