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I appreciate your perspective and thus why your post was not removed or edited and why you were not warned or banned. I believe in free speech and rarely get involved when people have issues with posts. However, let me help you edit your first post to be more positive and not rude (as I and OTHERS who wrote to me) believed it was. Rude You: From what I could make up from the overly long (extremely detailed) and somewhat confusing encounter...you had a good time...Happy to hear (read) that Your writing/typing sounds like somebody else who also writes long, hard to follow encounters with boys in Brazil... FYI...Most of the guys don´t steal especially if they know they have the opportunity to make more money with you and also if they know they may run into you again... Glad that you were able to entertain so many guys on here.. Not Rude You: From what I could make up from the extremely detailed and somewhat confusing encounter...you had a good time...Happy to hear (read) that Your writing/typing sounds like somebody else that use to post on this site. FYI...Most of the guys don´t steal especially if they know they have the opportunity to make more money with you and also if they know they may run into you again... Glad that you were able to entertain so many guys on here.. Oz here again: So, see, just a few words can make a big difference. You thought the OP's post was not to your liking. You said that in a rude way. I thought your post was not to my liking and I said that in a rude way. I guess I was trying to treat you like you had treated the OP and hoping that you would see how you could be just a bit kinder in THIS instance to help new posters feel more welcome as opposed to alienating them (much like another poster here from years gone by). Also, notice that your pissing on this thread did not cause me to piss on your other thread. I view things very separate. I think many would say that is the wrong approach but I'm old and my ways are kind of set in stone at this point in time. I can truly count on one hand the number of people banned from this site (other than one poster who created 10 or more names and we banned them all). You are appreciated here. But, rude comments to others are not appreciated or loved.

Complaining about sex performance in a brothel is not like calling Amazon customer service, is a dangerous business and is a gamble, sometimes you are pleased, sometimes you are not, that's the name of the game. Refusing to pay a prostitute if you are not 100% satisfied might lead to horrible consequences. Maybe the sauna thing is not for you.

For the youngsters in the group, you know we did not have apps and online fora in the 70s and 80s. We have all been as young as 20 and up. If we had online communication then, I think it would have been considered impolite or 'gloaty' to share that we could pick up tricks in a bar, park, church social (including Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence religious retreats), etc, but not describe them a little. Look, I had casual sex with a lot of really attractive guys in my day. Like, a lot. And I simply do not recall any silly top/bottom distinction; you fucked and got fucked. Eventually, you reach an age of majority ... the majority of hot young things look to their age group while issuing you your gay death certificate with a golden handshake, not even the decency of a golden handjob. Not bitter ... had a good run, and no hangups about the sex trade. This forum is meant to be inclusive in that it is not restricted to catering to men seeking info and stories about paid encounters. But commenting about Grindr and similarly sourced exploits is like saying there are gay men who have sex with other gay men. Everybody knows this already and that the bulk of sex that occurs on Earth does not involve monetary exchange. So if you wish to underscore your membership in the subgroup of queers capable of hookups with guys not interested in your money, please at the very least entertain us a little with some tantalizing narratives. Also, discreet photos of your conquests do not compromise the average joe in the same way as they would a working guy. How do you like them freedom of speech apples?

Glad to hear about your resolution to keep the reports going numazu1. Count me on those who love your way on telling your stories and those long and detailed reports.

I really doubt the GdeP demanding double is very confident it will pay off, at least in the sauna setting. The menacing posturing is his lottery ticket, usually discardable. Some of the garota brothels with high-end working ladies charge a flat rate: 400 reais for entrance and standard suck'n'fuck with one girl. Believe me, the customer does not easily get a second roll of the dice for free if he is dissatisfied with the one he chooses. Do we want the more cookie-cutter business model at those prices? Probably not. The law of averages works in our favour. We get to window-shop non-commitedly over a cocktail for a pittance, interact and extract phone numbers, have a hot time with at least one GdeP, optionally negotiate particulars of sexual choreography, all for a substantially great price.

