DivineMadman

OK. In a lighthearted post that was trying to point out that the word can have quirky little differences in the way we read it, and also provide some helpful information about common gay app profile uses, definitely important to say, "You shouldn't have said connote. You should have said 'means'." I see. Never would have crossed my mind that someone would make that comment. I wish I had never made the post. As do we all, I am sure.

Honestly - because it seemed very odd to take issue with the use of the term "connote." I don't understand the need for the correction. That's why. In part because I don't the correction was actually correct. And in part because I don't think was necessary at all.

I certainly don't understand why the fact that I thought it was fascinating or amusing changes anything. Also, not sure why my particular examples lead anyone to then say no, this is something that must be corrected. The word has several different meanings depending on how it's being used. รับ the phoneme can also mean "take" or "get" (as in go get) and others. Yes the bottom is taking it, as in "take it baby, take it." But I thought I could just say that in that context the sense was the "receiving" sense. Here I thought I was just making a fun lighthearted non-controversial observation. Much less one that was wrong and in need of correction. But so be it.

my point was that in other uses it doesn't mean receive. That was the point.

On a slight linguistic tangent. For some reason I am constantly fascinated and amused by how รับ can be used in Thai. Of course there's the most beloved of all รับ = bottom (has a connotation of accepting or receiving) So there's "I am+" เป็น+รับ (เป็นรับ) OR another way to say it is งาน+รับ (งานรับ), where งาน usually means something in the area of "work" or "job". So work + bottom (งานรับ) means I'm a bottom or my "role" or "position" (hehehe) is bottom รับ. [Already a bit of a joke, because we all know the tops do all the work.] But then if you reverse the two, รับ + งาน (รับงาน), it basically means working or technically more along the lines of "accepting work". So the yummy guy in Hornet who says "รับงาน" is in it for the money. But he may not be a รับ. A top (รุก) working might say รุกรับงาน (or similar variations). The basic lesson is that in Thailand it's much easier if everyone is just verse. By the way, these aren't the only uses of รับ. A massage guy will say รับ + massage (นวด) = รับนวด. But it doesn't mean I'll "accept" a massage. It means I will perform the massage. nothing passive about that.

Thai press briefing today said that 19 of the guys (I think) had COVID-19 in detention and had stayed in detention until they were cured before being deported to Myanmar. Apparently there are WHO guidelines about how to handle deportations that the countries in the region have adopted. They are following through with the gov't of Myanmar on this and the other cases. It could all be bullshit, or it could raise the question of whether Myanmar was reporting that the individuals tested positive for anitbodies. Perhaps we will never know.

Spoon may have found it in another source, but I noticed it was in my feed from National Geographic and the piece is at least in part supported by a Nat Geo COVID-19 storytelling grant.

And my point w/r/t to the literary criticism was that I had actually addressed it, and personally, I don't think there's any doubt that the vast vast vast majority were happy to continue to work, rather than deprive their families of their earnings and go home where food will just get stretched thin. So again, the literary criticism - and let's not forget the ""Why am I not surprised?" - seemed off point to me and actually denies the Cambodian workers' their "agency" - as people say nowadays.

Actually, Somchai reports that the workers say they would rather be there in his first quote. Does anyone really doubt they would rather be working? All of the guys I am contact with or follow on Facebook say they would rather be working.

