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Hi. There are a few massage places in SP. Gold https://www.goldtherapy.com.br/ Inhouse https://www.inhouseagencia.com.br/equipe MD https://md-massagem.com.br/ Lotus https://www.xtudiolotus.com.br/ I have never been to Prince, but from what I have read you could choose the guy there. All 4 places above ask you to book the guy in advance via whatsapp, but you could ask if you could select the masseur there. MD has the best infrastructure.

Now, I have not read this book, so my few observations are only based on what I have read on this thread. In Pattaya I think the bars can 'de facto' create loose 'family groups' around the bar, where boys talk and support one another (aside from any physical liaisons that take place). Similarly groups of bars, JC, Sunee, Boyztown etc, can extend those groups. The boys all seem to know each other and talk to each other and often support and help each other in straightened times. Secondly I think social media, FB groups, Line groups etc. can also provide some discrete sense of gay community. The number of Thai orientated gay FB groups are increasing, with boys posting to get the validation or encouragement from other boys for their looks, sexuality, etc. There are often many thousands in each group; some boys members of several groups. As a farang joining such groups I am a mere observer, just vicariously enjoying the provocative pictures (well as provocative as FB allows that is) the boys put up. They create the same sense of 'community' as we do ourselves as members of this (and other) gay Thailand forums; perhaps more so.

Thanks you @CurtisD for a fascinating and wide-ranging review. It throws up many issues which I did not realise would be covered in the book and, hopefully, once and for all condemns to the trash can other western outdated notions of why young gay boys in Thailand behave as they do. It has been obvious for decades that the real success Thailand had in combatting HIV and AIDS had little to do with western programmes and vastly more to one Thai man, Meechai Veravaidya. As when I was a young boy, condoms were difficult to buy and there seemed to be a stigma attached to purchasing them in a shop (indeed, in my town only one shop stocked them). Working in family planning, Meechai realised that the only way Thailand could reduce it mushrooming birthrate was to work on birth control. So he set about touring villages to popularise the condom and its use. He even had condom blowing competitions and creating water bombs from them. It worked amazingly well and the birthrate has now been significantly reduced. When HIV came along, he switched to stressing the importance of condom use. By the mid '80s he was a Minister in Prime Minister Prem's government and therefore very high in the social hierarchy. Since condoms had become so popular they were known as 'Meechais', this unquestionably helped in controlling rates of HIV. Had he been able to continue his work which was by the start of the century extensive, more could have been done But the Thaksin government cut the funding for HIV-AIDS education. Sadly the boys in the study largely fall into that group, approaching puberty when the HIV prevention programmes were being wound down. And these I believe are the main reasons for the following conclusions from the book - But even more important, I believe, is the notion of public/private personas and fulfilling a role. It explains why there can be a general acceptance of homosexuality in much of Thai society but non-acceptance in, for example, most places of work. It explains why gay men a bit older than those in the study who are trying to hold down a job in a large company and to fit in to Thai society are exceedingly reluctant to be associated with gay movements. Thank you again.

From Bangkok Post The Tourism and Sports Ministry vows to open the whole country without quarantine by January next year, but such a move largely depends on nationwide herd immunity. Phiphat Ratchakitprakarn, the tourism and sports minister, said Bangkok was scheduled to reopen in October as part of the second phase for the country, but this phase has been delayed to November as the majority of residents will not receive their second vaccine dose until the end of October. "The plan for Bangkok is more challenging as it has extended territory covering vicinities that require more elaborate standard operation procedures [SOPs]," he said. Meanwhile, Chiang Mai, Prachuap Khiri Khan (Hua Hin) and Chon Buri (Pattaya) will go ahead as planned on Oct 1, as well as Phetchaburi, which hasn't yet started its SOPs and needs to speed up this month, said Mr Phiphat. At a meeting between the ministry and the Tourism Authorities of Thailand (TAT) on Friday, he said they agreed to add some provinces to the third phase of reopening under the 7+7 extension programme. As a result, from Oct 15 there are 25 provinces tourists can enter via the sandbox programme as second destinations after spending seven days in one of these destinations: Phuket, Samui, Chiang Mai, Chon Buri, Prachuap Khiri Khan, Phetchaburi and Bangkok. Continues at https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/2176951/tourism-ministry-sets-january-date-to-reopen ================================== Phuket sours on Sandbox The private sector in Phuket is urging the government to fully reopen the resort island by Dec 1, saying the move can bring in more than 210 billion baht in tourism-related revenue in just three months. The call came as businesses in Phuket realised that they won't be able to survive with the island only partially reopened under the Phuket Sandbox scheme. "Only over 20,000 tourists have come over the past two months since the Phuket Sandbox was launched," said the vice-president of Phuket Tourism Association, Nanthida Atiset. https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/2176819/phuket-sours-on-sandbox