I suggested avoid complaining or refusing to pay because of the quality of the performance, in case of the boy asking for substantially more than was the deal, I would notify the management, they have a good idea of what the boys are charging and in the case of something outlandish they will do something about it. Is not in their best interest to have workers robbing the clients and the possibility of the police coming in is the thing they fear the most.

I’m not complaining about all the sauna boys, just the experience I had with a couple of the macho tops. I think you mostly hire bottoms... Regardless the saunas in Rio are a lot of fun to hang out in and watch/check out the eye candy. I can’t think of anywhere in the world like them. Also they are immediate gratification...with grindr you still have to arrange an actual time/place to meet, deal with flakes, etc.

Yes that is true and there is one American in particular who all the boys unanimously fell that way about! :-) He is obnoxious to everyone including fellow Americans and doesn’t realize it! I have been sitting at a table with 4 or 5 guys and he walks in and they all collectively sigh! they all ask Twice as much from him and he has said to me “The guys are all asking much more now!” i go “yeah it’s crazy!” lol

If you can't smell out a 'cheat' of a sex worker beforehand, shame on you. And even then, consider all the human transactional parts of it. Always remember they might be criminals; but OTOH they might just be human too.

That would lead to issues in the future when trying to go back to the sauna or possibly with other guys...what was so bad you didnt want to give the guy $25-30 dollars for his time? That doesn't seem right....

Very true... Do not get involved with police in Brazil until it's strictly necessary.

Perhaps it’s a cultural thing, but calling the police on something like this seems really petty. With many people, the police aren’t always seen to have their best interests at heart, at best, and corrupt and murderous, at worst. Brazilian police also aren’t always the fairest to those that they know they can extort for money — like European or American gay tourists at a brothel.

I ran an escort agency years back. When there was a complaint from a client, I gave them a free date. That came out of my pocket. It was rare but it happened. The customer is always right and sometimes personalities just don't mesh. That said, I have been in situations where service was not rendered and I have always paid. One in LA through Craig's List was adorable but he was a shitty fuck. I still paid him and gave him a tip. He asked to see me again and I told him he was cute but not good sex. He asked for another chance which I gave him and he was fantastic the next 10 times. When boys know they are going with someone who is known, they don't fuck up as much. When they know they can get a repeat, the smart ones work harder as it makes their life easier. When I was traveling to Rio multiple times a year for a few months at a time, I never had any issue as they all knew I was good and consistent. But, with tourists, they also know they most likely will never see them again and some do stupid things to ensure they get as much as possible for the least amount of time. I have never refused to pay at a sauna or at a massage place in Brazil or Thailand. And, I have had bad "dates" in both. I just consider it the price of admission. As I always tip the mamasan in Thailand before I leave when the boy is bad, I give no tip and tell her he was not good. As a former pimp, I feel that is needed. But, in Brazil, the boys do not work for the sauna and they are independent contractors and what happens at all stages is between the two parties. I bet most sauna owners do not want problems. But, at the same time, as a foreigner, I do not want an issue in a country that is not my own.

Don’t be daft. He’s referring to physical violence or robbery outside the sauna.

one of my biggest complaints, and there are 2 Americans i know who did this continuously, both who i would term “cheap”! the kind of guys that are always in the bathroom when the restaurant check comes for instance! I finally told one that if he kept spending a hour playing with everyone’s dick but never take anyone to a suite he was going to run into trouble when he left the sauna sooner or later(a sauna guy told me this) wisely he took the advise!

Tomcal, I have the same situation here in Bangkok. I spend 6 months a year. I have stayed in the same condo for 5 years. I love the location and all the amenities. Everybody asks me where it is and how can they rent it. I never tell anybody. Only ones that know location are the boys I bring home. FloridaRob arrives today. I don’t even tell him.