Here's a transcript of an entirely made up meeting at the Thai government in mid- to late-March: Somchai (Junior Official) "Boss, I have a great idea, I know the Cambodian government is asking us to keep workers here, rather than send them back where they won't have work. And they're worried about sending people back across the borders with COVID-19 now. And the workers say they would rather be here. Boss "Ah, Somchai, of course they would rather be here. Thailand is envy of the world. Somchai "Indeed, Boss. "And, Boss, I know people are worried about shutting down the economy. Boss "And rightly so, Somchai. The Thai economy is the envy of the world. Somchai "Of course, Boss. "So I was thinking about the construction industry and the migrant workers from Cambodia who work in the construction industry. What if we let them stay in Thailand and keep some construction going. Boss "Hmmmm. But Somchai, why can't we say the same thing and keep the malls open? That will make my mistress -- I mean my wife -- very happy. Somchai Oh, but there's a difference, Boss. The construction workers live together, go to work together, stay on the construction site, and go home together. The malls are the opposite. People come from different places, then mix, and then disperse. So that would be very different for the spread of the disease. Boss "Ah yes, Somchai. And after all, our malls are the envy of the world. Somchai "As you say, Boss. Boss "But Somchai, the benevolence of the Thai people is the envy of the world. Won't we seem heartless having our Cambodian cousins working in a global pandemic. What if they get sick? Smooch "But Boss, don't forget, documented migrant workers are eligible for our universal health care system. Even undocumented migrant workers are eligible. Not everyone takes advantage, but we conduct active outreach and try to enroll as many as we can, and the Thai universal health care system is there for them if they need it just like the rest of us. Boss "Of course, Somchai, you are correct. I didn't forget that. I was just testing you. "The way Thailand has expanded universal health coverage to documented and undocumented migrant workers is the envy of the world. Somchai "As you say, Boss." Boss "Well, Somchai, I think I have laid out my brilliant plan to you. You may circulate it among the ministries. "This is the sort of win-win thinking that will only earn respect for our Kingdom! Somchai "Yeah, sure, Boss.

One question then is are there hot spots among the immigrant community that have developed and been unnoticed, noticed and deliberately ignored or have not "bled" out into the general public. Those would just be the questions that would need to be answered. There's a little bit of damned-if-you-do/damned-if-you-don't going on here. At the time when things were closing down there were a lot of people being quite vocal that the worst thing to do to the provinces or the neighboring countries would be to shut down and send people home. The fear at the time being that it would spread the virus to places such as Cambodia, Laos and Myanmar, even less able to deal with it. If you're looking for a non-malicious motive, perhaps that's a potential path forward. As I keep saying, this stuff is complicated.

I think they might say they are not ignoring it. It's just they've adopted the track-and-trace model. I have absolutely no doubt cases are being missed. At a recent Foreign Correspondents Club of Thailand discussion a Thai individual on the panel said the problem with Thailand was there were too many elephants in the room, but she was referring to something else, I think. hahaha.

Definitely mass testing would be nice. Remember, these individuals were in a detention center by the Malaysian border. Also note that 4 of them had come from Malaysia - ahem (not pointing finger). I absolutely agree more testing would be nice. The other day Thai press spokesman addressed the general question of mass testing. I forget all of the response, but I think the points he made were (1) they conduct rigorous contract tracing, and that is generally regarded as the more effective method and (2) the 1,000,000 person localized health volunteer brigade that blankets the country is credited with a lot of success of getting people educated and catching cases early before they spread, including the immigrant community. He also addressed the question of significant undiagnosed cases. His answer was that there hasn't been an uptick in otherwise unaccounted for deaths Thailand, unlike other countries where the likely answer is the increase in deaths is likely from COVID-19. I know that some of the NGOs are out there testing, which is great. SWING will test sex workers and is offering that testing as part of its outreach in BKK and Pattaya. Duang Prateep has been actively testing in the Klong Toey slum. But again, mass testing would be nice. I am not disputing that.

Hong Kong currently tests everyone on arrival and you have to wait for the test results. The reports are it takes about 8 to up 12 hours to get the results. There is a mandatory 14 day quarantine. They tell you where you can quarantine based on how they assess your risk (and obvs if the test is positive). Because of the distancing and safety issues in collecting the sample for testing, the number of people who can come in is severely limited. "Tourists" of course can't travel there now anyway, so it really affects returning nationals and special cases. https://multimedia.scmp.com/infographics/news/hong-kong/article/3082266/hong-kong-inbound-travellers-restrictions/index.html

If the objective is to get people back to work and keep the economy going, even if that means COVID-19 spreads, there is a clear quantifiable cost in human lives of the workers and their families put at risk and the people they infect and so on. Plus of course the greater potential for another broader shutdown of the economy and all of the costs associated with that. And the people not at risk are the rich owners of the businesses who benefit but are still working from home or safely socially distant in their offices. So the "let's get people back to work" argument is hardly a clear winner, to say the least. Personally, I think these issues aren't lost on the governments that have taken a strong view towards controlling COVID-19, including Australia, New Zealand, the SE Asian countries, etc.

