abidismaili

Hi Christian. No, no joke. But I can imagine people think that. I got the same question from someone else in a private message. Here for you the same reply I gave him: I only was interested what would happen if finally a Farang doesn't take it anymore, all these scams these boys get away with and goes to court. Because many of these boys are "criminals". If we did what they do, we would go to jail. They get away with it. Isn't that an interesting topic to contemplate about? But I really not understand why a judge or police would laugh at it. Scams are serious crimes. Look, I would never bring charges because I feel pity with many of these boys. Poor backgrounds, need to send money monthly to parents etc, no good education because parents couldn't afford it, choosing for the easy money by being a moneyboy, which not always is easy if you see some Farangs who off them and who they have to have sex with. Because of all that, I pity them, understand it and don't take action. Sometimes I pretend to believe and give the money. It all depends on the boy. What my intuition tells me. If he comes over as essentially a good person, I forgive him his lie, pretend to believe it and give. All out of pity and wanting to help. But still I can't help but thinking: technically he is committing a crime and getting away with it.

Why do you use the word 'sucker' for the victim of a crime? The words used by a person, tell a lot about that person. About his social standing, his income, his education, middle class, lower class, etc. The fact you use here - in this context - the word 'sucker' tells me something about you. You clearly seem to imply you associate with the perpetrator of the crime and not with the victim? Even dumb victims, stupid idiots who are a victim of a crime, who fell for the scam because of lack of intelligence, or an unreasonable believe in the good of people, are in our societies protected by the law. What about the example of the old lady I gave, who was robbed of her money because of a lie? Isn't the guy who did it a hero and the lady a stupid bitch who deserves what she gets? I mean that is what you probably would think not? The lady deserved it? It is a shame if the guy who robbed her is brought to court. In a fair world he should get away with it? Not?

Ok, so I will not be convicted if i do the following in the Netherlands: "Dear old lady, give me please 1000 EUR, it is for helping my sick grandmother who can not afford health care". The old lady gives it to me. I go buy a new iPad Pro. The old lady discovers this and starts a court case. According to your reply I would never be convicted? You truly think that? Trust me: I would end up in jail in my country. It is a scam. Scams are illegal. So in the same scenario why would a Thai boy not be convicted, why would the judge not take it serious? Are scams in Thailand jokes? No serious crimes, as they are everywhere else? (Please assume you have the proof: for example chat logs, Facebook posts implying he was not visiting his sick mother the day he said, confirmations from others he indeed did buy iPad from your money, etc; please assume there is proof.)

I agree that it would not be wise to start a case if the Farang paid for sex. Strictly speaking the Farang violates the law too, or is only the prostitute violating the law? I do not know Thai law regarding prostitution. Maybe only the person offering himself is in violation? But of course if there is a real possibility that not only the boy gets convicted, but also you, then it is not wise of course to start a case.

We do not exploit. The boy offers himself. As go go boy or beer boy or via Hornet. It is just a business. A very well paid business I may add. Not many in the West have a job which gives them 2000 baht for 1 hour work. He sells his body, others sell their brains etc. There is no exploitation. Or does my employer exploit me for my brain cells? I don't understand this reasoning.

I would not sue myself. But I can imagine others will sue out of principle. Even if it only costs you money. Just to prevent the boy from getting away with criminal activities. I think we all agree: criminals should not get away with crimes. Shouldn't that be a principle we all should embrace? But again when it comes to Thai boys I am very understanding and forgiving. But strictly speaking quite a significant part of the boys we encounter are - legally speaking - criminals. But they look so nice and cute, so we forgive. And they get away with their scams. No jail terms. No criminal records. In our home countries we would feel victimized and go to police. In Thailand we just forgive and smile.