I dont agree that threads exist or should exist for "positive" commentary only. There is a yin and yang to everything in life. Negativity is part of lifes fabric. Threads laden with only positively are unbalanced and often come off fake and contrived. HOWEVER, I also believe its not WHAT you say but how you say it. There is a way to respond negatively WITHOUT an attack on the person posting, and I think THAT'S the real issue... While I have been guilty many, many times of attacking posters, its usually after the fact once they attack me for my comment. Some people can just make you lose it ! Keeping yourself in check is one of the most difficult things to do on forums where your anonymity shields you, but I am a work in progress.

Gee Oz, I guess I am NOT the most difficult person you ever had to deal with here, huh ? Kinda makes me wish those old JD days were back... Maybe we need to introduce Badboy81 to Rockhard ???

Trash his reputation to who? The people on this forum are a very, very small minority of clients these guys have... Maybe if you are a regular and live in Rio so you can be in the saunas often and trash said guy but whats the point...Just avoid him and never hire him again...

And it is not quite as safe, and if you like them young, you have to check their ID to make sure they are 18, and in the sauna, the guys take showers all the time, so they are super clean, etc etc. The saunas definitely make it easy for us.

Saturday - Rough Night. A couple of garatos prevent me on Friday that Saturday there will be a party, and a lot of people coming. I wasn't prepared for that! Arrived around 6:30p. The cute boy at frontdesk was next to a nervous breakdown. He run out of sandals, "no chinelos"! I was sent to the dressing room second section, as the main one was crowded. For at least two hours, waiting list for all. The place was packed and, as likeohmygod said, it was impossible to stay at the bar area. I was there until 9:30 pm. The "party" was nothing special, in my opinion. The regular trans show + strippers. There was free food, mostly consumed by the garotos. At the beginning you may be happy with so much people and options to pick, but in the end it also fired back. Everybody become tired pretty fast, and I see several garatos (the good ones) start leaving about 8:00 pm so, if you don't want to miss your chances, take action immediately! A lot of transvestites guests, that definitively attracts the attention from the GPs; good opportunity to check which garotos are really bi and those that really loves trans girls, if that matters to you. Lessons: for parties, try to arrive as earlier as possible, as the ambiance will exhaust everybody. Bring your own sandals; may be too obvious but this situation reminds me that these guys don't sanitize this (ok, I was naive..) and you can find a lot at the shopping mall inside Santa Cruz (http://www.shoppingmetro.com.br/Loja). A lot of these guys come to the party to socialize and for the free food, believe or not. 150 is the norm, unless you are damn good on negotiation. And more money doesn't mean better service.

Raidd is where I was! But are those guys for hire?

Give it time.....

In Rio, you've already been to 3 saunas by 5-530,lol

I don't think so. Most of the ex's clients are older than him and have been with him for years. Many of his clients are in their 70's and 80's. But, like others, I still see the same guys in Thailand and Brazil that I saw 20 years ago. If I met them today, I would not see them. But, good memories and I know good sex awaits. A bit older and not as in shape, but the fun times are there in my mind and thus I like the repeats.

I do, really, apologize for my rudeness of manner. That was uncalled for. But the documentary evidence presented in that article seems somewhat weak, as I read it through.

Brit actor David Oyelowo has a legacy that supercedes his actting.... It's its stunning son Asher, who recently made his modeling Runway debut... The kid is a Beauty... (maybe we can convince him to Escort ?) Asher on the Right...

Zeroing in on the OP's details, because the club staff initially impulsively threatened police contact and he simply 'raised them', calling their bluff, the question here is how to generally handle foiled expectations in-house, not how misguided he was at attempting to recruit a badge's intervention. So yes, give up a little on the relatively rare dust-ups, particularly if you want to return for the usually satisfactory experiences.

Nice to hear that Jacqueline is there, she worked very well. In my first visits on 117 she always asked me if I had any problem and even asked a couple of times how the boy had behaved (maybe a new boy on the staff or anyone under her vigilant eyes...)