No doubt. I was just making the point that it’s complicated, and policy makers are making difficult and complicated judgments of risk, and simply recognizing that fact - which doesn’t seem controversial to me - helps me be a little more patient and less critical of the governments that have actually been successful in controlling COVID-19.

It's possible that some tests might not be sufficiently accurate for airlines or governments to "bet the farm" on, as it were. https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-phe-laboratory-evaluations-of-roche-and-abbott-antibody-tests/ (Abbott about 84% accurate - in the bad way, i.e., failed to catch positives). https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/05/14/856531970/fda-cautions-about-accuracy-of-widely-used-abbott-coronavirus-test Abbott itself says 95% accurate. which is only to say that this is all complicated stuff, so personally I am reluctant to say that there are easy answers to getting global international travel up and running easily right now, without the sort of precautions we are seeing countries discuss.

Thailand has certainly done more than most of its neighbors towards some universal income payments in the current crisis, but it’s been woefully and tragically inadequate. It’s a developing country and does a shit job of taking care of its people. But the point remains that the workers in the factories and construction matter, and the grandparents back in the village matter. The 88% of the economy that isn’t international tourism (or 80% if that’s makes anyone happy) matters. So we can respect the government’s decision to be cautious on COVID-19.

I'm no mindreader, but they are all people returning to the country voluntarily. Personally I doubt they would feel imprisoned. Most are Thai nationals and my guess is the Thais are actually quite proud of their nation's success in controlling COVID-19. Certainly in the press we don't read anything about the repatriated Thais being resentful of the quarantine process. And it's world wide phenomenon.

If 20% makes anyone happier then I think the same analysis goes whether it's 80% non-international tourism GDP or 88%. There are reasons why people tend to stick with the hard direct numbers, they're generally verified because the methodology is generally agreed, etc. One problem with the soft numbers is that the total often ends up to more than 100% GDP because different "people" (parts of the economy) may all lay claim to some of the same "indirect" revenues. (It's maybe a surprising but at the same time obvious point. Currently all GDP is 100% accounted for, so if International Tourism says it really is responsible for a greater percentage, that means another group is responsible for less.) But there are reasons that portion that International Tourism wants to claim is put in someone else's column in the first place. I think that's the main reason people generally think in terms of the reported GDP numbers. Of course the ultimate flaw with GDP numbers is that they don't take into account expenses or costs (including environmental) or even just what's best for the country. All those billions of dollars spent on airports and tourism infrastructure satisfy the monied hotel owners and construction firms, but are there longer term benefits of directing the resources into education, skilled labor jobs, etc. But that's for another day. It's not contradictory. It just reflects the fact that Thailand - like so many, many other countries - is requiring quarantine for all current arrivals. As I mentioned in another post (I think), the constant drumbeat of new cases from these repatriated Thais can only make the government more cautious. Just stepping back, Thailand is still currently repatriating it's own nationals - I believe at 500 per day max (?). Next in the pipeline are permanent residents & work permit holders and then (as I understand it), with luck people with family members. Maybe we can expect international students will need to get onto the fast track as well because the schools are opening. That's a lot of people still be bring back into the country. And personally I think they justifiably can go back first. We're at the back of the queue.