I was thinking about the following. I wonder if ever a Farang brought a legal case against a Thai moneyboy because the moneyboy talked him out of money because of lies. Many Farang know of course they are being lied to, but do they know technically they are the victim of a crime? I think many (or all) just accept it and do not take action. In the Netherlands if I talk people out of money because of a lie (for example "can you please give me 1000 EUR, I will give it to a good cause to help a family in need", but then I use the money for myself to by myself a new iPad pro) I am violating the law. I can go to jail. Now consider what is going on in Thailand: 1) Thai boys saying they need money because mother is sick, so you give it. But mother is not sick. He spends it on himself. 2) Consider Farang who has Thai boyfriend and gives him each month 20.000 baht to live from because the boy gives him the impression he really truly loves him. The boy knows the only reason he gets this money is because he made the Farang believe he loves him. But the boy has two other such 'arrangements'. He doesn't feel love. Isn't this technically a scam? And we all can make up other examples. Are the examples I mention above also a crime according to Thai law? In other words is not quite a significant part of the Thai moneyboy scene strictly - from a purely legal viewpoint - made up of criminals? I know this is quite a provocative thing to say. But isn't there a kernel of truth in it? What would the chances be of winning a court case when you are the victim of such a scam and have all the information to proof it? This is not about me. I have been lied to, as all of us have. I do not intend to start a court case. In fact I forgive them, because I understand why they do it. They come often from very poor backgrounds. I even give sometimes money while I know it is a lie. I am just interested what would happen if some Farang made it a court case. if there is rule of law in Thailand you would win easily? Wouldn't you? Assuming you have all the proof?

Ah. They do it to protect us? To avoid our cheating to surface? Hehe.

If you only use the hotel for sleeping and fucking then the very cheap Marina Inn hotel I would recommend. Stayed there 3 days for about 20 EUR a night. In Tarntawan in Bangkok I had a room for 60 EUR a night. Gives an idea how cheap Marina is. Marina isn't too bad. Why pay more if you only there in the evening? You don't live in the hotel room. Better spend the money on boys. That is my advice. (Marina has a large swimming pool. But is not used very much)

I never understood the many lady boys in shows in the gay show bars. We are gay. We like to see boys in cabaret shows. That is why I enjoy The Venue show. It has lady boys yes, but also plenty of "real" boys. I encounter in the gay venues in Thailand policy decisions I can not understand. Like they do not know what the average Farang wants to see in a show. Boys!!! I love watching dancing cute Thai twinks. Ladyboys look to me 100% like ladies. Don't see anything male in them. Why would a gay want to look at ladies, pay for going see show with ladies? Apparently the gay bar owners think that is what the bulk of us want. How can they be so wrong?

I like this explanation. I know they borrow from each other. And that indeed can be a reason. Good thinking!

Ok. Sorry. Misunderstood. If he had asked he wanted motor bike I would have done it. Just didn't think about it myself because for me strange to do for relatively short distance.

I see you also have no answer why they don't want their friends to see them with a Farang. And about me sitting on money. I think I am one of the best tippers out there. When was the last time you gave a boy 4000 baht for short time? I did last week. Now who is sitting on money here? I often give 2000 baht just for spending an afternoon with me. No sex. When was the last time you did that? Ok, in your scenario they have to walk less. I don't mind walking 7 minutes. I take motor bike taxi or baht bus for longer distances.

Here another observation I had during my last trip. I never noticed it before. I took a boy from a beer bar in Boyztown back to my hotel in Sunee. He insisted on leaving Boyztown not via the main Soi but via a small side exit near Copa bar. Didn't even know it existed. That exit takes you to a hotel lobby and then to the left is the exit to the street. This avoided him being seen by most other boys in Boyztown. Then when we came near Sunee he insisted he didn't want to talk past the bars. He not wanted to be seen with me. I asked why and he said something like there will be chatting/gossip among the other boys. That is how I interpreted his answer. Same thing I noticed with Hornet boy. He did not want to be seen with me in Sunee. Why this for me new behavior? These boys know from each other they are moneyboys. So what is the problem if an acquaintance sees them with me? Now you may think I look horrendous and that that is the reason. But I can assure you I look good. At least better than the average Farangs I see. So there must be another reason. Also because the beer bar boy made the approach and made very clear he wanted me. I held off and finally gave in. His seduction worked. So what can be the reason for not wanting to be seen? Others noticed this behavior before? First time I see it. This was my 6th trip to Thailand. So I have some experience already.

I recently was in Jomtien to see the show in The Venue. I enjoyed it very much and some very cute twinks danced in it. I ordered a drink, but not a second one. Almost everyone - as I observed other customers - only had one drink. The show is worth more than the 150 baht for the drink. But I not order more because I am not thirsty. I can order a second drink and not touch it. Then order a third drink and also not touch it. But that looks very stupid. I would have loved to pay an entrance fee of say 500 baht. It is worth it. I think the reason others also don't order more is the same: not thirsty. Also because many have had drinks in bars already that evening, waiting for the show to start. So I wasn't that thirsty at the beginning and only ordered the first drink because it is mandatory. After oberserving myself and others I think revenue can be better with an entrance fee. The show is worth it. I really felt guilty watching it for only 150 baht. It didnt feel good. I not understand how from that income they made they pay all these many dancers. And the staff. I tipped two very charismatic dancers. To relieve myself of some guilt. Of course you can always just pay 500 baht for the first drink if it bothers you. I decided to give it to two dancers. But with tipping I always feel a bit uncomfortable. Why not have an entrance fee? works much better for me. No pressure to order dinks. I can sometimes see the begging looks in staff's eyes to please order another drink. Makes the experience sometimes a bit uneasy for me. Please introduce an entrance fee.