For those Interested, She's being honored today...... (what will she WEAR ?) Today the Human Rights Campaign announced this year’s Visibility Award with honor out gay Olympian Adam Rippon at the 2018 HRC Los Angeles Dinner this Saturday, March 10, 2018. “One word best describes Adam Rippon — fierce,” said HRC President Chad Griffin. “By being out and proud, Adam is bringing LGBTQ visibility to a whole new level while capturing the hearts of millions around the world with his incredible talent and personality. He isn’t afraid to use his global platform to speak out for equality, and we are proud to honor him with the HRC Visibility Award at the 2018 HRC Los Angeles Dinner.” Adam Rippon made history as the first openly gay U.S. American male figure skater to compete in the Olympic games. Rippon publicly sparred with Mike Pence in the press and on social media, bringing a new focus on Pence’s long anti-LGBTQ record. Rippon publicly voiced his concern over Pence leading the diverse U.S. delegation to the Olympics. In an exclusive interview with HRC, Rippon said, “At first, I had a few hesitations to come out, because I was afraid of repercussions that it might have. But at the end of the day, I felt like it was important, and it was an opportunity to shine a light on a subject that was bigger than me. I know when I was coming out I drew strength from learning about other people’s stories and hopefully my story will do the same for others.” The HRC Los Angeles Dinner brings together more than 1,000 of HRC’s most active members and supporters in the greater Los Angeles area to raise crucial funds in the fight for LGBTQ equality.

It appears the very recognizable Jacqueline, who worked 117 reception for many years, is on staff. Will be interesting to see the chessboard unfold.

Congrats on finding another place to ho around! Now, your schedule will be full? Wait, no, wasn't it already full? You need to add more hours to your day to keep up with all the Rio guys!

Body Tech R. Visc. de Pirajá, 365-B - the main commercial street thru Ipanema One block from R. Farme de Amoedo

Nope, I'm into the short small gymnast type 30's who in the dark look young 20's. Midnight beauties.

Why single out garotos who may be a bit “long in the tooth” for their ptofession? There are plenty of advertising escorts here in the States and elsewhere who have been plying their trade for well over a decade and some may say that they have long worn out their welcome. Some of them may be on various message boards... even here! The point is that although many here may prefer young, fresh and freckle-faced, straight-off-the-showroom-floor garotos / escorts / gogo boys / hustlers, there are also clients who may prefer the “seasoned” (in either actual age or look). Maybe this business should just be like “Logan’s Run” and have a carousel that murders everyone at the age of 29 (and I just dated myself with that reference)?

he just called me from bangkok on his way to his place! have a great time! and don’t invite him to your apartment! LOL

I am but as I get older I realize its a lot of work being a top and maybe its' more relaxing and less strenuous to be a bttm...but I have tried and it lasted maybe one minute and I did not like it!! it amazes me that guys can get hard and cum while getting fucked!!

Grindr is amazing in Rio, and hornet also. I have had hotter hookups from the apps then from straight sauna guys who don’t always perform that great

I have a friend (ex) in NYC and also Brazilian who is in his 50's and still escorting. It is all he has done for 25 years since I introduced him to The Gaiety. He still get clients and he has worked no other job in all these years. When I was at Stella's Bar in the 90's there was an older Puerto Rico dude in his 60's and still getting clients. He was old but apparently a big dick and a good fucker. Luckily, there is someone out there for these guys.

You can ask whatever you want! Although it might be considered rude. I wouldn't. I would either be interested based on their appearance, or not. If a guy looks worn out and haggard, but then proves he really is only 23, would that change your mind? I can't imagine a situation where the *actual* age would take preference over the apparent age/physical condition of the guy. *not being negative here. Honestly curious if youth is such a fetish for some people that they would fuck a guy based on his age rather than his attractiveness.