There were 3 interviews which took place over a 20 month period in 2011-2012. The participants were aged 18-19 at time of the first interview. Only 5 of the 25 participants were involved in the bar scene at any time and of those their attitude toward their fellow bar-boys was mixed, some seeing the culture as being bad as it encouraged a cycle of partying, drugs and consumption that made bar work necessary to maintain the cycle. Most of the participants seem to have been looking for a long term relationship and for the poorer ones this was often structured as seeking an exchange of differences with a partner who could not only help them but also their family - this was the case whether or not they got involved in the bar scene. The author was surprised by how lacking in knowledge they were as the participants were obtained through advertising to participate in a study related to improving knowledge of HIV on gay aps and networks. Bangkok Guy is younger than the participants in the study and is very informed about HIV/AIDS. The only form of sex is safe sex. I am now curious to understand how he became so well informed. My guess is that his 'older sister' with whom he runs some of the market stalls may have clued him in.

A fascinating thread...thanks , everyone. Reading the precis, kindly prepared by CurtisD, led me to consider , yet again, the eighteen years I've been with P. and in particular those periods of mutual incomprehension that were a feature of our early days. Line by line, I recognised what appeared to be puzzling aspects of this relationship and our attempts to explain to each other (mainly in Thinglish) what was going on. And how our struggles were likely replicated in many such relationships. A couple of things. Vessey is spot-on about the friendship groups that sustain the guys, particularly those who've just arrived. P arrived in Pattaya twenty years ago with two bosom pals. In times of plenty, they partied; in times of hardship, a lucky one who had enjoyed an off shared his winnings among the the three of them. Although he is now comfortably settled in his longed-for farm up in the north, he looks back at his three or so years as a Pattaya MB with nostalgia..... something that astonished me at first. He didn't mind the sex- even with people like me- but he loved the comradeship. Secondly, CurtisD reports that the study claims that guys from the country aren't clued-up on the hazards and prevention of Hiv/Aids. Not so in P's case. He was taught about this at school; even the famous banana/condom lesson was given.

Are there any places like Prince in Bangkok to go for massage in SP, Rio or Porto Alegre?

Every morning when I get up around 4 am I take my coffee out on the lanai and spend and hour or so reading my news feeds on my phone. For some reason I get a lot of stories from Australia even though I am in Florida. I'm a bit tired of all the countries that whine about lockdowns and increased death counts from Covid and then the kicker, as they have less than 1000 deaths total for the country since the beginning of the virus. It's probably more jealousy than anything but with such a poor job done in the US with the virus and death totals around 635,000 here I get tired of the alarms raised when a country gets 20 new Covid cases. I understand they have obviously done something very right about battling the virus that the US just couldn't handle due mostly to the selfishness of the US citizens to do what is best for the country and their family and neighbors. I live in a very small county by Florida standards and we had over 1000 new cases last week and Florida had over 1700 deaths last week alone, thanks mostly to Gov DeathSentance. I have stayed home, cancelled a vacation that was to start next week and mostly lead a secluded life for 18 months even as Florida has been wide open for business since late last year. No one is forcing this lifestyle on me and it's all my own doing to safeguard my health and that of others. I got my second shot in early February and plan on getting the booster when it becomes available. So to those countries that have done STELLER work keeping the virus at bay, you really don't realize how lucky you are and everything you have suffered is worth it and far better than the alternative. Please, get the shot and wear a mask to protect yourself AND others until we get a better handle on this menace.

