Londoner

Yes, I agree with that: planning well ahead makes sense in all sorts of ways. . When I'm feeling low, there's nothing like booking up a trip to Thailand to raise the spirits. I like to have one "in the bag" when I return to the greyness of London and so have just arranged a second one in March. It means that, when the chill hits me in December when I return from my upcoming one, I can smile grimly and anticipate the next. A stay in Thailand is a pleasure to anticipate, enjoy and recall.

RobinHood should stay in his own country if he doesn't want to mix with people of other cultures. And by the way, his comment is nonsense...I've just been there.

Yes, true. Book early! But comparing March prices with the one I paid for in July and my up-coming November flight, the fact remains that prices are stable.

LHR-BKK on EVA Air Business Class in July, £3000. In November, £3000. In March 2023, £2500. I surmise from this that the hike in prices we experienced recently is over.

This is what P and I did preparing for our November visit to Chiang Mai. The flights from CNX to BKK are plentiful but to U-Tapao, not so. It may have been worth it before Suvanbharmi was built....that extra ninety minutes from Dom Muang to Pattaya were unpleasant.

This should be a salutary reminder to all visitors who enjoy the sex scene to remember that hiv remains a real threat. And that, despite advances in medication and care, it remains a life-long condition with unpredictable implications, as Covid proved.

"Soccer"? may the Good Lord forgive you!

We have something similar here in the UK and I've been exploring the possibility of, as GWMinUS says, "preparing for the inevitable". It is not straightforward: I'd hoped that my solicitor/executor could fulfil that role but it turns out that this is not the case. I'd appreciate some advice, either here or via a PM.

My oldest friend died a year ago aged seventy-five. I was the only person who knew he was gay apart from a few masseurs in Pattaya to whom I almost dragged him. Even there he was uncomfortable. He was close to his brothers but they didn't know- or at least he hadn't told them. Perhaps they worked it out. I have to say that my siblings hadn't worked me out when I was forty -five and gave them the news about my own sexuality. The funeral provided me with an odd sensation, standing around his grave as eulogies were delivered, knowing that a hugely significant fact about him would be interred with his body. It saddens me to think of what he missed. I said to him, time and time again, "Carpe diem." Cancer had the last laugh. But I'm having my own laugh now, preparing for my second trip to Pattaya and P since Covid. With a third one already booked.

I suspect the numbers of new retirees may be dropping. When I considered relocating about fifteen years ago, the UK pound was worth 70 baht; now it hovers around 40. Many expats who arrived a decade or so ago must have felt a serious decline in their living standards. Some may well have left. Others may be struggling. Some falangs, whom I see around Pattaya Tai for example, appear to be experiencing hard times.

No, and Thailand isn't Pattaya. Nor Bangkok. I couldn't live where P does- quite happily- in a farming community with a 7 11 a local market, a temple and nothing else. Even the internet is refractory. And I know , were I to turn this around, P that wouldn't be happy here. His family and his dogs would be far away. As would his friends. And speakers of Thai. The things I love -Chelsea Football Club, classical music and so on- aren't for him. At his age (nearly forty) how easy would it it be to find a new Thai-speaking friend? My company alone isn't that good! Oddly enough, there is a beautiful Thai temple ten miles away in Wimbledon (near the tennis centre). He'd like that! Anyway, we've talked about both possibilities ad nauseam and as long as I'm lucky enough to be to jump on a plane and arrive fifteen hours later in BKK, and he has the means to leave his farm in the hands of his family to join me, why pursue it?

I ask this question in all innocence; are there any gay men who wish to see ladyboy shows? Honestly?

Thanks 12is12. The issue of relocation is a complex one. We've discussed it many times. I'll wait for another thread before explaining.

I tried to provide insights on a number of occasions on different threads but obviously my comments fell on stony ground. And I'm not going to repeat myself. I know three LTR couples, two of them British/Thai, one of them a US citizen. They are similar- 60+ falang/late thirties or early forties Thais. Both parties seems happy to me. If you keep your eyes open, you'll see such couples in the restaurants and malls of Pattaya. You won't confuse them with falangs with offed guys. It works for some of us. Perhaps it shouldn't, but it does. Don't be dismissive of other peoples' experience and other peoples' lives. And don't confuse sex and love. I've enjoyed both in the last twenty-five years visiting Pattaya. and so I don't.