Axiom, there was a discussion previously on here about not giving out the name/address as I don't anymore because when you want it the person(s)you gave the info to have it reserved, happened to me 5mos. after I gave it out! I have been using the same apt. for 6 years now and it's great and a great location and price. I have used it so frequently that the owner has given me my own set of keys so don't have to wait for someone to check me it and I don't have to leave a deposit, so loyalty does pay!

I am bothered because I hate people shitting on people who are trying to make the place more enjoyable for all. I may not like black guys, but you won't see me posting about in a post (I love black guys but you get the point?). When you read something you don't like, move on. No need to be a negative nelly. IMHO Goodness, I had near 10 boys living with me at one time and not one was effeminate (other than me). They were as manly and as masculine as any guy I met in Harlem, Brazil or Spain. True, none were fat (one was chunky) but none of the one I had sex with in other places were anything but in shape and thin as well.

I’ve been in Rio now for 2 weeks, and it is my second trip here. The saunas have been crowded with lots of model-looking guys. I have mostly gone to Club 117 and Point 202, as well as Rio G Spa. I’ve had about 5 programas so far, and I am getting kind of tired of the sauna guy antics. I’m versatile, and the only good experiences so far have been me with me being activo. For reference I am early 30’s and have no problem getting hook ups from grindr, I just go to the saunas for the model good -looking, drop dead gorgeous guys i couldnt get in US. However, my best experiences in Rio so far have been for free off grindr and in Rio G Spa, as well as the nude beach in Grumari. Garota 1 - said he liked to kiss, promised to suck, said he was only top. Agreed on 100 reals. He kissed for about 10 seconds then literally pushed my head to his nipple and told me to suck his nipple. Said he would only suck with condom. Was staring at the porn on the tv the whole time, and couldnt act more disinterested. After he starting topping for a minute he told me to cum. Practically yelling cum, cum etc. Basically trying to rush me. Then he came without asking and demanded 200 reals. After arguing with him in spanish (i only speak spanish and english), he agreed to 120 reals. Garota 2 - Agreed on 120 reals for everything including cum. Only kissed less than a minute, only wanted to fuck doggy style, and again staring at porn on tv the whole time. Regardless how hot he was, it wasnt enjoyable. Garota 3 - Cute pasivo guy in early 20’s. Very affectionate, good kisser, sucked great. Had a great time with him. Garota 4 - One of the sauna gods - probably the best looking guy in 117. Said he was activo. Agreed on 150 but after he demanded 200, claiming the session was longer than normal. Was a good top, but again refused to kiss, refused to touch my dick. Better than the other tops but still not a satisfactory hook up for me. Garota 5 - Versatile, very cute, kind of twinkish body. Good kisser, sucked good, overall great in every way. I am wondering how others handle when sauna guys refuse to do what they promised, or try to raise the price after the fact. It just gets old being shaken down constantly for more money. Maybe I just need more affection than other clients also. I’m not really into sex with someone who is acting disinterested or doesnt like guys at all. It is just a strange feeling for me. Rio G spa has been great on the weekends. My hook ups there have been so much better in every way, with guys who are actually into me. The nude beach at grumari had a lot of hot group action going on as well up in the rocks. I think in future trips to 117 I am going to have to be more selective and get a feel for the guys attitude before going with them. Does anyone else have any tips on how to deal with sauna guys?

I got a WhatsApp message yesterday from a guy I had not seen since 2003! I assume me got my FB WhatsApp from one of the current guys I know because when I met him at Estacau sauna in 2002 no one had cell phones much less smart phones and I just had my 35mm camera! I saw him 2 or 3 times over the next year when I would run into him at the sauna. never saw him again after 2003. anyhow, I went back over my photos to find a original one from then and then one from what he looks like now!(the third one is from a now defunct xrated site) I told him I appreciated him contacting me but I am unavailable! I do feel sorry for the guys who were sauna boys in their early/mid 20s and now are in their mid 30's and never made the transistion to "regular" work or lost their jobs in the difficult economic times that Brazil is in....