perhaps that's the goal - learn to live with contained covid as attempts at "zero covid" policies seem to be just pipe dream. My sister lives in a country with slightly above half of population vaccinated and that along with other standard measures was enough to bring infection rate down exponentially ( about 100 times in 5 months ). Warnings about fourth wave from mid-Aug so far did not materialize that much either. Perhaps THAT virus requires less than standard 70% for herd immunity? just saying as I'm not neither very interested in medical stuff nor qualified to say much ( although being built by qualified staff did not prevent Titanic from sinking ) .

By random coincidence (or message from the universe), I think I located my Asian-Brazilian beauty: https://md-massagem.com.br/#team/kaique He has roughened up his look with facial hair but I still recognize the beauty in the bone structure! Since he's been found and apparently offering services, why am I not on a plane to Brazil right now?

Just curious, is there a mention of the time the interview happened? Surely those who are teenagers in 2010 onwards vs those who were teenagers in 1980s has a very different experience growing up.

From Bangkok Post Govt may lift emergency decree The government is considering lifting the emergency decree when the current extension expires at the end of this month, which would also mean the closure of the Centre for Covid-19 Situation Administration, a top security official said on Monday. National Security Council secretary-general Gen Natthapol Nakpanich said the government and CCSA were making the necessary preparations. If the decree was not extended, the Communicable Disease Control Act would be used to manage the Covid-19 pandemic, under the auspices of the Public Health Ministry, he said. The end of the decree would also mean the end of the CCSA, which was set up under the decree to handle the coronavirus situation, he said. The ministry was responsible for fighting disease outbreaks before the decree came into force. Gen Natthapol, who is the CCSA operations chief, admitted some groups felt uneasy about the use of the decree. He said use of the disease control act under the ministry would be enough to control the spread of the virus. https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2177327/govt-may-lift-emergency-decree

Mary Renault's birthday was this weekend. Born in 1905. "Truly your journey has been blessed and here it ends."

Lets hope this is true. Meanwhile malaysia is also thinking of the same line of living with the virus, though our timeline might be more realistic as we are 48% fully vaccinated and 62% at least first dose of all population. Of the eligible adult population, that number is much higher at 67%/87% respectively. We will also begin vaccination for 12-18 soon in states where majority of the adult has been fully vaccinated. https://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2021/09/01/covid-19-expected-to-become-endemic-in-malaysia-by-end-of-october-says-kj

Nice to hear but I don't believe in those predictions / promises until they will be firmly announced

I just binged episodes 6-16 of Light On Me (the pretty Korean HS boys drama). They put the first 5 eps on YouTube but then the rest was on Viki or WeTV. I signed up for the Viki free trial to watch the rest. It is really great. Quite well done. I loved the story's twists and turns. The production design is really good. Highly recommended if you get a chance to see it.