Anyone who is reading the news expecting a government announcement now -- or in the near future -- of any sort of international travel plan that will get Thai tourism back to the old normal or anything even approximating the old normal soon is a bit like Charlie Brown asking Lucy to hold the football for him. (Cartoon below). Expect frustration and disappointment. As much as we may think tourism is the most important thing to Thailand, it's not. The usual number for GDP international tourism is roughly 12%, and roughly 6-7% for domestic tourism. That leaves roughly 88% non-tourism. That 12% International tourism is juicy and sexy and fun for us -- and 12% is nothing to scoff at -- but it is by its nature much riskier as far as COVID-19 is concerned. The 88% non--tourism is more important, by far. The Thai government, and the Vietnamese government, and the Laos government, etc., etc., have to look to overall safety of their people and to their economies overall. Another serious wave of COVID-19 could well mean another shut down of construction and of the factories, etc. And that would be bad. It is eminently reasonable for governments to be exceedingly cautious as far as opening their borders is concerned. I don't think one can truly, fairly say that the Thai or Vietnamese (or Australian or New Zealand) governments are being unreasonably cautious. We are less than three months from the global shutdown because of COVID-19. There is no vaccine. It has been brought under control successfully in some places, but not in many other places. It is still a global pandemic, getting worse in many places. Ironically, it has been brought under control in Thailand, but we don't seem to be showing respect for the Thai government's approach to COVID-19. I confess I find that baffling. In the same way that we can be against police brutality in the U.S. and still pro-police, we can decry all the many legit failings of Uncle Tu and his government, but also give Thailand a "win" on COVID-19. Also, the recent polls taken in Thailand have shown (1) the majority of the Thai people are still very concerned about COVID-19 and (2) the vast majority of the Thai people do not want the country to rush to open the gates to international tourists. I haven't come across any suggestions that these polls were rigged or are inaccurate. Thus, another thing that we can do is give a nod of respect to the sentiments expressed of the Thai people in these polls. (The 30% who want the tourists back may well be the 30% employed in the tourism sector, but the 70% saying don't rush can have their voices heard as well.) If there's wisdom in crowds, one might notice that Thailand is not alone in still trying (struggling) to come to terms international travel in the age of COVID-19. At this point I'm not aware of any government that has said "here are the easy answers." Of course I can't speak for anyone else, but I think I feel as bad as many here about not being able to get back to Thailand when I want. I'm paying rent on a condo I can't use and I certainly miss my friends, etc. And daily reading of the rumor mill is excruciating. In part this is because it is usually imprecise and occasionally downright inaccurate - as all sorts of ideas are floated in public. Maybe it would be easier if it was all kept secret until there was a final government-approved plan. Compared with many neighboring where there is no such openness, I keep coming back to the mantra: "wait until there's an actual plan." Because the openness and [comparative] press freedom is a good thing. I personally do not expect a plan that will be particularly "open to tourists" until October at the earliest. It's disappointing, but because I honestly and truly am able to say to myself, "OK. It may not be what I want, but I understand there is reasonable decision making that goes into the decisions, even if I disagree, ... so be it." If I were in the government I absolutely would be advising the government to go slow-slow-slow until October. The way to protect the high season is to be cautious from now until then. If there are "low hanging fruit" of rich people who will happily spend a week or two at a resort on an island, where the risks can be contained geographically, then go for it. And if they do go for it, I certainly won't be criticizing them for taking only this small, cautious step. But broad-based travel now? The world isn't ready. Today's English language press briefing in Thailand gave the astonishing statistic that currently there are about 10,000 people in quarantine in Thailand. I think it's worth letting that sink in before we wonder why the government isn't rushing to open the gates. YES, this is hard on the many people employed in the tourism sector. Each month I give a bit of the money that I might otherwise have spent on "entertainment" to charities in Thailand that I've posted about previously: SWING (direct help to sex workers) and Duang Prateep Foundation and COVID Thailand Aid. Highly recommended.

Stranger "bar" posted that they would be having a party Friday night. I think they included the hashtag "#dragdinner. You could always ask to order food at (if not necessarily from) the bars there, so good for them for recognizing their inner restaurant.

The BKK Art Biennale 2020 is still on track to open this coming high season. Dates are 29 October 2020 - 31 January 2021. The theme is "Escape Routes." As if anyone needed another reason to visit. This time the artists include Yoko Ono. (Not making that up.) https://www.bkkartbiennale.com

From Jupiter's Facebook page: "We are open 1 July 2020 . See ya..!!"

Will the bars and pubs be allowed to open? Newspaper reports are that the "fourth phase" of reopening proposed for June 15 does not include bars or pubs.