Cost of living, particularly regarding accommodation. Often, this includes transport; most Pattaya guys live within walking distance of their bars in Pattaya and travel can be an issue in Bangkok. Social interaction with friends on the scene. Often the Pattaya guys live close together in certain areas (near Tuc Com, for example) and frequently in the same building. Guys looking for a LTR are more likely to find one in Pattaya, where visitors stay longer. Some of the falangs in BKK are two -nighters on business trips, or are moving onto other Thailand cities.

Nevertheless, JC is the place to be! It is the last outpost for such as I. And, taking into account the fact that I'm no longer in the market, it is vibrant, more than gay-friendly....and fun. I suspect that the twinks of yore do not exist in Pattaya for a variety of social and economic reasons. In the past, large families in rural areas resulted in the youngest children leaving in their late teens to find work. I'm suggesting for one moment that life is easy and that poverty isn't very real, only that social conditions have improved. Helped, of course, by contraception. The young are staying home. As an example, in 2001, P left home for Pattaya and after some other jobs, ended-up in BT. His twenty-one year-old nephew, both gay and cute (a winning combination) is happily living in the same village and with an enormously improved life style. Pad's family didn't even have electricity until 2000.

There's no difference in essence. Eye contact and a smile, or an offer of a drink. in my day, guys would often approach first...nowadays, I'm led to believe, this isn't so common. I must agree with BiggusDikkus about JC's lack of twinks. I must admit that we only visit the bars early in the evening for a drink before dinner and so I am an observer rather than a participant but he's right; it is not a twink-heaven. It certainly isn't like the BT or Suny of years ago, or even, as I understand it, Winners today. The guys are predominantly Cambodian, a higher proportion are straight and the cute, gay twenty year-olds of yore don't seem to be much in evidence. And yes, I know this is dependent on the definition of a twink....but Biggusdickus and I seem to agree on that.

Yes...I remember this practice at Tarntawan in BKK....but the odd thing about the Agate ones was that the group who arrived in the evening weren't the same as those who'd previously left in the morning with their bags. The groups were one-nighters.

Historically, I am told that the park of the big Buddha was a cruising ground late at night. And the beach near Dusit. This was twenty plus years ago. In more recent years, the Royal Garden Mall when it was the only one in Pattaya. Now, the cruising is done on apps. apart from Sansuk, of course, if that counts as "cruising."

This used to puzzle us. The coaches would arrive late in the evening and then the groups would take breakfast early the next morning. And then leave en masse. I never saw them around the pool, or in the Complex. Or anywhere. We assumed that the overnight stays were for the purpose of easing travel to the airport...or somewhere. We saw the same thing happening at our hotel in Seminyak, Bali a few years ago. it must be a money-spinner for the hotels!

I wonder how many falangs are 100% honest with the guys they meet? How many promise, or imply, that they will pay more than they actually intend to? or find an excuse to pay less? or that they'll return to the bar tomorrow for a second "off"? Or over-egg their "pillow talk"? or give the impression that two or three nights of passion are the beginnings of a long-term relationship? We know the game the moment our planes land . We hold all the cards except one; the carnal one. As so often in our dealings with Thais, just smile.

"Tomorrow in my birthday."

Agate's prices at the moment are good value. I paid 1000 pn last month; and I'm paying 1,200 for my next trip (for which I cannot wait!) in November. No breakfast though; we ate at Zing. Charming staff there too! Agate's public areas are 4* plus, if that's important to you. They are to us. P and I would gaze at and appreciate all the exhibits in the glass cases in the corridors. Other Agate guests will know what I mean! And its two pools are a blessing if sprogs appear.... P and I always had the sea-water one to ourselves. As I always say, don't use Agoda or Booking; book direct with the hotel. Much cheaper.

I came to Pattaya in 1995 hoping to meet twinks in the 18-23 age group. I soon discovered that older guys were more technically proficient and spoke better English, transforming a forty minute transaction into a couple of hours which included chatting over a drink. I learnt a lot from them. Overall, better value.

In my experience, sex is fun while love can be very painful indeed. I honestly do not recommend it. If it happens, as it did to me, welcome it as a privilege but don't expect it to be as much fun as an hour with a MB. And it will be more costly- and I'm not just talking about money.