My copy arrived the other day and I read it through in one sitting over a pot of coffee. This is a book with a serious purpose – to better understand the life experience and mindset of young gay (not the term used in the book) ex-urban Thai guys in order to see if there is a better way to get them up to speed on the risk of HIV and the need for safe sex before they become part of the 30% of gay men in urban centers with HIV. As it is a serious book, it is not written for light reading and there is some academic jargon. However, it is pretty readable, much more so than I would have expected for a book of this type. The book is based around interviews with 25 guys over an 18 month period in which they finish high school and go on to higher education or the job market, usually leaving their home town for a city. What the guys say is quite illuminating and requires a re-read. There is a lot of material and having only read through it once over coffee the precis that follows may need amendment on a second reading. The Thai framing of life in general including sexuality is quite different to the Western framing. There are many strands here, which in combination suggest that a Western approach to HIV outreach (peer-groups, gay-community-based support) will be much less effective than it is in the West because (i) young Thais listen better to someone more senior in the social hierarchy than a peer and (ii) young gay Thais do not see themselves as part of a gay community – creating an identity around being gay makes as much sense to them as creating an identity around a brand of car or a football team. The process through which they and their family and friends recognize their sexual difference is quite different to that of a Western teen. · Thai society places a lot of value on appearances – on behaving correctly and fulfilling the expected role – and less value on factual truth. As long as you fulfill public role expectations, what you do in private is not of much concern as long as it does not hurt anyone. This means that having separate public and private personas is totally acceptable, not hypocritical. · Same-sex attraction is not a sin or bad behavior. It is bad luck. You have been dealt an unlucky hand because achieving a stable same-sex relationship is very difficult, if it is possible at all. Your chance of being happy in love is thus less than a straight persons. In karmic terms it is punishment for being a homewrecker in a previous life. · Sexual roles are defined along gender lines. If you are gay, you are assumed to be more female and it is assumed that acting and being female is what you want. Hence the recognized role of kathoey. Many of the guys interviewed were accepted and socialized as kathoey by their family and community before going to the city. As they gained experience they realized that they were not in fact passive and changed their self-presentation from kathoey to Man. · The fact that same-sex attracted people are accepted – with a slight second-class status as ‘bad luck’ – means they feel part of the broader family and community and creating a separate gay community does not feel so necessary. · The Thai view is that successful long term relationships are built on the combination of the differences that each partner brings to the relationship. Male/female, top/bottom, young/old, rich/poor, attractive/unattractive. The relationship is built on the exchange of these differences. · For teens of both sexes from poor backgrounds, this understanding of ‘exchange of differences’ provides a deeper logic to finding an older, wealthier partner than the logic that is obvious to Westerners. · The obligation to the family, particularly the mother, is life-long. The debt to the mother can never be repaid. You need to be a good son and support your family and particularly your mother. If you cannot provide grandchildren, you can compensate by greater provision of lifestyle support. You still have a role and maintain face. · Entering the bar scene is not loss of face. (i) The separation of public/private personas is not hypocrisy. In your home town you are a good son supporting your family. You do not escort in your home town, that would lose face, but out of sight is fine. (ii) As same-sex attracted you are thought of in a female role framework, so finding a husband to support you is a legitimate objective. To improve the economic status of the family, a wealthy husband would be preferable. Working bars is a way, probably the only way, to meet a wealthy man. · An ex-urban teen arriving in the city is likely to have very little knowledge of HIV and AIDs and safe/unsafe sex. · An ex-urban teen arriving in the city will not seek out a gay community and so will not encounter gay support groups who handle HIV/AIDs education. · A same-sex attracted teen arriving in the city has probably been conditioned to be passive, to seek an older wealthier partner and to follow the lead of this partner who is more senior in the hierarchy. So initially the teen is likely to be the receptive partner not the penetrative one and will take the lead of their partner on safe or unsafe sex practices. This creates a very big risk that they are infected with HIV early in their sexual experience. After some initial experiences, they may realize that they prefer the active role, and if they have contracted HIV and continue to not practice safe sex, they then help to spread it. And there you have the 30% positive rate among gay urban Thai men.