I mean with visum the stamp you get in your passport and which gives you the right to a 60 (?) day tourist stay. I am Dutch. I do not need to apply beforehand for a visum. But I need that stamp of course. And with the stamp comes a departure paper which you need to give to customs when you depart. So it is a bit awkward that I get the stamp and two hours later already get a departure stamp. So my tourist 'visum' has lasted then for about 2 hours :-)

I suddenly get the following question. When I arrive in October at the airport I will go for a tourist visum and go pick up my friend who will be waiting for me in the airport. Then we go together to check in counter for the flight to Singapore. But then I again need to pass customs of course. They will give me an exit stamp in the passport (while I have only been inside for 2 hours or so). A few days later I will arrive back from Singapore. Do I then need again to go to customs for a visum stamp? I think so, because the other visum has been invalidated. But that other visum has then only been active forabout 2 hours. Is there a way around this? A tourist visum gives me the right to stay for a few weeks, so leaving the country and re-entry again a few days later shouldn't be a problem.

Thank you all.

In October this year I will go with a good friend (a Thai national) to Singapore. Committing gay sex acts is illegal there. But I understand from the Internet that that law is not really enforced. Can someone confirm this please? I assume it is no problem for a gay Westerner in this 40s to share the same hotel room with a 24 year old Thai national? Hotel will allow that? Despite the law and despite the age difference? Singapore is very conservative and has tough law enforcement. I obviously don't want to get into problems. So what are your experiences in real life when it comes to being gay in Singapore and with taking a guy to your hotel room?

And that is good for us who go for one reason only to Thailand. It is in our interest it doesn't become to prosperous anytime soon.

But in my country (Netherlands) there are of course also poor people. But try to find a hot 20 year old twink who is willing to have short time with you for 20 EUR is as good as impossible. Also no go go bars etc. So if Thailand becomes as rich as the West, it is over with the fun.

The USA is in some areas a third world country. Lots of poverty, but also badly maintained public infrastructure. When I am there it is very frequent to see highways with holes in them. Like the state government has no money to properly maintain them. In Western Europe you do not see this. When it comes to the public sphere (parks, roads, residential areas) Western Europa is far more richer and better maintained than the USA.

I am not rich enough to support him. So I understand he needs to date Farang customers. He knows I know. If I had the money like you I would support him with a decent income. But even then: can you really trust he then would not date others? Young guys are horny all the time. They do not wait with sex till you arrive back in Thailand. So why send them money every month? You get nothing extra's out of it that his normal customers also do not get out of it. And for them it is far cheaper. They only pay per date. You send a lot of money monthly and get nothing extra out of it. Not more sex, not more time with him. Nothing.

Thailand is a very nice country. With in general very nice people. Many who not have much money. That relative poverty is of course one of the reasons why we can have sex with hot looking Thai boys from go go bars etc, who back at home would be unreachable for most of us due to our age. We can have them in Thailand because it is an easy source of income for them. They wouldn't do it if they could earn a descent salary with a 'normal' job. And of course you wish them all the best and you wish Thailand a prospering economy. But sometimes I have thoughts I am not proud off. Like for example when I read that the Thai economy is not doing well. I can't help that the bad side in me pops up now and then (and I am not proud of it; I hate myself for thinking it). Thoughts like: "good news for me their economy is in decline, it means that there will also be in the near future hot guys being available for relatively cheap prizes. Let's hope Thailand doesn't become a well developed rich country during my lifetime." More of you have sometimes thoughts like this? Or am I the only one with 'evil' thoughts you rather wish you had not? It is a dilemma. Because if it becomes as rich as a Western country, it will be over with the fun for most of us.

Do others also read these trip reports to see if the author has had a date with your BF or with other Thai boys you dated? It is one of the reasons why I read the reports. To see what my BF is up to :-). He is very hot and popular, so always interesting for me to try to spot him in the reports. It is of course not always possible from the descriptions to identify the guys, but sometimes it is. I once saw my BF in a picture posted on this forum.