From Channel News Asia Social platform helps small eateries survive Wilailak Thanakitwibul, 68, cooks for a customer at Three Aunties', a small eatery on Bangkok's Samran Rat road. (Photo: Pichayada Promchertchoo) BANGKOK: The sound of a metal spatula against a wok was a familiar greeting to visitors at a small eatery on Samran Rat road. Aromatic smoke, sometimes with a spicy note of chillies, and the sizzling of food over hot flames used to fill its little unpretentious space on the ground floor of an old shophouse. For five decades, its occupants - three sisters now in their 60s and 70s - have cooked and served an array of local dishes to generations of customers. Their eatery Three Aunties’ is one of many in Bangkok’s historic neighbourhood known as Pratu Pee or ‘Ghost Gate’ among Thais. Once an exit way for dead bodies from Bangkok’s old city, the area is home to numerous street-food legends, whose culinary fame and mouthwatering dishes such as Phad Thai noodles and Ba Chang sticky rice dumplings had long attracted throngs of foodies. Today, the neighbourhood is unusually quiet. COVID-19 and various lockdown measures have dealt a heavy blow to the restaurants. People stay at home to avoid infections and many have less spending power than before. With hardly any walk-in customers for more than a year, small eateries are struggling to survive. “We used to make 3,000 to 4,000 baht (US$92 to US$122) per day but right now, we can barely make 1,000 baht,” said 68-year-old Wilailak Thanakitwibul from Three Aunties’. Scant income has caused the siblings to slip into debt and dejection. They owe their landlord two months’ rent and have to live sparingly to get by. Knowing they may not have any customers, the three sisters have no choice but to open their eatery every day and hope for the best. “We can’t stop because the rent is more than 500 baht per day,” Wilailak said. “It’s so exhausting to earn some money these days. Still, there have been some lucky days with hundreds of orders, thanks to a community-driven platform called Locall. According to its co-founder Peangploy Jitpiyatham, Locall is a by-product of the pandemic, formed in April last year by a civil society network named SATARANA. Its digital platform allows customers to place orders for select restaurants and cafes in different neighbourhoods, focusing on small and elderly sellers with no access to online delivery services. They also engage unemployed community members who wish to deliver food from local sellers to customers. Continues with photos https://www.channelnewsasia.com/asia/thailand-covid-19-local-platform-help-eateries-2145106

The life of seclusion is very difficult. I have done it as well. Luckily, I found a great guy to stay with me and take care of me (or vice versa). I had one shot and another next month. I am looking forward to this easing up toward the end of the year and getting back to semi-normal. I don't think the entire thing will be over for many years. But, as time goes on, we learn to live with it better each month.

I agree with you entirely flguy. I have been so fortunate to live in Thailand through this pandemic - I have lived here for almost ten years now. Up to April this year we had less than 100 deaths here, but since then it is over ten thousand deaths. Infections and deaths appear to be slowing down now, but I too have been keeping to myself for the last five months as I am diabetic with other underlying conditions which place me at high risk. The absolute disaster around the vaccination programme in Thailand is outrageous, with barely ten percent of the population vaccinated so far. I was very fortunate to get my first dose of AstraZeneca on 7th August but of course I must wait twelve weeks for the second dose, so 30th October. Restrictions are starting to be lifted from tomorrow but I think I shall give it a couple of weeks yet to see how the figures move before I think about possible meeting with friends again. As you say it is about protecting ourselves and others from infection. The "long covid" damage has yet to be clarified but I think that may become significant for many people who have been infected.

I said it 127 times here but only 11 this year so I say it again in defense of straights. They know they need to try harder and almost universally they do. As a bonus they tend to be more straightforward with limitations they may have. like : "you sleep with me ? " Ok, I fuck you but you no fuck me" , "in the evening, but what about morning ? "ha, ha , ha , lets go"

I thought we'd put to bed the notion that otherwise straight men aren't interested in sex with gay men. There are many guys on the board who have a preference for straights--regardless of their nationality. Most of the guys who work the bars and massage shops in Bangkok are straight. That they can service both men and women adds to their utility and--for many admirers--their attractiveness.

When I was in a new city, I always looked to train at a fashionable gym. So I asked the gay guys I met which gym they considered to have the best trainers, equipment etc and which gym was popular with gay men. Usually it was easy to discover the best place to go. And when I joined, I used to say I preferred to train with a gay trainer. That inevitably led to questions being asked of me…and when I met a cute trainer, I discussed “and more” as you put it @Ethanmiami

Sometimes I read about Broke Dick syndrome, and I'm scared to know that it's a real thing, especially since me and my best best friends don't like to use much lube, and they are really really tight!